Lily1918

true. when the action is correct then the finality doesn't matter.

I deserve better, but Im not gonna go hunting for it.

This is the first time I haven't had a rebound.

Why the crap does he still come sit next to me in church? its the only boundary I haven't laid.
I keep hoping something in the service might click in his brain and don't want to wish him away from that. Its the only thing he is doing right.

At the same time "just because a mouse lives in a cookie jar, that does not make him a cookie"

Why haven't I let go yet?

I don't talk to him or anything outside of church. even then its like 2-5 min after, tops.

I don't try to make him change or call him. I did fail and sent a reply to his text today.
He said is there anything he can do? anything at all??? I simply replied "Joshua 24:15" He has it memorized I didn't need to spell it out. In one word and two numbers I told him where to go...

I think he got the hint cuz he shut up.

I can't really say that I am unhappy in life, or craving love. I can say that when He contacts me I want to be a lantern to him... Even if it goes in one ear and out the other. I want him to see me blessed and happy and hopeful in my future and that I am still sober.
ego. pride. the joy of being pursued.
or is it wrong to want to be a light in the darkness??? I just don't know.

irisgardens

Thank you Lily...I have some behaviors that have come up for me since starting to deal with the addiction in my teenagers. I am on the third...tyg that the oldest two are leading their own lives and functional.

I keep obsessively reaching out to a mother and siblings who just ignore the issue and mother calls me mentally deranged...have had a few meltdowns...nothing but silence. I have been doing this for so many years...finally realized that I am making progress in my (using this for the first time) codie work. Got to the shame and blame part and abandonment issues and guilt...deeper with this new child in addiction than ever before.

I just had a huge overwhelm and horrible hitting bottom attack when daughter relapsed in January and chose to stop contact in April.

What does all this have to do with your post? Your post allowed me to forgive myself just a bit for my actions. I have not typically blamed others...but my biological family's actions have made me realize that it can't be ALL my fault.

I am trying to go into what I read about here called no contact...as hubby and I are focused on starting our financial lives over...and to the extent we can love without enabling (we are a country away)...supporting daughter.

Your post made me realize that I am a normal person (within the context of being a codependent) and that I need to continue in my own recovery and work...and to take one step at a time as each steps become clearer.

Don't trust my own judgment anymore.

AnvilheadII

or is it wrong to want to be a light in the darkness???

i'm not sure that we are supposed to nominate ourselves as The Lantern nor to determine upon whom our Light shall Shine. basically you are still trying to GET him to SEE the light.

that's not how it works...Step 12 says that having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we TRIED to carry the message to others, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.

..in the Twelve Steps, where people learn about God through their own experiences with him, there is no need to "persuade" with theology or verbal arguments. We let pain do the persuading, because we know that it is only through pain that the hunger for healing comes that will make us ready to admit our powerlessness. We know that until the pain of our lives was greater than the fear of swallowing our pride and going for help, we were not hungry enough for healing to go for it through the Twelve Steps...from A Hunger for Healing, by J. Keith Miller, p. 196, 199, 210

In a similar vein, in Matthew is the passage about "carrying the message"

And whoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when you depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.

and from the Sermon on the Mount:
Even so let your light shine before men, that they may
see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.

we don't get to pick who to save. who to convert. who to get sober. who sees the light.

Vale

The addict I CHOSE to interact with did not choose life.
That was her choice---and quite honestly......none of my business.
The call of Pandora's box was too strong. Although every freshly
hatched little little turtle frantically rushing to the waters edge
thinks that THEY won't be a part of an attrition statistic---the
mathematical reality is not all of them will make it.

For me to try to coerce her back 'to life' would have been wrong.
I spent many a month trying to figure out a way I could ethically do
it-----but either there WAS no way, or I was not smart enough to
think of one.

She pushed the limits of the abyss---and finally the abyss pushed
back. I wasn't trying to be a light in the darkness, just a person
sitting on the curb with a Bic lighter saying "please don't do this".

Her life, in the end, was her business. Between her and God. All we
need to believe is that our prayers are heard----even if the answer is
no.

Lily1918

makes sense you guys.

here is what I don't understand:

crazy making. saying one thing then swearing up and down the next day they didn't say that. I understand that. why we choose to doubt ourselves I don't understand.

scapegoating. Starting fights as an excuse to use. then when we ignore them they use anyways.
if we fight. we "make them use" if we ignore we "make them use"
they never just go get high because they want to.
and sometimes we foolishly believe them.

I agree we choose to deal with it if we don't block and walk. si then why do so many of us play the role of victim? we are only victims once.

I just don't get the codependent mind. I don't.

addicts only chase the drug and cash out and get angry qhwn they can't have it.

I think that I have chased attention and respect and human love and get depressed when I font get it.

why? why isn't god and my children enough?

Lily1918

also, why do they get pissed when we say no?

I remember accepting his drug use. I never used with him but there was a time I was the biggest enabler I even took him to pick up.

I was so sick.

now that I won't do that anymore he gets mad and wants the old me.

I can't do that.

now that I know better I attempt to do better

AnvilheadII

don't YOU get pissed when he says NO? his no being not doing what you want? I don't thing that's a special reaction reserved for addicts.....

people engaged in dysfunctional relationships have clearly defined ROLES....and if one dares to try and change themselves and therefore the dynamic, the other goes all out to get them to CHANGE BACK.

