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Separation/I think he's quacking!

Old 11-25-2013, 07:40 AM
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Separation/I think he's quacking!

Long story short, I asked AH for a separation after the holidays. The silent treatment and passive aggressive behavior became too much for me and I finally had had enough. Ah went on a missions trip to Haiti last week and came back a spiritual man full of praise and prayer(so he says). He says the trip changed him and he wants to fix our marriage. I then told him I wanted to separate anyway and he got angry and we got into a huge fight and I realized he hadn't changed 'that' much. I won't go into details because it's just the typical arguments we have anyway.

Now, all of a sudden he's sending me communicative emails. He's telling me he's going to find pastoral counseling for us and he's looking into apartments and he's packing up his coffee mugs, etc. He's being very nice and compliant and is actually speaking to me. For 2 months before this trip he was ridiculous in how he responded to me. I would tell him I loved him and he'd say "OK". I would ask him what his business trip was like and try to communicate and get details, just to open up the lines of communication, and I'd get one word answers.

The final straw for me was when all of us were in the car and we were discussing my sister, who is dating a new man. AH asked if they were sleeping together yet and I said that's none of our business. He then made a few statements about, "that's the only reason a guy's going to stay in a relationship. If he's not getting s*x, there's no reason to stick around." So, he just told our 15 year old that you don't need to stay with a woman if she doesn't put out right away? I told him that they had only been dating a month. Anyway, completely inappropriate to say in front of a teen. Then, my mom and her spouse were visiting right before he left for Haiti and he didn't speak more than 10 words to her. He came to dinner with us one night and just sat there while the 3 of us had a normal conversation. It was creepy and he says he was just protecting himself, not punishing us with his silence. That's how he defends his silent treatment ALL THE TIME!

So, I'm sitting here trying to figure out if he's quacking or if he's for real. Can one week on a missions trip really change someone enough? I seriously doubt it, especially after our fight in the car on the way home from the airport.

I left everything in his hands, except the finances. I told him: find a therapist and let me know. Find an apartment, let me know. Just 'let me know', is pretty much my response. If he continues working on things and doing what was asked of him, maybe then I'll have my answers. Or, maybe he's just blowing smoke up my rear and hoping that I'll change my mind because he's being so nice? Only time will tell!
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:54 AM
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Can one week on a missions trip really change someone enough?
I believe one moment can change someone enough if God whacks them over the head in a way that opens their eyes (Paul on the road to Damascus comes to mind).

However, a godly man who has had his eyes open and his heart changed would NEVER say what he said in the car. I am appalled that he would bring up the subject, let alone say that in front of his own son -- especially since it was a stab at you.

And you know, my AXH would have done exactly the same thing. And this is the man who tried to get full custody of our children because I was an ungodly mother. Yep.

Stick to your plans. If he truly is a changed man, a man of praise and a man of prayer, a man of God who wants to save his marriage, then he will do it regardless of whether you're separated.

Actions, not words, is where it's at. Love is a verb. Let him show you.
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:54 AM
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Well...I will say this. What comes out of someone's mouth makes no difference. Look at his actions....over the course of a long period of time....and you will see if he is quacking or not. I have decided my AH is full of BS! That being said...I will take those quacks at this point. I would rather be pleasant to each other (even if he is faking it) than be fighting. We are most likely going to separate when the holidays are over. So I have decided (and told him this), that his words don't really mean a thing to me and that his actions will be his actions and I cannot control those, only he can. I can only control how I react. So he wants to play nice? Sure, I am a nice person and would rather have peace than fights and horrible. It takes a very very long time to build up trust in a marriage to an addict. I have let him know I will be watching his ACTIONS not listening to his WORDS over that long period of time.

Good luck and God Bless to you. Keep posting, you are not alone!
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:08 AM
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There's really no way to know in the course of a few weeks, or even a couple of months, if he is sincere or not. And honestly, one thing has nothing to do with the other. (His sincerity and your separation.) Give yourself some time. If he has really changed, you will see that change over the course of the next six months or a year--or whatever time you need to truly believe it. You don't need to live under the same roof in order for him to change. And my personal opinion is that it would be better for your son if he wasn't caught in the middle of your ongoing marital issues.

