Oh Well Part 3
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
Tatsy, you know that I encouraged you to speak up on your own thread to let us know that you didn't like the virtual coffee. Sohard may not know this because our correspondence about this was via PM. You subsequently did speak up for yourself, which is all that needed to happen to put a stop to it. I believe I congratulated you and thanked you for doing so, as did others. And the coffee was over.
"Coffee clutch" is not a new term - it's actually quite old, so you may find it popping up on other threads from time to time as well. This isn't so much an odd coincidence as it likely a reflection of the age of a fair number of members here on SR (and the youth of others). (Also, btw, broster's use of the term "crones" harkens back to Cow's threads. Think of it as a term of endearment.)
If either of you would like to discuss this more, please by all means contact me via PM. I'd like to truly leave this behind us now and if further correspondence would help you to do so, I'm more than willing to participate in an off-line discussion.
Finally, no one around here has the corner of the "life and death" market. Let's try to assume the best of each other going forward, shall we? Misunderstandings might come up and that's natural. All we need to do is confront them directly - no need for attacks or armor.
"Coffee clutch" is not a new term - it's actually quite old, so you may find it popping up on other threads from time to time as well. This isn't so much an odd coincidence as it likely a reflection of the age of a fair number of members here on SR (and the youth of others). (Also, btw, broster's use of the term "crones" harkens back to Cow's threads. Think of it as a term of endearment.)
If either of you would like to discuss this more, please by all means contact me via PM. I'd like to truly leave this behind us now and if further correspondence would help you to do so, I'm more than willing to participate in an off-line discussion.
Finally, no one around here has the corner of the "life and death" market. Let's try to assume the best of each other going forward, shall we? Misunderstandings might come up and that's natural. All we need to do is confront them directly - no need for attacks or armor.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,654
Not that it matters, I performed a search on SR, just two results. Notwithstanding, I said I believed this issue was already clarified as innocent and left behind us, after Sassy reopened it! I wish you all the very best in sobriety, O 🤗
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
Please, for the love of sanity, I beg of you all. No more on the coffee clutch topic otherwise I'm going to have to bust out in satirical song and you don't want to hear that as it would be very heavy on the puns. Either that or I could shut this one down and start over again. hmmmm
Tatsy, I sent you a PM.
Tatsy, I sent you a PM.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,654
It wasn’t me, O, I said the (CC) was left behind us after clarification, following Sassy’s resurrection of the (CC) post and raising of the drama issue. Gees. it’s like being reprimanded for something I didn’t do in kindergarten! On that comment, I hope I’ve imtroduced levity.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Colorado
Posts: 3,474
.
I've been reading here for some time while enjoying Posts that have made me think.
Perhaps the most important Epiphany I had a few Years in was when a SR Pundit mentioned returning to what you once were before active Addiction. As a youngster. This insight led me down the path of more-fully understanding I was an Introvert. So, SR was my best way forward since Meetings would be stressful. And, counter-productive to achieving independent, internalized, permanent Sobriety.
My contented focus is internal; not external. Despite >4 Decades of concerted effort, I could not drink my way into being someone I never was. Despite Society generally rewarding Extroverts.
Read about the Science here...
~ Extroverts & Introverts ~
I've been reading here for some time while enjoying Posts that have made me think.
Perhaps the most important Epiphany I had a few Years in was when a SR Pundit mentioned returning to what you once were before active Addiction. As a youngster. This insight led me down the path of more-fully understanding I was an Introvert. So, SR was my best way forward since Meetings would be stressful. And, counter-productive to achieving independent, internalized, permanent Sobriety.
My contented focus is internal; not external. Despite >4 Decades of concerted effort, I could not drink my way into being someone I never was. Despite Society generally rewarding Extroverts.
Read about the Science here...
~ Extroverts & Introverts ~
Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,654
A great Extroverts and Introverts article, MesaMan. Drinking all those years ago, simply turned me into something I was not, externally. It feels good to revert back to pre-drinking type. I expect you can guess which I am!
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: US
Posts: 5,095
Good morning everyone
Just another day. Ribs are better. The pain kinda morphs...back to being very sore in the morning but it eases after a couple hours. I can't really complain, even tho I do. It is improving.
My trip to Cali got pushed out to the 12th, which I'm soooo relieved about. My suitcase, my laptop...all daunting to think about how I was going to move things and make this happen. So I've bought myself a little time.
My daughter is doing fantastic. Gawd to be able to say that with no reservations is such a huge thing. She is doing great in school, just finished midterms. She got a job in her department, Biology, working with dried herbs. Haha. She's a natural with dried herb. We both got a kick outta that. She seems like she's finding some balance and finding her own path. What huge growth over the last 6-9 months. She's unrecognizable from 2 years ago. She has finally dumped the last of this pack of girls she got wrapped up in her junior year. I hated ALL of them from the first hello and told her they were all going to bring her down. And they did. But now she sees it. I'm so relieved. Scummy girls. Icky. She and her long time bestie are asleep upstairs. They are so cute. They come here to shower and use all my products because just a home shower is such a huge thing. They eat and rest and do laundry and then take off. Needs met. And I'm so glad to meet them. And such a huge thing for me right now being so home bound to have them come and relieve the monotony and boredom.
