Difficult Situations

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Old 05-07-2015, 07:29 PM
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Well, went to the dr's today. Basically it's a waiting game. She doesnt look good to him at all, and he said it looks like she has a 50% chance of mortality in the next 3-6 months. But, he also said that the next 3-6 months is when we will see if she recovers at all and her liver gains any functioning again without the drinking.
Apparently she can't go on any transplant list until she's been 6 months sober. So, 5 more months to wait to cross that bridge. I hope there's enough time.
She's just so unwell. She's in and out of sleep all day because she doesn't sleep at night. Most days she's not alert. Some days she seems just fine.
When she's out of it, she's dozing in and out, talking in her sleep, grinding her teeth so badly she bleeds.
She can't write legibly.
She's dizzy. In pain.

Ugh, it's just awful. I really hope she pulls through. Plus this is horrible for my codependency. I get all finnicky and point things out, and remind and annoy her about the things she really should be worrying about. She is doing a good job of pointing it out to me. It's all out of fear. She just does the magical thinking thing. Ugh it's so scary.

My sister is coming by in 2 days, she leaves in 5. I havent talked to her about it yet. What Im doing is going to counselling tomorrow to regroup, go over my plan with my counsellor. Then I think I will go home and tell my mum that if she doesn't tell my sister by Saturday, then I will be telling her. I mean. My sister wants to know why I have spent extra nights over. She will want to know why my mum's out of it/swollen belly/yellow. She's not stupid. For me, it's all about timing.
I have to tell her in enough time for her to speak to my mum. But I also am worried about doing it before my sister comes for the visit, cause then my mum will call it off likely...And if I tell my mum I am going to tell my sister, she could have the chance to mess with my brain.

BUT. The fact remains, I MUST tell my sister that our mum is unwell. I have to. It's happening. It's the when and how.

I can't believe that I could be losing my mum. It's just awful. It's even worse because it feels like I have lost her already, emotionally from years ago. And it feels like I am losing her again as she gets more and more ill. And then I will lose her again because I am going to tell my sister. And then I really am going to lose her.
I'm so afraid I'm going to hate myself for how I've treated her, because I have been rude and annoyed and short tempered. I'm so afraid I'm going to be left with just awfulness. A shell of a person. Which it already feels like I have been, but now 10 times worse.
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Old 05-07-2015, 08:05 PM
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(((Spalding))) So sorry to hear this. Hopefully your mom will do what she needs to do to get healthier and get on the transplant list if that's what she needs.
As far as telling your sister, can't you just tell her to ask your mom if she has any questions? It seems like an unfair burden to make you the go between, when it's really not your responsibility.
I'm really glad you're getting support from a counselor right now. Caring for yourself is crucial. As far as bearing a burden of guilt, you can make amends to your mom if you wish. But also remember that for years she has chosen to drink even when it had a negative impact on her parenting abilities, relationships and health.
Keep reaching out and posting. We are here for you.
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Old 05-07-2015, 09:32 PM
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Hi Spalding, I really admire the way you're coping with this; it's not the usual stuff, but getting serious.
I hope your mother sticks to the 6 month sobriety period because it will help her mentally and well as physically.
If it were my choice I would tell your sister, and make no apologies to your AM about it. I would be astounded if you were to 'lose her' over it as she's made these threats to you time after time, and always goes back to demanding you stay with her. She's chosen to involve you very closely in her illness, mental and physical, and as the mature adult you have the right to make some hard decisions.
I really hope she becomes sober and you find the mother you used to know. It's so hard for you being put in this position at your age, and if you can find support from your sister, take it.
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Old 05-08-2015, 04:04 AM
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Spalding, I don't want to minimize the seriousness of your mom's condition, but my second husband was in EXACTLY the same situation for several weeks (told he would need a transplant, have to wait, etc.). Unfortunately, he went back to drinking after a few months of sobriety, and almost 20 years later he is still alive. Don't ask me how, but he is. I don't have contact with him, and I assume his condition is bad, but the point is that nothing is carved in stone.

