Class of December-Part 4
Drunkaholic
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Channelview, TX (Houston)
Posts: 514
Warren ... I'm glad you're OK.
As I have mentioned in a previous post, I have discussed the prospect of drinking with my therapist. Not in an asking permission sort of way, but more in a way that if I drank too much because of what was wrong with me mentally, can people go back to drinking if they treat the root cause.
I do miss the romantic aspects of drinking, the most excellent Scotches and experimenting in the wine department trying to find the perfect under $10 wine and then playing the same game under $20. These were my previous drinking hobbies, they tended to be the activities I did that did lead to responsible drinking.
But now I feel like a dog that runs in a yard with an electric fence. I just can't seem to get beyond that fence. My mind reminds me of this year spent hangover free, and how my LOVE FOR MYSELF seems to have grown beyond belief.
To me it is as though I have left behind a character flaw, such as I suddenly quit being a liar.
Quietly, inside I no longer feel a sense of weakness because I fear being too drunk, but now I find myself having some odd sense of superiority over those who do. I don't ever vocalize these thoughts, but I suspect they are just coping mechanisms.
Yes, I am taking your experience and plugging it into my personal computer and reaffirming my thoughts on "slipping" for myself.
My best days are the days when I don't think about drinking at all. I like it when I don't have the internal discussions on whether I could have a red wine with this meal.
Life always seems better when I don't have to stand guard outside my mind's door that leads to my happiness.
As I have mentioned in a previous post, I have discussed the prospect of drinking with my therapist. Not in an asking permission sort of way, but more in a way that if I drank too much because of what was wrong with me mentally, can people go back to drinking if they treat the root cause.
I do miss the romantic aspects of drinking, the most excellent Scotches and experimenting in the wine department trying to find the perfect under $10 wine and then playing the same game under $20. These were my previous drinking hobbies, they tended to be the activities I did that did lead to responsible drinking.
But now I feel like a dog that runs in a yard with an electric fence. I just can't seem to get beyond that fence. My mind reminds me of this year spent hangover free, and how my LOVE FOR MYSELF seems to have grown beyond belief.
To me it is as though I have left behind a character flaw, such as I suddenly quit being a liar.
Quietly, inside I no longer feel a sense of weakness because I fear being too drunk, but now I find myself having some odd sense of superiority over those who do. I don't ever vocalize these thoughts, but I suspect they are just coping mechanisms.
Yes, I am taking your experience and plugging it into my personal computer and reaffirming my thoughts on "slipping" for myself.
My best days are the days when I don't think about drinking at all. I like it when I don't have the internal discussions on whether I could have a red wine with this meal.
Life always seems better when I don't have to stand guard outside my mind's door that leads to my happiness.
mergirl
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Paradise
Posts: 4,161
Originally Posted by ExNavyInHouston 
Warren ... I'm glad you're OK.
But now I feel like a dog that runs in a yard with an electric fence. I just can't seem to get beyond that fence. My mind reminds me of this year spent hangover free, and how my LOVE FOR MYSELF seems to have grown beyond belief.
To me it is as though I have left behind a character flaw, such as I suddenly quit being a liar.
Quietly, inside I no longer feel a sense of weakness because I fear being too drunk, but now I find myself having some odd sense of superiority over those who do. I don't ever vocalize these thoughts, but I suspect they are just coping mechanisms.
Life always seems better when I don't have to stand guard outside my mind's door that leads to my happiness.
But now I feel like a dog that runs in a yard with an electric fence. I just can't seem to get beyond that fence. My mind reminds me of this year spent hangover free, and how my LOVE FOR MYSELF seems to have grown beyond belief.
To me it is as though I have left behind a character flaw, such as I suddenly quit being a liar.
Quietly, inside I no longer feel a sense of weakness because I fear being too drunk, but now I find myself having some odd sense of superiority over those who do. I don't ever vocalize these thoughts, but I suspect they are just coping mechanisms.
Life always seems better when I don't have to stand guard outside my mind's door that leads to my happiness.
bona fido dog-lover
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SF Bay area, CA
Posts: 99,800
Warren, my dear friend, I'm sorry to hear of your slip, but glad you got right back up on the wagon. I'm not going to "yell" at you either, just glad you came right back to sobriety. I love you and wish the best for you.
:ghug3
:ghug3
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,055
Don't have much time cause I need to get out and do those darn errands! lol But I wanted to say to Charles, I really enjoyed reading your post =) Very insightful and kind.
And also the pics are amazing! Love them.
Okay, off to get ready for my Babys day! Oh and Warren she *LOVES* music!
