thomas11

What is your degree in?

TorchedGrave

Philosophy.

thomas11

I see. I don't know if all your previous coursework would be per-say, but I see your point. You are young, and if you are really determined to go back to school, I would make a decision and do it now. Or seek out an opportunity that appeals to you.

TorchedGrave

Day 112

If you go back into one of my first posts, you'll recall that one of the prime reasons I wanted to stop drinking was to alleviate, to the extent that I could, the anhedonia. Now, I've read the studies and am a bit informed of addiction science in general, but I know that, with alcohol in particular, anhedonia is one of the strongest predictors of relapse. Not surprising. I was definitely expecting the anhedonia to be worse during the initial stages, but I wasn't expecting it to last this long. Sure, maybe in the scheme of things ~3 months is nothing, but then again I've only been "drinking" for about two years. All of this is to say that I was expecting at least some relief by this point.

Whatever though. Time will tell.

TorchedGrave

Just four weeks left.

TorchedGrave

Just less than four weeks left.

thomas11

Tomorrow will be even less than less than four weeks left.

Soberwolf

Your doing great TG

TorchedGrave

Just less than less than four weeks left.

thomas11

By the way, what's in four weeks? Is that when your new Ferrari gets delivered?

TorchedGrave

It's actually a Porsche.

thomas11

Cheapskate.

TorchedGrave

This is the best news I've had all year: http://www.usatoday.com/story/weathe...cast/84588334/

TorchedGrave

Day 116

So I've been thinking a lot about what Dee had said previously, which was


And as I've also made clear, I fully agree that abstinence is not synonymous with control. The question, though, is how can I know the difference? It's kind of like that joke about going to the doctor and telling him, "My arm hurts when I do this," and he says, "Well stop doing that!" It's not really a fix. I see abstinence the same way. It's not really a "cure," and, as Dee said, it's not the same as control.

So back to the question -- how can I know whether I am truly in control? This is a serious question. You know it's like, if you break your arm, then you go do physical therapy, but the only way to know whether you've regained your strength is to actually experiment, right?

All of this is to say that, how can I know whether these three months have been all for naught unless I can reexamine my relationship with alcohol? Does that make sense?

I'm not trying to rationalize my thinking in order to justify drinking again. I'm just genuinely wondering how exactly I can delineate the distinction between abstinence and control. Do I deliberately put myself into situations in which alcohol is available, and see how I react? Do I go sniff rubbing alcohol and see if that triggers a craving? I really don't know.

Jsbodhi

I love philosophy

aNewEternity

I don't know, but to me it sounds like you're overcomplicating by moving into academic questions.

I, personally, firmly believe that "to drink or not to drink" is a personal choice that you have to make. for all the talk of triggers and slippery places - and one should be conscious of such things, sure - ultimately it is up to you to pour the drink down the throat, or not.

I don't know exactly what you meant by your "time to experiment" comment on Day 100. it is absolutely possible that you'd be able to use alcohol in a non-destructive way, and it's absolutely possible that you would fall into the same destructive drinking habits that let you to quit. and it's absolutely true that you can't know if you can do it unless you try.

the question you have to answer is, is it worth it? you can live with not knowing.

one thing you could do to think through the problem is a 'cost-benefit analysis' - try to list all of the positives about Drinking that you can, then all of the Negatives about drinking, then all of the positives about Not Drinking, then all of the negatives about Not Drinking.

I realize that your 'adhenonia' feeds into a lot of thoughts, it sounds like you're suffering for stimulation. I don't know of any quick fixes for that, and I'd be lying to you if I said I knew it would get better. stay strong buddy.

Dee74

Abstinence means I'm/you're not drinking...control means we're trying to.
Sounds a pretty clear separation to me.

The lack of control with alcohol never changes.
I could drink again today and sooner or later I'd be back at 2007 or worse.

I've known guys who went back to drinking after 20 or 30 years. Same deal. Ground Zero.

There is no control, now or ever.

What you might be calling control, I call acceptance.

I accept drinking bleach is not healthy. I accept I cannot drink for the same reasons.

In this scenario though it would be like breaking your arm with a sledgehammer and then 6 months later bringing a sledgehammer down again to see if the arm breaks again.

Do you feel the need to prove your mastery over alcohol TG?

D

TorchedGrave

Yeah sure but just because I can doesn't mean that I should. I can live without ever bathing again, but I won't. Knowing how things work and looking into the blackbox are precisely what I live for.

But I get you. Don't poke the bear. Can I outrun him? Probably not, but it's not worth finding out.

I think I'm the point now where I've just accepted that this is how my life is. You know how some people are tall, some people are short, well, I'm anhedonic. Oh well. It's not me being a pessimist. I've just learned to accept this, kind of like having a permanent limp.

A need? Definitely not.

At the end of the day, I try to remind myself of this simple truth: I don't need it. I don't need to drink. Things are going fine without it. (None of this is to suggest that if/when things are all of a sudden "not going fine" that it will then be OK to drink.) No. I'm just saying that, for right now at least, my not drinking is not an issue in my life. It's not causing me stress. It's not an itch that I have to scratch. It has just become the norm. It's my de facto mode of living. All of which is to say that this inquiry was largely "academic" in nature, insofar as it was motivated more so by curiosity than by a desire to actually find out.

thomas11

If I understand the last few posts correctly, you've come full circle. I know that this is an unpopular point of view, but I actually agree with your original premise. You won't know what you're relationship is with alcohol unless you were to venture into that territory again. You might be just fine. Of course, you might NOT be just fine as well. And we both know there is only one way to fine out. But, your last post is much wiser, You don't need it, and you don't have an itch that needs scratching so why mess with it. If you are fine with that, I say let sleeping dogs lye. Your sobriety is a known factor, you drinking again is an unknown quantity (not sure I'm using that word correctly there). I think you know what I'm saying.

TorchedGrave

I get what you're saying 100%. Couldn't have said it better myself.