AVRT Crash Course
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Gary, that was a great description of a Beast's struggle against the cutting off of ITs supply!
Kaily, it's the polar opposite of your previous struggles against the Beast, now the role is reversed - you have removed the power from the Beast - your Beast is struggling and not you, but IT tries to use your thoughts and feelings to inject insecurity in abstinence, forever.
The final screw in the Beast's new cage, ITs prison, is when you affirm your Big Plan, thereby setting your confidence level arbitrarily at 100%.
"Never say never"' says every Beast, terrified. But it's always NOW, in a year today, it will be now. At first I said "I will never now drink again and I will never change my mind". Now? I can happily omit the now, because it's always now, and so never really does mean never.
Whilst walking my dogs earlier, I thought of your post. I reflected on how different this spring seems, compared with past ones. The is the first year in a long time, that I've actually witnessed the spring flowers and blossom, growing from tiny buds then blooming. Previously, I'd be oblivious to this slow growth and progression, usually I'd only notice them when they were curling up, brown and dry, falling off. Now for instance, the bluebells are almost ready to flower, I've watched them erupt from the soil and grow larger, bushier and can't wait to see the carpet of blue.
My eyesight was dimmed, clouded, by the Beast's demands for alcohol, which I met and in return, the Beast ran rampent and I sat in the squalid cage next to it. The Beast lowered my senses to those of IT, craving one thing only, alcohol. IT didn't care about nature and beauty, birdsong, my dogs. Had I not made a Big Plan and practised AVRT, the Beast would've demanded the daily binging until I died, and left my beloved dogs.
Kaily, it's the polar opposite of your previous struggles against the Beast, now the role is reversed - you have removed the power from the Beast - your Beast is struggling and not you, but IT tries to use your thoughts and feelings to inject insecurity in abstinence, forever.
The final screw in the Beast's new cage, ITs prison, is when you affirm your Big Plan, thereby setting your confidence level arbitrarily at 100%.
"Never say never"' says every Beast, terrified. But it's always NOW, in a year today, it will be now. At first I said "I will never now drink again and I will never change my mind". Now? I can happily omit the now, because it's always now, and so never really does mean never.
Whilst walking my dogs earlier, I thought of your post. I reflected on how different this spring seems, compared with past ones. The is the first year in a long time, that I've actually witnessed the spring flowers and blossom, growing from tiny buds then blooming. Previously, I'd be oblivious to this slow growth and progression, usually I'd only notice them when they were curling up, brown and dry, falling off. Now for instance, the bluebells are almost ready to flower, I've watched them erupt from the soil and grow larger, bushier and can't wait to see the carpet of blue.
My eyesight was dimmed, clouded, by the Beast's demands for alcohol, which I met and in return, the Beast ran rampent and I sat in the squalid cage next to it. The Beast lowered my senses to those of IT, craving one thing only, alcohol. IT didn't care about nature and beauty, birdsong, my dogs. Had I not made a Big Plan and practised AVRT, the Beast would've demanded the daily binging until I died, and left my beloved dogs.
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Another thing I forgot to add kaily, if you want to make a Big Plan, you make it, wholeheartedly and fearlessly . The feelings the Beast dredges up don't matter. Discount them, discount ITs fear, ITs panic, the uncertainty ITs trying to instill in you by trying to transpose ITs feelings onto you.
Once you do make the Big Plan, the battle lines are drawn, and IT knows it. You and IT, no more a merged oneness
ITs voice, the AV will stand out like a sore thumb, as the AV is any thoughts feelings images that suggest drinking and go against your Big Plan of "I will never drink again and I will never change my mind." That plan leaves no wiggle room for the Beast, to suggest drinking as an option.If drinking ever does come up in your thoughts as an option, that is exposed as AV immediately
Once you do make the Big Plan, the battle lines are drawn, and IT knows it. You and IT, no more a merged oneness
ITs voice, the AV will stand out like a sore thumb, as the AV is any thoughts feelings images that suggest drinking and go against your Big Plan of "I will never drink again and I will never change my mind." That plan leaves no wiggle room for the Beast, to suggest drinking as an option.If drinking ever does come up in your thoughts as an option, that is exposed as AV immediately
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Originally Posted by GaryB1 
I think the best thing is, you are no longer waiting to be rescued and at the mercy of the hopeless UK addiction services. You have rescued yourself, how empowering is that?
