geekorunique

As the al anons would say - detach with love - it's all you can do.

faithfully

No, thought about that, no. I tried to leave and the last time he wound up in the hospital. I love and care for him and am sad, but I'd rather he didn't need me in any way other than spending time, like all friends.

faithfully

[QUOTE=smacked;2387095]Crack is what is killing him. How does he get it if he is so ill? Are you providing it?

I provide him money and that is bad enough. But when someone is in agony, crying, waking you up at all hours, not taking no for an answer and in sheer agony and won't go to the doctor, I give in. It is delivered even though I tell him to go out an get it, he can't hardly move until he gets some

suki44883

With all due respect, Faithfully, that is not your problem. It's his problem, and he's never going to do anything to help himself so long as you are there doing it for him. He has to hit his bottom, and you being there taking care of him keeps him from doing that. You need to take care of you and let him figure out how to take care of himself; and if he doesn't do that, it's NOT your fault. I'm willing to bet though, that if you left and refused to help him in any way, he would reach the point where he would beg for the ambulance to come get him and take him to the hospital. Then, you would need to LEAVE him there and let them do their jobs. I know it's not easy, but with you sitting there with a front row seat to all the drama, you're just allowing yourself to be drawn into it. You need to get out and stay out.

outtolunch

It certainly sounds like he's in the midst of decay and belongs in a hospital.

So long as you care and provide for him he has no reason to consider other alternatives.

But you know what, this is not about him. It's about taking care of yourself. I don't even know you but I do know that you deserve to treat yourself better than you have been.

rayofsunshine

As long as he has a warm bed, food, tv... all the basic necessities and $$ provided to him for crack, this will be your life. Nothing changes if nothing changes. Just wondering, what if his dying takes years and years and years.... are you willing to stay with things just as they are now? (Likely it will only get worse.)

YOUR sanity and peace are important, too. You are worth removing yourself from this situation. Do the humane thing and report him to Adult Protective Services when you leave, so you can leave with some peace of mind knowing someone will look into situation and get him the help he needs.

((((HUGS))) I know how hopeless you feel... but please take baby steps to do what's needed.

Adding my prayers for you.

P.S. God WILL forgive you... all you have to do is ask... he'll also give you the strength you need to do the next right thing.

Wolfstarr

I have read this entire thread and the suggestions given are heartfelt and true. Please, take them.
Take the guilt that you have and that you must "save" him and stow it away, far away. You can't save him. The very best thing for him is for you to leave.

I was given this advice and I begrudgingly took it. It saved a loved one's life.

It will either help him or not, but it's not a loving thing to do to destroy yourself for him.
Love yourself, help yourself. You have the absolute almighty power to do this, and in doing so, you will be helping your loved one.
Prayers for you and him as well...

teke

i think i remember you too. i've read this entire post and it has left me in pain for you. i'm a recovering addict and i agree that crack will numb the pain but IT IS NOT A MEDICINE. if i remember correctly, according to what you posted in the past, you had not talked to his doctors, you only hear what he's telling you the doctors are saying, right?

you say if you leave, he'll end up in the hospital, right? isn't thats where you are trying to encourage him to go? don't you think a hospital can help him more than you can by supplying him his drugs, food and a warm place to crash?

it is not your fault he ended up in the hospital while you were away. he may be sick but sounds like he's telling you whatever he needs to, in order to convince you to continue to help him do his drugs. he ended up in the hospital because he needed medical help and he didnt have you to help him stay doped up. i think he probably won't except medical help because crack addicts would rather do crack than to care about their health. i've been very sick too, but as long as i could do my crack and stay high, i wasn't thinking about going in for the surgery that ended up saving my life.

i lost my little brother to addiction but i refused to help him die by supplying his habit. at least i didn't have to feel guilty for helping him to kill himself.

'M sorry but imo, this man may be using his illness to guilt you into staying with him and supplying his drug habit. so you allow him to have his drugs delivered to the house where you live? did you know that this could bring YOU jail time and cause you to lose your home, car and anything else you own.

i pray that your hp gives you the strength to step aside, hopefully he'll end up in the hospital again, where he can possible get the medical attention that he sounds to desperately need. you are not helping him to get better only to die faster. crack kills.

cessy68

Hi faithfully,

I'm truely concerned for your emotional well-being. I looked at this thread, with my mouth hanging open, and I wondered if I should even respond.... the reason: because I can not comprehend where you are at, or why you 'feel' this way.

Then I thought about what you said, and one of the first things was, "I used to come here-- if felt likr some of you 'didn't like me'."

