Tiredofdrugs

Take care of yourself Opio and be careful! I know nothing about subs, so can't help you with any of that business! If the subs is what it takes to keep you off the H though! Then I'm all for it!

You call your wife's bedroom the black hole! LOL I call the cat room the "No entry" room for myself! Jethro could put those pain meds in that room and never have to worry about me getting to them. That's one room I avoid at all costs! Too much cat hair that always gets into my eyes and the potty smells are too much for my sensitive nose.

You gotta convince yourself you want to be off the DOC! This is the only way you'll get it done. There's always somebody out there that will sell you the drug. So relying on your man being shut down at certain hours isn't going to cut it. I've used many excuses in the past not to stop the opiates. I think everyone reading here knows the drill! It's part of using drugs and alcohol!

Do you have someone that can babysit the kids for a couple of days for ya? That would be helpful!

TOD

OpioPhobe

Well, I already ****** today up. My children had a doctor appointment this afternoon that my wife was supposed to take them to. In fact, she refused to help last night with the kids because she said she needed rest to be able to take them to it. I told her last night that she wasn't going to do it, and she swore up and down that she would. Of course, she flaked. There was an important phone call to the bank she claimed that she needed to make.

The doctor appointment was an hour long, and it consists of the kids playing with me while the doctor observes. It just wasn't feasible for me to be full on dopesick during it. I couldn't cancel the appointment either as we missed the prior one, and I really need the kids to see this doctor. He is an excellent doctor, which is incredibly difficult to find.

Whatever, I know it is just another day and another ******** excuse that I am telling myself. It is difficult to plan this withdrawal when I have the responsibility of taking care of my children hanging over my head the whole time. Where there is a will there is a way I suppose. I have the nanny tomorrow for a good part of the day so there are no excuses now. Although, she bailed on me this Friday so I have some anxiety about that.

I will be done with what I have in hand fairly early today (say 7 to 8 PM). It would be nice if I could take just enough to be able to sleep some tonight. That will cut down on the time that I have to wait it out. Whatever, I have just been a ***** about it, and it will stick one of these days.


TOD - I completely hear you on someone being willing to sell to me. The thing is that I just need to get over the hump with the subs. If, for example, I was cut off from the H for say 48 hours then I wouldn't have a choice other than to switch to the subs. Some folks find it easy to switch over, but for me it is a very rough process even if I don't take them too soon. If you take them too soon you get precipitated withdrawal. That is bad, bad news where your body basically goes into shock. It is like it compresses the drop of the opis in your system that would take a couple days into a couple hours. When I wait long enough to take them though it is still bad, but I eventually reach a point of no return with them. If say I took a full dose of 24 mgs I wouldn't be able to shoot over it. The subs would block the H and I would just have to ride it out. That is why the fact that my dealer would be done at 1AM would have made a material difference. At that point I would have to keep taking the sub and I would be forced to go over the hump whether I wanted to or not.

Also, you are right about making up my mind to get off. I am still on the fence, which is clear from the fact that I keep talking about switching over to subs but it hasn't happened yet. When I went into precipitated withdrawal the other day I should have just rode it out. It would have gotten better eventually. Tomorrow, if I have the nanny I think I will go to a meeting in the AM. A face to face meeting would help me maintain my resolve.

jmag

Precip is a nightmare, but it never actually happened to me. I've had friends who got hit hard by it. Subs are great if you are having trouble getting out of the habit of using and/or want to use them as a crutch for a little while when getting off dope. I wound up on subs for a little over a year and getting off them was rough. Didnt want to scare you about that, but in all honesty - they are a 100% better alternative than dope, so I cant hate on them too much. I went through wd from years of using and the 1 yr of subs - got almost a month in before went back. I used for about three months than quit cold turkey. I did it while going to work everyday (in finance, so at least I can sit down a bunch) 57 days today - have only drank alcohol maybe twice im that time. Getting sober can be done. I wish you tons of luck and I know you can do it! It gets easier every single day.

OpioPhobe

You know what...to hell with this. I have had a change in heart. I took what I could safely just now and then I flushed the rest of my daily dose (there wasn't much left anyway). I threw my ATM card into the black hole here. It is time that I found my pair and started acting like a man again.