One of the AV "illusion locks" to keep you in the Beast's prison is to make you believe that you are powerless, and too incompetent to not swallow any more alcohol. Hopeless resignation to rescue fantasies, of the cosmic variety or otherwise, are a natural consequence of this pernicious illusion lock.
AVRT doesn't "work" per se -- YOU work. You have all of the power here, Kaily, because the Beast has always needed you to feed IT, ever since the day IT was first born, many years ago. The illusion that this is not the case has kept you in the prison, with warden Beast calling the shots.
Addiction is a prison without locks, though, and you can walk out of the prison at any time. If you believe that there must be something out there, besides yourself, that must fix this problem for you, and save you from the Beast, then you are failing to recognize your Addictive Voice.
The Beast is certainly cunning and ruthless, but it is ultimately a dependent creature. It may try to make you believe that you are also a dependent creature, in need of rescuing, but the Beast is always dependent on you.
You have all of the power here, Kaily.
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Originally Posted by GaryB1
Perfect sense! That resistance you feel is the Beast. There IT is, in full view, horrified at your thoughts of never drinking again and never changing your mind. ITs trying to reign you in, to not rush into anything (anything that will deprive IT of ITs life blood..alcohol). ITs scared now, poor thing! Can you feel the fear? Thats ITs fear.
Yes, the Beast will love reading those posts..
"Ah IT thinks, the good old times, when I could have my precious stuff on tap, when I had kaily well under my control, she gave me what I wanted, when I wanted it, I was so clever, she though I and she were one and the same. No matter the alcohol was killing her, no matter she was in despair, no matter I was stealing HER life, it's mysurvival that counts, she thought SHE needed the alcohol to live, but she has blown my cover now and knows it's me that needs it to survive."
It's you or IT simple as that, you cannot both thrive. And now IT is suffering and you are not. Observe IT suffering, observe IT twisting and turning, trying to manipulate your thoughts into why drinking is a good idea (good idea for IT, not for you). Observe IT digging ITs heels in and trying to drag you back from fully committing to never drinking. Observe this, and keep thinking, I do not drink now (it's always now) My god, ITs in a panic!
You are doing great kaily..your Beast, thats not doing so great..and thats great!!
Yes, the Beast will love reading those posts..
"Ah IT thinks, the good old times, when I could have my precious stuff on tap, when I had kaily well under my control, she gave me what I wanted, when I wanted it, I was so clever, she though I and she were one and the same. No matter the alcohol was killing her, no matter she was in despair, no matter I was stealing HER life, it's mysurvival that counts, she thought SHE needed the alcohol to live, but she has blown my cover now and knows it's me that needs it to survive."
It's you or IT simple as that, you cannot both thrive. And now IT is suffering and you are not. Observe IT suffering, observe IT twisting and turning, trying to manipulate your thoughts into why drinking is a good idea (good idea for IT, not for you). Observe IT digging ITs heels in and trying to drag you back from fully committing to never drinking. Observe this, and keep thinking, I do not drink now (it's always now) My god, ITs in a panic!
You are doing great kaily..your Beast, thats not doing so great..and thats great!!
Join Date: Sep 2016
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Originally Posted by Kaily
Another thing I do which is a bit of a worry is keep remembering good but not much bad stuff about drinking. I am making a very conscious effort to think of the horrible destructive addiction which has controlled my life for so very long and not to keep romanticising it back to those first few sips.
The Beast 'knows' that its own life is on the line, and thus will never be deterred from its agenda of seeking more 'life-giving' alcohol by any scarecrows, along the lines of 'playing the tape' through. The Beast has its own tape, after all, which it will always fear more than yours.
With AVRT, we simply meet the Beast on its own turf, and abstain from the benefits of drinking, not just from the downsides. To do otherwise, would necessarily suggest the possibility of drinking some more if the downsides were ever mitigated. That idea is obviously the Addictive Voice itself.
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Originally Posted by Algorithm
With AVRT, we simply meet the Beast on its own turf, and abstain from the benefits of drinking, not just from the downsides. To do otherwise, would necessarily suggest the possibility of drinking some more if the downsides were ever mitigated. That idea is obviously the Addictive Voice itself.
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Hi Kaily, how are you today?
In the Rational Recovery book New Cure for Substance Addiction Trimpey describes being addicted to something as being in two minds about using (ie doing something against your better judgement, or a reversal of what you intended to do). This is different from chemical dependence, where you have a dependence on a substance but aren't in two minds, you like doing it and you don't want to stop, whatever the consequences you think it's worth it.