Anyway, babbling on. Just very grateful this morning. Even the damn pain is tolerable when I feel some light.
Have a great Saturday everyone. I'll try not to lose my mind pacing my house like a crazy person!
Just another day. Ribs are better. The pain kinda morphs...back to being very sore in the morning but it eases after a couple hours. I can't really complain, even tho I do. It is improving.
My trip to Cali got pushed out to the 12th, which I'm soooo relieved about. My suitcase, my laptop...all daunting to think about how I was going to move things and make this happen. So I've bought myself a little time.
My daughter is doing fantastic. Gawd to be able to say that with no reservations is such a huge thing. She is doing great in school, just finished midterms. She got a job in her department, Biology, working with dried herbs. Haha. She's a natural with dried herb. We both got a kick outta that. She seems like she's finding some balance and finding her own path. What huge growth over the last 6-9 months. She's unrecognizable from 2 years ago. She has finally dumped the last of this pack of girls she got wrapped up in her junior year. I hated ALL of them from the first hello and told her they were all going to bring her down. And they did. But now she sees it. I'm so relieved. Scummy girls. Icky. She and her long time bestie are asleep upstairs. They are so cute. They come here to shower and use all my products because just a home shower is such a huge thing. They eat and rest and do laundry and then take off. Needs met. And I'm so glad to meet them. And such a huge thing for me right now being so home bound to have them come and relieve the monotony and boredom.
Anyway, babbling on. Just very grateful this morning. Even the damn pain is tolerable when I feel some light.
Have a great Saturday everyone. I'll try not to lose my mind pacing my house like a crazy person!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,654
Entropy, it’s good to read that 6our daughter is thriving and has broken free from the scummy girls clutches. The delay in your California trip will allow your ribs time to heal. I recall vividly the pain of my fractured ribs, even though it was so long ago. Strange that my brain has a reduced capacity to recall the horrendous pain of drinking
,
,
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Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,654
Originally Posted by Obladi 
Tatsy, I did more reading about LOC today, and it's interesting. Every discussion I read spoke about this as you did. About where one's own motivation comes from, not one's belief about how the world works. // Anyhow, I'll think about it some more and expound on my theories when I have a keyboard at hand.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2016
Posts: 2,654
Hi guys and gals, just wish to let you all know, I’m not going ‘missing in action aka, drinking’. I’m just taking a break from SR, because I have to admit, checking for new posts and PMs is becoming a bit of an obsession. It feels uncomfortable, when people don’t reply, my (idiotic low self-esteem) AV, uses it as a weapon against me.
I need to focus on the 3D world and try to right my capsized ship! I’ll be back as soon as I’ve recharged and do hope that you all stay well. And most importantly, stay sober 🤗.
I need to focus on the 3D world and try to right my capsized ship! I’ll be back as soon as I’ve recharged and do hope that you all stay well. And most importantly, stay sober 🤗.
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
Flipsy, so glad to read about your really good Saturday. I remember those days full of one or another of my daughters and her friends that I truly liked. It's such a cozy contented feeling. 
Glad, too, that the rib pain is becoming bearable. I hope this continues into Sunday and you might be able to leave the house to enjoy sunshine and crisp leaves sometime soon.
Tats, there are worse things over which to obsess, but I get it. Of course you must do what's best for you. We'll keep the light on.
Glad, too, that the rib pain is becoming bearable. I hope this continues into Sunday and you might be able to leave the house to enjoy sunshine and crisp leaves sometime soon.
Tats, there are worse things over which to obsess, but I get it. Of course you must do what's best for you. We'll keep the light on.
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
So locus of control. Let's throw out the assessment as being unwittingly biased as it assumes we all inhabit a level playing field. We don't. People of higher social and financial class have a distinct advantage in traditional measures of success. People of color have a distinct disadvantage in caucasian-controlled societies. You know...
Tatsy points out that I've been using AA and antabuse to stay sober, so suggests that perhaps my locus of control is primarily external and I'd be best advised to continue with those strategies. But then again, I'm greatly influenced by AVRT concepts, which points to an internal locus of control.
dwtbd pipes up with the excellent question, "How can motivation be anything but internal?" I don't think it can.
So I don't think motivation = locus of control. I think motivation to do anything can be influenced by internal or external factors, but people don't do a single thing that isn't somehow rooted in self. Locus of control seems to me a concept that maybe describes not motivation, but instead "oomph." If I want to make my family happy, if I want to stay out of jail, if I want to maintain my reputation - all of those indicate an external locus of control. Conversely, if I want to be my "true" self, whoever that is and without regard to what that means in terms of status, income, current relationships - that reflects an entirely internal locus of control.
