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Oh...he was just joking, right!!

Old 02-20-2011, 01:23 PM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Depends on the type of phone, I think. My friend in the police drugs squad has mentioned that they have some kind of gadget to recover deleted text messages from phones, so you could just ask them if they can get them. And you should certainly speak to the police. I don't know how differently you think family annihilators would act prior to committing the act......I know that sounds dramatic, but those situations are real and are comitted by mentally unstable people who seriously hate their ex/current partners. Do you think your situation is different to that?

I know this is scary to think about, but you have to protect yourself and your children. You seem numbed to his words and I understand how that can happen. Can you trust us enough to at least make a call to the police and tell them what has happened?



(And please stop with the victim blaming. It will NOT help in situations of abuse - the victim needs building up to deal with the situation, not knocking down. Analysis can come later)
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Old 02-20-2011, 02:05 PM
  # 22 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Summerpeach View Post
Yes and she knows this and keeps going back. When does he stop being responsible and she start?

I've read many books on abuse, thanks, but if I keep going back to an abuser over and over and wonder why I'm being abused, it become MY fault!!!!!!

The victim role only lasts so long until one become a willing participant
I'm sorry, but I have to (as a survivor) address this. It is all too easy to apportion blame to the person who is the subject of this kind of behaviour.

It is NOT her fault. Being in an abusive relationship is likened to being a lobster in a pot. The water starts out fine, after all if someone came into your life immediately abusive you'd run, but the heat gets turned up gradually. Each little turn of the heat is sustained to 'normalise' the situation. It is by degrees and a period of adjustment and acceptance is established before it gets turned again. Then and before you even know it, you are in a dangerous situation in it and an equally dangerous situation jumping from it.

It takes a great deal of courage to leap.. because statistics bear out that THAT is when you are most in danger. So you are between a rock and a hard place.

To the OP.. this is worrying.. even if he has no intention of doing you physical harm, the mental/emotional damage is equally as scary. Please talk to someone.. get this on record.. and begin to plan for your safekeeping.

Tx
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Old 02-20-2011, 03:19 PM
  # 23 (permalink)  
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So....some of you have been in this type of relationship and some of you have not. I do take responsibility for MY choice in this relationship. I married him, and I have chosen up to this point to not completely cut ties. And though someone here is trying to blame me for this....I am attempting to manage a single life with 6 kids on my own...everything on my own...and unfortunately I am a teacher which allows me lots of time with the kids, but I don't really have the opportunity to make a lot of extra money AND, I need him to pay support. I've been divorced before and let me tell you that when the court files those papers for support/divorce...they are just PAPERS to them and that without paying a bunch of money to defend them...it is worthless...been there done that. So before you point the finger at me and blame me for 'allowing' him to be this way....I have to take care of a house, a job, 6 kids and myself....and pray I don't tick him off enough to totally walk away. I'm not saying I couldn't do it, just that some people on here make the decision seem like it is cut/dry when it is SO easy to say from the outside, but believe me SO much harder on the inside. you are correct that I would NOT allow my children to be treated this way.....or a friend etc., but again you are on the outside not the inside. I post here for support, I asked specific questions....I did not ask for you to blame me for him abusing me. The ONLY thing I am really concerned about right now is making a life for me and the kids.....that's it.
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Old 02-20-2011, 03:29 PM
  # 24 (permalink)  
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Of course you are only trying to do what's best for yourself and the children. I hope you didn't think I was implying otherwise - I just want to make sure that you aren't minimizing any threats to you and get some local advice.

So, I would suggest getting the number for your local police station and ask them their thoughts.

And call 1-800-799-SAFE (7233) which is the National Domestic Violence Hotline and they can point you in the right direction.

It's a difficult balancing act you are trying to manage here and the more RL support you can get, the better, imho. Because your safety and that of your kids is NO 1, yes?
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Old 02-20-2011, 03:31 PM
  # 25 (permalink)  
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Hon, that's why we encourage you to contact a domestic violence center. Just call them and talk to them. You don't have to make any huge decisions right now, but they can answer your questions about what you can do to keep yourself and your children safe. They can help you with a plan. You need a plan. Just call them.