And also the pics are amazing! Love them.
Okay, off to get ready for my Babys day! Oh and Warren she *LOVES* music!
Drunkaholic
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Channelview, TX (Houston)
Posts: 514
Warren --
Whatever it takes for you to get to your goal, and the goal isn't really sobriety, it is to have the greatest amount of love for yourself, balanced against the least amount of guilt.
Drinking may be just one of many behaviors we need to cast out of our lives to find happiness, but those are for different forums.
Whatever it takes for you to get to your goal, and the goal isn't really sobriety, it is to have the greatest amount of love for yourself, balanced against the least amount of guilt.
Drinking may be just one of many behaviors we need to cast out of our lives to find happiness, but those are for different forums.
Thriving sober since 12/18/08
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 3,115
See I had an entire wordy response to your post warren. I deleted it and retyped it a few times.
All I will say are the following things:
Your sobriety is your own. Mine is MY only responsibility. Yours is none of my business. There's a few people on here that have really fuzzy logic about what it means to be sober or have sober time. To each his/her own! Not my interest.
Whatever works for you, works for you. What you've done so far hasn't seemed to work for you at all.
You refer to your battle with alcohol. Respectfully, this isn't a battle. Alcohol already won. Maybe thinking that you will defeat somethingabout it helps keep you stuck.
You also talk about not having another drink in regards to feeling like you're on a diet forever. I'm sad for you that alcohol is still so hugely important to you, and so deeply felt as something you enjoy, outweighing whatever negatives most all of us can predict it will bring. I don't know how much more any of 'us' here can tell you how helpful it is to have assitance with all this, but for whatever reason you've not explored it, and that again is your business.
Smacked said something in another thread that I really liked, something to the effect of "Abstinence has very little to do with recovery. Recovery however, has everything to do with keeping me abstinent".
All I will say are the following things:
Your sobriety is your own. Mine is MY only responsibility. Yours is none of my business. There's a few people on here that have really fuzzy logic about what it means to be sober or have sober time. To each his/her own! Not my interest.
Whatever works for you, works for you. What you've done so far hasn't seemed to work for you at all.
You refer to your battle with alcohol. Respectfully, this isn't a battle. Alcohol already won. Maybe thinking that you will defeat somethingabout it helps keep you stuck.
You also talk about not having another drink in regards to feeling like you're on a diet forever. I'm sad for you that alcohol is still so hugely important to you, and so deeply felt as something you enjoy, outweighing whatever negatives most all of us can predict it will bring. I don't know how much more any of 'us' here can tell you how helpful it is to have assitance with all this, but for whatever reason you've not explored it, and that again is your business.
Smacked said something in another thread that I really liked, something to the effect of "Abstinence has very little to do with recovery. Recovery however, has everything to do with keeping me abstinent".
Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,055
I was reading in the Alcoholism forum, something I rarely do and came across this post. It's by Community Greeter Chip and I hope since I'm quoting and giving him credit it's okay for me to repost this! If not Dee, let me know =) I found it fitting considering what we've been talking about.
I want to respond to another thing I read but need to get my head straight first, long day and super tired! lol
Originally Posted by chip
Hi Everyone,
Just a thought about "trying it again".
I had a friend who was an alcoholic like myself. He was only 2 years older than me (I'm 35). His doctor told him to quit drinking because his body couldn't handle it. He had many of the physical symptoms I had when I quit (bruising, withdrawals, chest pains, bloody stools etc....) He quit, and patched together some good sober time. At some point, he stopped going to AA.
Later, he decided he wanted to "try it again" (Drinking). They found him dead. He didn't even drink alot. His organs gave up on him.
This is a life and death disease. People die from it. PLEASE ask for help, here or elsewhere, if you feel like drinking again. It's sad when we see someone die....it's preventable.
If you are here because you are an alcoholic, remember that drinking = death. There is no such thing as "a couple beers". There are no more REASONS to drink, only EXCUSES. For any of us, our next drink could result in our death.
chip
Just a thought about "trying it again".
I had a friend who was an alcoholic like myself. He was only 2 years older than me (I'm 35). His doctor told him to quit drinking because his body couldn't handle it. He had many of the physical symptoms I had when I quit (bruising, withdrawals, chest pains, bloody stools etc....) He quit, and patched together some good sober time. At some point, he stopped going to AA.
Later, he decided he wanted to "try it again" (Drinking). They found him dead. He didn't even drink alot. His organs gave up on him.
This is a life and death disease. People die from it. PLEASE ask for help, here or elsewhere, if you feel like drinking again. It's sad when we see someone die....it's preventable.