Drinking does have its rewards ( a rush of pleasure and intoxication ) or you wouldn't have kept doing it in the first place. If I gave you a cup of sea water to drink, with only nasty consequences for drinking it, you wouldn't accept another drink of that lol. But you know there are nasty consequences to drinking alcohol as well, just not as immediate. First comes the pleasure (and thats what the Beasts aim is, pleasure, getting that rush of pleasure is the reason IT exists). After IT gets you to deliver that substance, and keep delivering (ITs never satisfied) ITs job is done. But for you it doesn't end there. You have to deal with the consequences of mental impairment and loss of control of both thought and actions along with the pleasure. Then long after the pleasure has worn off, you have to deal with the consequences of drinking a poisonous substance and the aftermath of the intoxication.
If you truly want to stop drinking, then you will always be in two minds, because the Beast will never want to stop. IT feels you/IT will die without alcohol (there is no division between you and IT from ITs stance). This is where AVRT comes in. You make your Big Plan. That is your stance Iwill never drink again and I will never change my mind . Any suggestion of reversing this stance is Beast activity. You separate yourself from IT. Now you are in one mind, your mind. And by recognizing any thoughts or feelings that suggest drinking, and dismissing them as Beast activity (ie the AV) you will stay in the one mind...yours
In the Rational Recovery book New Cure for Substance Addiction Trimpey describes being addicted to something as being in two minds about using (ie doing something against your better judgement, or a reversal of what you intended to do). This is different from chemical dependence, where you have a dependence on a substance but aren't in two minds, you like doing it and you don't want to stop, whatever the consequences you think it's worth it.
Drinking does have its rewards ( a rush of pleasure and intoxication ) or you wouldn't have kept doing it in the first place. If I gave you a cup of sea water to drink, with only nasty consequences for drinking it, you wouldn't accept another drink of that lol. But you know there are nasty consequences to drinking alcohol as well, just not as immediate. First comes the pleasure (and thats what the Beasts aim is, pleasure, getting that rush of pleasure is the reason IT exists). After IT gets you to deliver that substance, and keep delivering (ITs never satisfied) ITs job is done. But for you it doesn't end there. You have to deal with the consequences of mental impairment and loss of control of both thought and actions along with the pleasure. Then long after the pleasure has worn off, you have to deal with the consequences of drinking a poisonous substance and the aftermath of the intoxication.
If you truly want to stop drinking, then you will always be in two minds, because the Beast will never want to stop. IT feels you/IT will die without alcohol (there is no division between you and IT from ITs stance). This is where AVRT comes in. You make your Big Plan. That is your stance Iwill never drink again and I will never change my mind . Any suggestion of reversing this stance is Beast activity. You separate yourself from IT. Now you are in one mind, your mind. And by recognizing any thoughts or feelings that suggest drinking, and dismissing them as Beast activity (ie the AV) you will stay in the one mind...yours
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Hi Gary.
Thanks again.
I have been struggling the last few days, my AV is on overdrive from when I wake till when I go to bed.
I totally understand about being in two minds as that is exactly how I described it to people, a constant argument in my head- I will drink I won't drink, so exhausting! Unfortunately that has suddenly come back despite me practising separating myself from the beast.
I am scared of making my big plan (even though I do say to myself I will never drink again frequently) in case I lapse then the big plan will never hold any empowerment for me as the beast will of learn't that it can be reversed.
I can feel my resolve sliding away but I am hanging on the edge by my finger nails.
Thanks again.
I have been struggling the last few days, my AV is on overdrive from when I wake till when I go to bed.
I totally understand about being in two minds as that is exactly how I described it to people, a constant argument in my head- I will drink I won't drink, so exhausting! Unfortunately that has suddenly come back despite me practising separating myself from the beast.
I am scared of making my big plan (even though I do say to myself I will never drink again frequently) in case I lapse then the big plan will never hold any empowerment for me as the beast will of learn't that it can be reversed.
I can feel my resolve sliding away but I am hanging on the edge by my finger nails.
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You haven't separated Kaily. The "in two minds" mentality is BEFORE you have made the Big Plan, it's BEFORE you have learnt to recognize the AV for what it is and dismiss ITs suggestions to drink
Arguing is exhausting, thats why in avrt you don't engage with the AV. IT wants to drink. Nothing you say will change that, you can't talk IT out of wanting to drink. You just dismiss the idea that YOU will drink out of hand. Look at your hands, YOU wiggle a finger, now ask IT to wiggle a finger. IT can't IT doesn't have control of your body only you do and if you don't bring the drink, there is no danger of IT getting to drink!
