So much resentment towards recovering AH
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Gabe- But just living the sober life is not enough 'making amends'. Hey the alcoholic is living the sober life -1st and formost for himself. And a sober life can still be a lying cheating life. It is a honest open loving giving sober life that would be a great amend. And maybe helping out doing the job jar. Just my opinion. dax
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Dax, no one ever said that just living the sober life is enough.
As a matter of fact, John Bradshaw said "Take the alcohol out of an a$$hole and all you've got is a sober a$$hole."
Living the sober life is a start, and a far sight better than the alternative.
Recovery programs are not just about getting sober, ergo the 12 steps.
Those twelve steps include taking an inventory and making amends.
It's been my observation that for some family members affected by the disease of alcoholism, nothing is ever good enough.
Not sobriety, not apologies, not anything.
And as long as people stay bitter and entrenched in past wrongdoing, nothing will ever BE enough.
As a matter of fact, John Bradshaw said "Take the alcohol out of an a$$hole and all you've got is a sober a$$hole."
Living the sober life is a start, and a far sight better than the alternative.
Recovery programs are not just about getting sober, ergo the 12 steps.
Those twelve steps include taking an inventory and making amends.
It's been my observation that for some family members affected by the disease of alcoholism, nothing is ever good enough.
Not sobriety, not apologies, not anything.
And as long as people stay bitter and entrenched in past wrongdoing, nothing will ever BE enough.
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This is so true. sometimes the damage done is irrepairable. And then it usually means divorce. When children are hurt of course, it can be someimes mean a lifetime of therapy to get over the abuse from the alcoholic.. I find it interesting that a lot of the AA members held in highest regard in our area are often men who are estranged from their family. In being estranged, they now have the time and patience and the wisdom of loved ones lost, to help others see the straight path. This was true of my husband's favorite sponsor- now dead. dax
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Asking another person {who may be still sick themselves,not working on their own recovery}what kind of amends do you want?Can be very harming,.Ive known some alcoholics who have done this.They became door-mats,/hostages,until they stoped.No matter what they did,it just wasn't enough.The non-alcoholic continuing to hold the hammer over the alcoholics head.The alcoholic,pays over and over and over and over,.When does it stop?When the one who is still offened decides?The non-alcoholic plays a part in the family disease,called alcoholism.Have they asked their alcoholic,what kind of amends do you want?How can i ever make up to you my dear alcoholic all the grudges,resentments,anger,etc,,that ive held against you,and treating you badly?The insanity only stops when one is living in recovery program.and the goal is to get weller.Holding grudges,trying to make another,do their amends the way i want it to be made,is ,,well,,what can i say,other than the non-alcoholic is still trying to control yet again,to their own selfish satisfaction.To each their own,...
There is no pain big enough that God can not heal.I say this from my own experience.
Thanks for letting me share,
Im personally sharring this as an alcoholic myself,and also in al-anon too.Im only one,of da many.
There is no pain big enough that God can not heal.I say this from my own experience.
Thanks for letting me share,
Im personally sharring this as an alcoholic myself,and also in al-anon too.Im only one,of da many.
Last edited by Cap3; 09-14-2005 at 06:44 PM. Reason: posts....
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Cap- Well i guess we can agree to really really disagree here. of course moderation is the key. I DO NOT THINK I OWE MY ALCOHOLIC ANY AMEND FOR THE HELL HE PUT ME THRU. HEY HE WAS STONED A GOOD PART OF THE TIME and didn't have a clue how he endangered me and my children- driving them drunk without me realizing he was drinking everyday after work. I would rather see the acoholic having to do too many amends than not enough. But hey alcoholics drunk or sober likes to deny , deny. You alcoholics are so put out if an spoused just doesn't 'turn everything over immediately' so you can move on guilt free- I think this is shirking you resonsibilites -A LOT!!!
I see a very different view in these posts from straight alanon living witrh a drinking spouse and double winners- the DW alweays defending the alcoholic. I guess it boils down to me and my distrust of a program after 27 years a of seeing it work sometimes but crashing a burning its non addicted victims as well.
dax
I see a very different view in these posts from straight alanon living witrh a drinking spouse and double winners- the DW alweays defending the alcoholic. I guess it boils down to me and my distrust of a program after 27 years a of seeing it work sometimes but crashing a burning its non addicted victims as well.
dax
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Originally Posted by Cap3
They became door-mats,/hostages,until they stoped.No matter what they did,it just wasn't enough.The non-alcoholic continuing to hold the hammer over the alcoholics head.
