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Capabile to Love while drinking?

Old 11-25-2010, 07:53 AM
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Capabile to Love while drinking?

I am still battling along. I miss him but am focusing on me. I beleive he has not done anything while "separated" from me, he has not contacted his sponsor, booked a therapist, seen our priest. He just sits at home drinking. I had so hoped that he would be addressing these issues like he said he would, that being why he needed "time out". He seems full of excuses as to why we cant have a relationship right now....all excuses I beleive. Anyway I have one question as i am trying to decide whether to wait (he said he will call in a week or so) or to go. Is he capable of love while drinking - do they really know how to love the person who loves them while drinking?

I keep praying to God for strength to make it through each day. Have planned a full weekend as although it would be our weekend without the kids, I think I am not an option. I just dont understand how anyone would choose BOOZE over a relationship.
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Old 11-25-2010, 08:19 AM
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I don't understand it either but people do, every day.

My personal opinion is that my xah probably loves me. I'm just not as important as alcohol. He would not say that but he doesn't have to - he behaved that way. At every decision making turn - he chose alcohol and his other needs.

I've decided that the emotion of love isn't enough. Thinking love in our heads (or their heads) is not enough. Love has to be an action. I have to *feel* the love based on the how they treat me for it to count.

Sending warm thoughts for you this holiday. I hope you are able to put him and the relationship out of your mind for a short time to enjoy the graciousness of the day and warm yourself with thoughts of all the things in your life that make you special, individual and valued. Those things are there, they are there for all of us, we just have look and pay attention.
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Old 11-25-2010, 08:24 AM
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JW,

I am going to send you positive vibes. I have been there. Thumper said it all.
Hugs!
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Old 11-25-2010, 08:35 AM
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Before I even read Thumper's response, I thought, Well, he can feel love, but he can't do love, and that's the part that counts.

Recently my daughter said to me, as part of a discussion about Daddy's behavior, "He has a good heart." I said, "He does, but something gets lost in between his heart and how he lives his life."
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Old 11-25-2010, 12:52 PM
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Someone who is hurting his mind, body and soul does NOT love himself. Thus if he cannot love himself he cannot love others. Just my two cents from my own small experience. RE excuses, well the alkie I knew also had excuses about everything. Somewhere I learned they are called "Evasion types". Fits perfectly in my book. The hard thing for me was realizing I was behaving similarly, trying to love someone while despising myself and acting against myself most of the time.

Here I have learned what they feel or say is not that important, that you have to push the MUTE button and see the actions without words. Hard exercise for me but there it was- the addict, the alcohol and nothing more. I was not "second" or sharing him with Mr Jack Daniels. Alcohol is all there was and all there is for him.

Gladly the alcoholic is no longer "all I have" and for that I am very grateful.
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Old 11-25-2010, 01:12 PM
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Truth is, he can't have a relationship as long as he choses to drink over those he loves. Sure I have no doubt they love but that love is pushed so far down by all their own shame and self loathing, it cannot possibly be shown until they work through their own issues. You can't express love to anyone if you don't express it to yourself.

I don't think it is so much a choice as it is an action of default. A very ineffective way to deal with life's struggles and any emotional demands placed on them by family, work, friends etc. It is a cowards way of saying "I can't deal with anything right now but rather than think about why, I am going to numb myself".

Hang in there.
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Old 11-26-2010, 06:06 AM
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Well I hate this damn hurting. I am angry today. Angry that I let myself fall in love with him, angry that he told me everything would be ok, angry that he used to say the most lovely things but actions were another thing. What is wrong with me. I am lonely, I miss him - this man who SAYS he loves me. He is able to be sober around his young children and show them a good time. He talks to them. He talks to his ex wife, his brother, friends - but he has cut me dead - he said he will call in "a week or so". I KNOW I am my own worst enemy but I fell for him so badly and honestly believed him when he said that he felt so much for me. DAMNIT. I want this pain to go away.
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Old 11-26-2010, 08:27 AM
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I know how you feel. I am in a similar situation. He calls me when intoxicated. That says to me that the sober him doesn't want to talk to me, only the intoxicated him wants to talk to me. When I called him, and caught him sober, he cut the conversation short. His anger is right there when sober.