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Old 11-25-2013, 08:22 AM
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Sounds like he's quacking to me. Sounds like **** just got real for him, that he's being told to go away, and now he's playing nice to avoid it.

Of course, people do change, even profoundly so. But it seems that is not usually the case with most people, most of the time.

The fact that you seem to indicate that he reverted back to his same old, same old (or just showed his true colors?) when you said you wanted to be separated anyway, even after he professed to have made big changes, speaks volumes.

Of course, I'm still married. And he's still screwing up in big ways. So I'm clearly not doing as well as I should be. But, from what you say, this is what my opinion is.

As others have more or less said, you'll find out in time regardless.

Good luck Hon. Hugs!
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:34 AM
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Originally Posted by lillamy View Post
I believe one moment can change someone enough if God whacks them over the head in a way that opens their eyes (Paul on the road to Damascus comes to mind).

However, a godly man who has had his eyes open and his heart changed would NEVER say what he said in the car. I am appalled that he would bring up the subject, let alone say that in front of his own son -- especially since it was a stab at you.

And you know, my AXH would have done exactly the same thing. And this is the man who tried to get full custody of our children because I was an ungodly mother. Yep.

Stick to your plans. If he truly is a changed man, a man of praise and a man of prayer, a man of God who wants to save his marriage, then he will do it regardless of whether you're separated.

Actions, not words, is where it's at. Love is a verb. Let him show you.
I wasn't clear in my story: he said those things a few weeks ago, before he left for Haiti. But, while in the car on the way home from the airport, just hours after he left Haiti, he said some things that were ridiculous. He called me a frigid Christian woman and that our son will most likely turn out gay because his mother was his role model.

He then told me that he wanted to have a family meeting and I said, "that's fine, but let's make sure we keep the information age appropriate." He laid into me and said, "Do you even know what age appropriate means? C'mon, B, the kid's going to have to learn what a vagina is at some point. You protect him way too much." Ummm, how does a woman's body part play into the topics that we'll most likely be discussing in our family meeting? It doesn't and I had to keep myself from making a rude facial gesture at that point because I realized that he hadn't changed 'that much'. And, as for the 'talk' with ds, I did that a year ago and gave him a Christian book series called, "God's Design for Sex" and told him to come to me with any questions. My AH never made a move towards having the 'talk' with his son.

He also got on my case about things I said and how hurtful it was, and I then got defensive trying to remind him of the context in which those comments were made and the situation that precipitated it. It got so out of hand and that's why I told him I'm sticking with my separation idea, but the ball is in his court on what he's going to do to prove to me and to our son that he's changing.
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:39 AM
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I believe you had the perfect response (below). Good for you! You are simply saying hmm..no...i'm still standing my ground, I still want to separate, but if you want to change your actions be my guest!

That is perfect.


It got so out of hand and that's why I told him I'm sticking with my separation idea, but the ball is in his court on what he's going to do to prove to me and to our son that he's changing.[/QUOTE]
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Old 11-25-2013, 08:40 AM
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Whether or not he is changing is irrelevant if you are separating for the right reasons. If you aren't using the idea of separation as a way to cause him to change, then, as I said, it's all irrelevant.

If you have decided to separate, then separate. You are never going to get any clarity while you are living with this guy. You NEED to have that separation so you can get out of the fog. This should be something you are doing for yourself and your son.
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:05 AM
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Liz---about his sincerity?? Honestly, the first thought that popped into my mind is: When a narcissist "suddenly" gets nice---be verrry suspicious!

He, however, will get to prove or disprove it by his actions. Actions don't lie.

For your welfare--I really do believe that a separation would clear some space where you can come out of the "fog" and get the kind of clarity that you NEVER can wile living in the toxic environment.

