How Much is Too Much?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2017
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How Much is Too Much?
I'm currently 27 years old and I have a real struggle with alcohol. I think I'm comfortable with stating that I was first addicted to alcohol my junior year of college. This is when I first started blacking out due to binge drinking and making very poor choices while drunk. Also, junior year was when I started drinking on the weekdays which I have continued to this day. Recently I have limited myself to an extent, I no longer drink hard alcohol and I try not to go over 9 standard drinks (although it does happen on occasion). But the fact is, I think I have a real psychological dependence to alcohol. I often feel that I cannot relax or have a good time unless I drink. I'm far better off than I was a year ago but my question is, how much is too much?? Is what I'm doing now sustainable in the long term or do those of you with more experience than me think I will continue down the rabbit hole in the future?? I'm quite certain I do not have a physical dependence to alcohol, and I never want to get to that point, but what are my chances? Any input would be appreciated.
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
How Much is Too Much?
imo, when I question how much is too much and start trying to rationalize how the amount im drinking is acceptable
im drinking too much.
you state you have a psychological dependence. if you keep drinking, you have a high probability of getting that physical dependence.
heres a few lines from a book first published back in 1939:
Despite all we can say, many who are real alcoholics are not going to believe they are in that class. By every form of self-deception and experimentation, they will try to prove themselves exceptions to the rule, therefore nonalcoholic. If anyone who is showing inability to control his drinking can do the right- about-face and drink like a gentleman, our hats are off to him. Heaven knows, we have tried hard enough and long enough to drink like other people!
Here are some of the methods we have tried: Drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums - we could increase the list ad infinitum.
imo, when I question how much is too much and start trying to rationalize how the amount im drinking is acceptable
im drinking too much.
you state you have a psychological dependence. if you keep drinking, you have a high probability of getting that physical dependence.
heres a few lines from a book first published back in 1939:
Despite all we can say, many who are real alcoholics are not going to believe they are in that class. By every form of self-deception and experimentation, they will try to prove themselves exceptions to the rule, therefore nonalcoholic. If anyone who is showing inability to control his drinking can do the right- about-face and drink like a gentleman, our hats are off to him. Heaven knows, we have tried hard enough and long enough to drink like other people!
Here are some of the methods we have tried: Drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums - we could increase the list ad infinitum.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,775
Originally Posted by AlcoholicJak 
I'm currently 27 years old and I have a real struggle with alcohol. I think I'm comfortable with stating that I was first addicted to alcohol my junior year of college. This is when I first started blacking out due to binge drinking and making very poor choices while drunk. Also, junior year was when I started drinking on the weekdays which I have continued to this day. Recently I have limited myself to an extent, I no longer drink hard alcohol and I try not to go over 9 standard drinks (although it does happen on occasion). But the fact is, I think I have a real psychological dependence to alcohol. I often feel that I cannot relax or have a good time unless I drink. I'm far better off than I was a year ago but my question is, how much is too much?? Is what I'm doing now sustainable in the long term or do those of you with more experience than me think I will continue down the rabbit hole down the road?? I'm quite certain I do not have a physical dependence to alcohol, and I never want to get to that point, but what are my chances? Any input would be appreciated.
By the time I reached 30 I was finding harder to get up. I couldn't bounce back like in my early 20's.
And my problems with alcohol which friends started to notice when I was 21 never went away. They simply continued and/or got worse.
Nothing wrong with having a few drinks to unwind or to socialize however I just never knew when enough was enough.
I didn't start the night out to screw things up but sometimes I would and all the signs alcoholism were there by the time I reached 21-22 years of age.
Good luck.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Wareham, Mass
Posts: 7,067
Hi, Jak, and welcome. Here is my take, fwiw. If you are worried about your alcohol intake, then it's a problem worth investigating. Alcohol dependency is progressive in that we often have to drink more and more to get that little "click" that tells us we are relaxed and having a good time.
Not clear from your post how much you are consuming daily, but it sounds like a conversation with your physician might be a good idea.
Also lots of good info about alcohol dependncy on this site and out there. You could start with googling "rethinking drinking" for guidelines about alcohol consumption.
There are many good programs to help if you want to lower your consumption or stop altogether. I would not try to stop completely on my own without medical help. Unsupervised withdrawal is uncomfortable and, if you are drinking a lot, downright dangerous.