That in itself speaks loudly. Clearly you don't like yourself, othewise you wouldn't need affirmation from people here... or from this very sick man.

A lot of people here --- INCLUDING ME, have done things/said things/ etc. that we are not 'proud of'.... with that being said, I understand there are extremes to all behaviors, including addiction & co-dependency.

Ask yourself some questions, like what are you saying about yourself 'supporting' a MAN financially? What are you saying about yourself, by 'aiding' a person to do drugs, but refuses medical treatment that is CLEARLY needed? Obviously you aren't sleeping in a bed with a man that is filled with boils, and his flesh is rotting with infection.... what about YOUR health? what are YOU GETTING OUT OF THIS RELATIONSHIP?

Perhaps you don't want to 'see' that this is absolutly out of control. Your refusal to take some AUTHENTIC responsiblity and accountablity for YOUR PART in all of this, is ultimately going to cause YOU to be ill.... frankly I think you are already.

A blind person could see that sitting by and feeling held prisoner by a man who is letting his body rot away, is utterly unhealthy. Furthermore, what kind of SICK, SICK individual would ask you to witness this??

He is dead wrong in asking/expecting/ etc......... but for some reason, YOU taught him that this is all you are worth. (Sitting by and watching him use drugs and rot away).

Faithfully, I would seriously seek out some professional help for YOU, before it's too late. I'm quite sure that you can't see what you are doing to yourself.

Can you even imagin having a 'normal' person in your life? Having a partner, who can go to the beach with you, or out to the movies? Take you to dinner, and a comedy show, and laugh till you cry? You are dyeing right now, instead of LIVING.

Try to see, what people here are telling you. DON'T take it as criticizm, but an EYE OPENER.

Try to keep posting, even if you hear things you might now want to hear.... it's only going to HELP YOU!!

Hugs,
Cessy

faithfully

Thank you everyone for your replies and responses. I will never forgive myself for what I've done. I will leave but I love him and worry about him. I always seem to do OK for myself but I refuse to let him be alone, possibly losing a limb in the hospital. I'm sorry that's just not called friendship. We have a different system in canada adult protection services, it's like the only choice I have is calling a cop and psychiatric nurse, for an assessment. If I've done all this to him by enabling him I will never forgive myself and no wonder. I feel like a complete evil person and apparently I am and you're right. Somehow it seems like I'm looking for vindication and I understand that I'm not to be vindicated. I have actually lost my spirit and one day too will be paid for it by dying in hell alone. It's like watching someone dying in front of you in pain and you're not going to give them something to help take the pain away? Everyone, including his methadone pharmicist is looking at me like I'm wrong because I can't force him to get medical care and yes I want him to go to a hospital but often enough, they really don't do anything... with all the disease in IC units etc, it's actually not that safe for someone with open wounds. I want him to go to clinics, get referels to specialists, go to the wound care center, but I'd have to quit my job and drive him around. He is not well enough to take Handy Dart. I will of course take him to the hospital but NOT leave him alone in a hospital if he's getting surgeries, hospitals are not what everyone thinks. Somethings are complex and people who are codependent for addicts have much the same symptoms and sickness and codependents for acutely ill people who are not addicts. I appreciate all your help. I will remove myself from the situation, if only so that I am not giving him money for that stuff. I can figure out a way, I know but now that I've created such bad matters I'm not just going to walk out and leave him without any love or emotional support. I do agree I have to remove myself though from the situation so I will get myself ready, and hopefully I can do the next right thing. Thank you again.

faithfully

I feel all your prayers and will keep coming back. I am going to visit a friend tonight, made some food, and will come back tonight. I will only be around the corner. I am not leaving him tonight. But I will not give him any money. I will of course take him to the hospital though at any time he asks. He went out today on his bike but not for long. He is trying to rest right now and I have made him dinner for when he wants it. Thank you. I hope it's Ok if I check in later to re read all your posts, it gives me stregnth but makes me also feel very bad for what I've done

teke

faithfull, you are not to blame for his situation. you can only do so much. so far, you've done what you could to help him but unless you are working in the medical field, how can you help him like he needs to be helped.

i'm still curious to know if you have actually heard his doctor tell you his diagnosis or is it him who is relaying his doctors messages. i honestly don't believe that god will punish you for stepping aside and allowing him to get to the place where he wants to seek help for himself. you don't have to leave forever, only one day at a time. you never know, this may be what will drive him to seek recovery. please don't continue to except the blame for this, i'm sure if you could fix the situation, you would.

remember, while you were not there to help him, he sought help for himself. i think even if he ended up in the hospital, they will have to have permission to treat him and they do call in specialist when needed, don't they?

itisatruth

Hello faithfully, I hope you come back and come back often Even in this one thread I can 'see' that some things may be becoming more clear to you. You asked if anyone can relate, well maybe not with everything like Sailorjohn said, but I definitely relate to having felt responsible for someone else. There was a time where I had to make a choice of whether or not to keep enabling my husband to continue his downward spiral of addiction to pain meds. After years of making excuses for him and basically taking care of everything, I had to stop. Just stop. For me. For him.