1.800.799.SAFE (7233)

Get Help National Domestic Violence Hotline

Check out the website, too. It can help answer some of your questions.
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Old 02-20-2011, 04:13 PM
  # 26 (permalink)  
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I can really relate to your concerns, and felt compelled to reply to your post because I am (thankfully and hopefully) further down this road than yours. I am too working full time a very demanding job and when I separated from AH, I realised how he had managed to isolate me from any other source of support than HIM. I felt so dependent on him, so helpless. See, not only I suddenly became a full time working single mum, I am also living on the other side of the planet from my entire family. AH's family live on the other side of Australia and have pretty cut off any contact with me and the kids (apparently, I am the evil). And of course, as a master manipulator, AH had also cut me off from the few friends I had. He also made some threats and turned up completely intoxicated at my place one night. I realised that he was doing this to manipulate me psychologically, trying in fact to make me insane I think to regain some control over me. In this type of situation, you need to set yourself goals and keeping in mind that your security always has to come first. I had a plan of escape within my house, slept with my mobile phone, informed my neighbors of the situation, and slowly built a network of friends that I trust with my life. I now can say that I do not need AH to help me with the kids. Also, I found the perfect appartment complex with high security devices which allows me to sleep with the knowledge that AH will not rock up in the middle of the night to scare the life out of me and my kids. I am now in control of my life but it took some time....
I wish you all the best
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Old 02-20-2011, 04:22 PM
  # 27 (permalink)  
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Oh and I forgot to say: one day, AH told me that I'd better watch what I was doing because the kids might end up with no parents at all. I, of course, took this as a death threat. So I promptly bought a tiny digital recording device and secretly recorded conversations we had in which he was intimidating, abusive, manipulating. I made my psychologist listen to these conversations and this helped me tremendously to understand every manipulative tactic of his. Also, I felt I had regained some control as I had proof of the abuse, and proof of potential further threats.
Again, all I can tell you apart from taking your security matters seriously is to build a solid support system around you so you do not need to rely on your controlling AH as far as children are concerned. It is interesting to see now how my AH absolutely hates my friends because he knows that because of them, I don't need him any more and therefore, he has no more control over my life.
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Old 02-20-2011, 05:09 PM
  # 28 (permalink)  
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Get an Order of Protection. Keep that dangerous man away from you and your kids. Stop communicating with him.
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Old 02-20-2011, 08:01 PM
  # 29 (permalink)  
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My ABF (in a roundabout way), when he was on one of his binges, threatened me and my dog, saying "what would be the one thing in the world that would hurt you most if it was no longer here?" While saying this, he looked right at the dog. The next day, I didn't go into work because I was terified of what would happen. That afternoon, I asked him to leave. That night, he refused to leave, and while there was no physical violence, the possibility existed. I called the police not once, but twice.

He never came back to that apartment-I moved, he moved and each time this incident was mentioned, he always tried to refer to it as a joke. It wasn't to me and when I felt threatened, I called the police. Even though we have moved to our own places and have reconciled, I told him that things like that are not jokes, it wasn't trivial to me and if I ever feel threatened like that again, I will did what I did before.
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Old 02-21-2011, 04:03 AM
  # 30 (permalink)  
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he wasn't just joking, and it's not your responsibility. his behaviour is all his to own. ALL. just as your behaviour is all yours to own.

I understand exactly, wanting to try and be a "normal", seperated, co-parent, I understand the paralysis that in-your-face abuse can bring when it's happening. It's easy afterwards to think -I should have called the police, not just said I'd called the police, or I should have not opened the door when he came to the house, or I should have down-loaded the texts. It is hard to think of these things when you are both frightened and desensitised to them. Its easy to think when you're not in a situation, that's its obvious what one should do.

for example: Lots of people think that if they were attacked in the street they would run away and call out loudly. If car-jacked, the most sensible risk limiting thing to do is get out of the car immediately or ram it into a police station/populated area, rather than drive the attacker to another location of their choice giving them a chance to isolate and overpower you at their leisure. Should a hijacker point a gun at a plane-full of people, if they ALL get up and rush forward, the hijacker is easily over-powered. Most people when in these situations, actually don't do those things though. Fear paralyses: and a very complex risk-assessment goes on internally especially when you are so used to living with it that you don't recognise that it is there.

