Not in recovery?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: waysouth
Posts: 388
Not in recovery?
Hi all!
Many of you know me, I've been hanging out here for a little over 6 months.
In that time, I made (what will hopefully be) my last attempt at getting sober.
I came here after 10 years of unssucessful home detoxes from opiates. I could get through the wds, but it was the aftermath of emotional wds that always sent me back out, even after significant periods of sobriety. I had forgotten how to live life with dope - using it, searching for it, financing it. My whole life revolved around it. I prayed for the strength to change, I went to NA meetings and was met with open arms, good people telling me I was on the right path, helping and encouraging me when I fell.
After some research I found suboxone. It's certainly not right for everyone,and it is not an 'easy out' from the hell of addiction. It takes work, and an incredible commitment to be honest and zealous in your recovery. I meet with my doctor weekly, I go to councelling weekly, I have made countless concious decisions to change the way Ilive. I came clean with my loved ones, my regular doctor,my dealer and my friends at SR.
I have made amazing progress, but it has (and will continue to) require alot of work, both externally and internally.
On this websitem I have connected with a small group of other committed individuals who are also on the suboxone maintenace program. That was an incredible gift that SR has given to me.
Sadly,the perception that suboxone and/or methadone are just 'easy outs',and not 'real recovery' runs rampant here, as it does in real life. I have been told that I am not welcome to share at my NA meetings. I have been told that I am not clean, not in recovery and am simply substituing one drug for another...whats worse than those who straight out dissapprove, is those that just quietly ignore me all together. Is it a coincedence that my posts are never awknowledged by many 'established' members here, who, IMO are also those who answer most queries about recovery by asking "when is the last time you've been to a meeting?"
I guess what I'm saying that NA is a wonderful tool in recovery, that is 'in theory' open to ANYONE who has the desire to stop using. Unfortunatly, the reality often plays out as excluding those who are on suboxone or methadone. The quiet dissaproval, the fleeting comments, the complete lack of communitcation with anyone who is labeled as a 'sub user'.
Hey, it's a free world, and everyone is entitled to thier opinions. But don't think we don't notice that you don'treply to our threads or answer our questions. This is not an official NA site....um,yeah. The thing is, even though my experience with one particular group was bad, I think NA is a fabulous thing. I love hearing stories of the endless number of people it had saved. It really is brilliant. I don't want to argue or debate, I just feel there is a little ignorance about those of us on suboxone.
Thanks for listening. Again, I don't want to stirthings up -just wanted to let all of you people know that if you talk to me, you'll probably find out I'm just like you. I won't push subxone on you, you won't catch any suboxone cooties that might contaminate your clear cut recovery, in fact, I rarely even talk about it. I just want to talk about recovery, regardless of which appraoch anyone takes. It's all good.
Later all!
SS
Many of you know me, I've been hanging out here for a little over 6 months.
In that time, I made (what will hopefully be) my last attempt at getting sober.
I came here after 10 years of unssucessful home detoxes from opiates. I could get through the wds, but it was the aftermath of emotional wds that always sent me back out, even after significant periods of sobriety. I had forgotten how to live life with dope - using it, searching for it, financing it. My whole life revolved around it. I prayed for the strength to change, I went to NA meetings and was met with open arms, good people telling me I was on the right path, helping and encouraging me when I fell.
After some research I found suboxone. It's certainly not right for everyone,and it is not an 'easy out' from the hell of addiction. It takes work, and an incredible commitment to be honest and zealous in your recovery. I meet with my doctor weekly, I go to councelling weekly, I have made countless concious decisions to change the way Ilive. I came clean with my loved ones, my regular doctor,my dealer and my friends at SR.
I have made amazing progress, but it has (and will continue to) require alot of work, both externally and internally.
On this websitem I have connected with a small group of other committed individuals who are also on the suboxone maintenace program. That was an incredible gift that SR has given to me.
Sadly,the perception that suboxone and/or methadone are just 'easy outs',and not 'real recovery' runs rampant here, as it does in real life. I have been told that I am not welcome to share at my NA meetings. I have been told that I am not clean, not in recovery and am simply substituing one drug for another...whats worse than those who straight out dissapprove, is those that just quietly ignore me all together. Is it a coincedence that my posts are never awknowledged by many 'established' members here, who, IMO are also those who answer most queries about recovery by asking "when is the last time you've been to a meeting?"
I guess what I'm saying that NA is a wonderful tool in recovery, that is 'in theory' open to ANYONE who has the desire to stop using. Unfortunatly, the reality often plays out as excluding those who are on suboxone or methadone. The quiet dissaproval, the fleeting comments, the complete lack of communitcation with anyone who is labeled as a 'sub user'.
