Need to vent: Mr Nicey Nice is driving me crazy
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Need to vent: Mr Nicey Nice is driving me crazy
So, after the pastoral counseling last week when the pastor agreed that AH should move out and that we should separate, my AH has been on stellar behavior. He's so nice it's sickeningly sweet, but I see it as manipulation. Maybe his motives are pure. I'm not sure he even understands what he does or why he does it, at times, but I don't trust this Mr Nicey Nice anymore than I trust Mr Passive Aggressive, or Mr Punisher Silent Treatment.
Although, I am taking advantage of the fact that he is doing the dishes for me, walking the dog in the evening when it's cold, he's cleaning up his messes, he's greeting me day in and day out, etc so I'm enjoying it as best as I can. Too bad I don't believe any of it. A week ago he was spouting off about how I should be the one to move out and why should he be the one to move out, and screw what's best for our child.
I'm tired of playing along. I'm also tired of him not doing anything about finding a place to live and using the holidays as his excuse. Whatever. Fine. I'll probably have to be the one to move out at this point and I'm totally OK with that. Just have to find a good therapist for our son to help him through the transition.
Although, I am taking advantage of the fact that he is doing the dishes for me, walking the dog in the evening when it's cold, he's cleaning up his messes, he's greeting me day in and day out, etc so I'm enjoying it as best as I can. Too bad I don't believe any of it. A week ago he was spouting off about how I should be the one to move out and why should he be the one to move out, and screw what's best for our child.
I'm tired of playing along. I'm also tired of him not doing anything about finding a place to live and using the holidays as his excuse. Whatever. Fine. I'll probably have to be the one to move out at this point and I'm totally OK with that. Just have to find a good therapist for our son to help him through the transition.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
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I agree---I think it is just as important to detach from the fake niceness as it is to detach from the nastiness. I think you are handling it just right......LOL....Like Goldilocks--not to mean; not to enthusiastic;---just right.
dandylion
dandylion
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Sorry I haven't been keeping up with your situation but I recall your AH is still drinking. Is that correct?
Is the separation based on a boundary of keeping an active A out of your life? Were you planning for this to be a trial separation, a time for your AH to seek recovery? or is this the end of your relationship?
It took me a long time to detach my actions from RAH manipulation and irresponsibility.
I think A's will always try to manipulate and not take responsibility no matter what.
It doesn't seem right for you and your son to be disrupted from your home unless it is the end and you are taking the first step to moving on.
Hope you do enjoy the holidays and yes whether you believe it or not enjoy what your AH is doing around the house, you deserve the help and he should take responsibility.
Is the separation based on a boundary of keeping an active A out of your life? Were you planning for this to be a trial separation, a time for your AH to seek recovery? or is this the end of your relationship?
It took me a long time to detach my actions from RAH manipulation and irresponsibility.
I think A's will always try to manipulate and not take responsibility no matter what.
It doesn't seem right for you and your son to be disrupted from your home unless it is the end and you are taking the first step to moving on.
Hope you do enjoy the holidays and yes whether you believe it or not enjoy what your AH is doing around the house, you deserve the help and he should take responsibility.
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I totally agree with Dandylion...detach from the fakity fakes as much as you can. I'm glad you're prepared mentally to be the one to leave if that's what it takes to reclaim your serenity. You're doing great! Giant ((hugs)) to you, my friend.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
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Yes, detachment is so very useful in these situations! I always appreciate that it allows me to play the role of the observer to the event rather than feeling "part" of the dysfunction. When I successfully detach in a healthy way, I learn a lot!
You are sounding stronger every single day Lizatola!
You are sounding stronger every single day Lizatola!
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[QUOTE=dancingnow;4338883]Sorry I haven't been keeping up with your situation but I recall your AH is still drinking. Is that correct?
Not only is he still drinking but still driving around with no license.
Not only is he still drinking but still driving around with no license.
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[QUOTE=Upsetnneedhelp;4339092] Just for clarification: he has a license, it is interlock restricted. He rents cars when he travels once or twice a month and THEN drives them illegally and drinks, too.