IT is scared of you making a Big Plan, not making a Big Plan is in itself disenpowering, as AVRT rests on your Big Plan.
You are scared of your Beast. IT is nothing to be scared of, what can IT do without your cooperation? Nothing.
The physical urges may be strong in the early days, but they are only urges, they pass. They don't last very long.
You are worried IT will "persuade" you to drink? Don't engage with it, any "persuasion" going on is AV.
You are making it into more than a battle than it needs to be.
You are Kaily, you don't drink....this is Kailys Beast it lives to drink.....
I am Gary, I don't drink...this is my Beast it lives to drink, I won't give IT drink. Gary's Beast thinks he is mean and tries every AV ploy IT can to get drink into Gary. Gary doesn't care what IT does, Gary doesn't drink.
Maybe reading through the AVRT discussion threads can spur you on Kaily?
Arguing is exhausting, thats why in avrt you don't engage with the AV. IT wants to drink. Nothing you say will change that, you can't talk IT out of wanting to drink. You just dismiss the idea that YOU will drink out of hand. Look at your hands, YOU wiggle a finger, now ask IT to wiggle a finger. IT can't IT doesn't have control of your body only you do and if you don't bring the drink, there is no danger of IT getting to drink!
IT is scared of you making a Big Plan, not making a Big Plan is in itself disenpowering, as AVRT rests on your Big Plan.
You are scared of your Beast. IT is nothing to be scared of, what can IT do without your cooperation? Nothing.
The physical urges may be strong in the early days, but they are only urges, they pass. They don't last very long.
You are worried IT will "persuade" you to drink? Don't engage with it, any "persuasion" going on is AV.
You are making it into more than a battle than it needs to be.
You are Kaily, you don't drink....this is Kailys Beast it lives to drink.....
I am Gary, I don't drink...this is my Beast it lives to drink, I won't give IT drink. Gary's Beast thinks he is mean and tries every AV ploy IT can to get drink into Gary. Gary doesn't care what IT does, Gary doesn't drink.
Maybe reading through the AVRT discussion threads can spur you on Kaily?
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What I mean't is that when I was drinking I had the constant argument in my head as everyday I was going to give up in the morning but by afternoons I would be drinking again.
It is this weekend that it has returned and I am aware that it is the beast (addiction) nagging away at me. I do dismiss it but it keeps coming back!
I have been out for a 5 mile walk today which was lovely but as soon as I get home I am tired yet restless. I read through the AVRT threads frequently.
Ho hum least I am not drinking much to the beasts disgust.
Thanks for your support.
It is this weekend that it has returned and I am aware that it is the beast (addiction) nagging away at me. I do dismiss it but it keeps coming back!
I have been out for a 5 mile walk today which was lovely but as soon as I get home I am tired yet restless. I read through the AVRT threads frequently.
Ho hum least I am not drinking much to the beasts disgust.
Thanks for your support.
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Yes, restlessness is part of Beast activity. If you do not deliver to any survival drive (even a bogus one) there will be discomfort. But that wears off with time. If the AV is nagging away, trying to wear you down, just think of it as you would if any other ridiculous idea came into your head. I get the urge when I see people bending down to kick them up the bum. But I instantly dismiss the idea when the urge comes over me 
Was ok to do when I was 6 not so much of a good idea now.
Same with any suggestions from the AV about drinking. It's just something I don't do now.
You will get there Kaily, and it won't be uncomfortable for long
Was ok to do when I was 6 not so much of a good idea now.Same with any suggestions from the AV about drinking. It's just something I don't do now.
You will get there Kaily, and it won't be uncomfortable for long
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Originally Posted by zenchaser
Kailey a big AHA moment for me was realizing that both sides of the internal argument was the AV. YOU don't drink period so there is no reason to entertain either side of the debate.
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When drinking the Beast is getting ITs supply and the AV argues and debates and cajoles ect.. and wears you down to get ITs supply , the strategy works hence the morning to night 'battles'.
Making a BP is the announcement the battles ended. The whining and tantrums may continue but the BP means nothing can come of them.