Hey, it's a free world, and everyone is entitled to thier opinions. But don't think we don't notice that you don'treply to our threads or answer our questions. This is not an official NA site....um,yeah. The thing is, even though my experience with one particular group was bad, I think NA is a fabulous thing. I love hearing stories of the endless number of people it had saved. It really is brilliant. I don't want to argue or debate, I just feel there is a little ignorance about those of us on suboxone.
Thanks for listening. Again, I don't want to stirthings up -just wanted to let all of you people know that if you talk to me, you'll probably find out I'm just like you. I won't push subxone on you, you won't catch any suboxone cooties that might contaminate your clear cut recovery, in fact, I rarely even talk about it. I just want to talk about recovery, regardless of which appraoch anyone takes. It's all good.
Later all!
SS
Knucklehead
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Davenport, WA
Posts: 4,005
Hi SS,
My name is Paul and I am an addict of alcohol and marijuana, and have 9 days sober today. I use secular programs of recovery, because I'm not spiritual in a theistic sense, and 12 Step programs just don't hold much meaning for me. I often encounter people in AA who tell me I'm just dry or not in recovery because I don't believe in God and work a 12 Step program, or that I'm not a "real" alcoholic. So, I can relate to the discrimination you experience. From my understanding, the maintainence drugs for treating opiate addiction bind with all the extra receptor sites created by the regular use of opiate drugs, and relieve some of the discomfort, without producing a high. Sounds like a medical treatment to me. Anyway, I just wanted you to know that I don't consider you or others any less in recovery than those who are able to get by without. You sound healthy and positive, and to me that is what counts.
DK
My name is Paul and I am an addict of alcohol and marijuana, and have 9 days sober today. I use secular programs of recovery, because I'm not spiritual in a theistic sense, and 12 Step programs just don't hold much meaning for me. I often encounter people in AA who tell me I'm just dry or not in recovery because I don't believe in God and work a 12 Step program, or that I'm not a "real" alcoholic. So, I can relate to the discrimination you experience. From my understanding, the maintainence drugs for treating opiate addiction bind with all the extra receptor sites created by the regular use of opiate drugs, and relieve some of the discomfort, without producing a high. Sounds like a medical treatment to me. Anyway, I just wanted you to know that I don't consider you or others any less in recovery than those who are able to get by without. You sound healthy and positive, and to me that is what counts.
DK
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,709
Originally Posted by shestruggles
you won't catch any suboxone cooties that might contaminate your clear cut recovery, in fact, I rarely even talk about it. I just want to talk about recovery, regardless of which appraoch anyone takes. It's all good.
I find it sad, what you describe. I read the substance abuse and NA forums a lot, but don't jump in much. Kind of out of respect, I guess.
I guess the real alcoholic thing that bothers me so much in my home fellowship sort of manifests itself as well in the room down the hall, so to speak.
Just wtf is clear cut recovery, anyway...
Thanks for sharing ss.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: waysouth
Posts: 388
Thanks for the replies.
"clear cut recovery' -I meant 100% abstinence, no maintence programs. I didn't mean it to imply it was'clear cut', as in simple. No way. Not for anyone!
Love to you both!
"clear cut recovery' -I meant 100% abstinence, no maintence programs. I didn't mean it to imply it was'clear cut', as in simple. No way. Not for anyone!
Love to you both!
Member
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: los angeles, ca
Posts: 8
Well NA and AA are not part of the Modern Medical Establishment who like to give drugs to help alleviate symptoms of problems. It is kind of like holistic medicine that strives to cure disease vs. the "modern medicine" that prescribes drug upon drug to make you "feel better" but still be diseased. In mental health there are many drugs prescribed to help cope with mental illness. In my research and talks with prescribers of these medications, they are supposed to be temporary until the patient can get ahold of and deal with the underlying issues. For some people it is necessary to have some relief to deal with the underlying issues. Once core issues are dealt with a "clean cut" recovery is probably recommended. A life on a different drug is some difference, but you can see the aversion some may have to it.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Louisianna
Posts: 499
(((shestruggles))) Sweetheart it don't mean one d@mn who likes what you are doing or who don't. All that matters is Is your life better? If it is I wouldn't waste a second of my time caring what anyone else thought. Congratulations on your recovery time.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 8,709
Originally Posted by shestruggles
Thanks for the replies.
"clear cut recovery' -I meant 100% abstinence, no maintence programs. I didn't mean it to imply it was'clear cut', as in simple. No way. Not for anyone!
Love to you both!
"clear cut recovery' -I meant 100% abstinence, no maintence programs. I didn't mean it to imply it was'clear cut', as in simple. No way. Not for anyone!
Love to you both!
