Trying to understand my Alcoholics addiction
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Crazy. They told me I should sell cars, or vacuums door to door. I was a 37F20 when I got out (reclassed from 63B) which they apparently equate to "marketing/sales skills" not sure how you get that from PSYOP, but whatever. I finished the pointless degree program (French Literature) that I had started before I enlisted in 1999 and got a job as a night janitor. I write (in English) during the day while my kids are at school. Livin' the dream!
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Well with a BS in Marketing they could be right. I have a friend (ex Marine) who is making 200k a year working in industrial sensors/equipment sales right now making over six figures.
He has a BS in Marketing from his GI Bill
He has a BS in Marketing from his GI Bill
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I am a terrible salesperson and a natural introvert. I think they got the idea that we "sold" democracy to the Iraqis (epic fail) that it was the same as selling products.
Of course we had a really terrible "product." There is probably more demand for industrial sensors and equipment. Good to hear success stories though.
While we're on the topic of selling, have you tried Alanon, or are you familiar with the program at all?
Of course we had a really terrible "product." There is probably more demand for industrial sensors and equipment. Good to hear success stories though.
While we're on the topic of selling, have you tried Alanon, or are you familiar with the program at all?
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Originally Posted by ladyscribbler 
I am a terrible salesperson and a natural introvert. I think they got the idea that we "sold" democracy to the Iraqis (epic fail) that it was the same as selling products.
Of course we had a really terrible "product." There is probably more demand for industrial sensors and equipment. Good to hear success stories though.
While we're on the topic of selling, have you tried Alanon, or are you familiar with the program at all?
Of course we had a really terrible "product." There is probably more demand for industrial sensors and equipment. Good to hear success stories though.
While we're on the topic of selling, have you tried Alanon, or are you familiar with the program at all?
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I am even seeking counseling through the VA... may as well it is free right... I went last monday and I am going again Tuesday. My mission is getting my life together so i can make a great partner for the right woman hopefully someday soon.
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Honestly the best help i have received so far has been on this site.. i have been to counseling and to an ALANON meeting and for some reason the more i type here and the more i read the anxiety seems to be lifting away like fog off of a lake... it will still take some time I'm sure, some days will be easier than others...
Having been in a relationship with an Alcoholic sure feels like i got a really bad snake bit that took three years to heal and you did not realize you got bit until it was too late!
Her and I did go to counseling for awhile then she just stopped wanting to go all together.. then she started going back with her mother and I felt that it would be inappropriate to go sit in on a mother daughter counseling session... her mother never asked me to go so i chose to give that time to her mother for the two of them... my ex told me after a couple meetings that her counselor told her that me telling her she is an alcoholic is abusive and i need to stop!
Having been in a relationship with an Alcoholic sure feels like i got a really bad snake bit that took three years to heal and you did not realize you got bit until it was too late!
Her and I did go to counseling for awhile then she just stopped wanting to go all together.. then she started going back with her mother and I felt that it would be inappropriate to go sit in on a mother daughter counseling session... her mother never asked me to go so i chose to give that time to her mother for the two of them... my ex told me after a couple meetings that her counselor told her that me telling her she is an alcoholic is abusive and i need to stop!
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I take advantage of VA counseling services, it has been really helpful to me.
I remember my first Alanon meeting. It was a newcomer meeting held at a rehab. I felt so alienated. My ex never once attempted sobriety, so I was sitting there feeling very resentful of all the "lucky ducks" who had someone in rehab, lol. I had no idea the daily work and effort people put into living in long term sobriety and recovery. I thought rehab was a magic bullet that fixed it all.
Where Alanon really helped me was in reframing my perceptions of the world and of my life. It was so easy to blame everything on the alcoholic because it was such a big, obvious problem. That attitude kept me stuck for a really long time. I saw my life and happiness as being contingent on the actions of another person, which made it easy not to take responsibility for my own bad choices.
Different meetings have different vibes. The second meeting I went to really clicked for me and became my home group. I also attend another one on Sat nights (my big night out, lol).