I reread my post from a little while ago and thought about what I would have said to someone. It would have looked like they didn't really want to quit. I would have told them that they needed to have a resolve that they were going to quit come hell or high water. So, that is what I need to get through this. To hell with worrying about timing things so I get sleep on such and such night. It comes down to whether I want to quit or not. I want to quit...it is time to rock and roll.

Marcus

Hey Opio. Sorry you are struggling. Based on my history I have no room to judge anyone. I don't really know you or your entire situation. You are obviously stuck on the fence and unfortunately seem to be tipping back onto the wrong side of it. I am not pointing that out to be an A-hole cause I have done the same thing. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to read back to your recent posts and see the excuses (waiting on the methadone, waiting on the subs, I came down with something, my wife let me down, etc.)

I have a lot of respect for you showing up here and being honest. Obviously excuses and honesty will only get you so far, but trust me I know the fear you are feeling. The easy way out seems to be to just keep numbing yourself out, but trust me it couldn't be farther from the truth. It is no longer if something horrible is going to happen if you continue to use, but when.

I know you said last time there is just no way you can cold turkey. Trust me if your true plan is a short term detox with methadone or subs (versus maintenance) my advice is to find 4 days somehow / someway to just rip the band aid off and kick that sh*t already. I can't imagine your wife doesn't know you are banging dope everyday. Again you don't have to provide excuses why that just will not work for you. I am sure a few sick days or vacation days must be available to you and if you take into account how much money you would save being clean even if you did not get paid for those few days it would come back tenfold.

I know you say you need to be there for your kids, but honestly wouldn't getting yourself clean REALLY be being there for your kids? Sorry not trying to preach to you dude or make you feel even shittier. I am just laying it out there because I have been there and you deserve better and so much more!

Here is a good tune to help release some ANGST. I like to think about the YOU in the song as DOPE. Kick it to the curb!

OpioPhobe

Jmag - haha...I was in finance too, and I also went cold turkey while working (back in 2012). By that time I was well respected in my position so I was able to get away with a few days of slower productivity without it being really noticed. I had my own office so I just sat there for the first couple days and 'vegged' out listening to Metallica. To be honest, taking care of children during withdrawal was tougher than when I had to work through withdrawal. Running after little ones keeps you busy, and then watching children's programming becomes mental torture after a while. It might have been different if I had a construction job or something physical. Then again, a physical job might have helped me get exercise during the days so who knows. Withdrawal is going to suck no matter, and there is no perfect time for it. The sooner I accept that the sooner I am going to be able to wade through it.

Congrats on 57 days. Well done.

Marcus

You posted just before me. Now that is the mindset you need to find my friend!!!

OpioPhobe

Marcus - you are right...it has been one complete ******** excuse after another. It is plain as day when I read back through everything. There have been points where I wanted to quit, but as soon as I go to bed and wake up the next day it is gone. I have done this a hundred times in the past, but actually seeing it written down in front of me is helpful.

You make a fair point about going cold turkey. The part about needing to have some level of functioning is legit though in my eyes. My wife will never be able to get my kids to school, to doctor appointments, etc. I can get a nanny to help with some things, but I can't expect her to act as a mother for 4 days straight. If I went cold turkey on a Thursday that might be able to work though. My eldest doesn't have school on Friday so I could start that Thursday. I wouldn't be that sick by the time I needed to pick her up. Actually, now that I think about it that could work. I am going to keep going now over the weekend, but if it ends up being more ******** then I can go cold turkey on Thursday.

cleaninLI

Yay! Opio!! you are Awesome! Remember you did it before so you can do it again! We are all here rootin for you! I'm so proud of you! As far as the kids go, try not to worry too much! It's ok if you aren't completely up on your game with them! Getting off is far more important right now! Trust me if they had a choice to have their Daddy a little under the weather right now....but off the H vs. remaining on it and totally attentive you know which one they'd choose right?

Just take it minute by minute.....second by second if need be! Remember a craving only lasts a few minutes. Stay with us as much as possible ok?


We love you opio!

Tiredofdrugs

Hey Hey Opio!

My last go round of trying to decide when to quit the opiates was a game of cat and mouse too! I fully understand trying to work out the time to have for getting that first time period in for the worst of it to go thru!