I'm very leary of anyone who knows anything as clear cut
Clyde's Bonnie
.gif)
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Manchester, CT
Posts: 128
hey ss- my abf is trying to kick the h and coke, and i did much research on buprenorphine, even found a doctor 20 minutes away who accepts new patients and state assisted insu. How is that drug going for you? U know what i say to those anti-med people- hope they don't smoke ciggs and go on anti-depressants-hope thier headaches are asprin free- when they have cramps leave the Midol be, and pennicillian stay away. Sometimes meds help people that's what they're for. Even if its methadone for heroin- on the methadone addicts can fuction normally- jobs, family, sports, ect. Sometimes one needs to take a step back to take a step forward. As long as its in the right direction- congrats to u. See when u go on meds to get off dtreet drugs, you're off the street drugs and can begin the recovery process. That in my opinion is a step in the right direction. When u are no longer:lying for heroin, stealing money, making your children and spouse cry, unable to keep a job-it is always a positive step. Some people can do it without prescription meds and some can not- to both i praise- because both are off street drugs- and I am sure thier life has improved even the slightest bit. Sometimes you crawl before u walk- sometimes you just stand up and walk- either way all that matters in the end is that you've learned to walk.
I'm an addict.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hyde Park, NY
Posts: 1,201
What up SS,
I think you rock and I think you are taking steps to better your life and you seem happy about it. I mean you no disrespect in what I'm about to say, but I need to say it.
As the devil's advocate:
NA is a program that is based on complete abstinance from all drugs. (this isn't my wording, it's the basic text's) With that as a foundation of the program, some people believe that it is impossible to move forward along the road to recovery untill complete abstinance is attained. Now I don't want you to think I'm talking down to you or think I'm better than you, b/c I don't, I was on methadone for 2 years before I got clean. I can relate. When I was on the done, I functioned normally and could pass of as a productive member of society most days, I thought I was clean. It wasn't till I put down the done and detoxed and got to NA that I realized how screwed my thinking was and how I couldn't live life without the use of drugs, my life was unmanagable and I had a disease. The fog doesn't begin to clear till you have no dope in your body, trust me. SOme people are assholes and instead of trying to explain why they say something, they just say it. SO right about now, you're probably telling me to go **** off in your head. I'm sorry, but if I'd rather someone tell me the truth than to feed me pretty lies.
Right now you are probably noticing how much better life is once you have committed yourself to NA, I promise you it getts even better once all the dope is gone too.
As for meetings, if it helps you to go to meetings and to share, then do it. Some people may get all pissy about it, but if it helps you, then do it.
I do have a question, are you on bupe for maintenance or detox? If it's for detox then it shouldn't be that much longer and you won't have to worry about it.
I'm not knocking methadone or bupe, if it wasn't for the done I wouldn't be where I am today, just trying to give you an alternate interpertation.
P.S.-I really do like you and I hope you choose to not let assholes screw with your recovery.
P.S.S.-also L in the life after methadone thread could probably give you some info on doing the 12 step thing while on a maintenance program, she was in aa for 2 years while on the done...
I think you rock and I think you are taking steps to better your life and you seem happy about it. I mean you no disrespect in what I'm about to say, but I need to say it.
As the devil's advocate:
NA is a program that is based on complete abstinance from all drugs. (this isn't my wording, it's the basic text's) With that as a foundation of the program, some people believe that it is impossible to move forward along the road to recovery untill complete abstinance is attained. Now I don't want you to think I'm talking down to you or think I'm better than you, b/c I don't, I was on methadone for 2 years before I got clean. I can relate. When I was on the done, I functioned normally and could pass of as a productive member of society most days, I thought I was clean. It wasn't till I put down the done and detoxed and got to NA that I realized how screwed my thinking was and how I couldn't live life without the use of drugs, my life was unmanagable and I had a disease. The fog doesn't begin to clear till you have no dope in your body, trust me. SOme people are assholes and instead of trying to explain why they say something, they just say it. SO right about now, you're probably telling me to go **** off in your head. I'm sorry, but if I'd rather someone tell me the truth than to feed me pretty lies.
Right now you are probably noticing how much better life is once you have committed yourself to NA, I promise you it getts even better once all the dope is gone too.
As for meetings, if it helps you to go to meetings and to share, then do it. Some people may get all pissy about it, but if it helps you, then do it.
I do have a question, are you on bupe for maintenance or detox? If it's for detox then it shouldn't be that much longer and you won't have to worry about it.
I'm not knocking methadone or bupe, if it wasn't for the done I wouldn't be where I am today, just trying to give you an alternate interpertation.
P.S.-I really do like you and I hope you choose to not let assholes screw with your recovery.
P.S.S.-also L in the life after methadone thread could probably give you some info on doing the 12 step thing while on a maintenance program, she was in aa for 2 years while on the done...