Shop around and try different groups, go for the counseling, spend some quality time on yourself. You're worth the effort.
I remember my first Alanon meeting. It was a newcomer meeting held at a rehab. I felt so alienated. My ex never once attempted sobriety, so I was sitting there feeling very resentful of all the "lucky ducks" who had someone in rehab, lol. I had no idea the daily work and effort people put into living in long term sobriety and recovery. I thought rehab was a magic bullet that fixed it all.
Where Alanon really helped me was in reframing my perceptions of the world and of my life. It was so easy to blame everything on the alcoholic because it was such a big, obvious problem. That attitude kept me stuck for a really long time. I saw my life and happiness as being contingent on the actions of another person, which made it easy not to take responsibility for my own bad choices.
Different meetings have different vibes. The second meeting I went to really clicked for me and became my home group. I also attend another one on Sat nights (my big night out, lol).
Shop around and try different groups, go for the counseling, spend some quality time on yourself. You're worth the effort.
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Hey exparatrooper,
I agree with what many people on here have already suggested. You just need to take care of you. No one deserves physical violence, male or female. It's unacceptable. Plus, if she's even capable of doing that... consider what's possible if the two of you decided to have children.
I think that trying to understand her thinking is a futile thing. Not all alcoholics are the same, so it's hard for a former alcoholic to say what she's thinking. She may already think that the failure of your relationship is her fault. I think that often times people express onto others what is a reflection of themselves, if that makes any sense.
Just my two cents based off of what I've read and my own experience as being the alcoholic:
Look really hard at what you can and cannot control in this situation. Then, ask yourself what it is you want. What would make YOU happy?
In a nutshell, I think it'd be a lot more fruitful for you to focus on yourself and your healing rather than the "why" because you may never understand.
I agree with what many people on here have already suggested. You just need to take care of you. No one deserves physical violence, male or female. It's unacceptable. Plus, if she's even capable of doing that... consider what's possible if the two of you decided to have children.
I think that trying to understand her thinking is a futile thing. Not all alcoholics are the same, so it's hard for a former alcoholic to say what she's thinking. She may already think that the failure of your relationship is her fault. I think that often times people express onto others what is a reflection of themselves, if that makes any sense.
Just my two cents based off of what I've read and my own experience as being the alcoholic:
Look really hard at what you can and cannot control in this situation. Then, ask yourself what it is you want. What would make YOU happy?
In a nutshell, I think it'd be a lot more fruitful for you to focus on yourself and your healing rather than the "why" because you may never understand.
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Originally Posted by Lulupalooza
Hey exparatrooper,
I agree with what many people on here have already suggested. You just need to take care of you. No one deserves physical violence, male or female. It's unacceptable. Plus, if she's even capable of doing that... consider what's possible if the two of you decided to have children.
I think that trying to understand her thinking is a futile thing. Not all alcoholics are the same, so it's hard for a former alcoholic to say what she's thinking. She may already think that the failure of your relationship is her fault. I think that often times people express onto others what is a reflection of themselves, if that makes any sense.
Just my two cents based off of what I've read and my own experience as being the alcoholic:
Look really hard at what you can and cannot control in this situation. Then, ask yourself what it is you want. What would make YOU happy?
In a nutshell, I think it'd be a lot more fruitful for you to focus on yourself and your healing rather than the "why" because you may never understand.
I agree with what many people on here have already suggested. You just need to take care of you. No one deserves physical violence, male or female. It's unacceptable. Plus, if she's even capable of doing that... consider what's possible if the two of you decided to have children.
I think that trying to understand her thinking is a futile thing. Not all alcoholics are the same, so it's hard for a former alcoholic to say what she's thinking. She may already think that the failure of your relationship is her fault. I think that often times people express onto others what is a reflection of themselves, if that makes any sense.
Just my two cents based off of what I've read and my own experience as being the alcoholic:
Look really hard at what you can and cannot control in this situation. Then, ask yourself what it is you want. What would make YOU happy?