Likewise, I don't think that the tools we use to accomplish anything are necessarily indicative of motivation or locus of control. I think they are just tools. I don't take antabuse because it prevents me from making the choice to drink - I take it because the fallout would be very unpleasant. I don't go to AA because it prevents me from drinking - I go because being in the company of people who understand is reinforcing. AVRT doesn't stop me from drinking, but the concepts are there to help me manage thoughts that suggest that drinking is an option.
Not sure where all of this thinking leads me, aside from noticing that I'm distracted by MesaMan's interjection in regard to introversion vs extroversion. How does that relate? Instinctively, I think those traits must be correlated with locus of control.
Anyhow.
I didn't drink yesterday and I won't drink today.
Internal, external, upstairs, downstairs or in my lady's chamber - doesn't matter as long as there's no booze in the picture.
Tatsy points out that I've been using AA and antabuse to stay sober, so suggests that perhaps my locus of control is primarily external and I'd be best advised to continue with those strategies. But then again, I'm greatly influenced by AVRT concepts, which points to an internal locus of control.
dwtbd pipes up with the excellent question, "How can motivation be anything but internal?" I don't think it can.
So I don't think motivation = locus of control. I think motivation to do anything can be influenced by internal or external factors, but people don't do a single thing that isn't somehow rooted in self. Locus of control seems to me a concept that maybe describes not motivation, but instead "oomph." If I want to make my family happy, if I want to stay out of jail, if I want to maintain my reputation - all of those indicate an external locus of control. Conversely, if I want to be my "true" self, whoever that is and without regard to what that means in terms of status, income, current relationships - that reflects an entirely internal locus of control.
Likewise, I don't think that the tools we use to accomplish anything are necessarily indicative of motivation or locus of control. I think they are just tools. I don't take antabuse because it prevents me from making the choice to drink - I take it because the fallout would be very unpleasant. I don't go to AA because it prevents me from drinking - I go because being in the company of people who understand is reinforcing. AVRT doesn't stop me from drinking, but the concepts are there to help me manage thoughts that suggest that drinking is an option.
Not sure where all of this thinking leads me, aside from noticing that I'm distracted by MesaMan's interjection in regard to introversion vs extroversion. How does that relate? Instinctively, I think those traits must be correlated with locus of control.
Anyhow.
I didn't drink yesterday and I won't drink today.
Internal, external, upstairs, downstairs or in my lady's chamber - doesn't matter as long as there's no booze in the picture.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: canada
Posts: 7,242
well, i have been thinking of what taplow said in another thread (hi taplow!) about how could one overrule oneself and that he always does what he wants.
i think that relates much to LOC.
at first i thought well no, even my dog doesn't always do what she wants. i have helped her learn it's not in her best interest. so her LOC came from outside but is now inside. or is it?
and when i don't do something because of fear of consequences, which are external, where is the line in external/internal LOC?
and if i experience a relationship with a power greater than myself as having removed my drink obsession, but it is my relationship, so to speak, then where is the LOC?
just throwing these things out to look at some of the worms in the can.
yikes. i can see it will all go back to my favourite topic: the choice-thing. power. choice. control. agency.
i think that relates much to LOC.
at first i thought well no, even my dog doesn't always do what she wants. i have helped her learn it's not in her best interest. so her LOC came from outside but is now inside. or is it?
and when i don't do something because of fear of consequences, which are external, where is the line in external/internal LOC?
and if i experience a relationship with a power greater than myself as having removed my drink obsession, but it is my relationship, so to speak, then where is the LOC?
just throwing these things out to look at some of the worms in the can.
yikes. i can see it will all go back to my favourite topic: the choice-thing. power. choice. control. agency.
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
I don't know taplow well (hi, taplow!), but I'm guessing he doesn't do anything he doesn't decide to do. Wanting is a different thing altogether. Or at least it can be.
I want to drink.
I have decided not to drink.
I am my beast and I am myself.
My self wants to not want to drink.
And so I've decided to not drink.
Sounds like an addicted person's Dr Seuss.
But it's true.
I want to drink.
I have decided not to drink.
I am my beast and I am myself.
My self wants to not want to drink.
And so I've decided to not drink.
Sounds like an addicted person's Dr Seuss.
But it's true.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: US
Posts: 5,095
O has it been 90 days? Time flies when you're having fun! So happy for you.
I couldn't agree more with your post about LOC. But it all gets too analytical for me. And I think over time external can become internal and visa versa. Who cares. If its working, staying sober and maybe learning a thing or two, both internal and external, then keepa going.
Daughter and different friend hanging on the couch. She actually walked the dog for me. What is this new kid? So grateful.
xoxoxoxo
I couldn't agree more with your post about LOC. But it all gets too analytical for me. And I think over time external can become internal and visa versa. Who cares. If its working, staying sober and maybe learning a thing or two, both internal and external, then keepa going.
Daughter and different friend hanging on the couch. She actually walked the dog for me. What is this new kid? So grateful.
xoxoxoxo
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