Support our Troops.
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Republic Of Texas
Posts: 452
Originally Posted by shestruggles
I just want to talk about recovery, regardless of which appraoch anyone takes. It's all good.
Thanks for sharing.
You're never alone!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,191
CONGRATS SS-- I must say!!! You have done more for the Substance abuse forum than I have seen done since we started on it.. You have people here responding on your thread that I haven't EVER seen on any of mine in well, I don't know, I've been here a couple years. That is a step in the right direction... To bad there has to be discrimination here at my favorite place on the web. My favorite place for recovery next to Celebrate Recovery, which is a 12 stp christian based group.. They do not treat you any different there if you are on suboxone or methadone, of course they feel in time you will not need that, and that is the way I feel, and I know it's also the way you feel. I love my group.
Truly though. I feel the same hurt you feel, we have been members here for a while, and we have the same wonderful people respond to us, that's great, we love you, yet feel a bit (not sure which word to use here, with out getting people too angry, slighted, descriminated against?)
When I welcome new people in to SR, I often refer them around, encouraging them to check out NA/AA, or any other recovery group that will work for them, RARELY EVER have I EVER said go check out suboxone, I don't believe I ever have, unless they were questioning it, because I too believe they should try everything before suboxone or methadone, but, sometimes, there are people that just need the help of sub, to get their life in order, and get a good program going, then go off the sub. (I believe CassyK had it pretty well written in her post) . But you know what, if they are on Methadone or Suboxone for maintenence, it doesn't matter, they NEED SUPPORT as much as the next guy does, and I am willing to give it to anyone I can. I pray for everyone here, no matter their choice, or lack of choice of recovery program. If they are clean, that's great too. Whatever. We all need support.
I myself do not believe that "clicks" belong on SR. Everyone deserves, everyones support.
Blake you asked SS if she was on Maint. or if she was on it for detox? Does it matter? Does she deserve to have support from NA or AA members, or do I if we are on it for maintenence? Do we just deserve support without opinions?
I guess I just feel real strongly about this, not only because I am on Suboxone, ( I believe for this reason , there are people that are afraid to admit, even on the internet that they are on Sub, or done) but because I care so much for all people here. I want to be able to support every person here. That's not possible, it's just not possible for my to respond to every post here, I am on the computer to often as it is, but I try to respond often to different people, and welcome people often.
I think NA and AA are great, I think and recovery group is great, as long as it's helping people. To me, it's not about the program, but more about the people.
I'm sure I won't make any friends with this post, and that's to bad, because everything I have said is the truth, and it's really how I feel, and it's a feeling that's shared among others as can be seen in posts. I'm a little suprised that you kind of confronted the issue. No, I know you don't want to start anything, as I do not want to either, but maybe just to open up some eyes to see that we all need support, whether we are on some type of medication or not. I don't even question the fact that I am in recovery. Others may, that's fine, that's their opinion, and if they are, maybe they should be taking the time they are worrying about my program, to thinking about their own.
Thanks, I love you all. Thank so much to those of you that have taken their time to support me, especially recently as I have been having some harder times lately.
I have not used.. Cool, eh?
Have a great night. and to all of you that PM'd me, or responded to me on a thread, I will get back to you, I am just getting back a buit sloewr right now..
Love, Becky
Truly though. I feel the same hurt you feel, we have been members here for a while, and we have the same wonderful people respond to us, that's great, we love you, yet feel a bit (not sure which word to use here, with out getting people too angry, slighted, descriminated against?)
When I welcome new people in to SR, I often refer them around, encouraging them to check out NA/AA, or any other recovery group that will work for them, RARELY EVER have I EVER said go check out suboxone, I don't believe I ever have, unless they were questioning it, because I too believe they should try everything before suboxone or methadone, but, sometimes, there are people that just need the help of sub, to get their life in order, and get a good program going, then go off the sub. (I believe CassyK had it pretty well written in her post) . But you know what, if they are on Methadone or Suboxone for maintenence, it doesn't matter, they NEED SUPPORT as much as the next guy does, and I am willing to give it to anyone I can. I pray for everyone here, no matter their choice, or lack of choice of recovery program. If they are clean, that's great too. Whatever. We all need support.
I myself do not believe that "clicks" belong on SR. Everyone deserves, everyones support.
Blake you asked SS if she was on Maint. or if she was on it for detox? Does it matter? Does she deserve to have support from NA or AA members, or do I if we are on it for maintenence? Do we just deserve support without opinions?
I guess I just feel real strongly about this, not only because I am on Suboxone, ( I believe for this reason , there are people that are afraid to admit, even on the internet that they are on Sub, or done) but because I care so much for all people here. I want to be able to support every person here. That's not possible, it's just not possible for my to respond to every post here, I am on the computer to often as it is, but I try to respond often to different people, and welcome people often.