In a nutshell, I think it'd be a lot more fruitful for you to focus on yourself and your healing rather than the "why" because you may never understand.
I have a long road ahead of me, I am slowly realizing that what I had I was not happy with and the life I dreamed of did not exist. I am realizing that the woman I loved was the fragments of what may have been a sober her and the rest of the time I was busy playing mr. fixit trying to get that her back, little did I know Mr. Fixit is also an enabler and just prolonger her suffering and mine.
After I met her, looking back into the past, her mother was Mrs. Fixit... because I did not realize my ex was an alcoholic at the time I did know realize her mother was enabling so badly.. bringing her mcdonalds and coffee after she would go on a bender, a case of power aid, insisting i take her to med express to get a doctors excuse for her 4 day drunken binge, giving her rides to work to make sure she got there.. dumping out and looking for bottles... Oh yes all of those duties got handed over to me once I moved in after 3 years of our relationship. When I moved in I did not realize how bad it was until these things started happening, finding bottles in drawers, wrapped up in towels in the linen closet, her gym bag with an empty fifth of liquor in it but missing..... gym clothes, shoes shorts, towel toiletries etc... so early morning gym days must have been sit in the car and drink days... boy was I stupid huh...
You find yourself standing in the middle of this huge mess that you didn't realize was a huge mess... your busy trying to help out but your helping is actually enabling and prolonging the problem further... In my case i did not learn about all of these things until after I walked out for the last time...
I am slowly learning now what happened and possibly why but her family is also very very sick and they think they are not the ones with the problem so why should they have to go to meetings... they are going to find out the hard way that I was not the problem but i will no longer be around to pin the blame on they will have to find someone else this time around.
I truly hope she chooses to stay sober and continue working her steps.... or.....
Hopefully the REHAB facility keeps a bed made for her because she is going to be back.. best case scenario.. worst case scenario.... she will die a horrible lonely woman in agony clutching her bottle of booze in her apartment feeling sorry for herself and mad at the world.
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Wow, it sounds like she has a long line of willing enablers just waiting in the wings to support her dysfunction. That might be part of the True Tragedy here to me, her issues are very external & obvious but theirs are insidious & subtle in a LOT of ways. Unchecked, rampant Codependency can be a nasty thing to behold.
Welcome to the boards, glad you are finding comfort & support here!
Welcome to the boards, glad you are finding comfort & support here!
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Originally Posted by FireSprite
Wow, it sounds like she has a long line of willing enablers just waiting in the wings to support her dysfunction. That might be part of the True Tragedy here to me, her issues are very external & obvious but theirs are insidious & subtle in a LOT of ways. Unchecked, rampant Codependency can be a nasty thing to behold.
Welcome to the boards, glad you are finding comfort & support here!
Welcome to the boards, glad you are finding comfort & support here!
Little did I know her family was also lying her, covering up her past and sweeping things under the rug.
We met online... match.com and the day i met her she in the hospital. At first i was very reluctant to meet her while she was at the hospital for what i was told was "pancreatitis". but she continued to insist that it was ok. I was working at the time and living with my father to help him out since he is getting up there in age and has 4 acres and a 4 bedroom house to take care of. I had a business trip that actually took my by the hospital she was in so i made time to stop in.. I figured well why not do what most people wouldn't do and at least hear her up..