If you are here because you are an alcoholic, remember that drinking = death. There is no such thing as "a couple beers". There are no more REASONS to drink, only EXCUSES. For any of us, our next drink could result in our death.
chip
Thriving sober since 12/18/08
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 3,115
Warren, how you live your life, and deal with your issues with alcohol is your own.. like I said.
I think we are at odds when it comes to this whole sobriety thing, and I always respect differences in opinions and approaches. It would be disrespectful to you if I were to be dishonest or give you a hug for 1. drinking, and 2. for not putting any tools together to support you in this 'battle' you feel you have going on.
I care about you, we differ in our thoughts and approach to this.. and that's ok. Isn't it?
You requested feedback, and I do not apologize that my feedback wasn't a virtual pat on the back. You should know me better than that by now, and I know you don't 'respond well' to tough love, and it's not even what my way is, I'm just honest.. maybe brutally honest.. maybe too blunt. I can't sugar coat over the tragedy of this stuff.
I wasn't even going to post, obviously I attempted, deleted, edited, tried again, deleted and came back and finally summarized some thoughts after thinking about it a bit further. I will never be anything but up front and honest with anyone here, or elsewhere in my life. Sometimes it doesn't come wrapped up in pretty paper and a song. This is life or death for the most part.. and that's what drives me sometimes. If you are hurt or offended by anything I said, do know that's not my intention.
I think we are at odds when it comes to this whole sobriety thing, and I always respect differences in opinions and approaches. It would be disrespectful to you if I were to be dishonest or give you a hug for 1. drinking, and 2. for not putting any tools together to support you in this 'battle' you feel you have going on.
I care about you, we differ in our thoughts and approach to this.. and that's ok. Isn't it?
You requested feedback, and I do not apologize that my feedback wasn't a virtual pat on the back. You should know me better than that by now, and I know you don't 'respond well' to tough love, and it's not even what my way is, I'm just honest.. maybe brutally honest.. maybe too blunt. I can't sugar coat over the tragedy of this stuff.
I wasn't even going to post, obviously I attempted, deleted, edited, tried again, deleted and came back and finally summarized some thoughts after thinking about it a bit further. I will never be anything but up front and honest with anyone here, or elsewhere in my life. Sometimes it doesn't come wrapped up in pretty paper and a song. This is life or death for the most part.. and that's what drives me sometimes. If you are hurt or offended by anything I said, do know that's not my intention.
Thriving sober since 12/18/08
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 3,115
I've mentioned I'm going to pursue therapy and I want to read a few good books that have been suggested for further help
Do what you will. I wish you luck, and health. I don't make comments here lightly or for my own entertainment. I'm sorry that you don't/can't find value in what I have said. I think for now, I'll leave this thread.. I'm not going to play into this back and forth of dissecting each line we write to each other. You have a lot of love and support here. I know you'll rally together and be great with each other. I don't fit here.
Take care, I'm done here... I know when to walk away.
Drunkaholic
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Channelview, TX (Houston)
Posts: 514
Since this is a Sobriety forum I have to believe it should be common place that people would come in here and discuss their trials and tribulations with their S/DoC.
In my naivete, I never took Warren's open discussion of his thoughts and fears as true indicators for a eventual return to drinking.
I actually felt you (Warren) were being honest and forthright. I suspected this honesty was from your heart and that made it pure. I thought you were using the forum as it was intended.
Now remember, this is all through my filter.
Everyone else here sees their sobriety a certain way and have a whole value system perceived in their mind that keeps them in check and safe. Our dashboards have our warning lights in different places.
Some people seem to be able to walk away from it and their example is admired, while others struggle every single day. Some people who walk calmly away are just plain lucky and not gifted or skilled at working a program.
My recent thoughts about wine with dinner were not a surprise to me. I knew they would come. I have lived in my flesh and heard the BS my brain can come up with for almost a half century. Plus, you have to factor in my countless attempts to get away from drinking for 30 years.
This time with the "wine thoughts" it was different, but no credit to myself. For me, my sobriety is mostly luck. Sure, I doing some good things like therapy and adding positive sober activities in my life, but who the hell knows what temptation lurks around the next corner.
As soon as I got those wine thoughts, it was like white blood cells on attack of some "infection" in my brain. I bombarded those fleeting thoughts with a million examples of why I quit in the first place.
I went on attack like no other time, remembering hang overs, championing my current fitness, the way I feel every morning, the progress of therapy. I mean it was like rapid fire.
When the dust settled from that moment, I felt so loved. I didn't feel fear or like I had some close call. I felt like there was a part of me that was actually coming to my own defense. It was a beautiful moment.