I think NA and AA are great, I think and recovery group is great, as long as it's helping people. To me, it's not about the program, but more about the people.
I'm sure I won't make any friends with this post, and that's to bad, because everything I have said is the truth, and it's really how I feel, and it's a feeling that's shared among others as can be seen in posts. I'm a little suprised that you kind of confronted the issue. No, I know you don't want to start anything, as I do not want to either, but maybe just to open up some eyes to see that we all need support, whether we are on some type of medication or not. I don't even question the fact that I am in recovery. Others may, that's fine, that's their opinion, and if they are, maybe they should be taking the time they are worrying about my program, to thinking about their own.
Thanks, I love you all. Thank so much to those of you that have taken their time to support me, especially recently as I have been having some harder times lately.
I have not used..
Cool, eh? Have a great night. and to all of you that PM'd me, or responded to me on a thread, I will get back to you, I am just getting back a buit sloewr right now..
Love, Becky
I'm an addict.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Hyde Park, NY
Posts: 1,201
Originally Posted by angelgirl
Blake you asked SS if she was on Maint. or if she was on it for detox? Does it matter?
I think the main problem with this issue is that NA teaches us that a drug is a drug is a drug. Is it better to be on bupe than heroin? hell yes it is. Is it clean, not really. I'm sorry, but NA saved my life and I feel strongly about it. The message is clear. Abstinance is the foundation of recovery. Abstinance is not using ANY dope.
To me, it's not about the program, but more about the people.
If that works for you then do it, but that is not NA. NA is 2 parts, the fellowship (the people) and the program (the steps), both are intergral to learning a new way to live with out the use of dope. THe fellowship can keep you clean for a time, maybe a long time, but without working the steps, a drug addict will end up back on drugs.
I'm sure I won't make any friends with this post, and that's to bad, because everything I have said is the truth, and it's really how I feel, and it's a feeling that's shared among others as can be seen in posts.
maybe just to open up some eyes to see that we all need support
, whether we are on some type of medication or not.
What I have posted about this subject is support, might not be the support you want to hear, but it is support. It is possible to stop using a maintenance program and get clean. If I can do it, anyone can. I support anyone that is trying to do that.
I firmly believe that methadone and bupe are great tools if used as a means to an end. If you are going to do dope, it is much safer and easier to maintain on them, but the ultimate goal should allways be to get off them eventually. That is where recovery really starts, the desire to stop using, surrender, acceptance, honesty, openmindedness, willingness, working steps with a sponsor....at least that is what works for me.
DOn't take offence to any of this, it was the message I was given and we can only keep what we have by giving it away.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: waysouth
Posts: 388
Wow, thanks for all the supportive replies. The bottom line,as many of you pointed out, is that I am happy and doing very well with my recovery.
I know everyone has thier own idea of what 'recovery' is; I certainly know that I don't fit NA's description (thanks Blake, for the reminder ~ I don't mean that rudely, it'sjust been a while since I heard that particular line from the text). I have made a good decision not waste my energy on people & places that don't accept me, or make me feel bad about the huge accomplishments I've made.
After thinking on this today, I can't help but feel I took the wrong approach...trying to reach out to those who make a point of ignoring me...I amnow thinking more along the lines of...it's just SO LAMEyou can't/don't respect the choices I've made or see how hard I work at this.
Let's just keep things as they are - you continue to avoid me & make judgemental comments about what REAL recovery is - I won't let it bother me. In fact, it almost makes me feel like a better person - open and ready to share with 'anyone who has the desire to stop using', not anyone who is willing to do it MY way....isn't there something else about taking what you need and leaving the rest? That also works for me - I'll cherish and learn from the love, strength and kindness of those who offer it and leave the rest of y'all who choose to ignore me behind..
~ special thanks to the few people who have NEVER spoken to me before for replying to this thread~
~and thanks to those who do speak to me for sharing thier thoughts~
Love to you ALL:SS
I know everyone has thier own idea of what 'recovery' is; I certainly know that I don't fit NA's description (thanks Blake, for the reminder ~ I don't mean that rudely, it'sjust been a while since I heard that particular line from the text). I have made a good decision not waste my energy on people & places that don't accept me, or make me feel bad about the huge accomplishments I've made.
After thinking on this today, I can't help but feel I took the wrong approach...trying to reach out to those who make a point of ignoring me...I amnow thinking more along the lines of...it's just SO LAMEyou can't/don't respect the choices I've made or see how hard I work at this.