Now is the time to get a handle on your drinking. Peace.
Not clear from your post how much you are consuming daily, but it sounds like a conversation with your physician might be a good idea.
Also lots of good info about alcohol dependncy on this site and out there. You could start with googling "rethinking drinking" for guidelines about alcohol consumption.
There are many good programs to help if you want to lower your consumption or stop altogether. I would not try to stop completely on my own without medical help. Unsupervised withdrawal is uncomfortable and, if you are drinking a lot, downright dangerous.
Now is the time to get a handle on your drinking. Peace.
Trudgin
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,348
if alcohol is becoming a problem you are smart to make changes and address issues. My drinking was progressive though I attempted to control it for a very long time.
I found this thread on SR and gained some understanding by reading this book
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...influence.html
The premise is how an alcoholics body metabolizes alcohol differently than nonalcoholics.
Interesting moniker you choose - glad you're here.
I found this thread on SR and gained some understanding by reading this book
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...influence.html
The premise is how an alcoholics body metabolizes alcohol differently than nonalcoholics.
Interesting moniker you choose - glad you're here.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,095
I fooled myself for many years in thinking I didn't have a dependency to alcohol.
During the first 5 years I drank 6 - 12 beers everyday with an occasional shot. I then graduated to whiskey and drank up to a liter everyday for about 4 years. I then went back to beer, wine and occasional hard liquor and drank 8 - 15 drinks everyday for the last 16 or so years.
Even in my 27th year of daily drinking I fooled myself into thinking I wasn't that bad - I estimate I drank well over 100,000 drinks in 27 years.
Today at 73 days sober and with a clearer mind I feel that was too much,
During the first 5 years I drank 6 - 12 beers everyday with an occasional shot. I then graduated to whiskey and drank up to a liter everyday for about 4 years. I then went back to beer, wine and occasional hard liquor and drank 8 - 15 drinks everyday for the last 16 or so years.
Even in my 27th year of daily drinking I fooled myself into thinking I wasn't that bad - I estimate I drank well over 100,000 drinks in 27 years.
Today at 73 days sober and with a clearer mind I feel that was too much,
Forum Leader
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Welcome Jak. My honest opinion would be that it really doesn't matter if your dependence on alcohol is mental or physical, it's dependence. And it's bad. Even 9 drinks at a setting is a very extreme amount of alcohol to be drinking and if you are doing that every day ( and possibly more at times ) the chances of you causing permanent physical damage to your body are very, very high. It's definitely not sustainable.
Another thing you may want to consider is that if you've only "cut back" to 9 drinks a day you wouldn't know if you were physically dependent until you quit completely. And I'd caution against quitting cold turkey, especially at the rather extreme levels you are drinking now as withdrawals can potentially be dangerous. I'd speak with a doctor or a treatment center about it before quitting.
I'm glad you've come here and you recognize the problem, and I hope you can make the best decision for your health and future. You'll find a lot of support and understanding here.
Another thing you may want to consider is that if you've only "cut back" to 9 drinks a day you wouldn't know if you were physically dependent until you quit completely. And I'd caution against quitting cold turkey, especially at the rather extreme levels you are drinking now as withdrawals can potentially be dangerous. I'd speak with a doctor or a treatment center about it before quitting.
I'm glad you've come here and you recognize the problem, and I hope you can make the best decision for your health and future. You'll find a lot of support and understanding here.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
Welcome Jak. My honest opinion would be that it really doesn't matter if your dependence on alcohol is mental or physical, it's dependence. And it's bad. Even 9 drinks at a setting is a very extreme amount of alcohol to be drinking and if you are doing that every day ( and possibly more at times ) the chances of you causing permanent physical damage to your body are very, very high. It's definitely not sustainable.
Another thing you may want to consider is that if you've only "cut back" to 9 drinks a day you wouldn't know if you were physically dependent until you quit completely. And I'd caution against quitting cold turkey, especially at the rather extreme levels you are drinking now as withdrawals can potentially be dangerous. I'd speak with a doctor or a treatment center about it before quitting.
I'm glad you've come here and you recognize the problem, and I hope you can make the best decision for your health and future. You'll find a lot of support and understanding here.