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Old 11-25-2013, 09:33 AM
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Your husband sounds like a sociopath. Is he still drinking? Is he still driving around with no license? I recall that was a big issue you had in the past.
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Upsetnneedhelp View Post
Your husband sounds like a sociopath. Is he still drinking? Is he still driving around with no license? I recall that was a big issue you had in the past.
He was drinking the week before he left for Haiti. He has a license but it's interlock restricted so he rents cars while traveling for work, and drives those around. Yes, he still drinks and drives. He claims those days are over, but I know how cunning the disease of alcoholism is, I'm not sure he really knows this yet since he's not involved with AA. Only time will tell if he's true to his word and yes, I will see it in his actions.
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Old 11-25-2013, 10:01 AM
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Liz -I think it's really smart of you to go ahead with the separation after all that you've been through to this point. If he is sincere, it will show & your relationship will strengthen despite the separation. If not, you will be able to see it more clearly & already have the physical distance you need to minimize your interaction.

I think it's also a great show of your inner strength for your DS to see that even if you aren't sure of where this is leading, even if you are hesitant or just completely scared to your core about this change - you have faith that doing what it right for YOU TWO is the right thing to do no matter how hard that road may be.

Just making this decision to separate has been agonizing for you - all of us here have watched you struggle with this for a while. Sending you lots of STRENGTH today & always!!!
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Old 11-25-2013, 10:14 AM
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LIZ--It has always seemed like your husband has been in the "driver's seat" in your relationship. With him at the helm directing the way--with you as merely a passenger reacting to him. Him defining the course.

This would be the first time that you would be making a decision as to the course of your l ife. You in the drivers seat. You at the helm. (no doubt he will do a lot of reacting--trying to take the wheel back, so to speak).

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Old 11-25-2013, 04:01 PM
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He just emailed me to tell me that he contacted a realtor to look into buying a small house or condo!! He thinks renting, even if it's short term, is a bad idea! Seriously? What is this man thinking? I am trying to stay calm and not react. I told him it would be a nice investment property if we can fix the marriage in the long run. But, in reality, I am curious as to his motivation.
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:01 PM
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Originally Posted by lizatola View Post
The silent treatment and passive aggressive behavior became too much for me
Hi Lizatola. Sounds like you have dealt with your share of control and manipulation. I have been there. It sucks! Good for you for drawing the line in the sand. Stick to your guns. Words mean nothing. They'll say anything to get what they want, to keep things from changing. Change is your friend. Stay strong and whatever you do, make it be on your terms!
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:08 PM
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Did your son get invited on the mission trip? I know many fathers and sons who have gone together and had a wonderful, spiritual, bonding experience.
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:10 PM
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Liz, it is YOUR motivation that is important. HIS MOTIVATION--that is his thing to worry about. But, I can tell you from experience--The motivation of a narcissist is bound to be something to benefit him and scr*w someone else!!!!!!!!!!!!

He is still living rent free in your head as long as you are wondering about h is motivations......

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Old 11-25-2013, 04:40 PM
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Originally Posted by LoveMeNow View Post
Did your son get invited on the mission trip? I know many fathers and sons who have gone together and had a wonderful, spiritual, bonding experience.
No, my AH originally went just to get away from me and work stress. I don't think he even considered it.
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Old 11-25-2013, 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by lizatola View Post
No, my AH originally went just to get away from me and work stress. I don't think he even considered it.
Ok, I'm new but that sounds like a quack to me? Not the work stress but the get away from you part. And the buying of the condo thing also sounds like manipulation to me. You ask him to leave... he doesn't want to leave... so he makes it sound like he's moving on so that you rethink him moving out?

When we feel insecure, we try to shift our position so that we feel more secure. You were secure enough to ask for a trial separation which makes him feel like you're in control, not him. He manipulates you into giving him control by saying that he's going to buy a small house or condo (now you're the one fighting for the relationship when before he was the one who needed to fight for the relationship.)

Idk if that makes sense but that's my impression.
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Old 11-25-2013, 05:31 PM
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ETA: I guess the real thing is we shouldn't have to 'figure out' their motives or vice versa. We should be open enough in our relationships that we should just be honest with each other. (Not a judgment on you at all, I may be totally off base in your case. I'm speaking more from my experience I guess.)
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