Years later her brother confessed the truth about that hospital visit.. it was not pancreatitis after all it was for alcohol poisoning after a binge. I was informed of this after one of her recent binges that i was around for after we were already engaged. The binges didn't start until after we were engaged at least not to my knowledge because we did not live together until the last six months. It was after i moved in that our relationship went south.. Me and my family suspected something was off but couldn't put our finger on it for years. Sometimes she would slur her speech in the middle of the day. sometimes i swore she smelled like alcohol but couldn't be sure... I never was able to prove it until after I moved in. I was in college at the time using my GI Bill and while she was at work one day i started snooping and bam i started finding bottles everywhere and after that is when our relationship tanked I'm guessing because the cat was out of the bag. then the binges started and then the orders from parents started flying in... get her to work, dump out the bottle, take her credit cards... now I'm in a situation where I'm living with her.. all my stuff is there i can't afford to move out and i was starting a job working from her apartment... so it was the perfect storm i guess which just got worse and worse until i had no choice but to walk out... I did slowly start moving my things in small amounts so i would not spark any arguments and hope she wouldn't notice. during this time i begged her family for rehab and her mother laughed at me infront of her father... so that tells us that they were clearly in denial..
Now i am back at the old mans waiting for the smoke to clear and picking up the pieces of my life. Could i have done things differently... i do not know... do i wish i could have done things differently... yes i do if i had known what i could have done.
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The messed up thing is after we met for the longest time we did what allot of people do.. we went to the club, went to the bar etc... meanwhile her family held this dark secret of their daughters passed and chose not to inform me. All along I'm taking an alcoholic to the last place on earth that they should have been.
I feel like her and her family duped me... her mother has lied to my face about the stay at the hospital... when her brother told me a few years later that is was alcohol poisoning.. so in this case i have an entire family lying to me about their daughter and you have no idea that you are not supposed to believe them. I am not implying that i am perfect but i have never been in a situation where an entire family was so hell bent on covering up their childs problems to rope in a guy for marriage... her mother and my ex both were on me about moving in to her place.. i really did not want to move in with her until i finished college and found a job. I wanted us to get married and buy our own place together so it could be ours.. but i gave in... now i realize what happened mother wanted me to take over mother was tired of catering to her daughters dark big secret called alcoholism.
Her family even started looking for houses for us and she went and picked out her wedding dress everything seemed to good to be true after i moved in... all until i started finding the bottles hidden everywhere and confronted her about it and asked her family about it.. then bam it was a downward spiral from six month to this past july when it exploded.
I feel like her and her family duped me... her mother has lied to my face about the stay at the hospital... when her brother told me a few years later that is was alcohol poisoning.. so in this case i have an entire family lying to me about their daughter and you have no idea that you are not supposed to believe them. I am not implying that i am perfect but i have never been in a situation where an entire family was so hell bent on covering up their childs problems to rope in a guy for marriage... her mother and my ex both were on me about moving in to her place.. i really did not want to move in with her until i finished college and found a job. I wanted us to get married and buy our own place together so it could be ours.. but i gave in... now i realize what happened mother wanted me to take over mother was tired of catering to her daughters dark big secret called alcoholism.
Her family even started looking for houses for us and she went and picked out her wedding dress everything seemed to good to be true after i moved in... all until i started finding the bottles hidden everywhere and confronted her about it and asked her family about it.. then bam it was a downward spiral from six month to this past july when it exploded.
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Sometimes we just don't see until we're ready to see it or until "more is revealed". And it's like you said earlier (I think) - it's a lot harder to really see the situation when you're standing in the middle of it. I always related it to labyrinth.... you're lost when you are inside of the maze but can solve it easily if you are hovering above it, observing in the 3rd person.
That is really, really hard to do when we spend a lot of our time managing our qualifiers' addictions, running from crisis to crisis. I was a complete enabler, as the 1st born to a very active alcohol & drug addict (father) some might argue I was bred for it, unwittingly. My recovery is a work-in-progress, an evolution that just happens between epiphanies throughout life. I have recently come to Accept that my recovery is something that is for life, the way it is for my recovering alcoholic husband. There will never be a time in my life where my recovery becomes irrelevant, it will just keep changing into what I need it to be so long as I keep the focus on me in that respect.
Her family is obviously very vested in their enmeshment, my AF's FOO was like that so much so that I have NC with every single one of them since he passed away. I can't change the mindset of the entire clan & it's not my job to try....but I can choose to stop interacting with it & not allow it to touch my life any further than I am comfortable with.