I'm glad you have no idea what you're talking about SP, but your words perpetuate a stereotype that helps to further entrap and abuse people already living in fear. Talk to some DV experts and find out how people in abusive relationships receive the words you have just typed, before "saying" them again?
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Old 02-21-2011, 05:26 AM
  # 31 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by JenT1968 View Post
he wasn't .

I'm glad you have no idea what you're talking about SP, but your words perpetuate a stereotype that helps to further entrap and abuse people already living in fear. Talk to some DV experts and find out how people in abusive relationships receive the words you have just typed, before "saying" them again?
Listen, I am entitled to say my opinin on this and I don't need to be told that I have no idea what I'm talking about. Typical codie behaviour, tell others what to say and think. You're entitled to your input, and I am entitled to mine!

I don't need to talk to anyone, and if I did talk to an expert, I think it's clear if someone is spending time with an abuser, they would ask, why are you spending time with someone who abuses you?!

If she is so terrified of this man, why not go NO CONTACT? Why cause they have kids together? Is that any excuse to see a man who is so dangerous! Women who are abused leave, hide, run away and don't spend time with the abuser.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but why do you spend time with a man who keeps threatening you and whom you are so scared of?
I get abused people suffer from PTSD and go back for more abuse, but at what point do you do you stop being the victim?
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Old 02-21-2011, 05:28 AM
  # 32 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Verbena View Post
Get an Order of Protection. Keep that dangerous man away from you and your kids. Stop communicating with him.
Yes, EXACTLY, stop contact!!!!!!!!! I totally agree!
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Old 02-21-2011, 06:33 AM
  # 33 (permalink)  
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In hindsight I look back at my dance with the XAH I was caught in the excitement/drama in it until I went to enough Alanon to see how insane I was. One of the first things I learned in there was how to detach. I also learned to not engage with him when he was using. I would turn my phone off at 9pm. My XAH's brain was eaten up with alcohol/drug abuse. He had also done alot of coke in years past which eats big holes in your brain. To engage with someone like that is not good kids or not. My minister in church told a story of if you put a fence around a turkey he does not fly out. For some reason he forgets he can fly. You can fly. It took me a while but I did finally- after years -I realized I could fly.
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Old 02-21-2011, 07:57 AM
  # 34 (permalink)  
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Smile

SP:

Please know in advance, it is not my intention to attack you, but to present, hopefully, a perspective you can relate to.

In another thread you wrote:

"My gut says he may be using me only to feed his very low self esteem. "

" ......It's so very confusing. He doesn't want to come back for sure or want to be with me, for sure. "

This is a mild version of what most women go through living with an alcoholic...Confusion-- knowing in your gut the thing to do, but somehow unable to quite bring yourself to do it. For most women, I think, there are many, many reasons used to rationalize their acceptance.

When you throw abuse into the pot..the confusion is multiplied a 1000x over. I personally couldn't believe when he was actually dragging me from one room to the next by my hair that it was happening. It was surreal to me. This did not happen in real life, only in movies on lifetime channel!

Then fear steps in and plays havoc on your brain. The day after an attack, (and don't kid yourself, I defended myself--only to discover that I was not anywhere near as stong as he, especially when he was drinking crazed, nor as tough as I thought I was all these years.) I always shook. I told myself this was crazy. I am not afraid of him. Good grief.

I knew I needed to leave. Yet I didn't for 2 years. I always had reasons to stay..no job, he is doing better lately.... Then came time to do it I decided...... It was OVERWHELMING. I packed up a few boxes and then had no energy to finish them. They sat in the living room for weeks. It took everything I had to get out of bed and face the days routine, much less try to leave.

Support and understanding is a huge issue in helping an abused woman get out.

When I finally did, I called my sister and said. I need help. I have to get out TODAY. I hid waiting on her posse to arrive.

Why not the police? They had been there the night before, and when did cry for help from them, because HE had a scratch on his forehead, we were both guilty. So either we both went to jail or one of us leave the house. He was drunk out of his mind, so guess who left? ME. I was put on the street by the people who are suppose to protect me.