Let's just keep things as they are - you continue to avoid me & make judgemental comments about what REAL recovery is - I won't let it bother me. In fact, it almost makes me feel like a better person - open and ready to share with 'anyone who has the desire to stop using', not anyone who is willing to do it MY way....isn't there something else about taking what you need and leaving the rest? That also works for me - I'll cherish and learn from the love, strength and kindness of those who offer it and leave the rest of y'all who choose to ignore me behind..
~ special thanks to the few people who have NEVER spoken to me before for replying to this thread~
~and thanks to those who do speak to me for sharing thier thoughts~
Love to you ALL:SS
You're never alone!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,191
Originally Posted by Blake
Yes it does matter. The 3rd tradition of NA is "the only requirement of membership is a desire to stop using" A detox program shows that desirw. Being on a maintenance program is not a desire to stop using. It is a desire to use in a safer, smarter way. (which I can relate to, I was on methadone for 2 years and had all but decided that I was gonna be on the done for the rest of my life.) Looking back on my done days, the voice in my head telling me that I'd never be able to get off it was my addict trying its best to **** me over.
I think the main problem with this issue is that NA teaches us that a drug is a drug is a drug. Is it better to be on bupe than heroin? hell yes it is. Is it clean, not really. I'm sorry, but NA saved my life and I feel strongly about it. The message is clear. Abstinance is the foundation of recovery. Abstinance is not using ANY dope.
If that works for you then do it, but that is not NA. NA is 2 parts, the fellowship (the people) and the program (the steps), both are intergral to learning a new way to live with out the use of dope. THe fellowship can keep you clean for a time, maybe a long time, but without working the steps, a drug addict will end up back on drugs.
I feel the same way about what I have said.
What I have posted about this subject is support, might not be the support you want to hear, but it is support. It is possible to stop using a maintenance program and get clean. If I can do it, anyone can. I support anyone that is trying to do that.
I firmly believe that methadone and bupe are great tools if used as a means to an end. If you are going to do dope, it is much safer and easier to maintain on them, but the ultimate goal should allways be to get off them eventually. That is where recovery really starts, the desire to stop using, surrender, acceptance, honesty, openmindedness, willingness, working steps with a sponsor....at least that is what works for me.
DOn't take offence to any of this, it was the message I was given and we can only keep what we have by giving it away.
I think the main problem with this issue is that NA teaches us that a drug is a drug is a drug. Is it better to be on bupe than heroin? hell yes it is. Is it clean, not really. I'm sorry, but NA saved my life and I feel strongly about it. The message is clear. Abstinance is the foundation of recovery. Abstinance is not using ANY dope.
If that works for you then do it, but that is not NA. NA is 2 parts, the fellowship (the people) and the program (the steps), both are intergral to learning a new way to live with out the use of dope. THe fellowship can keep you clean for a time, maybe a long time, but without working the steps, a drug addict will end up back on drugs.
I feel the same way about what I have said.
What I have posted about this subject is support, might not be the support you want to hear, but it is support. It is possible to stop using a maintenance program and get clean. If I can do it, anyone can. I support anyone that is trying to do that.
I firmly believe that methadone and bupe are great tools if used as a means to an end. If you are going to do dope, it is much safer and easier to maintain on them, but the ultimate goal should allways be to get off them eventually. That is where recovery really starts, the desire to stop using, surrender, acceptance, honesty, openmindedness, willingness, working steps with a sponsor....at least that is what works for me.
DOn't take offence to any of this, it was the message I was given and we can only keep what we have by giving it away.
I respect you, as well as all the others here, doesn't matter if you respect my choices. Doesn't. Hurts that people chose not to support us, that's all. May sound childish, doesn't matter either.
In the end, we all need the same thing,a nd that is why we are here. I don't need to even answer what I am on sub for. Doesn't matter, I am in recovery. I am not searching, stealing and lying any more. I am not stealing from family friends and relatives, I am not running up HUGE hopital bills.
So, I guess what SS said was very wise we will just continue to go along as we have. I wish you the very best in your recovery. I am here if you ever need someone to just listen as you type the junk from your head, as I often do.
That's for everyone here, as always...Love, Becky
Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Ohio
Posts: 2,139
****{SS}}}
I LA-LA-LOVE YOU G/F!!
Ain't no beating around the bush, so to speak, for you and more power to ya'!!
If I may interject my opinion, and it is JMO, but I really think that people are drawn to those they feel they have the most incommon with or feel more at ease posting with here. I don't reply to alot of posts, threads, or even different forums here at SR and I seriously hope that no one thinks I am being rude or stuck up cause I'm not and I don't have the time and I feel more comfortable posting to people who know me or things I know abit about. Maybe that is the way others are too?
BTW...I have never fit "the mold"... as you might know I am still on anxiety medication...and its Xanax so I probably am not considered totally clean either by some. It doesn't matter one bit and I wouldn't even waste precious time concerning myself with it or explaining. We have more important tasks to focus our time on!