So as you do the next right thing....which is, I hope, doing what you need to do for you.....I want to leave you with this thought: sometimes love means saying no and/or walking away. It might hurt, it might not feel right, but sometimes giving someone the dignity to take care of themselves (in whatever way that may be) and find their own way is the most loving thing you can do for them.

PS That love can also mean loving yourself.

rose

Faithfully,

I remember you posting...! We are only a ferry ride away, I am in Nanaimo. Hope you never feel again that you are not liked. This is to be a place where we can come and share all we want, get it out with people who understand. I can understand where you might have shyed away, some posts can feel very harsh and bold, "you do this or do that and if you don't then don't come crying back". Maybe without the exact wording, but in so many words that is how we can be left feeling. So take what you like and leave the rest.

You came here and opened up...a huge step! Reaching out for help! From everything you have posted, it is clear that you know it has gone way to far and you are in an emotional turmoil. This man is very very sick, it just seems like he has dragged you into his web, manipulated you, controlled you and convinced you that you are life or death to him. What pops into my mind is the man who took that young girl and hid her for almost 20 years. Some how he convinced her...she had chances to run, but she didn't. Others that they showed and interviewed that went through the samething said they were not locked up, he went to work, they just stayed where they were told, never to run.

I don't know or nor am I no expect, but to me it is a brainwash. Just like this man has done to you. You are not a bad person for the things you are doing, he has convinced you that is your job, you know it is not right, that is what has brought you here.

You are going to need some help, professional that can guide you. My biggest block that haunted me from even posting on here in the beginning is that I was being unfaithful, once I saw that I was just getting it all out and there was nothing unfaithful about it, it released a wall to the beginning of my freedom back.

Rose

kj3880

I don't think you do understand a bit about hospitals. Canada is a country with very good doctors and medical care, isolation units, sanitary practices, and the lot. It is not some backwater, third-world death-trap.

What could you possibly provide at home (other than access to crack) that is not better done at hospital by pros? You then say:
Somethings are complex and people who are codependent for addicts have much the same symptoms and sickness and codependents for acutely ill people who are not addicts.
OK, fair point, but all that means is that both codependent types are doing the same harm to themselves and to their ill partners, by not allowing them to hit bottom and be forced to allow professionals to help them.

We are not professionals, and we are not detached. We can't get them out of these situations in any way. We are not powerful enough. You seem to think that your emotions, your guilt, your love, your grief, your shame, are powerful enough to cure him. If that were true, none of us would be here.

We didn't cause this. We can't control this, We cannot cure this. All any of us can do is get out of the way before we are dragged along with it. Please, get to an Alanon meeting. You need help. And keep coming back here. None of us are blaming you. We know that you are sick, too.

Love,
KJ

spiritualone

IHi, my name is Terri, you are going through some rough stuff. My heart goes out to you. I just want to say to you that he has his own GOD and his own Journey. It sounds to me like he is making alot of bad decisions and choices. They are his to make. It sounds to me like he wants to be totally dependant on you and as long as he has you he is not going to do anything else. Just let me say this, you could be saving his life by leaving. Then he will have to depend on others, others who are skilled in taking care of the sick. But then you dont want to turn your back on his. I am glad I am not in your shoes. And you need some support. Have you thought about hospice coming in and helping, or treatment. There are all kinds of resources. You might think about getting some support for yourself by going to alanon. Then I need to tell you my dad suffered a terrible death from cancer. he had a trek, feeding tube, diapers, open soars like you speak of. And my mom took such wonderful care of him. A nurse never came into the house. But my dad wasn't fighting an addiction and was easy to care for. He never gave my mom any trouble. Again, he has his own god and his own journey. Let go and let GOD Please go to alanon, it could be so helpful for you. Because you need to take care of you too. Sometimes we need to practice tough love. god bless:praying

rose

The best place for this man in this condition is in the hospital. I truly think that he has her so convinced that this is not an option. Then again she is right, it is impossible to have someone committed against their will, even if she did get him there if he chooses to leave, there is nothing they can do to stop him. Yes we do have some great care in Canada, but for those who want it.