I think you owe it to your sister to tell her. If your mom does die from this, imagine how your sister would feel if she never had a chance to say the things she wanted to. Your mom is in this situation despite all your efforts to be supportive, and I wouldn't be terribly concerned about whether she wants you to tell your sister or not.

I walked away from my second husband (and I know with a parent it's different), and I feel no guilt in spite of the fact that we had our disagreements and ugly moments. If he died tomorrow I would be sad but not guilty because I did the best I could. You have been working very hard at being supportive of your mom--often to your own detriment--and you have zero to feel guilty about.

Hugs, I hope your sister and you can support each other through this.
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Old 05-08-2015, 10:32 AM
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Spaulding,
Like many others who have weighed in, my mother is an alcoholic, mentally unhealthy, in poor health. And like some others, I am also a divorced parent of a teenager.

I read through this entire thread just now. Parts of it made me angry for you and parts made me super sad for you. The WHOLE situation is tremendously difficult and unfair. I'm glad you are talking here and in counselling, I've been through many years of that too and it's amazing how, every now and then, something will just "click" and your entire perception shifts, and suddenly you can see things clearer, manage things better, take steps you couldn't take before.

A few weeks ago, you said this about your mom (sorry I don't know how to do the quote thing):
"It's also hard due to the way she responded when I said I was leaving. Guilting me (how could you when you know I could be dying), punishing me (I guess I wont record the shows we watch anymore, don't bother coming back tonight to watch that one show), belitting me (Selfish, thanks for nothing, this isn't love or caring).
That's hard to listen to. It's hard cause I know she's so hurt by this and she can't understand my need for some space away. It's just a really bad situation."

It's been said before in this thread, but I hope you realize that, even sober, your mom is also a very mentally unhealthy adult person. I SO wanted my mother to "understand" me, my choices, my needs, to validate me. Once I recognized my own need for my mom's validation and realized that I would probably never get it (because of my mother's own issues, not mine), then I stopped trying to earn it, stopped trying to prove myself, and things got easier.

I also wanted to tell you, Spaulding, that I really admire your maturity and your thoughtfulness. I was past age 30 before I even got to the place you're at now.
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Old 05-09-2015, 02:56 PM
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Thank you everyone. You've all made good points, and I cannot express my appreciation for your input and support. I would go crazy without this board and knowing that at least some people know and care. I'm not alone in this.
Garfiild, I get what you're saying. I think I get stuck in the wishing she would understand/validate mode and I just wont get anywhere with that. I need to meet her where she's at.
It's funny, everyone says I've approached this with such maturity and whatnot. I've always been told that, but I just don't see it! I guess I wouldn't as I'm me and I can't really know any different, but I've been told this from so many people? I don't know what it is that people pick up on though, that says 'maturity'? What it is that I say that points to that?

I told my sister today. She was upset, though she held it together. She guessed it was cirrhosis. She's really upset and she almost feels like no longer leaving, which I understand and am upset about. She must be facing such a huge dilemma with leaving in 2 days but knowing that her mum might die while she's gone.

I feel bad that she's in that position, but I'm glad I've told her at least. And she's coming back tomorrow for mother's day. So, now she can ask questions and see her again with this knowledge. I think she's upset with me though, that I didn't tell her sooner. And that's understandable.

I am seriously considering contacting her liver/family doctor because she is now seriously incapacitated. She's not taking her medications. She's barely awake enough to eat, or even go to the bathroom.

I finally got the dressing off her paracentesis site, and it's looking a little angry, and so was she that I did that, but I couldn't let it sit and fester with gauze over it. So I just pulled it off. I'm hoping to get a better look soon.