All in all, you know I will always support you and be here as much as I possibly can for you and many others here I have become cyber-friends with!
{And I still LA-LA- LOVE YOU!!! Heehee!!}
Jane
I LA-LA-LOVE YOU G/F!!
Ain't no beating around the bush, so to speak, for you and more power to ya'!!If I may interject my opinion, and it is JMO, but I really think that people are drawn to those they feel they have the most incommon with or feel more at ease posting with here. I don't reply to alot of posts, threads, or even different forums here at SR and I seriously hope that no one thinks I am being rude or stuck up cause I'm not and I don't have the time and I feel more comfortable posting to people who know me or things I know abit about. Maybe that is the way others are too?
BTW...I have never fit "the mold"... as you might know I am still on anxiety medication...and its Xanax so I probably am not considered totally clean either by some. It doesn't matter one bit and I wouldn't even waste precious time concerning myself with it or explaining. We have more important tasks to focus our time on!
All in all, you know I will always support you and be here as much as I possibly can for you and many others here I have become cyber-friends with!
{And I still LA-LA- LOVE YOU!!! Heehee!!}
Jane
Not all better, getting better
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: The Beautiful Inner Banks of NC
Posts: 1,702
Originally Posted by angelgirl
Look, I do not disagree with anything NA has to say, I REFER people to NA, I have gone to NA, I respect people from NA, as well as AA, many people from NA/AA do respond to our threads, but there are is quite a few members that have been here for a long time, and I have been here for a long time, that do not respond to any of our threads, which shows a real lack of support, and in a sense a "disapproval" for the route which we have chosen.
I respect you, as well as all the others here, doesn't matter if you respect my choices. Doesn't. Hurts that people chose not to support us, that's all. May sound childish, doesn't matter either.
In the end, we all need the same thing,a nd that is why we are here. I don't need to even answer what I am on sub for. Doesn't matter, I am in recovery. I am not searching, stealing and lying any more. I am not stealing from family friends and relatives, I am not running up HUGE hopital bills.
So, I guess what SS said was very wise we will just continue to go along as we have. I wish you the very best in your recovery. I am here if you ever need someone to just listen as you type the junk from your head, as I often do. That's for everyone here, as always...
Love, Becky
I respect you, as well as all the others here, doesn't matter if you respect my choices. Doesn't. Hurts that people chose not to support us, that's all. May sound childish, doesn't matter either.
In the end, we all need the same thing,a nd that is why we are here. I don't need to even answer what I am on sub for. Doesn't matter, I am in recovery. I am not searching, stealing and lying any more. I am not stealing from family friends and relatives, I am not running up HUGE hopital bills.
So, I guess what SS said was very wise we will just continue to go along as we have. I wish you the very best in your recovery. I am here if you ever need someone to just listen as you type the junk from your head, as I often do.
That's for everyone here, as always...Love, Becky
You're never alone!!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 2,191
Originally Posted by tyler
Hi Becky, SS!! If I were you guys, I wouldn't really worry about people who don't respond to your threads. Perhaps it is because they don't really feel they have anything to offer as far as wisdom. I don't think I've responded to many of your threads because I really can't relate to your drug of choice.
Hey Tyler, I really think you have responded to my threads, maybe you didn't understand what we were going through, but I do believe you have responded with support to at least a few of my threads. I thank you for that. See, we don;t really need to totaly understand, do we? It's a matter of really understanding that we were once in the same place, sharing the same pain. We all know that terrible pain. Maybe this analogy will work? Take a woman who has an addicted daughter for example, she goes to alanon to recieve support with all the issues she faces, and the pain she deals with.
Then you have another mom, say they are both here on SR, this other mom here, does not attend alanon, but she is seeking support, because she is in pain or has questions, or just wants to as I say, type the junk out of her head. I guess the way I look at it is, although she is not a member of alanon, she still needs to be supported. That is what she comes here looking for.
I guess that's how I see t, I don't know if you think that's a good analogy, but thats what I had, I don't know, I guess maybe you're right, it just doesn't matter. ?
Pot and alcohol were/are my main problems. I take anti-depressants, so by many people's NA standards I am not "clean". I don't go to NA, so I really don't care if they consider me "clean" or not. My issue with alcohol was binge drinking, I do not do that anymore, but I will, on occasion, have a beer or two, never enough to get a buzz off of, but it just goes good with hot wings and stuff. By AA's defination, I am not sober, but I don't go to AA, so that really doesn't matter to me. I mean no disrespect to either AA or NA, they are great programs that help a lot of people, but it just wan't my thing.
None of us mean any disrespect to any group.
