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Old 02-27-2018, 02:09 PM
  # 41 (permalink)  
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The silent treatment is a form of abuse.
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Old 02-27-2018, 02:31 PM
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GMO824.....LOL....sometimes, when you are dealing with a **ssed off alcoholic, ir can be a blessing.....especially, if you are trying to detach, anyway!
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Old 02-27-2018, 02:42 PM
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this was your statement as of 02/23/18:

This morning she admitted she was wrong and has made a promise to herself not to drink. I have heard "one day at a time" way too often. This is now my boundary. Crossing it will mean the end of the marriage. She knows it. The ball is in her court. I trust she is taking it very seriously and want the marriage to continue. I will stay vigilant and determined to mind my own boundaries. Thanks for everyone's input and help.

you now have proof that she has NOT stopped drinking, that she IS hiding booze in the house, even with your ultimatums - or perhaps in spite of them.
she has been slippin and slidin since rehab....this is not the fault of the treatment center as they do not TELL people to drink, this is not the fault of AA as they to do not instruct people to drink.
nope my friend, this is on HER...........these are her ACTIONS, not her words..........
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Old 02-27-2018, 02:45 PM
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Ha! Oh, don't get me wrong, I enjoyed my days and even weeks of the silent treatment from my xah (he never sought any type of recovery). Gave me a little room to breathe. It wasn't until I was out of the FOG that I learned on SR that the silent treatment is a form of abuse. My xah was always twisting everything around and saying I was the bad guy .... you shoulda seen the smirk on my face when that lightbulb went off when I realized how I had believed his bs for so long
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Old 02-27-2018, 02:54 PM
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Gm0824......lol.....I understand what you mean....
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Old 02-27-2018, 03:01 PM
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donewithhurting....Anvill makes a good (and very obvious) point. You were brusting with confidence on Feb. 23.....stated your determination to honor your own boundaries....that if she drank, that the marriage is over.
Well, as Anvil points out...she DID drink. So, now, what?

What happened to y our boundary in four days?
Are you going to enforce that boundary, like you said...OR...did you make a boundary that you are not able or willing to enforce...?
Lots of people do this....not realizing that if they make a boundary for themselves...that they must be prepared to enforce it...or the other party knows that your words are hollow.......

Like they used to say----Don't talk the talk if you can't walk the walk.....

What is the deal, now...?
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Old 02-27-2018, 08:21 PM
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Excellent points and questions.

At this moment, we've been together for over 30 years, work together and with grown kids so unwinding the relationship will be complicated.

She is keeping to her side of the road and me to mine seemingly going in different directions. She has not owned up the my discovery although she must have surely realized I found it.

I think a measured disconnection is happening. Each doing our own thing whereas we used to do everything together. As recently as last week. This is so unreal. She is being coached by aa members who have recently gone through horrible divorces. I guess misery loves company.

As far as I am concerned the marriage as it was is over as long as drinking, lying, justification for bad behavior and bashing me continues.

I am in no rush to serve papers yet. It may be inevitable. As of now it seems an in house separation is happening even if she doesn't realize it yet. I think she is playing a manipulation game whereas I am not. She just doesnt realize that yet. I think she thinks I am going to cave and apologize.

Not happening. This will either get better or worse. For now it is moving into worse territory for me. Its strange how unaffected my emotions are. I am quite calm about it all.
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Old 02-28-2018, 01:54 AM
  # 48 (permalink)  
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It’s very sad that this is happening after 30 years and building a life together. The thought of divorcing and dealing with all that must seem like a nightmare.

I read a great ebook that you might want to read by a guy called Doug Kelley who was in the same place as you are now.

‘Alcoholic Relationship Survival Guide’ which can be downloaded from www.empoweredrecovery.com

I hope things work out for you.
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Old 02-28-2018, 04:49 AM
  # 49 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by donewithhurting View Post
At this moment, we've been together for over 30 years, work together and with grown kids so unwinding the relationship will be complicated.

She is keeping to her side of the road and me to mine seemingly going in different directions.
As far as I am concerned the marriage as it was is over as long as drinking, lying, justification for bad behavior and bashing me continues.