Had my sister not come and brought 6 people with her. I would still be there. I promise.

I was safe while they were all there. We busted tail and got out as much as quickly as we could.

I was safe staying the next 2 nights in her home.

Then, my daughter and I got our own place. She works nights. Now, I was alone. I turned all the lights on. I checked the doors and windows repeatedly. I watched for odd people or cars near our home. I didn't go out if I didn't have to. I was reclusive for many weeks. I watched to see if I was being followed when I had to go out. Everyone around me and everyone near me was bait for suspicion.

Plain and simple: I was afraid.

I began to read about abusive men. I began to heal and become sane again. Then he starts calling and coercing me.

I actually said to my DV counsellor: "Maybe it wasn't as bad as I remember it."

And I began to try to work on saving my marriage. Using what I thought was good judgment and boundaries. Still believing I can influence him to change.

Anyone on the outside looking in wants to ask why? I often thought: "While there is no denying he has a bad side, they have no idea how good our good is." Oh what we could be. After all real love is hard to find.

Each person must find their own way out, in their own time, due to their individual needs and circumstances.

It's terribly easy to judge circumstances that you youself are not in.

There is a sticky telling how to support an abused woman. It says be the opposite of what the abuser is. I can guarantee you the abuser attacks her and blames her. We need to support her.


We are family!!
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Old 02-21-2011, 08:07 AM
  # 35 (permalink)  
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I handled a case involving a woman whose husband burned her on a daily basis with hot oven racks from a toaster oven. For a year and a half.

Why didn't she leave? She had, once, and he tracked her down and snatched one of the children back to stay with him. That child, and the other children, had severe emotional problems. The burning started once she came back because she feared for the life and well-being of the child he took.

He threatened on a daily basis that if she ever told, he would kill her. She believed him. He threatened to kill the kids. She believed him.

She was every bit as much a prisoner as someone in a concentration camp. She became numb and concentrated on surviving each day so her children would not be left alone with this monster.

Leaving is not simple when abuse is involved. Statistically, abused women are at highest risk of being killed when they are in the process of leaving.

It IS possible to help a victim of abuse to plan to leave safely. But it is never as simple as just walking away and "going NC". Women are stalked once they leave. They are in unfamiliar surroundings. Often while they remain with the abuser they can see when an attack is coming and prepare for it--not possible when they are ambushed once they leave.

Certainly everyone in an abusive relationship should be encouraged to take steps to get out of the situation. But it must be done carefully and safely, not hastily or without planning.
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Old 02-21-2011, 09:46 AM
  # 36 (permalink)  
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When my AH kicked us out last August, the first thing I thought was "this is it, I'm finally out, with the kids" I figured I had all the cards stacked in my corner, social services would jump at helping a homeless mom with 3 kids, I can go to the women's shelter, etc. It would look terrible for him in court, because he kicked us out, so I would definitely get the kids, no more threats from him on how he would totally take the kids from me, because 12 years ago oldest son learned how to break out the screen and climb out of the window in the basement apartment I was living in with him, while AH was in basic training. And I didn't catch him right away, and MIL was outside and kept him with her.

Women's shelter was full, couldn't take in a woman with 3 kids(one being a teenage boy) who didn't get there via the authorities. No other shelters in the area had room for us either. Social services took forever, and didn't even look at half my paperwork(the parts where you explain special circumstances, such as a spouse who is abusive or an alcoholic)I ended up coming back, after being screamed at by my sister on the phone, and told what a loser I was for trying to temporarily live in a 1 bedroom apartment that a friend offered(both sister and AH attacked me about the apartment)

It's frakking hard, if you haven't lived it, don't judge. My support system fell apart, just when I needed it the most. Turns out, a lot of that was because I kept the drinking, the abuse hidden. My sister thought I was just being a bitch to him. She didn't realize what exactly was going on, because I never told her or my mother.