I ran myself out of opiates on purpose several times in order to go thru the w/d's only to have another major event rise up. 1. Our neighbors moved out of their home and had an auction that me and my husband helped with. 2. My dad was dying and I went on 3rd shift to care for him at my parent's home. He passed seven days later. 3. My mom moved in with us after he passed for a couple of months. I had to help her with all the paperwork that goes along with a parent passing. My mom is also like a ****-ant on speed! My slow moving world got an awakening! LOL She also brought 3 chihuahua dogs with her. Into a house of chickens. Not good! 4. Thanksgiving was decided by my two sisters to be done here at our home since mom was here and dad had passed! Oh My! 5. Then Christmas rolled around which was thankfully done at my older sister's house. 6. Mom moved back to her home and I set the date! 7. THEN? My husband got a call he was going to have surgery on his hand in three days! OMG! I was thinking? Will I ever get to detox? So we got thru the surgery and I said this is it! I'm doing this! Then on my 7th day off the pills? I get a call saying the family is meeting at a restaurant to celebrate my younger sister's 50th Birthday! Well thank God I had seven days under my feet and not two or three!

I borrowed pain meds from hubby to get to the next stage of time I had figured out for getting off them. I had a bottle of pills coming and I gave them to my husband to make up for the ones I got from him earlier. And I DID start the w/d's and get past the worst of it. That's why I now have 230 days clean!

Don't beat yourself up over sitting on the fence due to things happening around your world at home. Just remember to keep setting the date for the time you ARE going to do this thing! That is if you haven't already started it?

TOD

Chasingthedream

Hey Opio, it sounds like you are really struggling, and I feel for you. As a mother of 2 I totally understand how difficult it is looking after children when you are withdrawing/dealing with addiction.
I am talking as your friend who cares about your sobriety- and I am not judging you. We have all been round the merry-go-round a hundred times, but I am worried that there will always be an excuse not to go for it right now? There is always going to be some reason that the addict part of you comes up with for you to continue using. It always presents itself as a short term logical solution until the perfect time comes along for you to quit, but come on man- that perfect time to quit is a fallacy. And even if th perfect time comes along, what happens if you are in the middle of a binge and it passes you by without you noticing or you are too high to care at that exact moment?
You have reached back out again for a reason- I know you can do this, you did it before for going on 6 months, you can do it again. You know all the sayings- nothing changes if nothing changes. And maybe the situation with your wife and children isn't going to change until you embrace sobriety, not the other way round?
What is the exact situation at home- does your wife know you're using? Are you still full time carer looking aft the kids?
I know you can do this Opio!

OpioPhobe

I was able to sleep OK last night. Part of that was because I did take pretty close to my normal daily dose yesterday. All-in-all today hasn't been terrible so far. I am going to hold out as long as I can before taking any of the subs. For now, I do plan on taking the subs later today.


Chasing - my wife does know about my using. However, I used for a full month before she realizes that I was using again. Over that month I didn't lie a single time about it, and I didn't sneak around, manipulate, or conduct any of the normal nefarious activities that come with active addiction. It wasn't because I turned over a new leaf or anything along those lines. The reason was that I didn't have to do anything to hide it. She was locked away in her room busy with God knows what. That might give you an idea of how isolated she is from the rest of the family.

To answer your second question - Yes, I am the full time caregiver for the children. To be precise I would say that I am the primary caregiver because we do have a nanny that comes in some days. That is a huge blessing, and it gives me time to go to meetings or to conduct business. However, even with the nanny there is always a part of the day when I have to take care of the children.

That is all part of being a parent though, and I like taking care of the children. My problem is that she doesn't do anything with the children. Sometimes she doesn't even see my son for weeks, and we live in the same house! If I was a single parent things would be so much easier, because I wouldn't be distracted with my wife.

It is a catch-22 though, because a divorce would inevitably lead to her getting custody of the children. I would be condemning them to a live of utter misery to do that, and I would feel that I abandoned them to a crazy mother.