So, monday I will hopefully be able to speak to one of them and see if she can be admitted, because she can't even do anything at this point for herself, she can't really get up off the couch without help at this point by herself.
If she were able to be coherent and take her meds, fine, I wouldn't push. But I'm getting seriously worried.
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Old 05-09-2015, 03:17 PM
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It does sound as if she needs skilled nursing care. You might want to contact your local social services agency
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Old 05-09-2015, 03:28 PM
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I'm glad you told your sister. Don't worry too much about your sis--you have your own hands full, and she will deal with the situation in her own way. It isn't your job to "fix it" for your sister any more than it is for you to "fix things" for your mom.

Stay on an even keel, and yes, call your mom's doctors. At this point, let her be mad if she's going to be mad. You can't do all of this on your own. You need to let the professionals help.

Hugs, and I hope you are able to have a peaceful Mothers Day.
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Old 05-09-2015, 09:08 PM
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Honestly, I dont think it can wait til Monday. I'm consiering getting her to a hospital tomorrow.
Looking at hepatic encephalopathy, she's pretty classic. Sleep is backwards, she's basically been sleeping since Thursday. She's very unalert. Confused, not making a lot of sense.
She's also had some foot flapping, like her feet are just twitching non-stop.
I'm honestly afraid to leave it, she's deteriorated so rapidly.
She had been sleepy and whatnot, but at least alert and able to stay awake. Now she's not really.
I'm afraid she might go into coma she's sliding so fast.
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Old 05-10-2015, 01:46 AM
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Call 911 and get her in a hospital now.
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Old 05-10-2015, 03:56 AM
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I really hope things work out for you and your mum. I echo - get medical help now - it is far better to call and get a visit from paramedics and her not be hospitalised than you not call and she ought to have been hospitalised, if you see what I mean.
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Old 05-10-2015, 06:25 AM
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I didn't call last night. If anything, I probably will today. Though, she's much more alert this morning. She woke up and got herself sitting up and the TV on by herself, which is good. And she's talking, having apple juice. So that's an improvement.
If she goes back to sleeping non-stop, or when I get back to the house later today she still is confused/unable to keep up with conversation, then I will definitely get her over there ASAP.
Just sucks, it's mother's day you know? It'll be the last thing she wants. But I need to do it.
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Old 05-10-2015, 06:48 AM
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Oh, and she's still in denial. Why did you have to tell your sister, it's not like I'm on death's door, if I was I would be in the hospital etc etc.

She's also threatening 'retribution' and that she's 'going to get me' for having told my sister. She had thought that I had said something to do with the dogs to m y sister yesterday which is why she hadn't been upset (lol, see this is the kind of nonsensical worrying stuff she says. She also replied after I mentioned the dog had been shaking because of the thunderstorm last night, with a question about a basketball player shaking cause the TV was on basketball??????).
She's mostly worried cause my sister's leaving so soon, and my mum doesn't know how my sister is going to handle this new info. Which is a reasonable worry. But still, she shouldn't speak to me that way.
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Old 05-10-2015, 08:48 AM
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Spalding, you are doing super in a terribly difficult situation. Kudos to you, again and again.

It seems that your mother now is not aware enough to be in charge of her own health, so don't hesitate to call in the professionals. And, you don't have to see calling her doctors from her perspective. She sees it as betrayal and an action against her, but that's not the truth. It may just be that there is some medical help for her, if you call in the health professionals to take a hard medical look at her condition.

You are not betraying her, and you don't need to carry this burden on your own. It sounds like it is time for the doctors to do what doctors do - assess her medical condition, and choose the best medical solutions for her.

Her best interest, in this case, is not aligning with her emotional perspective. And her emotions come from denial and declining health and capacity to reason from the medical issues. If her liver is not functioning properly, she is being flooded with toxins that her body cannot remove. She has had longstanding problems with acknowledging the reality of her health, and now, she may be suffering a kind of dementia from the toxins. Because of that, it is okay to disregard her misguided demands and take the action that she needs. At some point, lay people like us have to turn medical problems over to people who are trained to handle them.