Another thing you may want to consider is that if you've only "cut back" to 9 drinks a day you wouldn't know if you were physically dependent until you quit completely. And I'd caution against quitting cold turkey, especially at the rather extreme levels you are drinking now as withdrawals can potentially be dangerous. I'd speak with a doctor or a treatment center about it before quitting.
I'm glad you've come here and you recognize the problem, and I hope you can make the best decision for your health and future. You'll find a lot of support and understanding here.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by Doug39
I fooled myself for many years in thinking I didn't have a dependency to alcohol.
During the first 5 years I drank 6 - 12 beers everyday with an occasional shot. I then graduated to whiskey and drank up to a liter everyday for about 4 years. I then went back to beer, wine and occasional hard liquor and drank 8 - 15 drinks everyday for the last 16 or so years.
Even in my 27th year of daily drinking I fooled myself into thinking I wasn't that bad - I estimate I drank well over 100,000 drinks in 27 years.
Today at 73 days sober and with a clearer mind I feel that was too much,
During the first 5 years I drank 6 - 12 beers everyday with an occasional shot. I then graduated to whiskey and drank up to a liter everyday for about 4 years. I then went back to beer, wine and occasional hard liquor and drank 8 - 15 drinks everyday for the last 16 or so years.
Even in my 27th year of daily drinking I fooled myself into thinking I wasn't that bad - I estimate I drank well over 100,000 drinks in 27 years.
Today at 73 days sober and with a clearer mind I feel that was too much,
Member
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: USA
Posts: 71
I was 17 when I knew I had a real problem with alcohol, but I didn't care.. I thought I was real cool! Life of the party chic! I still got good grades and graduated college somehow binge drinking maybe 3-4 times a week.
Somewhere around 25-27, was my first attempt to really try to quit. Too many bad things were happening and I was finally starting to realize how I was potentially messing up my life. Even tried AA. It worked for a whole month.
I SO WISH I HAD QUIT WHEN I WAS YOUR AGE. It did progress, but in waves depending on what was going on in life.. Like you, I tried all the methods of cutting back, changing up type of alcohol, only on certain days, etc.
Wishing you the best
Somewhere around 25-27, was my first attempt to really try to quit. Too many bad things were happening and I was finally starting to realize how I was potentially messing up my life. Even tried AA. It worked for a whole month.
I SO WISH I HAD QUIT WHEN I WAS YOUR AGE. It did progress, but in waves depending on what was going on in life.. Like you, I tried all the methods of cutting back, changing up type of alcohol, only on certain days, etc.
Wishing you the best
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Lakeside, Ca
Posts: 10,208
Originally Posted by AlcoholicJak
I try not to go over 9 standard drinks (although it does happen on occasion).
my question is, how much is too much??
Is what I'm doing now sustainable in the long term or do those of you with more experience than me think I will continue down the rabbit hole in the future??
All indicators seem to point to the rabbit hole.
Now would be an excellent time to start working a Program and stop drinking.
Good luck,
M-Bob
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Originally Posted by AlcoholicJak
I don't drink 9 drinks per day. My weekly schedule looks like this: Sunday - no drinks, Monday - no drinks, Tuesday - no drinks, Wednesday - 6 drinks, Thursday - depends on the week, and Fri/Sat who knows...I don't drink everyday but 4 days per week is pretty standard for me.
I would still suggest that if you feel you have a psychological/mental dependence on alcohol and need it to relax, it's not a healthy relationship regardless of the amount you are drinking.
Have you considered simply quitting for a period of time to see how it goes?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 8
Originally Posted by Mountainmanbob
Jak to be very honest with you -- you seem to be a (very heavy) drinker.
All indicators seem to point to the rabbit hole.
Now would be an excellent time to start working a Program and stop drinking.
Good luck,
M-Bob
All indicators seem to point to the rabbit hole.
Now would be an excellent time to start working a Program and stop drinking.
Good luck,
M-Bob
Recovered
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,129
How much is too much for me? The amount that I can't NOT have. Even after a long hiatus from drinking. If I can't leave it alone, it is a problem. I was never in trouble when not drinking/drugging. When I was, alcohol was always involved.
It took me 20 years of "moderation" and "taking a break from drinking because ______" to realize that alcoholism is not about the amount. "But I'm only drinking on weekends!!", I cried. Remove alcohol from ME and I'm left with "ic". Do I want to do something about it? I did....because I wanted to be happy and free.