I am a million times better than I was 6 months ago. I dont' smoke pot at all, as opposed to 24/7. I don't sit in my room and down a half bottle, or more, of whiskey. I am doing what works for me, and that is really all that matters. If a suboxine program is working for you, that is your choice. I think that it is probably better to be on a program that will allow you to taper off,
Yes a good reason.
if for no other reason than financial. (it is my understanding that the stuff is pretty expensive!)
It is expensive
But if you are doing better today than you were yesterday, more power to you. I guess what I am saying is that while it is good to listen to other opinions, and consider what they have to say,
I do like other opinions. They help me often.
"to thy own self be true."
Don't stress too much about what others say, and certainly don't stress about what they don't say. Well that's enough from me!! Take care.
Hey Tyler, I really think you have responded to my threads, maybe you didn't understand what we were going through, but I do believe you have responded with support to at least a few of my threads. I thank you for that. See, we don;t really need to totaly understand, do we? It's a matter of really understanding that we were once in the same place, sharing the same pain. We all know that terrible pain. Maybe this analogy will work? Take a woman who has an addicted daughter for example, she goes to alanon to recieve support with all the issues she faces, and the pain she deals with.
Then you have another mom, say they are both here on SR, this other mom here, does not attend alanon, but she is seeking support, because she is in pain or has questions, or just wants to as I say, type the junk out of her head. I guess the way I look at it is, although she is not a member of alanon, she still needs to be supported. That is what she comes here looking for.
I guess that's how I see t, I don't know if you think that's a good analogy, but thats what I had,
I don't know, I guess maybe you're right, it just doesn't matter. ? Pot and alcohol were/are my main problems. I take anti-depressants, so by many people's NA standards I am not "clean". I don't go to NA, so I really don't care if they consider me "clean" or not. My issue with alcohol was binge drinking, I do not do that anymore, but I will, on occasion, have a beer or two, never enough to get a buzz off of, but it just goes good with hot wings and stuff. By AA's defination, I am not sober, but I don't go to AA, so that really doesn't matter to me. I mean no disrespect to either AA or NA, they are great programs that help a lot of people, but it just wan't my thing.
None of us mean any disrespect to any group.
I am a million times better than I was 6 months ago. I dont' smoke pot at all, as opposed to 24/7. I don't sit in my room and down a half bottle, or more, of whiskey. I am doing what works for me, and that is really all that matters. If a suboxine program is working for you, that is your choice. I think that it is probably better to be on a program that will allow you to taper off,
Yes a good reason.
if for no other reason than financial. (it is my understanding that the stuff is pretty expensive!)
It is expensive
But if you are doing better today than you were yesterday, more power to you. I guess what I am saying is that while it is good to listen to other opinions, and consider what they have to say,
I do like other opinions. They help me often.
"to thy own self be true."
Don't stress too much about what others say, and certainly don't stress about what they don't say. Well that's enough from me!! Take care.
I guess you have said it all here. I think it's more, raising the awarness to people, sometimes people don't even realize that others feel the way they do, until it's put out there, now it's put out there..
Love ya, Tyler, you seem to be doing very well. You also seem to have come a very long way. That's great. You also do what works for you, and I respect you for that.
Thanks for taking time to respond. is all I need
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Everywhere... and Nowhere
Posts: 38
shestruggles... I am SO GLAD you made this post... I've been harboring ill feelings towards SR for almost a week. I haven't been here long, but I've reached out to as many people as I possibly can, in chat and through PMs. I've been pretty active considering the short amount of time I've been a member here. Anyways... I'm also on Sub for opiates (i haven't taken any sub for 2 days now though). I hit my 30 day mark last week and it went over completely unnoticed by the entire board. Not even the people I talk with frequently acknowledged it. That REALLY hurt my feelings. I don't have a support system at home whatsoever and have been doing this all alone and it would've been really nice to have my fellow SR members congratulate me like I see them do for alot of others. I see people making posts congratulating people on their landmark days (30, 60, 90 days, 1 year etc..) and even kudos for day one.. Which I think is GREAT, EVERY day sober is outstanding work.. BUT, it seems as those acknowledgements are only extended to a select group of members who I guess I'm not a part of. I've made several threads of my own, which have recieved few and even no replies. Even my FIRST post as a newcomer had very few replies. Yet I see other newcomers with 2-3 pages of hugs and well wishes. I don't understand why this board is selective about who they help and acknogledge and who they don't. There was a brief period where I began to feel welcome and "part of the group" but that, like I said, was BRIEF. I don't understand it, and I don't think it's right. We're all here with the same basic problem, looking for the same kind of comfort, and wanting just to belong. I didn't know when I signed up that there were criteria you had to fit to be recognized, but I obviously don't fit the mold.
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