He claims he's done drinking and is using some sort of book on 'habit breaking' to help him see his patterns of behavior and to help him stay away from drinking. I've heard it all before, in different ways.
It's funny to see how friendly he's being. It would make us look like a normal family, LOL. Sadly, we're not.
Originally Posted by dancingnow 
Sorry I haven't been keeping up with your situation but I recall your AH is still drinking. Is that correct?
Not only is he still drinking but still driving around with no license.
Not only is he still drinking but still driving around with no license.
He claims he's done drinking and is using some sort of book on 'habit breaking' to help him see his patterns of behavior and to help him stay away from drinking. I've heard it all before, in different ways.
It's funny to see how friendly he's being. It would make us look like a normal family, LOL. Sadly, we're not.
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Hey Liz, you know what I think you should do?
(Yes, I am giving ADVICE and I'm not apologizing for it!!!)
I think you should give yourself a big high five and pat on the back.
You know why?
Because DO YOU EVEN SEE HOW FAR YOU HAVE COME???? There was a time when you (and I!) would have been jumping for joy over this development and said "YAY he has become the man I always knew he could be even though he's still drinking!" and then the crash when it turns out not to be true would have been that much harder.
Having realistic expectations saves us so much grief. And you have come so far and grown so much -- and having walked that path myself, I take great joy in seeing that. Not because I want your marriage to break up, but because I know the best thing we as family can do is detach and step aside. For us and for the alcoholic.
I admire your calm and your stubborn insistence that you will not do anything until you know it's right. That'll take you places.
(Yes, I am giving ADVICE and I'm not apologizing for it!!!)
I think you should give yourself a big high five and pat on the back.
You know why?
Because DO YOU EVEN SEE HOW FAR YOU HAVE COME???? There was a time when you (and I!) would have been jumping for joy over this development and said "YAY he has become the man I always knew he could be even though he's still drinking!" and then the crash when it turns out not to be true would have been that much harder.
Having realistic expectations saves us so much grief. And you have come so far and grown so much -- and having walked that path myself, I take great joy in seeing that. Not because I want your marriage to break up, but because I know the best thing we as family can do is detach and step aside. For us and for the alcoholic.
I admire your calm and your stubborn insistence that you will not do anything until you know it's right. That'll take you places.
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 490
Originally Posted by Upsetnneedhelp
Not only is he still drinking but still driving around with no license.
Liz didn't cause it.
Liz can't control it and
Liz can't cure it.
All Liz can do is continue to work on herself to make the life she deserves for herself and her boy and I think she is doing GREAT!
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Thanks everyone for the support.
I just got back from the obgyn office and the doc found a mass in my right armpit area. I am trying not to freak out. She said it feels like a fluid filled cyst. I just got off the phone with the breast health center and I already am frustrated with insurance issues, etc. The doc wrote the directives wrong and now I have to wait for them to get the right ones faxed back over before I can even make the appointment. I guess this is a good time for me to use my program and to just take things one day at a time.
Why is it that when it rains, I always feel like it pours? UGH!
I just got back from the obgyn office and the doc found a mass in my right armpit area. I am trying not to freak out. She said it feels like a fluid filled cyst. I just got off the phone with the breast health center and I already am frustrated with insurance issues, etc. The doc wrote the directives wrong and now I have to wait for them to get the right ones faxed back over before I can even make the appointment. I guess this is a good time for me to use my program and to just take things one day at a time.
Why is it that when it rains, I always feel like it pours? UGH!
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
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NO freaking out allowed! 
