courage2

Cow, I support the hourly activity logs. I suggest you spend about 45 minutes per.

Mesaman, that is the filthiest rock formation ever. And then when you finish it off with -- is there anything I can write that won't sound suggestive? -- beating sobriety with a stick.... I'm slain. Utterly.

MesaMan

Who? What? Me?-)

That ain't the best of it. That Formation/Area is called 'Garden Of Eden'.

Cruised all around this astounding Geology with Metal Music blasting in poifect Weather.

A Topical Tune, Maestro...

'Rock! Rock! ('Til You Drop)' ~ Def Leppard ~ Live
-

courage2

Well I guess that means that anybody who can see anything but what I see there is a blessed innocent, and that you and I ate the apple. Screw it, I ate the apple and swallowed the seeds.

fini

i looked at it and saw innocence hadn't been restored to me.
crumbs; now i'm realizing my favorite apple is called Ambrosia.

Leshar

Hey, Courage, that's funny. I thought the rocks looked a bit "rude" too. Still an amazing formation though.

Lenina

sorry, ((((walkies)))) didn't mean to leave you out. I'm just scattered the last few days.

I'm having anxiety too, probably work related as my time off draws near the end and reality returns.

Please don't anyone think I leave you out on purpose, I don't!

AG, that's nice about leaving bequeathment! We had a good crowd last night. And our chef had outdid himself. We had lots of donations kicked in and a good harvest at the local gardens!

everyone have a good afternoon. I'll be around and about today, I need to hang my new curtains.

Love from Lenina

strategery

I hope everyone is having better days.

I was hoping to get some advice from you guys.
With being sober, I have recently noticed a fairly large character flaw. The gist of this flaw is that I am extremely self-critical and don't allow myself to be proud of any accomplishment. Instead, I tend to minimize and dismiss any accomplishment I should feel extremely proud of. Have any of you experienced the same thing and what have you done to overcome this?

RobbyRobot

Hi strategery.

Back in those early weeks and months of my sobriety I too was super-critical of myself. In group therapy I came to realize shame and guilt I was carrying around unresolved was why I couldn't allow myself off the hamster wheel of self-criticism. It became impossible for me to really move ahead until I came face to face with myself about shame and guilt. Without the booze, I had more clarity of mind after a couple weeks of being clean, and I was so use to pushing down my shame and guilt I automatically did so, even without the booze. Well, without the booze, pushing it all away didn't really happen, and so I fell into pushing almost everything away, and this included feeling proud on my accomplishments as well. Kind of like using a shotgun effect to get rid of the bad but wrecking the good too.

Have you been working on any of your possible regrets, shames, and guilt?
If not, you may find some relief by doing so. And if you are already, you may want to tweak what is working to feel better asap.

Just food for thought if nothing else based on my own experiences. I hope things work out for you. Since your sober, you have every right to feel proud of yourself and your accomplishments!

silentrun

I did that. I had a loop running in the background of how worthless I was. I had been trained to think of myself as lowly and even the mere thought that I might do something cool was arrogance. Whenever I would try to feel good about an accomplishment immediately Who do you think you are?...you don't deserve anything...stop trying to take glory that does not belong to you
I watched countless hours of Ted talks. I found Brene Brown really helpful. You could start here
Brené Brown: The power of vulnerability | Talk Video | TED.com

Also Paper Dolls had a really good thread called Brave Girls Club. Something said on there is something I would say to myself when I would catch that dialogue going on in my head. You didn't deserve what happened to you. It sounds weird but for the longest time I though I did deserve to have bad things happen to me. Most of the people I grew up with should have been 5150ed along time ago. A kid can't say there is something wrong with the adults. A kid thinks there is something wrong with them.

chaosundivided

Is it kind of organisation?

silentrun

OMG I am so glad I wasn't the only one. I almost pmed Courage because of the whole wing incident.
Fini your comment made me think of this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nYuXgl3JHP0
make a wish baby and love will make it come true

fini

http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&...91386359,d.cGU

courage2

Strategery, I still am pretty self-critical, but no longer take it so personally, if you know what I mean

Really probing my past and discussing it with others has brought me to realize I'm no worse than many others have been, and asking for help or others' input with many current decisions has helped me do better as I go forward. This at least allows me to take responsibility for my deeds in a conscious way.

A lot of my sense of worthlessness came from knowing that I was in fact guilty of laziness, deceit, and manipulation of others to cover my alcoholism, to name just a few things. I felt like a fraud and I was one. Owning up to that and trying not to perpetuate those faults has taken a long time, and it will be longer before I completely lose that habit of doubting myself. But close examination of myself has helped stay sober, because I acknowledge that I can and must make changes in many dimensions, and if I drink again, it will be much more than a physical relapse.

alphaomega

Strat - I have noticed a trend in alcoholics, that I most definitely display - ALL OR NOTHING THINKING. I am just coming out of another alcohol induced fog being almost 4 months of continuous sobriety. My thinking regarding my life circumstances is starting to clear a bit and realization of reality is peeking around the corner.