Sometimes it feels like he is testing how to detach from me. He may use alcohol to numb, and the time apart as some test of his own strength to get over me.
Then he does little thoughtless things that I react to emotionally, and these things set me off, angry, upset, for a day each time. Meanwhile, he seems oblivious to that I have been hurt by these things, as if I am over-sensitive, or is it that he is under-sensitive.
The volitile roller coaster of emotions continues on, and it seems directly linked to his drinking, for both of us.
It's called codendency, and I'm reading the book codependent no more. You might want to pick up a copy yourself, cheap on amazon or ebay.
As much as I love him, talking to him again after a period of no contact for several months is making me realize that he sets me off every time I talk to him. For a day or two I am messed up all over again.
The relationship is toxic. We both desire to some degree to salvage what is left of it, but, at what cost?
Feeling vulnerable to his moods--either intoxicated and wanting to talk to me but not quite all there with me, or sober and curt. Talking to him is like sticking my hand down a hole in the ground and blindly waiting to see if I will be bitten by something. Not good.
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Old 11-26-2010, 09:01 AM
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I was raised as an only child by alcoholics, both mom and dad were Manhattan drinkers-whiskey all night long, every night. I wanted their attention and love so much. It hurt that booze came first for them. It hurt so bad, I got into drugs and became an opiate addict at a young age. I would get into codependent relationships with people and my emotions and life was based around how other people felt... instead of how I felt. Now I try to love my parents(who still drink and are amazingly, still alive), just the way they are... I hate booze and what it does to people. I stay away from my parents even though they need lots of medical attention, dying from alcoholism is a long awful process. I try to remind myself that I am powerless against alcohol/drugs, as well in other peoples lives. An addict/alcoholic doesn't see a choice between a person and a drug, it's like a whole different section of the brain. I try not to personalize that type of feeling anymore because I know it's not the case. It's an internal struggle to each person. I hope you feel better, whatever it takes to be happpy and healthy. Being on both sides of the coin, it was for me far harder to be the sober person watching the people I love kill themselves with whiskey than being an addict-and that's not a fun place at all.
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Old 11-26-2010, 09:21 AM
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My A (who is home with us, now, sober for 60 days) has been asking out loud to me ocassionally-- "what was I thinking?"
He says he is here, and it is warm and loving and stable, our son is a joy, and its a nice house.
HE says he can see and is seeing more and more of how he would tell himself all kinds of things that he could use to justify choosing that uglier existence. He would say I was unbearable, our child was being kept from him, the house was too small, I was controlling...
He looks at it now, and he says even he has a hard time believing that his need for alcohol lead him to those thought processes.
Still, at any moment, I know that he could and maybe will go out one day, not come back, and resume that life.

One thing I know now that I never knew before is that he does want to be here, I am not the one who is at fault for all that mess, and this is a great place to live.

If he does go back to all that, I will know in my heart that it is not because of my failings shortcomings.
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Old 11-26-2010, 03:15 PM
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I believe that my late alcoholic boyfriend was capable of feeling love and loving me in return, but with an alcohol-clouded mind. I've learned that it's safe to assume that an active alcoholic is always under the influence of alcohol. Imagine trying to understand the often subtle messages and complex emotions of love when your mind is saturated with a toxic substance. Love is hard enough to figure out with a clear mind.

So my answer is, yes, an active addict is capable of loving others, but in a more limited capacity than I needed.

Sharing a life with an alcoholic is emotionally and physically draining. It's not just hard, it's darn near impossible. Because of this, I tended to judge my boyfriend too harshly. He was, after all, just a man. He was never the prince charming I had blown him up to be in my mind. And while it was easy to blame all the chaos in my life on my boyfriend and his drinking, I eventually realized that he was not holding me hostage in that life. I was.

A new life was always there for the taking. All I had to do was let go of the things that weren't working for me, and walk through the door.
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Old 11-26-2010, 03:47 PM
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What is love?

I think the biggest lesson I have learned in Al-Anon is that what I called "love" was pity. And it was a way for me to feel needed -- obviously, I must love this man since I stay with him regardless of his drinking and bad behavior, right?

I wouldn't worry so much about what, if anything he is capable of or feeling. I would worry more about what you are feeling, and what beliefs those feelings signify. Do you believe that you are not worth more than you are receiving in this relationship? Do you believe that he is your responsibility? Do you believe that this is "the best you can do"?