Not happening. This will either get better or worse. For now it is moving into worse territory for me. Its strange how unaffected my emotions are. I am quite calm about it all.
At least the kids are grown, so that's less complicated. "Unwinding" would basically just entail finances at this point.

So, you say it's basically over, you're heading in different directions, etc. You are in the 'in-between' place that was posted about a while back. Sort of in limbo, not making progress. Is this how you wish to live out your years?

Being calm is good, it's very good. Best of luck to you.

COD
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Old 02-28-2018, 05:11 AM
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Thanks Codimum

I have downloaded ‘Alcoholic Relationship Survival Guide’ and am already in Segment 1. I will finish it by day's end.

The situation will be resolved one way or another. Thanks for the recommend - It looks like what I need to read right now.
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Old 02-28-2018, 06:54 AM
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She is being coached by aa members who have recently gone through horrible divorces. I guess misery loves company.
WOW, guess it couldn’t just be the fact that she wants to drink in peace without you hovering around her or playing eye spy where’s the booze. The disease is progressive so how things used to be with her and you are no longer and that is not AA’s fault. Nor is it AA’s fault that your wife has chosen NOT to participate actively in her own recovery. And it’s very possible that even if she’s actually going to any meetings that she’s met someone similar who also doesn’t want to stop drinking.

As of now it seems an in house separation is happening even if she doesn't realize it yet.
And from what you’ve shared it doesn’t seem like she’d even care and might even welcome that. Kind of got you off her back right?

I think she is playing a manipulation game whereas I am not. She just doesnt realize that yet. I think she thinks I am going to cave and apologize.

You sure about that? Isn’t using empty ultimatums a form of manipulation? And haven’t you already caved by not sticking to your boundary? That’s like a “I’m sorry” I’m not actually going to follow through with my words………………..just like she is not actually following through with her words of recovery.
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Old 03-01-2018, 06:57 AM
  # 52 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Codimum View Post
It’s very sad that this is happening after 30 years and building a life together. The thought of divorcing and dealing with all that must seem like a nightmare.

I read a great ebook that you might want to read by a guy called Doug Kelley who was in the same place as you are now.

‘Alcoholic Relationship Survival Guide’ which can be downloaded from Empowered Recovery - Help for Alcoholic Relationships

I hope things work out for you.
I have read the book.
I understand what it says.

My wife is not a raging alcoholic although there have been rages in the past.

While the book is geared towards an alcoholic who is not actively trying to recover, my wife is. She wants to recover. That makes this all so much harder. She is a great person who has had a rough childhood. Those issues surface periodically.

This reading is showing me i need to move on. I hope we can do this amicably. She is a reasonable woman when not drinking so i hope mediation will work as it will save lots of money and stress.

I would of course like to avoid this breakup after so many years together... good ones too. I'd hate to break up the family and the business.

A last kick in the head - she has cheated in the past, once PA long time ago (we worked through it) and two times Emotionally with gay workmates. I know how can she have an affair with a gay guy - trust me on this, when they have her heart, get jealous and turn her against me, thats an affair.

We now have a "no opposite friends" agreement in place to prevent that from happening again. Yesterday at a meeting a new comer - gay guy - was there and she "bonded" with him and they went out for coffee together. I received an accidental text from him meant for her. Thats how i found out. I confronted her on it and she now says he is just an aa member in need so she has every right to have coffee with him after the meetings. This does not fly in my book. I consider it a date and a violation of our agreement. Am I being too strict with my boundary here? My instinct is no I am not and she is setting herself up for another EA with a gay friend and future coffees alone with other men.
Opinions please cause this the THE deal breaker for me.
If she truly wants to stop drinking and continues her meetings and actually does stop drinking the marriage can continue. But meeting other men for "fellowship" does not fly with me at all and is grounds for divorce, Period. No grey area here.

What are you thoughts as I am not too familiar with AA's fellowship program.
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Old 03-01-2018, 07:11 AM
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my initial reaction? GAY my ass............

regardless of your wishes, she continues to do exactly as she wants.

no one can turn her against you, but she can turn away from you. which she has done, multiple times over the years.

she continues to drink, multiple times since rehab. she is hiding alcohol in the home.

we often say here, look at their actions, not their words.
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Old 03-01-2018, 07:20 AM
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Ditto what Anvil said.