Glad you are here. :-)
It took me 20 years of "moderation" and "taking a break from drinking because ______" to realize that alcoholism is not about the amount. "But I'm only drinking on weekends!!", I cried. Remove alcohol from ME and I'm left with "ic". Do I want to do something about it? I did....because I wanted to be happy and free.
Glad you are here. :-)
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Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 8
Last question, it seems to me that many people who have been a part of a sobriety program proclaim that alcoholism is a progressive disease; in that, you will continue to drink more and more until you kill yourself. I can see a logical fallacy in that theory whenever I choose! All I have to do is go to the nearest American Legion or VFW and talk to vets who have been getting drunk their entire lives! What separates them from those who commit alcohol suicide??
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Location: Wisconsin, USA
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Originally Posted by AlcoholicJak
That's fair, but I know others that are much heavier drinkers than me. I just don't want to fall into that category. I have good things going for me in my career, I don't choose alcohol over work, I take care of my responsibilities but I feel like I am tempted too much by alcohol. How do you stop that??
Forum Leader
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Posts: 16,945
Originally Posted by AlcoholicJak
All I have to do is go to the nearest American Legion or VFW and talk to vets who have been getting drunk their entire lives! What separates them from those who commit alcohol suicide??
Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,775
Originally Posted by AlcoholicJak
That's fair, but I know others that are much heavier drinkers than me. I just don't want to fall into that category. I have good things going for me in my career, I don't choose alcohol over work, I take care of my responsibilities but I feel like I am tempted too much by alcohol. How do you stop that??
However, until I reached that point I simply didn't want to stop. Just wanted to get it together. Today life is a lot simpler. By avoiding that first drink I don't get drunk. Is alcoholism a disease? Am I weak-will? Just plain f-up?
Who really knows?
All I know is if I start drinking again all bets are off. I just don't want to deal with all that again.
You're 27. Probably hard to image life without drinking. I get it. Still I something think about how different things might have been had I gotten sober in my mid-20's instead of at age 35.
But life is what it is.
Again best of luck.
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Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
Addiction is what separates those who are just "drinkers" from alcoholics. There is no concrete answer or diagnosis that can be made to distinguish between the two, the addict themself has to make the decision on their own. There are certainly warning signs - physical and mental dependance are 2 of the big ones. Feeling that you "need" to drink is another big red flag.
quat
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: terra (mostly)firma
Posts: 4,823
"how much is too much?"
Good question, what do you think aj?
I would assume any more then say 1 standard drink a day can have negative physiologic effect, just based on the chemistry , yeah? But does that translate into having 7 standard drinks in a 24 hr period once a week having the same cumulative effects ? Maybe , maybe not, I think the 'overload' from the single 7 drink session would involve more stress on the body , and those repeated stree events would most likely cause more harm over the years, yeah?
But that line of thought is biologic effect centric and says nothing about addiction. I think the best description of addiction is the idea of being in a state of ambivalence regarding a given behavior. I realized/decided I was addicted when I wanted to quit but found myself continuing to drink.
For me the solution to both the physical/chemical effects of consumption and the state of addiction was to decide on permanent abstinence.
I think it is up to each individual to know whether or not they are addicted. Some people drink unhealthy amounts of alcohol and don't want to change their consumption, so by my definition that aren't addicted, though obviously they could adopt an abstinence stance, too , yeah ?
Good question, what do you think aj?
I would assume any more then say 1 standard drink a day can have negative physiologic effect, just based on the chemistry , yeah? But does that translate into having 7 standard drinks in a 24 hr period once a week having the same cumulative effects ? Maybe , maybe not, I think the 'overload' from the single 7 drink session would involve more stress on the body , and those repeated stree events would most likely cause more harm over the years, yeah?
But that line of thought is biologic effect centric and says nothing about addiction. I think the best description of addiction is the idea of being in a state of ambivalence regarding a given behavior. I realized/decided I was addicted when I wanted to quit but found myself continuing to drink.
For me the solution to both the physical/chemical effects of consumption and the state of addiction was to decide on permanent abstinence.
I think it is up to each individual to know whether or not they are addicted. Some people drink unhealthy amounts of alcohol and don't want to change their consumption, so by my definition that aren't addicted, though obviously they could adopt an abstinence stance, too , yeah ?
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