With regards to your point about me embracing sobriety and then looking for changes on the home front, that is exactly what I did last year. After hearing for so long that my using was the sole cause of the marital problems I foolishly began to believe it. Once my using went away her behavior actually worsened, and she continued to blame everything on my using despite the fact that my using had been removed. I remained patient, and I felt it only fair to give her some time to adjust. However, by the time last summer rolled around it was really wearing on me. My daughter beating on her door, and telling me that she wanted to see mommy was hurting me tremendously. Still, she obstinately refused to come out of her room.

She admitted at points that her whole charade was a form of punishment for me. I told her that I understood her still being resentful and angry at me, but I didn't understand why she was harming our children. That was met with a reply along the lines of "what do you expect when they have a heroin addict for a father". This was probably 5 or 6 months after I had quit. That was around the time that this whole thread began. I ended up just getting in the car and driving off because I couldn't take it any more. She coaxed me back under the guise that things would be different. I knew that they wouldn't be different, but I was sad to be away from my children. Also, she was already telling my daughter that I left because I didn't love her any more.

Anyway, I am not sure how this post turned into a novel, but I wanted to address your point thoroughly Chasing. If she changes it will have nothing to do with my using or not using. From the perspective of my wife using makes it easier to deal with her, because at least I don't have to guess at her excuse as to why she has cut herself off from the family. That was a mental torture all in itself to listen to her newest excuse day after day after day. I am only looking to quit now, because my habit is at the point where it is unsustainable. It has nothing to do with appeasing my wife, and once I quit it will do nothing to improve the situation with her.

OpioPhobe

Still holding out...withdrawal is ramping up significantly, but I know I don't want to take the subs too soon. Even though a lot of time has passed since the last dose I know that I have to wait until it gets real bad before taking them. I'll let everyone know how it goes.

Justincredible

Just keep surfing this wave buddy, you got it. I had to switch from methadone to subs and waiting a week was hell due to my slow metabolism and methadones incredible half life. luckily my doctor put me on oxy to cushion the blow, but then at the end I had to wait the 24 hours before inducting myself into the suboxone hall of fame.

It was bad but the wait at the end really wasn't too brutal, just got to the point where I "knew" I was in full w/ds and started with 2mg, which immediately helped. For about 5 mins I panicked, fearing the precipitated wd's but feeling "better" or not dope sick crushed those fears. Took subs for about a week, then tapered off, and then the methadone w/ds came back for another few weeks but not full blown, a lot softer around the edges. The short half life of the H should make your kick much shorter. Stay the course, you got this! Keep us posted, you have a lot of people in your corner.

EyesOfAStranger

Opio.....so glad to see you back here and that you are ok Was really worried about you. I have to echo what Lost said, in that you gave me a lot of great advice and support so I know you have it in you and so glad you are working to get back on track.

It's funny, in reading your posts I do see some excuses there yet at the same time, I get it. I'm sure most of us do. Yeah, there is no "good" time to quit yet there certain situations that make it even more of a challenge. I know your home/living situation doesn't make things easier either. I hope you are able to work through that to the best of your capability for your children at least

Just wanted to send my wishes your way. You are so worth it, you really are. It's going to suck, but you will get there. That is one thing I am sure of. Just hang on

OpioPhobe

Damn, I am getting lit up right now. If I had access to my ATM card I would have folded already. I took a strip about 30 minutes ago. No precipitated withdrawal. Strip slowed it down some, but it definitely isn't going to hold. Going to give it another hour before taking another one. Most of my other sub inductions ended at the 4 strip max. My last doctor told me that anything above 2 strips was useless, but that doesn't match my experience.

Thanks to everyone rooting for me. I'm not done for yet.

OpioPhobe

How the hell did I forget how ****** this is!? I can't believe I put myself through this AGAIN.

Tiredofdrugs

Opio! We never forget! It's just over time of using again the thoughts dull about the w/d's!

Let this be your last time of going thru this!

Clinch your fists and grit your teeth! You've done this before! You'll do it again!

TOD

OpioPhobe

I just pulled a trifecta in the bathroom. Going to take a 0.5mg Xanax sublingual to slow this panic down. It is building on itself.

cleaninLI

Opio....here with you. You can do this! You are stronger than you think! I know it sucks! But you can get thru. That Xanax will relax you! Just breath and think positive thoughts. You are cleansing yourself. You just have a few minutes to an hour of this than it's all done...behind you. Once the sub takes hold you will be ok!