I often find (speaking of my personal path only) that just when I feel like I've turned a corner, gotten a handle on my boundaries, overcome a hurdle in my therapy.... then fate just immediately tests me, sometimes in harsh & unusual ways... just to see if I will lose my footing so to speak. Take a deep breath & just handle it step by step. (((((HUGS)))))
I often find (speaking of my personal path only) that just when I feel like I've turned a corner, gotten a handle on my boundaries, overcome a hurdle in my therapy.... then fate just immediately tests me, sometimes in harsh & unusual ways... just to see if I will lose my footing so to speak. Take a deep breath & just handle it step by step. (((((HUGS)))))
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 741
A summary of a few types of abusers from "Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Abusive Men" by Lundy Bancroft:
5. Mr. Sensitive
Mr. Sensitive appears on the outside to be gentle and soft-spoken and uses personal development jargon, meanwhile still being extremely self-centered and demanding emotionally.
"As long as I use a lot of "psychobabble," no one is going to believe that I am mistreating you. I can get inside your head whether you want me there or not."
3. The Water Torturer
[B]The Water Torturer stays evenly calm in arguments and has a quiet derision (insulting or mocking) and meanness. He can psychologically assault his partner so they don't even understand why they are so upset.
"As long as I'm calm, you can't call anything I do abusive, no matter how cruel."[/B]
5. Mr. Sensitive
Mr. Sensitive appears on the outside to be gentle and soft-spoken and uses personal development jargon, meanwhile still being extremely self-centered and demanding emotionally.
"As long as I use a lot of "psychobabble," no one is going to believe that I am mistreating you. I can get inside your head whether you want me there or not."
3. The Water Torturer
[B]The Water Torturer stays evenly calm in arguments and has a quiet derision (insulting or mocking) and meanness. He can psychologically assault his partner so they don't even understand why they are so upset.
"As long as I'm calm, you can't call anything I do abusive, no matter how cruel."[/B]
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Join Date: Dec 2013
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I would say the man needs to move out not you, to me you have been more of a servant from what I read. Walk the dog, clean the kitchen, and all the other things you mentioned. My point is he does not respect you and perhaps at some point in your relationship things were different but right now it's pretty obvious he not only hates himself but he has no respect for you or your son. Should you be the one to leave what happens to you boy?
I have seen this picture before and until the man learns to respect you and himself there is no chance of any type of meaningful relationship. You're not a door mat nor are you his mommy or servant. Sometimes after years of abuse we lose sight of ourselves as well, you deserve better so does your son. I don't know how old your boy is but don't think for one minute that this is not severely effecting your sons behavior. At some point your son may even start picking up his fathers bad examples and then two lives are being ruined.
I'd would say since he's being Mr. Kissy Kissy right now, that maybe it would be a good time to introduce him to AA and have him read the "Letter From An Alcoholic", I'd recommend you read it as well, but recovery starts with him making real efforts, not just kissing your back side. From what little you have shared I'd say he's hurt you really bad and I'm guessing part of you really wants to love the man he once was but you can't enable him any longer. If I was in your position I'd stay in touch with your Pastor and if you don't belong to Alanon I'd HIGHLY recommend you find a meeting close to you and start attending as often as you can for the first 30 days. I'd also recommend you get a sponsor as quickly as possible because your sponsor can help you through the rough times ahead.
I've seen many relationships repaired by using the tools provided in AA and Alanon, and weather you like the man or not, you need to think of your son and the impact divorce will have on him. Once you start working the steps I'm pretty sure everyone will agree with me that you will be able to handle crisis situations with clarity.
The serenity Prayer is a valuable tool I have used for the past nine years I have been in program and I can't tell you how many times it has changed the course of my actions and given me the strength to make smart choices.
In case you've not read it before:
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
I wish you all the luck in saving your family, you have a lot of work to do but you're in the right place by starting here and working with your Pastor. Alanon has saved my life! it has saved my marriage and I am a genuinely happy man today.
I have seen this picture before and until the man learns to respect you and himself there is no chance of any type of meaningful relationship. You're not a door mat nor are you his mommy or servant. Sometimes after years of abuse we lose sight of ourselves as well, you deserve better so does your son. I don't know how old your boy is but don't think for one minute that this is not severely effecting your sons behavior. At some point your son may even start picking up his fathers bad examples and then two lives are being ruined.