When I've been in situations with people with health problems, I've learned that all I can do is the best I can think of at that moment I am called to deal with the health problem. I don't have to be perfect; no one can be perfect. All we can do is gather all the data we can at the moment of crisis, look at it rationally and with great compassion, and make the best decision with the information we have.

Later, it isn't okay to look back with hindsight and more knowledge and second guess ourselves. We can't retroactively criticize our decision because we did the best we could at that moment and we did it out of love and compassion.

So, whatever you decide, from your thoughtfulness and caring for your mother, will be the absolute best decision you can make in her behalf, no matter what she says or no matter what happens subsequently.

This are difficult waters to transverse with great rapids, and you are doing a fabulous job. I only wish that your mother had the mental and emotional capacity to recognize the love and caring that you are showing her. But she can't do that, and her inability to recognize that you are doing your best for her doesn't negate what you are doing. If she were whole, she would be proud of you, too.

She is like a drowning woman, reaching out in panic and fear, saying whatever comes to her mind. You, on the other hand, are like the lifeguard reaching out with the pole to save her as best you can without going down yourself.

You are honorable, compassionate, caring and deserve to feel proud of yourself for trying your best to care for her. However this turns out, always remember that.

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Old 05-10-2015, 09:28 AM
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Well I guess the retribution threats are pretty much routine for you now, and you know it's a mix of mental and physical illness, but it is sad to see her in this state. Thinking of you, and I hope that without the alcohol in her system she starts to improve. It may not feel like mother's day, but you're a good daughter in the face of huge difficulties.
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Old 05-10-2015, 09:35 AM
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Spalding, I saw my second husband go through liver shutdown and he was exactly like an Alzheimer's patient. He said things that made no sense. He talked about getting well and building a boat. I remember going to the Barnes & Noble and picking up a copy of this magazine called "Wooden Boat" that he was thrilled with. Just try to play along with her, distract her where you can, and yes, call in the pros when you need to.

Hugs, you're a very wonderful daughter, one I'd be proud to have.
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Old 05-11-2015, 11:35 AM
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Spalding, I am so sorry. Just catching up.

I think you need to speak to her doctor about nursing care for her. I don't think you can mentally or physically take care of her, and it sounds like she definitely needs a person to help her.

Hugs to you. You did the right thing telling your sister.
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Old 05-12-2015, 06:06 AM
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All of your kind words are so helpful.
I ended up calling her Dr's, and they were kinda sending mixed messages. Since Sunday however, she's been doing much better, and yesterday was a very clear day. I'll be keeping an eye on her, and if she starts slipping again, I will take the action I need to.
I'm also planning on getting some time in at my dad's for a breather. I guess it's just gonna be a wait and see game for a while...
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Old 05-12-2015, 06:23 AM
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Originally Posted by hopeful4 View Post
Spalding, I am so sorry. Just catching up.

I think you need to speak to her doctor about nursing care for her. I don't think you can mentally or physically take care of her, and it sounds like she definitely needs a person to help her.

Hugs to you. You did the right thing telling your sister.
I agree with this--too much for you alone
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Old 05-16-2015, 07:38 PM
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As I said before, she'd been doing quite well since the Sunday. Moving around, way more clear and alert, almost as if nothing was wrong!?


But. Today. I get back from being at work since 11 this morning, and I get back at 10:30pm tonight, and she hasn't even gotten out of bed. She's been sleeping, moaning and groaning and grinding her teeth again. I try and talk to her and she falls asleep halfway through, doesnt seem she knew that it was even night time, she told me to get going to work!? Her feet and legs are flapping/twitching like crazy again? Like. What?

If she stays this way through tomorrow, then I am going to have to bring her to the hospital. I feel like this will be how it is for a while. A few good days followed by some bad ones.

It's just so surprising how suddenly it happens, and how big a difference there is. Ugh. This is a lot.
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