I call it "Not Good Enough Syndrome".
And it lasts as long as the non-alcoholic continues to harbor resentment and continues to sling that sledge hammer labeled "the past".
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Yes and recovery from the abuse an alcoholic has dished out often takes a long long time after years and years of mental,finanical and sometimes physical abuse. Recovering alcoholics want instant forgiveness.. Some very spiritual people can do it. Many can't . And hammer over head is probalby because the action of the alcoholic in reality has cause loss of love and mental well being. And often the abuse continues in the form of' benign neglect as the alcoholic goes to many meetings. dax
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dax you may find this hard to believe,but its true.I understand you.I know where youre at.Ive been there to.Although i am an alcoholic,i didnt know that i was for years,and years.I was a binge drinker.Drank maybe 4-5 times a year.So most of my life i have felt very similar as others here too , other Al-anons.Thats why im here.I can relate.I learn from others here..Ill just say,thinking that it may be helpful.My hub drank for 30 long years.For 20 of those painful years,i was at my wits end.Felt all that you are feeling.Trying to control,yes i did this.I didnt know that i couldnt control,,that i didnt cause this disease,cause,,or that i couldnt cure his disease..So i put the blame on myself,for his drinking.I did eveything that i could to make him stop drinking.And gave myself reason to drink myself,.I wont go any further here.All i know dax is that i hurt so very deeply,inside that i was desperate for help.When i came to Al-anon,which was my first recovery program i came with the intentions to change him.Until i actually started to learn more of what this program is about.And its about my own recovery.Willing and desperate enough i embeded these recovery programs.They work when i work them.I didnt want to be in pain anymore,Not the kind of pain that i was suffereing at that time.I was in programs 10 years before hub came to recovery,through the grace of God.And yea,even with so much program that i was doing,i too,though that when he made his amends,,thats it?Thats all these is?But knew that nothing will ever change the past,ever.Cant go back,so go forward.I needed to work on my own recovery with this.Because im alcoholic,does not mean that i never have been hurt by others,and that i never felt this pain.I have prayed for God to help me with the pain another has caused me.I want to be free of all this stuff,that keeps me into the sickness.Only God can heal the soul,that hurts.No human can do this no matter what they try to do to make amends.The pain is so deep.Its a place only God can go into.
Thanks for letting me share,
Go in peace dax,
God Bless,and take care!!!!!!
Thanks for letting me share,
Go in peace dax,
God Bless,and take care!!!!!!
Last edited by Cap3; 09-15-2005 at 07:44 AM. Reason: adding
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I realized early on that my husband was an alcoholic. Why ?????because he hated to make waves and start a fight and each time he went out for one drink and was out for 8 or 10 hours, he knew a big fight would happen. So I reaized he was addicted -but also up to him to get help. I called alanon, they directed me to a chapter 9 meeting, I asked him to go[but would have gone by myself}. He went, ytook a chip and has been sober 27 years. We had many good years early in sobriety, I so loved and trusted all that was AA and alanon that the affair ,covered up by going to meetings ,went on for a long time. So no I do not trust the program -for me myself absolutly never again trust program people.
And I still say-the recovering alcoholic whines a lot if he or she is not immediately forgiven for all the crap they have done. I see so many people here with newly recovered spouses- the spouse in recovery dumping them for a program person. AA is for the recovering drunk only- no care to the family left behind. I have seen it all in the last 27 years.
Cap- I am happy you have found peace. I am sorry- I now see AA as a closed group with almost cult like devotion by some members. I can not tell you how many times I have heard AA and alanoners belittle 'normal' non program people in the chapter 9 meetings here in Houston. I won't go anymore- it was so upsetting. dax
And I still say-the recovering alcoholic whines a lot if he or she is not immediately forgiven for all the crap they have done. I see so many people here with newly recovered spouses- the spouse in recovery dumping them for a program person. AA is for the recovering drunk only- no care to the family left behind. I have seen it all in the last 27 years.