Editing to add some:

She finally confronted me in December, she happened to come to the house before I had cleaned up from the night before. So there were nearly a dozen cans sitting around. That, and me telling her about the DUI, having to go the food pantry for food(which I'm still having to do, plus I am utilizing a program that distributes excess produce and grocery items that are nearly expired, which at least means the kids and I are eating) because he has been spending most of his paychecks before he even receives them. I have emergency money hidden away, and am working on finding an evening job that pays enough to cover rent on an apartment. Day job would be too difficult to figure out, what with daycare and getting the other kids off to school, court dates(because that will be an issue, at least for awhile)
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Old 02-21-2011, 10:24 AM
  # 37 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by LexieCat View Post
I handled a case involving a woman whose husband burned her on a daily basis with hot oven racks from a toaster oven. For a year and a half.

Why didn't she leave? She had, once, and he tracked her down and snatched one of the children back to stay with him. That child, and the other children, had severe emotional problems. The burning started once she came back because she feared for the life and well-being of the child he took.

He threatened on a daily basis that if she ever told, he would kill her. She believed him. He threatened to kill the kids. She believed him.

She was every bit as much a prisoner as someone in a concentration camp. She became numb and concentrated on surviving each day so her children would not be left alone with this monster.

Leaving is not simple when abuse is involved. Statistically, abused women are at highest risk of being killed when they are in the process of leaving.

It IS possible to help a victim of abuse to plan to leave safely. But it is never as simple as just walking away and "going NC". Women are stalked once they leave. They are in unfamiliar surroundings. Often while they remain with the abuser they can see when an attack is coming and prepare for it--not possible when they are ambushed once they leave.

Certainly everyone in an abusive relationship should be encouraged to take steps to get out of the situation. But it must be done carefully and safely, not hastily or without planning.
Here's something that is along the same theme as what you're saying:

Sanctuary for the Abused: Traumatic Bonding & Stockholm Syndrome

Stockholm Syndrome

We often berate the victim for staying in these relationships and can't understand how it happened. A violent, controlling man does not take a woman out and beat her on the first date. We all put on our best face when we initially meet people and batterers are no different. If he took the woman out and beat her on the first date there would be no second date. She has no history or investment in the relationship and wouldn't tolerate it. His taking control of her is a gradual process.
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Old 02-21-2011, 10:38 AM
  # 38 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Summerpeach View Post
Listen, I am entitled to say my opinin on this and I don't need to be told that I have no idea what I'm talking about. Typical codie behaviour, tell others what to say and think. You're entitled to your input, and I am entitled to mine!

I don't need to talk to anyone, and if I did talk to an expert, I think it's clear if someone is spending time with an abuser, they would ask, why are you spending time with someone who abuses you?!

If she is so terrified of this man, why not go NO CONTACT? Why cause they have kids together? Is that any excuse to see a man who is so dangerous! Women who are abused leave, hide, run away and don't spend time with the abuser.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but why do you spend time with a man who keeps threatening you and whom you are so scared of?
I get abused people suffer from PTSD and go back for more abuse, but at what point do you do you stop being the victim?
You clearly don't have a clue what you are talking about.
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Old 02-21-2011, 11:02 AM
  # 39 (permalink)  
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Summer peach,
judging is probably not the best course of support, here.
And hopefully you don't judge yourself so harshly.
We are all here because we have been affected by alcoholism.

If it was all that easy to "just go NC.", to just stop, no one would be on the site.
That includes YOU.

I hope this can b resolved w out any more abuse.
God speed
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Old 02-22-2011, 05:16 AM
  # 40 (permalink)  
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This thread has already been reported once, and please know that we are monitoring it.

Here's an important sticky thread about how to help a member who is in an abusive situation. Some of the mods here have worked in the field of DV: http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...ng-abused.html

I am a moderator here, and I survived an abusive marriage. I know how difficult it is to admit the situation, to reach out for help, to take the baby steps necessary to get out, and to get out SAFELY. Trust me when I say it's not as easy as just picking up your stuff and leaving.

I will strongly caution those of you who do not have experience with this to keep your well-meaning and misguided advice to yourselves. If you do not have your own experience, strength and hope to share on this thread, please take your attention to another thread.

I'll also strongly recommend that you put people on ignore if they trigger you. To ignore someone, simply click on their name and select "add xyz to your ignore list".

If this thread is reported again, we'll close it. And that would be a shame, because buried in all the screeching and preaching is some really good ESH.
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