That is really, really hard to do when we spend a lot of our time managing our qualifiers' addictions, running from crisis to crisis. I was a complete enabler, as the 1st born to a very active alcohol & drug addict (father) some might argue I was bred for it, unwittingly. My recovery is a work-in-progress, an evolution that just happens between epiphanies throughout life. I have recently come to Accept that my recovery is something that is for life, the way it is for my recovering alcoholic husband. There will never be a time in my life where my recovery becomes irrelevant, it will just keep changing into what I need it to be so long as I keep the focus on me in that respect.
Her family is obviously very vested in their enmeshment, my AF's FOO was like that so much so that I have NC with every single one of them since he passed away. I can't change the mindset of the entire clan & it's not my job to try....but I can choose to stop interacting with it & not allow it to touch my life any further than I am comfortable with.
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Now that everything is all said and done.. the ironic thing is the same mother and daughter that were on their new Fiance and future son in law about moving in are now teaming up to pin on the blame... very "sobering" (no pun intended) experience.. it is almost like this is not the first time this has happened. Guy finds out and doesn't want to play their game, mom and daughter just remove him and find another victim.
seems very odd to say the least. After i moved out i got a nasty text from her mother.. "We do not want you in our family" which was very hurtful coming from a person who cried when i asked her and her husbands permission to marry their daughter when they accepted and gave me a huge hug.
seems very odd to say the least. After i moved out i got a nasty text from her mother.. "We do not want you in our family" which was very hurtful coming from a person who cried when i asked her and her husbands permission to marry their daughter when they accepted and gave me a huge hug.
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Originally Posted by FireSprite
Sometimes we just don't see until we're ready to see it or until "more is revealed". And it's like you said earlier (I think) - it's a lot harder to really see the situation when you're standing in the middle of it. I always related it to labyrinth.... you're lost when you are inside of the maze but can solve it easily if you are hovering above it, observing in the 3rd person.
That is really, really hard to do when we spend a lot of our time managing our qualifiers' addictions, running from crisis to crisis. I was a complete enabler, as the 1st born to a very active alcohol & drug addict (father) some might argue I was bred for it, unwittingly. My recovery is a work-in-progress, an evolution that just happens between epiphanies throughout life. I have recently come to Accept that my recovery is something that is for life, the way it is for my recovering alcoholic husband. There will never be a time in my life where my recovery becomes irrelevant, it will just keep changing into what I need it to be so long as I keep the focus on me in that respect.
Her family is obviously very vested in their enmeshment, my AF's FOO was like that so much so that I have NC with every single one of them since he passed away. I can't change the mindset of the entire clan & it's not my job to try....but I can choose to stop interacting with it & not allow it to touch my life any further than I am comfortable with.
That is really, really hard to do when we spend a lot of our time managing our qualifiers' addictions, running from crisis to crisis. I was a complete enabler, as the 1st born to a very active alcohol & drug addict (father) some might argue I was bred for it, unwittingly. My recovery is a work-in-progress, an evolution that just happens between epiphanies throughout life. I have recently come to Accept that my recovery is something that is for life, the way it is for my recovering alcoholic husband. There will never be a time in my life where my recovery becomes irrelevant, it will just keep changing into what I need it to be so long as I keep the focus on me in that respect.
Her family is obviously very vested in their enmeshment, my AF's FOO was like that so much so that I have NC with every single one of them since he passed away. I can't change the mindset of the entire clan & it's not my job to try....but I can choose to stop interacting with it & not allow it to touch my life any further than I am comfortable with.
So now I'm staying there for free other than helping out with groceries and the cell phone bill after i was talked into moving in.. feeling like my god i have no choice but to do what they ask i can't afford to move out...
Ya... one crappy situation. but its over now and life goes on... i am glad i lived and made it through it to be able to share it on here. maybe someone else out there is reading this and seeing that they are not alone and that there are others out there suffering from the effects of someones addiction.