Cap- I am happy you have found peace. I am sorry- I now see AA as a closed group with almost cult like devotion by some members. I can not tell you how many times I have heard AA and alanoners belittle 'normal' non program people in the chapter 9 meetings here in Houston. I won't go anymore- it was so upsetting. dax
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It's been my observation that for some family members affected by the disease of alcoholism, nothing is ever good enough.
Not sobriety, not apologies, not anything.
And as long as people stay bitter and entrenched in past wrongdoing, nothing will ever BE enough.
Not sobriety, not apologies, not anything.
And as long as people stay bitter and entrenched in past wrongdoing, nothing will ever BE enough.
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Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Canada
Posts: 727
Hi again Dax,ive heard this to,where the recovering folks,belittle normal,non-program people.Yes it happens.Don't really know why,.Ive always understood,when referring to normal,that it was in reference to normal drinking,not people.Folks that are not going for recovery help,also have issues in their lives,and will seek out some form of help.Even just talking issues over with a good friend.
We do not wish to shut the doors on our past.We use our past as a tool to help other recoverying folks.This is true for both programs.Making amends over and over,staying in the guilt/remorse is damaging.Not only to the alcoholic.But the non- alcoholic as well.This only keeps them both in the pain.,misrery,in the sickenss.Both of them.Damaging to both,not healing to either.As you know this yourself.No matter what hub does,your still in pain.My part,your part.I make my amends.If another doesnt except this,this is not my part.This belongs to them.They own this.Their own issues within themselves.And,if we both stay in the issues,there is no healing.And the painful pasts,,grows,,and grows,,and is much bigger than it was to begin with.Because another has decided to stay in pain,does not mean that i will continue to feel guilty.Its not healthy.Again for both of us.And will change nothing.Me being controled,and them controling me.No.The sickness must stop at some point.Ask the non-program folks.They will say the same too.There is a time to let go,of all of it.These recovery programs helps all of us who hurt,.And we can recover.Dax,my dear,your human,and also have skeltons in da closet,too.Have you made amends to your hub.Not for what he has done to you.You dont own this,he does.But what you have done to him.Your part.This,is what will help you to heal.Not getting another to do anything.I have hurt others.Others have hurt me badly too.I chose recovery for my life.Humans cannot heal your kind of pain.They couldnt heal mine,either.God could and would if He were sought.Today my healing is not dependant on another.My healing is totally dependant on my relationship with God.
Thanks for letting me share,
God Bless,and take care!!!!!!!!
We do not wish to shut the doors on our past.We use our past as a tool to help other recoverying folks.This is true for both programs.Making amends over and over,staying in the guilt/remorse is damaging.Not only to the alcoholic.But the non- alcoholic as well.This only keeps them both in the pain.,misrery,in the sickenss.Both of them.Damaging to both,not healing to either.As you know this yourself.No matter what hub does,your still in pain.My part,your part.I make my amends.If another doesnt except this,this is not my part.This belongs to them.They own this.Their own issues within themselves.And,if we both stay in the issues,there is no healing.And the painful pasts,,grows,,and grows,,and is much bigger than it was to begin with.Because another has decided to stay in pain,does not mean that i will continue to feel guilty.Its not healthy.Again for both of us.And will change nothing.Me being controled,and them controling me.No.The sickness must stop at some point.Ask the non-program folks.They will say the same too.There is a time to let go,of all of it.These recovery programs helps all of us who hurt,.And we can recover.Dax,my dear,your human,and also have skeltons in da closet,too.Have you made amends to your hub.Not for what he has done to you.You dont own this,he does.But what you have done to him.Your part.This,is what will help you to heal.Not getting another to do anything.I have hurt others.Others have hurt me badly too.I chose recovery for my life.Humans cannot heal your kind of pain.They couldnt heal mine,either.God could and would if He were sought.Today my healing is not dependant on another.My healing is totally dependant on my relationship with God.
Thanks for letting me share,
God Bless,and take care!!!!!!!!
Last edited by Cap3; 09-16-2005 at 05:12 AM. Reason: post
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Well I wil trust in God for my recovery. but get it thru you head- some people just reject thed AA and alanon program. To you- it is my loss. To me - my gain . I am rejecting thw 12 steps - let it rest. As far amaking amends to my husbamnd- I think not. I treated him with love, respect and honesty and fidelity. The bad crap he did to me is so one sided, I am not going to go wringing my hands about if I shoudl make an amend to him. I really had made him a low priority. dax
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OMG.... I have to give you BOTH a big THANK YOU!