I always, ALWAYS have thought (no matter what I have endured, faced, overcome, etc) that I am "weak". It is laughable really in regard to what challenges life has presented me with. But regardless of my triumphs and willingness to go forward, in my head, I'm still weak. I think this is conditioning from growing up in a fully and wholely dysfunctional environment.

Only now, after some good sober time under my belt, am I able to view it with clearer eyes that I'm a god damn warrior in every sense of the word.

But old habits, those bastards die hard.

Turtle82

Thank you.

Littlebear

Alpha omega. Sorry to come into the thread at this very late point...although I read here lots (as I do other threads) I feel that I am butting in a little into what seems quite fragile. So forgive me if my input isn't so welcome right now. I thought I'd risk it...

When I read your 'I am able to view it with clearer eyes that I'm a goddam warrier' I spontaneously burst into some tears... Tearful...for you (that I don't know), for me (that i co), and for well...just all of us. It's profoundly sad that we (humans) that had to endurie awful beginnings in our young lives...often mature into another version of the unkind souls who helped shape our destiny - in piling onto ourselves condemnation. All I wanted to say...

alphaomega

Awww, Littlebear.

I'm touched that you reached out. Thank you for saying that.

Welcome to our little corner of the world. So nice to have you here.

walkbeformakrun

Just kidding about that Lenina. I know you can't mention everyone who posts here sporadically. Gave me a chance to post just bc I was left off the list.

Walk - Checking in here!

Lenina

hi Chaos! Welcome! I don't know if we are a club but you're welcome to join us!

Love from Lenina

AddictGuy

Dealing with self-condemnation

I hold my hand up high. Me! Me! Me! OMG the tapes that run. "Who do you think you are? What do you think you are doing? You can't. I can't." Some days more, some days less, but it is like the background music of my life.

I wake up with it in the morning. I go to bed with it at night. Day after day, month after month, year after year. And much more so as time goes by. And, in between the rain drops, I try to define myself and live my life. A therapist called them cognitive distortions. Hurrah! There's a name for it. She told me to try to understand what it meant. She also wanted me on medication for it. She gave me a book on anxiety and depression related to such things. That author said that medication doesn’t teach anyone to cope. Me? I intend to cope. Nose to nose with this adversary within.

They say that, in our minds, the effects of childhood abuse can be cumulative. A kind of drip, drip, drip over the decades that can leave you just wanting to scream. So, what does it mean? To me it means my mother, my dad and my older brother. It means parents that had no business being parents and with my brother, who learned how not to be loved, he learned also how to not love me. I would normally give each of you on the thread credit for things you have contributed to this discussion but, really, I can go researching all of who said what and all of that but, please, just bear with me and let me get on with writing this.

There’s the confusion of how it was really them that were screwing things up, but we get to thinking it was us. That was good and that was true. When you are just a little kid, it is your family that defines you, the world and your place in it – for you. It’s all you know. It’s just how it is. It has such a powerful influence on who we grow up to be and then how we go on to define ourselves, others and our place in the world. I can not emphasis that enough. It is the default mode "us". And it may just have to be our primary mission in life not to run on default mode.

And as another one of us in this discussion said, so you have opted to be a warrior. And yes, we choose to be warriors about dealing with our unwanted thoughts, feelings and our poor self-images, or those same thoughts, feelings and imageries very much have the potential to just go about wrecking limitless havoc in every direction of the compass.

I just know that those thoughts are not me and that only I am in my head, as much as I have to fight for that to be my reality. I know that those people are not here anymore, even though, I often, often see them in others who have come since. I project my family onto them. I often, even find myself drawn to them because in my insecurity, I want to go back home, to people who remind me of home – to recreate home, where, ironically, I suffered from the very abuse that caused me to be this way in the first place. I have to create a new “home”. A new center.

There’s a line in an old Police song with Sting: “Every woman I go out with becomes my mother in the end.” It may or may not be your mother, but like this woman I lived with for a few years told me. To her, as she walked along, there was a rapist behind every tree.” Like that.

It is just something I and countless others like me have to be constantly aware of and to be just that warrior, constantly reclaiming our own minds, sorting through and sorting out the thoughts we do not choose, and constantly working to define ourselves as worthy and deserving, and to go on and live our lives to the very fullest with everything we have in us. Again, ironically, such powerful motivators can end up making us so much more than we would have ever been otherwise.

Churchill said: Kites fly highest against the wind. He also said that a solitary tree, if it grows at all, grows strong.

I accept the challenge, and I will be a better person for it.

It felt good to share this with all of you. I am out of the closet about it and I will not go quietly.