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At least I'll never have to be alone...

Old 07-24-2012, 10:24 AM
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Well, as Popeye so eloquently put it:

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Old 07-24-2012, 10:38 AM
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It has always been my opinion that this is a safe place to come and vent.

Take what you want and leave the rest applies to all posts made here.

Your friend,
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Old 07-24-2012, 11:45 AM
  # 43 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Pelican View Post
To me, the words in Cyranoak's original post sting.
For me they sting because they are so sexist. Like men don't try to avoid their problems by playing knight in shining armor.

Women = stupid?

Maybe someone needs to look in the mirror?
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Old 07-24-2012, 11:48 AM
  # 44 (permalink)  
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Hail to Michigan

Bald no
Asthma no
Money and medical GREAT
Meetings I will think on that.
Big 65
250 not for long
Drink no

Cannot say I will even think about it us less you are a Wolverine? Spartans and Buckeyes need not respond unless you enjoy special treatment during football season.
Oh yeah, I will go with a winner every time! Wolverines are winners!
6'5"? (swoon)
If you are not gonna be 250 for long, you still gotta carry some weight on that frame!
As long as you don't drink, everything else is negotiable.
Yep, not rich by any means, but the money is better than a poke in the eye!
And, if you marry me, we would get more money each month (you are then a family member) and you could go to school or something.
Yes, a good life awaits you.

Hail! Hail! to Michigan
The leaders and best!
Hail! to the victors valiant
Hail! to the conqu'ring heroes
Hail! Hail! to Michigan,
The champions of the West!

source: Lyrics On Demand - Song Lyrics, Lyrics of Songs, Free Lyrics, Free Song Lyrics, Rap Lyrics, Country Lyrics, Hip Hop Lyrics, Rock Lyrics, Country Music Lyrics, Music Lyrics

Since 1898, they have been using that same fight song!

Beth

Last edited by wicked; 07-24-2012 at 11:50 AM. Reason: add quote spell Michigan
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:13 PM
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And you know what? We have our share of alcoholic-bashing here, sometimes when we need to laugh instead of cry.
Yes, I notice the bashing of everyone once in a while. And since I am an alcoholic, if I took every time as a direct hit on me, I would not get what I need from this forum.
And, I agree, sometimes things just suck so bad that I laugh instead of cry.

Beth
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Old 07-24-2012, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by lillamy View Post
Then you are familiar with the quote "Patience is a human virtue..."
(It's the only Klingon quote I use. But I use that a lot.)...
Ah ! A fellow traveller on the Klingon road of honor. Here's my fav:

"Expectation is the root of all heartache."

Here's a trivia question for the nerds; What is the original nationality of William Shakespeare?

Mike
* p.s.; and for the truly obsessed; What is the Klingon saying alluded to in the blessing "May you die only once" ? *
** p.p.s. and yes, these all relate to al-anon recovery **
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:10 PM
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I totally understand the need to vent.

But it's grating to have women bashed as a class like we're somehow specially defective, when we are all here -- men and women alike -- for the same reason.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:21 PM
  # 48 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Florence View Post
I totally understand the need to vent.

But it's grating to have women bashed as a class like we're somehow specially defective, when we are all here -- men and women alike -- for the same reason.
Armchair psychiatrist over here. I think he wants to accept this about himself but can't so he is complaining how we women are. You know what they say: Usually when you can't stand something about somebody else, it's because you see your self in them.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:24 PM
  # 49 (permalink)  
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I wouldn't have been offended if he had said, "I'll never be alone, all i have to do is stand on the street corner with a sign saying, looking for someone to fix..." (or whatever)

But he, a man, singled out women, when he is no better than the group he bashed. He projected his self hatred (or anger or whatever emotion motivated him) on to the opposite gender--and then bashed that entire gender.

Offensive.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by SadHeart View Post
I wouldn't have been offended if he had said, "I'll never be alone, all i have to do is stand on the street corner with a sign saying, looking for someone to fix..." (or whatever)

But he, a man, singled out women, when he is no better than the group he bashed. He projected his self hatred (or anger or whatever emotion motivated him) on to the opposite gender--and then bashed that entire gender.

Offensive.
Eh, don't take it personally. What someone else thinks about me is none of my business. Plus, women are most definitely the smarter sex.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:47 PM
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I know when I hear / see something that annoys me I should look to why it annoys me. I've read, left, and reread this thread and these are my thoughts.

I didn't find the original post to reflect "we codependents...." but rather "you, you women..." and that tone is what I find - what, condescending?

If the same sentiments had been expressed in a little more gender neutral way, or inclusive manner (like the original poster counted himself as someone who acted that way too), I am ok.

I do see some of me, as a human, in the overall idea of the post.
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Old 07-24-2012, 01:56 PM
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There are men married to alcoholic women who suffer through hell, but I really don't think that men culturally are influenced to be codependents the way women are.