You have soooo opened my eyes to something I have not been understanding.
Mr. R was married for 31 years. He has been sober for 20 of those years so in his marriage there was 11 years of his drinking and being an A. We have talked and talked and he has tried to explain to me the difference. He has been very honest about what he did when he was drinking, and it was not pretty... he hurt her VERY much and I could totally understand her pain.
They are divorced now, and he has not one regret in his divorce. She is still struggling with it and sending letters about how God will defend the people wronged and basically he will burn in hell.
I was struggling with a trust issue, how can you walk away from someone after 31 years of marriage and know for sure that your done with it. How could he think to committ to me if he could walk away from that??
Cap you just gave me the lightbulb moment. She never recovered from what happened 20 years ago, she still holds the resentments, anger and hurt and he has had a hammer to his head trying to repair what was not his issue. I personally have watched over the last 2 years what he has done to please her, the changes in his life that he went through because she thought that is what he needed to do, I watched last year when they seperated and his struggle to figure out what else he could do, his pain at being a failure in fixing this... but it was not his to fix. For 20 years he walked the walk..... but if both dont have recovery... and it does not matter if its AA/Al-anon or counceling or church... it will still fall apart.
I get it now.
You have soooo opened my eyes to something I have not been understanding.
Mr. R was married for 31 years. He has been sober for 20 of those years so in his marriage there was 11 years of his drinking and being an A. We have talked and talked and he has tried to explain to me the difference. He has been very honest about what he did when he was drinking, and it was not pretty... he hurt her VERY much and I could totally understand her pain.
They are divorced now, and he has not one regret in his divorce. She is still struggling with it and sending letters about how God will defend the people wronged and basically he will burn in hell.
I was struggling with a trust issue, how can you walk away from someone after 31 years of marriage and know for sure that your done with it. How could he think to committ to me if he could walk away from that??
Cap you just gave me the lightbulb moment. She never recovered from what happened 20 years ago, she still holds the resentments, anger and hurt and he has had a hammer to his head trying to repair what was not his issue. I personally have watched over the last 2 years what he has done to please her, the changes in his life that he went through because she thought that is what he needed to do, I watched last year when they seperated and his struggle to figure out what else he could do, his pain at being a failure in fixing this... but it was not his to fix. For 20 years he walked the walk..... but if both dont have recovery... and it does not matter if its AA/Al-anon or counceling or church... it will still fall apart.
I get it now.
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Cynay- Well if she was still mad at stuff he did 20 years ago, the marriages is certainly. best over. From what you wrote, it sounds like you were close to this man while he was still married. I hope this is not so. dax
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I was close to him while he was still married, I know his ex wife as well.
Mr. R and my ex-abf were pretty good friends for a long time. One of his ex-wifes issues was Mr. R's friendship with my ex-abf, she just did not like him, could not give a reason why, but decided that they could not be friends anymore. She is so angry with him still for the affairs, drinking, hardtimes back then it does not seem to matter what he has done the last 20 years to make it right.... NOTHING PLEASES HER... of course its her choice, she is choosing not to heal and to hang on to all that hurt and anger.
When my ex-abf and I broke up he talked with me about how an A thinks etc... again like I said we were friends... Then when he and his ex-wife seperated and filed for a divorce (she did not want this) we started to do things together, movies, drives etc... we could both talk about what happened and the hurt ... how it ended up the way it did etc... We actually started dating (romantic) about a month ago, and yep it was quite a suprise to me, after all this was my good friend not to mention he is an A and I was NEVER going down that path again. Guess life is what happens while Im making other plans... I have to remember who is in control.
See I have struggled to allow myself to get close, I did not trust that he was not rebounding etc... that it was really over for him. But this thread has really opened my eyes to how deep the anger can go, how distructive it can be for both the A and for the codi... and how it can completly distroy a marriage, even one with that much time in it, when a person does not let go .... trust that the person has the wounds inside from what they did and forgive... it will just continue to errode the heart/soul of what could be an amazing relationship. Mr. R has seperated from his wife at least once a year for 4 years now.... this last time he did not bat an eyelash.... He was done being beat up by his ex. Now Im pretty sure his ex thinks I was the other women, she is pretty blinded by anger and hate.... and Im sure others that have nothing better to do will come up with stories too.... But it does not matter, I and Mr. R know the truth and have no guilt about anything.