I've found all kinds of erroneous beliefs at the roots of my feelings. Be good to yourself.
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Old 11-26-2010, 10:43 PM
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Thank you for all your replies. I had a good evening with my sister-in-law last night and she asked me all kids of questions which I answered honestly. As I spoke, I started to think - what am I doing? it is obvious that ABF is not treating me how a BF should treat his GF. It is all about him. For me it is a heart / mind thing. My heart says STAY and my head says RUN. That is where my inner turmoil comes from. I am making him out, in my heart, to be way more than he is. I thank this site for helping my mind get a grip on this. Last night, coming home, I passed his home. All the lights were on as was the TV, it is a sad reality that he was probably passed out on the couch. This weekend is a really hard one for him - due to several life circumstances - I text messaged him earlier to say that I know how hard it is and that he needs to know that God is in control and that he needs to claim back his power over what this weekend is all about. NO RESPONSE. I think that the fact that he constantly ignores me, is the hardest thing. Perhaps I too am making excuses. I need to end this once and for all and not have his "I will contact you in a week or two" hanging over my head - but then the heart says - give him time - he is in such a bad place and the slippery slope has now become a sheer cliff that he is falling down. The heart says - if he is capable of love - then maybe................
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Old 11-26-2010, 11:37 PM
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But what if the mind says he is not capable of giving the type of love you need and deserve? Not today, not tomorrow, maybe never. Alcoholism is a progressive disease. Sometimes there is no path to sobriety, no light at the end of the tunnel. My boyfriend loved me as much as he could, but he lost his battle with alcoholism three years ago. I was not at his side during the last months of this life. I had to save myself. But as you can see, I never stopped loving him. I just learned to love myself more.

I hope you stick around and continue to share, and learn, and grow.
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Old 11-27-2010, 08:24 AM
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Well I have made it to the evening. I am told that he was out and about with his brother and his girlfriend at a friends house having a party tonight - his sponsor is apparently there too. Interestingly enough I know his sponsor and he has told me that ABF has not mentioned anything to him about drinking again and that he has not been going to AA meetings etc. His sponsor said that he will try see what is going on but will not intervene as ABF has to make the first step. I guess what is hard is that ABF is out and about living his life as usual. ABF did not have any alcohol - so I guess I look stupid telling his sponsor he is back drinking again. ABF hides his drinking so well. I guess it hurts knowing that he is out having "fun" and a social life and I am "waiting for a week or so". I am also told that he is telling everyone that he does not want a relationship at the moment (but cant tell me it is over) and that he still has feelings for his exwife. THAT has made me feel like such a tart as he professed to loving ME, to wanting to be with ME, that my ex H had to be out of my head and heart so we could have a relationship. He even said I was "the one", he felt connected to me and that - yes - he wants to marry me when the time is right as he has never felt this way about anyone in his life. STUPID ME.

I am just wondering how he can turn off his feelings so fast and get out there and be a total hypocrite when not being prepared to look me in the eye and tell me it is over. I voiced all these concerns at the beginning of our relationship and he made me feel safe and secure. HE needs to be accountable for his actions and lies and end it face to face with me.

He has two personalities - the church going (he is on the church committee) I am in love with JW123 type and the I am an alcoholic, who is out and about type.

Bitterness is creeping in now. Perhaps it also has to do that my xh's ow left her alcoholic and came running to us for support. She and my exh got real cozy.

I HATE ALCOHOL.
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Old 11-27-2010, 08:41 AM
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There is nothing stopping you from getting out and having fun during your separation--except you. Which sounds more appealing? Being alone and obsessing what your boyfriend is doing during your trial separation or getting out there and enjoying life?

I found that when I started to focus more on my life, I naturally became less focused on my boyfriend's life. It was difficult to think clearly and focus on what I wanted out of life when I was obsessing over what my boyfriend was doing.

The only way I was able to stop obsessing about my boyfriend's drinking was to find something more interesting, fulfilling, and fun to do. So, if you were not currently in a relationship with anybody, what would you be doing on this beautiful weekend? The rest of the day is yours for the taking.
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Old 11-27-2010, 09:03 AM
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I HATE ALCOHOL.
I'm with you on that one.

My heart goes out to you JW123. A lot of what you're saying reminds me of me almost 5 years ago when I became involved with my ex. He said some similar things. He came around eventually and I felt "special." If I could hop in a time machine today and go back to myself, I would say, "RUN!" I was emotionally involved and had already fallen for him.

Suppose he comes to you and changes his mind. He will do things like this again and again. You will spend many evenings upset while he is out and about with others enjoying himself. You will not be considered. Just my two cents.
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