I'd would say since he's being Mr. Kissy Kissy right now, that maybe it would be a good time to introduce him to AA and have him read the "Letter From An Alcoholic", I'd recommend you read it as well, but recovery starts with him making real efforts, not just kissing your back side. From what little you have shared I'd say he's hurt you really bad and I'm guessing part of you really wants to love the man he once was but you can't enable him any longer. If I was in your position I'd stay in touch with your Pastor and if you don't belong to Alanon I'd HIGHLY recommend you find a meeting close to you and start attending as often as you can for the first 30 days. I'd also recommend you get a sponsor as quickly as possible because your sponsor can help you through the rough times ahead.
I've seen many relationships repaired by using the tools provided in AA and Alanon, and weather you like the man or not, you need to think of your son and the impact divorce will have on him. Once you start working the steps I'm pretty sure everyone will agree with me that you will be able to handle crisis situations with clarity.
The serenity Prayer is a valuable tool I have used for the past nine years I have been in program and I can't tell you how many times it has changed the course of my actions and given me the strength to make smart choices.
In case you've not read it before:
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
I wish you all the luck in saving your family, you have a lot of work to do but you're in the right place by starting here and working with your Pastor. Alanon has saved my life! it has saved my marriage and I am a genuinely happy man today.
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Originally Posted by Cptnzulu
I would say the man needs to move out not you, to me you have been more of a servant from what I read. Walk the dog, clean the kitchen, and all the other things you mentioned. My point is he does not respect you and perhaps at some point in your relationship things were different but right now it's pretty obvious he not only hates himself but he has no respect for you or your son. Should you be the one to leave what happens to you boy?
I have seen this picture before and until the man learns to respect you and himself there is no chance of any type of meaningful relationship. You're not a door mat nor are you his mommy or servant. Sometimes after years of abuse we lose sight of ourselves as well, you deserve better so does your son. I don't know how old your boy is but don't think for one minute that this is not severely effecting your sons behavior. At some point your son may even start picking up his fathers bad examples and then two lives are being ruined.
I'd would say since he's being Mr. Kissy Kissy right now, that maybe it would be a good time to introduce him to AA and have him read the "Letter From An Alcoholic", I'd recommend you read it as well, but recovery starts with him making real efforts, not just kissing your back side. From what little you have shared I'd say he's hurt you really bad and I'm guessing part of you really wants to love the man he once was but you can't enable him any longer. If I was in your position I'd stay in touch with your Pastor and if you don't belong to Alanon I'd HIGHLY recommend you find a meeting close to you and start attending as often as you can for the first 30 days. I'd also recommend you get a sponsor as quickly as possible because your sponsor can help you through the rough times ahead.
I've seen many relationships repaired by using the tools provided in AA and Alanon, and weather you like the man or not, you need to think of your son and the impact divorce will have on him. Once you start working the steps I'm pretty sure everyone will agree with me that you will be able to handle crisis situations with clarity.
The serenity Prayer is a valuable tool I have used for the past nine years I have been in program and I can't tell you how many times it has changed the course of my actions and given me the strength to make smart choices.
In case you've not read it before:
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
I wish you all the luck in saving your family, you have a lot of work to do but you're in the right place by starting here and working with your Pastor. Alanon has saved my life! it has saved my marriage and I am a genuinely happy man today.
I have seen this picture before and until the man learns to respect you and himself there is no chance of any type of meaningful relationship. You're not a door mat nor are you his mommy or servant. Sometimes after years of abuse we lose sight of ourselves as well, you deserve better so does your son. I don't know how old your boy is but don't think for one minute that this is not severely effecting your sons behavior. At some point your son may even start picking up his fathers bad examples and then two lives are being ruined.
I'd would say since he's being Mr. Kissy Kissy right now, that maybe it would be a good time to introduce him to AA and have him read the "Letter From An Alcoholic", I'd recommend you read it as well, but recovery starts with him making real efforts, not just kissing your back side. From what little you have shared I'd say he's hurt you really bad and I'm guessing part of you really wants to love the man he once was but you can't enable him any longer. If I was in your position I'd stay in touch with your Pastor and if you don't belong to Alanon I'd HIGHLY recommend you find a meeting close to you and start attending as often as you can for the first 30 days. I'd also recommend you get a sponsor as quickly as possible because your sponsor can help you through the rough times ahead.