Im just as guilty of that hate/anger toward my ex-abf, though I think with everyone here and Ala-non and alot of talking I dont hate him anymore but I stuggle to have compassion for him... He stuck a knife in my heart and then twisted it MANY times over... Im guessing but I think he probably had a total of 4 (maybe more) affairs in the last year of our relationship... and the last one was a girl he met at AA. I hated AA/Al-anon for that too, how dare they not tell me .... I knew some of the same people. But you know what they would not be in AA if they were not sick, not to mention that I had clues and choose not to look at it. It did not matter if he was in AA or not, he would have cheated.
One thing I do know for sure is............ I dont want to look back and be Mr. R's ex. I dont want to live hating, hurting and not being able to forgive. I dont want to relive that relationship and the pain all the time. I need to work on forgiving my ex because you know what.... Im sure I have been forgiven alot too. I want what Mr. R is offering and because of this post Im feeling safer in taking hold of his hand... He has already paid the price for being and A, and he is ready to be joyous, happy and free ... he is ready for a loving, healthy relationship.
I guess the hammer is burried now. Its sad it happened that way, but I will not look the other way when Im given such a gift.
NO Im not the other women, we did not have an affair BUT I am hopefully the one that will reap the rewards of a man who chooses soberity and life over this disease.
Mr. R and my ex-abf were pretty good friends for a long time. One of his ex-wifes issues was Mr. R's friendship with my ex-abf, she just did not like him, could not give a reason why, but decided that they could not be friends anymore. She is so angry with him still for the affairs, drinking, hardtimes back then it does not seem to matter what he has done the last 20 years to make it right.... NOTHING PLEASES HER... of course its her choice, she is choosing not to heal and to hang on to all that hurt and anger.
When my ex-abf and I broke up he talked with me about how an A thinks etc... again like I said we were friends... Then when he and his ex-wife seperated and filed for a divorce (she did not want this) we started to do things together, movies, drives etc... we could both talk about what happened and the hurt ... how it ended up the way it did etc... We actually started dating (romantic) about a month ago, and yep it was quite a suprise to me, after all this was my good friend not to mention he is an A and I was NEVER going down that path again. Guess life is what happens while Im making other plans... I have to remember who is in control.
See I have struggled to allow myself to get close, I did not trust that he was not rebounding etc... that it was really over for him. But this thread has really opened my eyes to how deep the anger can go, how distructive it can be for both the A and for the codi... and how it can completly distroy a marriage, even one with that much time in it, when a person does not let go .... trust that the person has the wounds inside from what they did and forgive... it will just continue to errode the heart/soul of what could be an amazing relationship. Mr. R has seperated from his wife at least once a year for 4 years now.... this last time he did not bat an eyelash.... He was done being beat up by his ex. Now Im pretty sure his ex thinks I was the other women, she is pretty blinded by anger and hate.... and Im sure others that have nothing better to do will come up with stories too.... But it does not matter, I and Mr. R know the truth and have no guilt about anything.
Im just as guilty of that hate/anger toward my ex-abf, though I think with everyone here and Ala-non and alot of talking I dont hate him anymore but I stuggle to have compassion for him... He stuck a knife in my heart and then twisted it MANY times over... Im guessing but I think he probably had a total of 4 (maybe more) affairs in the last year of our relationship... and the last one was a girl he met at AA. I hated AA/Al-anon for that too, how dare they not tell me .... I knew some of the same people. But you know what they would not be in AA if they were not sick, not to mention that I had clues and choose not to look at it. It did not matter if he was in AA or not, he would have cheated.
One thing I do know for sure is............ I dont want to look back and be Mr. R's ex. I dont want to live hating, hurting and not being able to forgive. I dont want to relive that relationship and the pain all the time. I need to work on forgiving my ex because you know what.... Im sure I have been forgiven alot too. I want what Mr. R is offering and because of this post Im feeling safer in taking hold of his hand... He has already paid the price for being and A, and he is ready to be joyous, happy and free ... he is ready for a loving, healthy relationship.