The AA folks call what I experienced Stinking Thinking, but I have no idea what they call how my brain went on attack.
I don't have the Time in Ranks in the Sobriety Army, and I have 30 year history of failure, so I can't give you real advice either. But I can say you do appear to have been mostly on the right track.
Like I said earlier, if there is a second slip then YOU MUST face the truth if you are to succeed.
I do wish you would look into counseling ... and get a real bulldog who won't let you get away with rationalizations (and other synonyms for BS).
You have accomplished a lot, but there is much more work to be done.
Even those of us who have made our decision to stop, moved on in positive ways will all return to the gates of hell we remember as temptation. It will happen, it always does.
But when it is happening everyday, what we are doing is not working. It's like we are at a carnival on the bumper cars. We get knocked hard and the car faces a whole other direction, but we hit the pedal and the car takes off in the new direction. It could be right into another car, into a blocked jam of a group of stalled cars or out into a clearing with a temporary feeling of freedom.
Even with all these options we still have our hands on a wheel and our feet on the pedal to keep making decisions until we find one that works for us.
I'm mostly rambling now because I care about you. Don't take any of our words in any other way here but from a very caring place.
You have been most excellent at reading our words of encouragement or even tough love at times and not thinking of it as an attack.
Every day here is a form of intervention.
In my naivete, I never took Warren's open discussion of his thoughts and fears as true indicators for a eventual return to drinking.
I actually felt you (Warren) were being honest and forthright. I suspected this honesty was from your heart and that made it pure. I thought you were using the forum as it was intended.
Now remember, this is all through my filter.
Everyone else here sees their sobriety a certain way and have a whole value system perceived in their mind that keeps them in check and safe. Our dashboards have our warning lights in different places.
Some people seem to be able to walk away from it and their example is admired, while others struggle every single day. Some people who walk calmly away are just plain lucky and not gifted or skilled at working a program.
My recent thoughts about wine with dinner were not a surprise to me. I knew they would come. I have lived in my flesh and heard the BS my brain can come up with for almost a half century. Plus, you have to factor in my countless attempts to get away from drinking for 30 years.
This time with the "wine thoughts" it was different, but no credit to myself. For me, my sobriety is mostly luck. Sure, I doing some good things like therapy and adding positive sober activities in my life, but who the hell knows what temptation lurks around the next corner.
As soon as I got those wine thoughts, it was like white blood cells on attack of some "infection" in my brain. I bombarded those fleeting thoughts with a million examples of why I quit in the first place.
I went on attack like no other time, remembering hang overs, championing my current fitness, the way I feel every morning, the progress of therapy. I mean it was like rapid fire.
When the dust settled from that moment, I felt so loved. I didn't feel fear or like I had some close call. I felt like there was a part of me that was actually coming to my own defense. It was a beautiful moment.
The AA folks call what I experienced Stinking Thinking, but I have no idea what they call how my brain went on attack.
I don't have the Time in Ranks in the Sobriety Army, and I have 30 year history of failure, so I can't give you real advice either. But I can say you do appear to have been mostly on the right track.
Like I said earlier, if there is a second slip then YOU MUST face the truth if you are to succeed.
I do wish you would look into counseling ... and get a real bulldog who won't let you get away with rationalizations (and other synonyms for BS).
You have accomplished a lot, but there is much more work to be done.
Even those of us who have made our decision to stop, moved on in positive ways will all return to the gates of hell we remember as temptation. It will happen, it always does.
But when it is happening everyday, what we are doing is not working. It's like we are at a carnival on the bumper cars. We get knocked hard and the car faces a whole other direction, but we hit the pedal and the car takes off in the new direction. It could be right into another car, into a blocked jam of a group of stalled cars or out into a clearing with a temporary feeling of freedom.
Even with all these options we still have our hands on a wheel and our feet on the pedal to keep making decisions until we find one that works for us.
I'm mostly rambling now because I care about you. Don't take any of our words in any other way here but from a very caring place.
You have been most excellent at reading our words of encouragement or even tough love at times and not thinking of it as an attack.
Every day here is a form of intervention.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,495
I think it's true what you say Charles - with very few exceptions, noone here on SR takes the time to write a post without it coming from a place of caring and, sometimes, concern.
I'm very happy to read statements like this from you Warren
I don't think anyone can argue with that 
D
I'm very happy to read statements like this from you Warren
Some problem drinkers can drink again in moderation without a problem - there's no denying this - I just happen NOT to be one of them. It will never be *OK* for me to drink.
D
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