Lily1918

yes! oh anvil you are so smart.

what pissed me off most is...

I haven't picked up weed in months. I haven't dropped acid or eaten mushrooms in years.

I have been 100% clean since January. I haven't been drunk since July last year.

But Im "not an addict" cuz I have control. I can choose not to. according to his family and him. I didn't go to rehab to get clean.

ummmm no. I can't stay clean. My friends used to get irritated about me becoming a Jesus freak again and becoming obsessed with the beattitudes and going to Celebrate Recovery all the time.
I told them look girls. I did drugs a long time. The only thing keeping me off of psychedelics weed and alcohol is God. I showed them the chapter in the Big Book the family afterward. They get it now. They try to. I love God. God saved me.

He wants a trophy for showing up to church clean??? a pat on the back? where is mine????

Im selfish to!!!

I want to be numb. I want to catch a buzz. I want to escape.
I just traded chemicals for codependency.

I don't. and nobody cares and I don't anyway.

God cares. I care. My children will care when they are older.

ugh... where is this anger coming from? I haven't even talked to him or his family today. My head is just spinning. I want out.

having a sick day.

but a good day.

Today. No Contact. Today. No picking up for me. Today. No walking in darkness.

ugh!!!! ahhhggghh!!!!

Im just feining. And this is the wrong board to do it on but I don't care.

Im no better than any of them.

AnvilheadII

lily, maybe you are having a crisis of faith. I don't believe that is a BAD thing, quite the opposite. what IS it I truly believe and what IS my Higher Power to me aka Step Two and Three and where do I go from here? do we ask too much or not enough?

when Jesus was in the Garden, he had himself a chat with God...the Anvil translation....um God my Father, Jesus here, are you SURE this is the only way? maybe a little Divine Intervention, just smote them or something? I know you have a plan here, but does it have to be ME? I've lived now as flesh and blood for 30 years, with all the fears and sadness and anguish of the corporeal existence, and I'm Afraid to Die, scared spitless. I've got a bunch of good faithful holy men with me, any chance one of them could take over?

According to all four Gospels, immediately after the Last Supper, Jesus took a walk to pray (John 18:1). Matthew and Mark identify this place of prayer as Gethsemane. Jesus was accompanied by the Apostles Peter, John and James, whom he asked to stay awake and pray. He moved "a stone's throw away" from them, where He felt overwhelming sadness and anguish, and said "My Father, if it is possible, let this cup pass me by. Nevertheless, let it be as you, not I, would have it." Then, a little while later, He said, "If this cup cannot pass by, but I must drink it, your will be done!" (Matthew 26:42). He said this prayer three times, checking on the three apostles between each prayer and finding them asleep. He commented: "The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak". An angel came from heaven to strengthen him. During his agony as he prayed, "his sweat was as it were great drops of blood falling down upon the ground".(Luke 22:44).

growing up I always thought that when He said the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak, he meant the sleeping apostles. but today I see that he was hoping for a little support and hoping that maybe if they were awake and with him, perhaps they could take the cup that was to be passed. He said that prayer and then ran to check on the apostles three times! HIS spirit was willing, but HIS flesh was weak. He was having a crisis of faith, a BIG one!!!

and what happened? an "angel" was sent to give him strength. in His darkest hour, when He was questioning God's Will and while it was not mentioned, probably ready to bail over the wall of the Garden and make a run for it, THAT is when He was given strength.

pretty powerful lesson there, don't ya think?

Lily1918

extremely powerful.

I love how you spit the bible at me

didnt you tell me one time that you don't believe in it? or am I mistaken?

If so I really think its awesome how you know I do and point me to it with startling accuracy.

my lesson is that I do not love this person.

He is my paraphrenelia and his attention is my drug.

why else would I be getting mad cravings when I go no contact?

simple.

I have been "using" this whole time.

and now Im sitting here kicking.

F#%&!!!!

I relapsed on weed when he went to the SA.
that was the last NC.

no... this one is.

Quack quack quack

but still...

one is to many and a thousand is never ever enough.
shrooms
tabs
weed
moments of attention

its all the same for me.

time to sober up.

for real this time.

Im sitting in the prayer room at church tomorrow. He won't look for me there.

thanks for your support anvil.
hugs.

I come from a poor part of town and "we are the 99%" signs litter the roadside.

maybe I am.

But with God on my side I will be the 1%
:,)

AnvilheadII

just to clarify, I said i'm not a big Bible person....I don't tote one around with me, and I don't think we have one in the house, maybe the garage in a Renee box. I know the text fairly well, I grew up Catholic.....I believe there is a lot of wisdom in the Gospels, the stories that Jesus told, the message He shared.

Lily1918

sorry I didn't remember right.

thanks for clearing it up for me!

talking (or writing) it out has really helped

Vale

Lily1918 wrote:

"Im no better than any of them"
=============================================
since you are obviously on a spiritual journey to rid your life of the
chains of addiction------I must respectfully disagree with your statement.

irisgardens

Great reminder...great new/remembered knowledge. Wish I could remember this more often.