I guess the hammer is burried now. Its sad it happened that way, but I will not look the other way when Im given such a gift.
NO Im not the other women, we did not have an affair BUT I am hopefully the one that will reap the rewards of a man who chooses soberity and life over this disease.
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Well there are emotional affairs and you had one. You are very likely the reason , the marriage finally broke UP. He gets divorce AFTER meeting and sharing with you. I gather you met him at an AA? meeting ?? This is just another example of two 12 steppers getting too close.. I am sure the wife has another side to the story. the truth is probably inbetween. Enter at your own risk. You have an ex wife who considers you the ow. And an recoverd alcoholic boyfriend- number 2 at least. Good luck - you are going to need it. It is upseting to me to hear you rationize how this happend and that God was in control. You are in denial here. dax
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Funny Dax...
I don't read it that way at all..Cynay has been sharing since she joined all about her exABF..how much she loved him etc..
she never once mentioned this new guy..
You should stop jumping to conclusions..
I don't read it that way at all..Cynay has been sharing since she joined all about her exABF..how much she loved him etc..
she never once mentioned this new guy..
You should stop jumping to conclusions..
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: houston, tx
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Minx-"Now Im pretty sure his ex thinks I was the other women, she is pretty blinded by anger and hate.... and Im sure others that have nothing better to do will come up with stories too...". " I was close to him while he was still married, I know his ex wife as well. "I was stunned.. read what she has to say. She was 'sharing with him "while he was still married. I am sure the exwife is really pissed. 30 years of marriage- probably not a too good one but cheating men lie so who knows.- he files for divorce and has Cynay on his arm. Another marriage shot down from man sharing with woman in 12 step program. Where are those all men all woman meetings??? dax
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Dax,
Your anger and hatred are blinding you..Where do you read that she met him in an AA meeting? She met him because she and exABF were friends when they were a couple..and she apparently remained friends after..
So Dax you are assuming that because she said "close" it meant she was having an affair - either physical or emotional?
You are once again taking your anger on your situation out on someone else on this board..
Sure his exwife is blaming Cynay..She doesn't want to look at herself..Cynay also states that Mr. Romance has separated from his wife at least once a year in the past 4 years..Hmm..considering in her other posts Cynay was with her exabf for only two years - I guess she was responsible for that too.
I am really sorry you are still angry and bitter Dax..but it is your choice..
I've had a lot of crap in my life happen to me too..had men cheat on me etc..but I'm not bitter or angry..because it is a miserable place to be..
My mother is angry bitter and alone at 62..She could never forgive my dad (who was not an alcoholic) for the mistakes he made..she refused to accept ANY responsibility for the marriage...it was all his fault..she liked to blame my (now step-mother) for the dissolution of the marriage..I supposed it is her fault too?
Nope..blame resides equally on both my mother and dad for letting the marriage fail..my dad is in a happier place, my mother on the other hand is still miserable..
it's been close to 10 years since the divorce.
I hope one day Dax you can find it in your heart to heal and get better..
Your anger and hatred are blinding you..Where do you read that she met him in an AA meeting? She met him because she and exABF were friends when they were a couple..and she apparently remained friends after..
So Dax you are assuming that because she said "close" it meant she was having an affair - either physical or emotional?
You are once again taking your anger on your situation out on someone else on this board..
Sure his exwife is blaming Cynay..She doesn't want to look at herself..Cynay also states that Mr. Romance has separated from his wife at least once a year in the past 4 years..Hmm..considering in her other posts Cynay was with her exabf for only two years - I guess she was responsible for that too.
I am really sorry you are still angry and bitter Dax..but it is your choice..
I've had a lot of crap in my life happen to me too..had men cheat on me etc..but I'm not bitter or angry..because it is a miserable place to be..
My mother is angry bitter and alone at 62..She could never forgive my dad (who was not an alcoholic) for the mistakes he made..she refused to accept ANY responsibility for the marriage...it was all his fault..she liked to blame my (now step-mother) for the dissolution of the marriage..I supposed it is her fault too?
Nope..blame resides equally on both my mother and dad for letting the marriage fail..my dad is in a happier place, my mother on the other hand is still miserable..
it's been close to 10 years since the divorce.