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exparatrooper...you have no idea what stories she may be telling them...and what spin she may be putting on them. The reality is that the family will come down on the side of their child....not always....but, most of the time.
I know that this is very hurtful to your feelings---naturally, it is.
But this is just the harsh reality.
But, let me tell you, paratrooper....these hurts are only paper cuts compared to the sea wall of pain that would come had you married and had k ids with her.
This is short-term pain for long-term gain.
I do have a lot of empathy for your current pain, though.
You might want to take the time to read "Co-dependent No More". I think you would get a lot out of it, right now. You will need this info. in the future, also!
dandylion
I know that this is very hurtful to your feelings---naturally, it is.
But this is just the harsh reality.
But, let me tell you, paratrooper....these hurts are only paper cuts compared to the sea wall of pain that would come had you married and had k ids with her.
This is short-term pain for long-term gain.
I do have a lot of empathy for your current pain, though.
You might want to take the time to read "Co-dependent No More". I think you would get a lot out of it, right now. You will need this info. in the future, also!
dandylion
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Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sweden
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My family was absolutely dysfunctional. There wasn't anyone in my family that wasn't an alcoholic. After a lifetime of it, with alcohol permeating every single fiber of life, my family became consummate masters of adjustment to abnormality.
Things that normal people would be uncomfortable with, to downright horrified with, was just waved away as "nothing" in my family. It's "nothing" was the common reaction.
That could explain the baffling behavior. The way her family just tries to normalize the chaos. Sadly, it is rather common.
To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if there are more problem drinkers in the family.
Things that normal people would be uncomfortable with, to downright horrified with, was just waved away as "nothing" in my family. It's "nothing" was the common reaction.
That could explain the baffling behavior. The way her family just tries to normalize the chaos. Sadly, it is rather common.
To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if there are more problem drinkers in the family.
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 129
Originally Posted by dandylion
exparatrooper...you have no idea what stories she may be telling them...and what spin she may be putting on them. The reality is that the family will come down on the side of their child....not always....but, most of the time.
I know that this is very hurtful to your feelings---naturally, it is.
But this is just the harsh reality.
But, let me tell you, paratrooper....these hurts are only paper cuts compared to the sea wall of pain that would come had you married and had k ids with her.
This is short-term pain for long-term gain.
I do have a lot of empathy for your current pain, though.
You might want to take the time to read "Co-dependent No More". I think you would get a lot out of it, right now. You will need this info. in the future, also!
dandylion
I know that this is very hurtful to your feelings---naturally, it is.
But this is just the harsh reality.
But, let me tell you, paratrooper....these hurts are only paper cuts compared to the sea wall of pain that would come had you married and had k ids with her.
This is short-term pain for long-term gain.
I do have a lot of empathy for your current pain, though.
You might want to take the time to read "Co-dependent No More". I think you would get a lot out of it, right now. You will need this info. in the future, also!
dandylion
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 129
Originally Posted by littlefish
My family was absolutely dysfunctional. There wasn't anyone in my family that wasn't an alcoholic. After a lifetime of it, with alcohol permeating every single fiber of life, my family became consummate masters of adjustment to abnormality.
Things that normal people would be uncomfortable with, to downright horrified with, was just waved away as "nothing" in my family. It's "nothing" was the common reaction.
That could explain the baffling behavior. The way her family just tries to normalize the chaos. Sadly, it is rather common.
To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if there are more problem drinkers in the family.
Things that normal people would be uncomfortable with, to downright horrified with, was just waved away as "nothing" in my family. It's "nothing" was the common reaction.
That could explain the baffling behavior. The way her family just tries to normalize the chaos. Sadly, it is rather common.
To be honest, I wouldn't be surprised if there are more problem drinkers in the family.
So i also believe that her mother is a functional alcoholic... looking back over the years there have been incidents that may be red flags. Mother called my ex and it sounded to me like she was drunk and she was screaming at my ex and put her into tears... and my ex got mad hung up the phone and threw it across the room... i forgot about that happening... so theres a clue i guess.
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