Nagging kind of has the connotation that there is some argument or way to talk someone into some kind of inevitable action. Your BP means the nagging is really just whining from some little pathetic liar, without ITs supply IT will weaken and slink off. IT can be persistent, but the more you send the AV packing the more You realize it is all bluster and the sillier the whining sounds.
I doubt it's possible to not feel annoyed, but try not to be bothered ,if that makes sense. IT will always be and through the AV will always try, but your BP means the answer is always "No", whether you hear the whining or not. Kind of like white noise, sometimes we tune it in, but mostly if fades into the background, either way just noise. You can do this, heck you are doing it
"Nothing Sucks Forever"
Making a BP is the announcement the battles ended. The whining and tantrums may continue but the BP means nothing can come of them.
Nagging kind of has the connotation that there is some argument or way to talk someone into some kind of inevitable action. Your BP means the nagging is really just whining from some little pathetic liar, without ITs supply IT will weaken and slink off. IT can be persistent, but the more you send the AV packing the more You realize it is all bluster and the sillier the whining sounds.
I doubt it's possible to not feel annoyed, but try not to be bothered ,if that makes sense. IT will always be and through the AV will always try, but your BP means the answer is always "No", whether you hear the whining or not. Kind of like white noise, sometimes we tune it in, but mostly if fades into the background, either way just noise. You can do this, heck you are doing it
"Nothing Sucks Forever"
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Originally Posted by Kaily
Thanks Zenchaser but surely its me saying I won't drink not my AV?
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Hi kaily,
I just wanted to say that any self doubt you have in your ability to stick to your big plan is also AV, any doubt whatsoever. It is totally possible for you to never drink alcohol again. I mean WHY would you ever want to drink alcohol again?
The first month after I made my big plan my av went crazy like yours is at the moment. IT was really intense sometimes, and the lines between me and IT would get blurred, but I would recognise that and would repeat my big plan to myself to get some clarity on what was going on in my mind.
Over the past few moths my av has become weaker. IT is still there and IT pipes up with some kind of B.S. most days. I am getting better at recognising IT and all of the crafty ways it uses to try to get alcohol.
What I'm trying to say is that I know what you are going through, but hang in there, don't give into IT no matter what!! You deserve to have an alcohol free life!
I just wanted to say that any self doubt you have in your ability to stick to your big plan is also AV, any doubt whatsoever. It is totally possible for you to never drink alcohol again. I mean WHY would you ever want to drink alcohol again?
The first month after I made my big plan my av went crazy like yours is at the moment. IT was really intense sometimes, and the lines between me and IT would get blurred, but I would recognise that and would repeat my big plan to myself to get some clarity on what was going on in my mind.
Over the past few moths my av has become weaker. IT is still there and IT pipes up with some kind of B.S. most days. I am getting better at recognising IT and all of the crafty ways it uses to try to get alcohol.
What I'm trying to say is that I know what you are going through, but hang in there, don't give into IT no matter what!! You deserve to have an alcohol free life!
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Originally Posted by Kaily
It is this weekend that it has returned and I am aware that it is the beast (addiction) nagging away at me. I do dismiss it but it keeps coming back!
Sometimes it feels like a back and forth between YOU and IT, but really what's happening is that there is no separation and much of what you think is YOU is actually IT. Like this:
AV: nagnagnaggganag
You: Oh this is awful why won't IT shut up?
AV: See how hard this is?? This is too hard.
You: This is so hard. OMG stoppp I can't take it any more, but I'm going to try not to drink.
AV: No reason to struggle like this...I'm never going to stop. This is how your life will be forever.
You: This is how my life is going to be. This anxiety is killing me. I can't live like this.
There is no separation above. It is an AV circle jerk. Those thoughts aren't YOU.
YOU do not think those things, because YOU are not deprived and it's not hard for YOU. With separation, the same interaction might look more like this:
AV: nagnagnaggganag
You: no response or counter-thought, because it's AV and you don't drink.
AV: See how hard this is?? This is too hard.
You: no response or counter-thought, because it's AV and you don't drink.
AV: No reason to struggle like this...I'm never going to stop. This is how your life will be forever.
You: no response or counter-thought, because it's AV and you don't drink.
I work with young kids and when someone is annoying them, they will turn to them and say, "I'm ignoring you". The annoying kid will ramp up and then the other kid will say, "Stop it!! I'm ignoring you." then, "If you don't stop I'm going to keep ignoring you" lol so far no true ignoring has been going one at all, just engagement, which of course keeps the cycle going.
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