This gal is in a real tough situation, she knows it. She doesn't need the riot act thrown at her, easy does it. She needs us here for some comfort while she gets through it. She knows what is going on is not right, she poured her heart out. We all know things are much easier said than done!

Rose

faithfully

Hi everyone,
Sharing your experiences really helps me, especially hearing about other people who have had sick family members and have taken care of them. That is how I feel, you don't abandon people when they are sick. That being said, I don't have to enable by giving money and I don't have to sit by and watch him destroy himself. I have it set up that I can go this weekend or anytime to a friends who lives very close, she is older, like a second mom to me. She knows the whole situation and is very supportive. I realize that I am "sick" and have lost myself but I still do manage to work, take care of my dog, a very sick man, a house, all the bills etc. etc. The ultimate decision, to call car 86 and get him "committed" is a big one. And by them too I will be looked upon as evil for not being able to get him to a hospital before this. But I don't care how it looks, if it's the right thing to do. I'm just not convinced it is, it is a last resort, a horrible horrible option. By the way I did take him to the best hospital in vancouver, and all they did was refer him to another hospital to a surgeon and all the surgeon did was try to set us up with home care for his wounds, which he didn't follow up on, we were one block away from his appointment intake with home care and HE WOULDN"T GO. Even if I drove there and parked in front, I can't make him go in. I have taken him to the hospital before and he would not get out of the car. When he goes to doctors he doesn't talk about his pain enough and he thinks he can get painkiller on the first go, and doesn't want to do any treatment. But for myself I will not give him money anymore. I will leave my home before I do so. And as far as canada having good health care, I guess so compared to other countries and the states where you have to pay, but from other people here I have heard horror stories, botched surgeries and people who have gone into the hospital to get surgeries and come out with MRSA, pregnant moms innocent people who are not drug addicts. This is a problem in Canadian and all hospitals. My father had a hip replacement and were it not for his wife being there everyday and him hiring a private nurse in the hospital to take care of him, he said the care would have been atrocious. It's not the nurses and doctors fault, it's our supposedly wonderful helathcare system. But that's another topic. They simply don't have the budget. I have talked to hospice, about a year ago, but he did not want strangers coming in the house. I have spoken to just about every social service there is available. None of them have a good answer to the situation. Try to make him go to the doctor, that's all they say. Make a good decision for yourself, they say. He has to want help himself they say. Oh I feel for your situation they say but you can't make him do anything he doesn't want and you have to take care of yourself. I spend my lunch hours calling social services. I have no children so maybe I am not versed in how to be firm with people, or say NO but I can't make him eat good food, although I do try, he likes sweets too much, I can't make him quit smoking, but he has cut down. I can't make him stop drinking or anything else he wants to do. All I can do is STOP GIVING HIM MONEY no matter how many times he bullies me and believe me he does. Do you know I am available and offer to take him to doctors/hospital nearly everyday? He gets mad at me for doing so. He'll go when he wants to and is ready to go he tells me. So I lay off for a bit, then start offering again. Even my lady friend before he had the surgeries and before I left town, took him to the hospital 3 times and he walked away, it's happened to me too! Just as many times if not more. I guess you're right, he needs to be alone and hurting so bad that he will finally go. But it is my resolve today to NOT do anything for him that will cause him harm. No money! I'll make him food, do laundry, drive to doctors, OK. But that's it.