First of all, at least my generation of women was raised to be helpers and support people in need wherever they may be. The fact that we are sensitive and understanding means we have an obligation to figure out why other people feel bad when they do. And FIX IT. I feel like we're raised to be some kind of emotional plumbers with 24/7/365 on-call status.

And then we have popular culture.

Beauty and the Beast. (Which I will not let my girls see. )
Twilight.
50 Shades of Grey.
If 21 million women buy and enjoy reading a "love story" about a woman who stays with a man who is troubled and hurts her and is difficult and sometimes makes her want to run away but she stays because she loves him and believes her love will heal him... then I pose that women, as a group, have a problem with codependency. And the definition of the word "love."

Not all of us get involved with vampires or beasts or sadists or addicts. But the fact that women find the troubled, difficult, hurtful (but he's only hurtful to others because he's been hurt himself) man attractive even in fiction -- there is a problem there. And I don't think it's only an individual problem that so many of us have broken pickers. I think it's a cultural problem.

I can honestly say that brooding difficult men make me lace up my running shoes as quickly as addicts do these days. And I've got the Coast Guard on speed dial in case I run across a guy who needs rescuing. But I don't feel like I'm getting a whole lot of help from popular culture when men who are "buddies" and "good friends" are portrayed as sexless and boring and nerdy and the dark handsome stranger with secrets is the one who always gets the girl.
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Old 07-24-2012, 02:00 PM
  # 53 (permalink)  
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The fact that we are sensitive and understanding means we have an obligation to figure out why other people feel bad when they do. And FIX IT. I feel like we're raised to be some kind of emotional plumbers with 24/7/365 on-call status.
So true Lillamy. Good insight. I think maybe I will just change tactics and become a chef. Then, when I see someone I want to caretake, I can just give them pork chops with mashed potatoes and gravy and my job is DONE.
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Old 07-24-2012, 02:06 PM
  # 54 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Learn2Live View Post
So true Lillamy. Good insight. I think maybe I will just change tactics and become a chef. Then, when I see someone I want to caretake, I can just give them pork chops with mashed potatoes and gravy and my job is DONE.
Pork chops with taters & gravy sounds better than a sandwich! Need any sawzall work done?
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:14 PM
  # 55 (permalink)  
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Your post reminded me of this quote from 'Co-Dependent No More'. Add addiction and it really knocks the wheels off the bus.

Two codependants in a relationship can really play havock with each other. Consider two people-pleasers in a relationship with each other. No consider two people-pleasers in a relationship with each other when they both want out of the relationship. They will, as Earnie Larsen says, do horrible things. They'll nearly destroy each other and themselves before one will stop rescuing and say, "I want out."
You have said very little about your wife (which is appropriate) but I get this vibe from your posting history. It was a vibe my xah and I shared as well and it was incredibly painful and often confusing. If I'm way off base, just disregard!

I hope you can gather some quiet moments to be able to sit with yourself and your thoughts. You have the tools you need to find your center and that is where you'll find your strength. You do not have to fix or address anything today. You can nurture and strengthen yourself, there is time. As always, focus on you and the next right thing will follow.
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Old 07-24-2012, 03:21 PM
  # 56 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by OhBoy View Post
Pork chops with taters & gravy sounds better than a sandwich! Need any sawzall work done?
I actually do!!! LOL
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Old 07-24-2012, 04:10 PM
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Not women bashing at all... quite the opposite...

...it was mean to be ironic and could apply as well to some men here, just not in as insanely large of a number. I absolutely love, love, love women, and nothing would make me happier for them not to be as I described in this post. Many aren't, but oh so many are... in my opinion at least.

It was a a plea for women not to be like that, starting with my 16 year old daughter.

Cyranoak

Originally Posted by wellnowwhat View Post
What's with the women bashing? (was someone else yesterday)

Helps you how? Helps me how?

I haven't read all your story, but you are here, on the friends & family site, too! It's where anyone is supposed to feel free and safe to tell their story and work through their issues. To share, and learn, and share again. I imagine you used it for this too?

Sorry about your wife's relapse. So very sad.

Wishing you both the best.
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Old 07-24-2012, 04:10 PM
  # 58 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Cyranoak View Post

Hell, maybe I'll be able to stay home, blame others for my problems, deflect criticism back on my woman, and feel sorry for myself while they pay all the bills.

Cyranoak
This is exactly what my alcoholic husband does.

Hang in there Cyranoak. I feel the pain in your post.
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Old 07-24-2012, 04:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Learn2Live View Post
Eh, don't take it personally. What someone else thinks about me is none of my business. Plus, women are most definitely the smarter sex.
Yeah, everyone knows that!
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Old 07-24-2012, 04:13 PM
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Actually, that's exactly why I'm so angry...

Irony alert--

Originally Posted by wicked View Post
I am surprised he is so angry at codependents, because he is one.
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