I've seen many relationships repaired by using the tools provided in AA and Alanon, and weather you like the man or not, you need to think of your son and the impact divorce will have on him. Once you start working the steps I'm pretty sure everyone will agree with me that you will be able to handle crisis situations with clarity.
The serenity Prayer is a valuable tool I have used for the past nine years I have been in program and I can't tell you how many times it has changed the course of my actions and given me the strength to make smart choices.
In case you've not read it before:
God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference.
I wish you all the luck in saving your family, you have a lot of work to do but you're in the right place by starting here and working with your Pastor. Alanon has saved my life! it has saved my marriage and I am a genuinely happy man today.
My AH will not attend AA and is now balking at Celebrate Recovery as the pastor had asked him to attend. I am in regular weekly counseling with a Christian counselor and I meet with my pastor every few months when I need a some Biblical guidance. The pastor we met with was from another church where I do not attend(my AH does not attend church with us) but I met willingly with the man because I trusted the church leadership and I my best friend attends that particular church.
Anyway, right now, I'm feeling on the verge of breakdown because of this stupid mass under my armpit. How could I NOT have felt it or seen it there. Now that I know it's there I can feel it constantly! It's crazy how I have neglected my physical health and now I'm just praying that this is nothing to worry about, I've got enough on my plate.
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Join Date: May 2010
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Even if he does not attend Celebrate Recovery...you should try it! I thought I was dropping my husband off there to be "fixed". Ha ha...instead they have helped me! My group of codependent women there are amazing and I don't know where my life would be without them. Give it a try. For me it has been great support and it is a great program.
And...stop worrying about the mass! So many times it is just a cyst or something not to worry about. You are in my heart and prayers.
And...stop worrying about the mass! So many times it is just a cyst or something not to worry about. You are in my heart and prayers.
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Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Liz---over the years I have had a number of fluid filled cysts of the breast (breast tissue continues up into the armpit). Mine have all been benign--I had them aspirated and sent to the pathology lab for examination. They can appear quite spontaneously, and can be very small to relatively large in size. They can fluctuate according to the monthly hormonal changes.
I am not saying that yours is the same as mine---but, try not to panic while not k nowing what the facts are. Of course, it is normal to be very concerned--but, it might n ot be as bad as you are thinking.
I hope you get the "facts" as soon as possible, Liz.
dandylion
I am not saying that yours is the same as mine---but, try not to panic while not k nowing what the facts are. Of course, it is normal to be very concerned--but, it might n ot be as bad as you are thinking.
I hope you get the "facts" as soon as possible, Liz.
dandylion
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Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Midwest, USA
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Anyway, right now, I'm feeling on the verge of breakdown because of this stupid mass under my armpit. How could I NOT have felt it or seen it there. Now that I know it's there I can feel it constantly! It's crazy how I have neglected my physical health and now I'm just praying that this is nothing to worry about, I've got enough on my plate.
I have sensitive skin but not in the normal sensitive skin kind of way. More like everything that touches me might make me break out in the biggest zit you've ever seen (hey boys!). A while back, I found a massive lump, about the size of a walnut, in my armpit and rushed to the doctor to have it checked out. After a full battery of tests, with me convinced that I had cancer on my lymph nodes, the doctor informed me that this was the result of an ingrown hair getting a follicle infected, probably because of a reaction to my deodorant. He told me not to touch it and to leave it alone... which meant the first thing I did when I got home was lance it. IT WAS DISGUSTING. And so satisfying!
I hope you have a disgusting ingrown hair, Liz.
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Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Wisconsin
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Dandylion and I must be boobie twinsies! I, too, have recurrent fluid-filled cysts. They can be so stressful, especially when you're not sure what they are. Sending you strength and hugs, my friend!
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