My AW had an emotional affair with her boss, then got fired from her job because boss' wife found out about it and put an end to it. Then the boss went to the owner and said my AW was 'not working out'.

Why did I stick around?? Oh well, I understand your point.
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Old 03-01-2018, 07:30 AM
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dWH......looks like she is willing to use anyone and anything to take the focus off of dealing with her own issues. This is not recommended, but some people do it.....

You have a right to decide what you will or will not live with in a marriage.....
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Old 03-01-2018, 07:41 AM
  # 56 (permalink)  
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Only saying this because you asked. It seems to me you blame all of her issues on everyone else. The gay guys turn her against you. The AA members are changing her. I think SHE is responsible for her own actions, and that you need to stop blaming everyone else. I say this kindly because I know it's hurtful.

I also think AA is a slippery slope. Many are there for the wrong reasons (court ordered, they still drink, etc). Celebrate Recovery has the rule in place that men go w/men, women w/women, and it's a good rule. For those that are there for the right reasons, it's a God send. For the others, not so much.

That being said, everyone is responsible for their own behaviors and their own actions. Blaming everyone else is deflection.


Originally Posted by donewithhurting View Post
A last kick in the head - she has cheated in the past, once PA long time ago (we worked through it) and two times Emotionally with gay workmates. I know how can she have an affair with a gay guy - trust me on this, when they have her heart, get jealous and turn her against me, thats an affair.

We now have a "no opposite friends" agreement in place to prevent that from happening again. Yesterday at a meeting a new comer - gay guy - was there and she "bonded" with him and they went out for coffee together. I received an accidental text from him meant for her. Thats how i found out. I confronted her on it and she now says he is just an aa member in need so she has every right to have coffee with him after the meetings. This does not fly in my book. I consider it a date and a violation of our agreement. Am I being too strict with my boundary here? My instinct is no I am not and she is setting herself up for another EA with a gay friend and future coffees alone with other men.
Opinions please cause this the THE deal breaker for me.
What are you thoughts as I am not too familiar with AA's fellowship program.
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Old 03-01-2018, 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by hopeful4 View Post
men go w/men, women w/women, and it's a good rule.
And we had an agreement about that. She broke it and didn't come clean. Now she claims she can go to fellowship with anyone she wishes in AA to "help" them.

I think i've reached the end of my rope. Its just so hard to turn my back on all that was good for so many years.
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Old 03-01-2018, 08:01 AM
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I get it. My XAH whom I was with for 20 years did something similar. He would just do these things even after we had agreed on them, then act like I was crazy for getting upset.

I realized later, I was not crazy, just a fool for expecting him to change. The best predictor of future behavior....is past behavior.

I am sorry you are hurting. It stinks all around.
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Old 03-01-2018, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by hopeful4 View Post
I get it. My XAH whom I was with for 20 years did something similar. He would just do these things even after we had agreed on them, then act like I was crazy for getting upset.

I realized later, I was not crazy, just a fool for expecting him to change. The best predictor of future behavior....is past behavior.

I am sorry you are hurting. It stinks all around.
Yup - I have some hard decisions to make.
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Old 03-01-2018, 09:01 AM
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One thought comes to mind, if your wife had begun drinking again this go-round after suffering from a recent loss, perhaps she needs to grieve through this loss with professional help? Is she being supported through the heartache she no doubt feels? Grief doesn't have a timeline or an end. It's a process - maybe her drinking is a way of not dealing with her grief?

I am so sorry your marriage is fractured. Boundaries are what gives me issues in several of my relationships. I can certainly relate to where you are coming from, I would be tempted to start the process of splitting things up if divorce is the boundary you set. A fair minded mediation to start the process (I'm sure you've given it a lot of thought already) could be the wake up call (or not) your wife needs.

Doesn't have to be filing for divorce right now but getting your affairs in order, inventory your assets, documents etc before things get contentious (hopefully they won't but expect that they will).

My biggest advice - be fair, be compassionate but be firm. Attorneys are costly and in the end it's a shame if they end up with more than anything you two could amicably resolve.

Just my 2c worth but I'm old. In the end some things in life aren't worth fighting. Could it be your marriage has served its purpose, maybe time to move on for both of you? Only you can know that in your heart of hearts.
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