I hope one day Dax you can find it in your heart to heal and get better..
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Wow Dax... you are So off the mark.
I have to say from the bottom of my heart. Im sorry your in so much pain, it seems to me you are reflexting your marriage and emotions onto me.
She probably does think Im the other women. Most women that can not be accountable for their part in the problem look to other people to blame... for his ex Im an easy escape goat.
1. We have been friends over 2 years. Just like Im friends with many people, we talked about his divorcing her over a year ago... THE 3 OF US, Me, Mr. R and my ex-abf. Before he seperated and signed divorce papers we talked ... but it was by no means an emotional affair. If that is what you call an emotional affair then Im and everyone in counceling, AA or Al-anon is having one... and most of the people in Al-anon are women.
2. The statement of being blinded by anger and hate is because she hates him... for something he did 20 years ago that she cant get over. I will tell you what... if you hold that much anger and hate in your heart for that long its sure to blind you to everything else too. She lost her husband because she could not forgive him. Im sure there was alot more that went on in the marriage as well.. BUT she sure as hell did not lose him because of me. That is not mine to own.
3. I was close to him when he was married... he come to my home talking to us about his marriage... We also all went to dinner, bowling, a few times.. yes I know his ex-wife but she was never as open with us as he was. That comes from him being friends with my ex-abf... of spending time in OUR home. He is and was a friend.
4. I was stunned.... I did not think about him in that manner and he did not think about me that way either... I was stunned to see how much we have in common and well we communicate and how fun he is .. just never thought about him that way. I was also stunned because I did not think I would date another A.... even though he has 20 years sober and is healthy. I find it truely amazing that you can find this kind of companionship especially when it grows from a friendship.
5. WHERE DID YOU GET THE IDEA THIS IS PART OF A 12 STEP PROGRAM?????? I cant say this enough for you. He is a friend of my ex-abf, that is who I met him through. NOT AA or Al-anon. He does not currently attend AA unless there is something special going on, or a friend has a B-day there.
That is where I think you are projecting your hurt from your marriage onto me. That is what happened to YOU. Not what happened to his EX. We did not get together while they were still together.... He did cheat on her but that was 20 YEARS AGO.
I have to say from the bottom of my heart. Im sorry your in so much pain, it seems to me you are reflexting your marriage and emotions onto me.
She probably does think Im the other women. Most women that can not be accountable for their part in the problem look to other people to blame... for his ex Im an easy escape goat.
1. We have been friends over 2 years. Just like Im friends with many people, we talked about his divorcing her over a year ago... THE 3 OF US, Me, Mr. R and my ex-abf. Before he seperated and signed divorce papers we talked ... but it was by no means an emotional affair. If that is what you call an emotional affair then Im and everyone in counceling, AA or Al-anon is having one... and most of the people in Al-anon are women.
2. The statement of being blinded by anger and hate is because she hates him... for something he did 20 years ago that she cant get over. I will tell you what... if you hold that much anger and hate in your heart for that long its sure to blind you to everything else too. She lost her husband because she could not forgive him. Im sure there was alot more that went on in the marriage as well.. BUT she sure as hell did not lose him because of me. That is not mine to own.
3. I was close to him when he was married... he come to my home talking to us about his marriage... We also all went to dinner, bowling, a few times.. yes I know his ex-wife but she was never as open with us as he was. That comes from him being friends with my ex-abf... of spending time in OUR home. He is and was a friend.
4. I was stunned.... I did not think about him in that manner and he did not think about me that way either... I was stunned to see how much we have in common and well we communicate and how fun he is .. just never thought about him that way. I was also stunned because I did not think I would date another A.... even though he has 20 years sober and is healthy. I find it truely amazing that you can find this kind of companionship especially when it grows from a friendship.
5. WHERE DID YOU GET THE IDEA THIS IS PART OF A 12 STEP PROGRAM?????? I cant say this enough for you. He is a friend of my ex-abf, that is who I met him through. NOT AA or Al-anon. He does not currently attend AA unless there is something special going on, or a friend has a B-day there.
That is where I think you are projecting your hurt from your marriage onto me. That is what happened to YOU. Not what happened to his EX. We did not get together while they were still together.... He did cheat on her but that was 20 YEARS AGO.
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