I don't expect to "get" anything out of relationships, is that the point of being with someone? Not that I would know, I'm too sick. after this relationship, I will be very happy to be alone and certainly will not take on anything again. For me, I want to be forgiven and find God in my life and do the right thing. That is all. And while trying to do the right thing with this man, I have ended up doing the wrong thing. And if he would leave on his own, I would have been happy but as much as I've asked him to leave (for years and many times) he will not go, and he does feel it's my responsibility to take care of him til the day he dies. I've left homes I pay for 3x to live elsewhere, left my dogs and everything. And I come back, yes I do, it's my home, they are my dogs. I guess my failure is that I can't seem to make the change final. The cops cannot really do anything if he doesn't want to leave, he is a resident and has rights. You know in my neighbourhood, they are used to people doing crack, I guess they may put him in jail for a few days if they find anything on him, but with his wounds and sickness, he could get very harassed in there and possibly beat up. As for a restraining order, he wouldn't listen to a restraining order anyways. No I do not sleep with him and have not in years. That has for a long time, not been the basis of our relationship. I have been to my doctor and he is aware of this situation and so far I have not had any problems and am cautious in handling laundry etc. covering any cuts I get on my hands etc. I've tried to be a friend, he is a good person inside, just hurting for a long long time. And when I left, he almost died. No I don't feel important because of that, just horrible about it. I encourage him to call his friends, he only has a couple. But he doesn't feel well enough sometimes. Even when I was across country and him in the hospital, he never called his friend. I don't know why. I wish he would. I have not heard a formal diagnosis from any doctor except they gave him a sheet at the hospital on cellulitis. I have done extensive research. I have asked him to get a swab to see if he has MRSA. Again, he won't go, he says he has it in his blood, and that's it there is nothing that doctors can do. He was on antibiotics IV for weeks, he finished the treatment and the wound still hand't healed, He had an appointment with a plastic surgeon but missed it, again probably my fault as he insisted on getting out of my car to get dope when we were on the way to the pharmacist to get his methadone script filled out. I didn't want him to get out, I begged him not to "we're only two minutes from getting your methadone, just hold on!" and he said "you can't make me, you have no idea how much pain I'm in" I said, "well just wait" he said "it takes too long for that stuff to work, I'm in pain now, let me out you can't control me!" He got out of the car, He got arrested that day and missed his surgery appointment. He never made another one, Anyways, thank you for listening and all of your posts, I will re read and reread. It is hard to hear some of the things you say and I understand, to many of you I am an evil enabler and must be doing it to get something out of it. Truthfully, if I didn't have this burden in my life, I would be quite a content, peaceful person. I will keep coming back, I'll try meetings as I have in the past. And I am trying to find free counselling I can do in the evenings which is difficult. I cannot miss work for counselling nor can I afford counselling for myself. Mind you, if I say NO to giving him money, there eventually may be some available for me to get private help. And I am very willing to do so.

faithfully

[QUOTE=cessy68;2387310]Hi faithfully,


Perhaps you don't want to 'see' that this is absolutly out of control. Your refusal to take some AUTHENTIC responsiblity and accountablity for YOUR PART in all of this, is ultimately going to cause YOU to be ill.... frankly I think you are already.

Your post is particularly hard hitting, and I understand. Yes my self esteem is battered, yes it looks like I don't like myself, you are right, I don't like myself. I do see the situation as out of control. Yes I see how enabling has made matters worse. I have become numb to the horror of it. I see how I am responsible, by giving money, and that I will stop. He is unfortunately unable to work becuase he cannot walk or use one arm since the surgeries they did on him, so no, all he gets is a small welfare check that out here for living is a complete joke. It can pay for a room, but you'd have no food or bus money. I will be working on helping him get his full level disability, as he cannot get around to all the doctors required to get that pushed through, he has to have 3 doctors sign a form, and the processing, which can take over 3 months, may stil mean he is denied in the end. I have arranged with an advocacy group that I will be able to do an intake over the phone to get it started. I am currently working on that and it will give him an extra few hundred and month eventually if he is accepted. Ty for your post, and no I am not looking for people to like me here, just to find common experiences so that I can do the right thing and be able to understand. I think it's hard hitting posts like yours that drove me away. But I realize what you are saying and I feel very bad for how I've contributed to this situation, and made matters worse.

faithfully

I appreciate what you are saying about my contributing by giving him money, which I won't do anymore. No matter how much pain he is in, or how much he begs. It is not an OTC med, but it seems to take him out of pain long enough that he can walk, eat and bath himself. As for your comment about preventing him from getting help, I realize my giving him money so he gets out of pain and can move around is preventing him from getting help, I could see that, but if you see in my posts I have been trying to get him to doctors, taken him to hospitals and called social services every one I can think of and if he doesn't want medical help he can deny it. Even if I call an ambulance against his wishes, which he has told me is his dying request, for me NOT TO CALL AN AMBULANCE as that is what led him to get these surgeries in the first place, the ambulance people cannot force him to go to the hospital. I have called shelters, rehabs, spoken to my doctor, spoken to his pharmacist, if he doesn't want to go to the doctor or hospital I cannot make him. Short of having him committed I cannot make him get medical help. I can stop giving him money though, no matter what kind of pain and agony he is in, I will not give him money anymore, thank you for your post. What am I getting out of this? Utter anguish, worry, stress and most of all extreme sadness.