Hes starting AA-I dont want him to
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
I completely agree. I think recovery has to be selfish. I don't know the solution to the frustration for those who love the addict, but I do know that is a time to be selfish, IF YOU ARE TRULY WORKING RECOVERY. For my XAH, he was not working recovery while being selfish, so that's something else entirely.
Originally Posted by tomsteve 
something i heard early on:
i had to be selfish and fix me before i could be selfless and help others.
i had to be selfish and fix me before i could be selfless and help others.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by hopeful4
I completely agree. I think recovery has to be selfish. I don't know the solution to the frustration for those who love the addict, but I do know that is a time to be selfish,.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 49
My husband came out if rehab almost 2 weeks ago and instead of coming bqck to me and his 3 young children, he is staying with his mum. I felt so hurt and thought my marriage has ended (he still doesn't know anyrhijg about anything so it might well be but stay positive). Since then I've been on this forum and Al Anon. I've done loads of research about alcoholics in early recovery and they all say the same. They have to be selfish, their life is hell after rehab. Their life has been turned upside down and they need to rebuild it. They are also scared for everything and mostly about relapse.
I've learned not to contact him, to let him do what he needs to do. He is doing AA, after care meetings and has a Sponsor. He is doing what he should be doing.
Don't get me wrong. The week after next he will return to work and I am very anxious about what will happen then.....where does his family fit in with work and AA and other meetings? I don't know but my husband has to concentrate now in order for recovery to be succesful.
I hope this helps a little.
I've learned not to contact him, to let him do what he needs to do. He is doing AA, after care meetings and has a Sponsor. He is doing what he should be doing.
Don't get me wrong. The week after next he will return to work and I am very anxious about what will happen then.....where does his family fit in with work and AA and other meetings? I don't know but my husband has to concentrate now in order for recovery to be succesful.
I hope this helps a little.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 681
That's just devastating. Its so hurtful that they have to be so selfish to recover. I can't wrap my mind around it. Honestly, I think after they quit drinking, it hurts more than when they were. I've been thinking about you all day, and I hope you can get what you want, need and deserve.
Originally Posted by Dutchy36
My husband came out if rehab almost 2 weeks ago and instead of coming bqck to me and his 3 young children, he is staying with his mum. I felt so hurt and thought my marriage has ended (he still doesn't know anyrhijg about anything so it might well be but stay positive). Since then I've been on this forum and Al Anon. I've done loads of research about alcoholics in early recovery and they all say the same. They have to be selfish, their life is hell after rehab. Their life has been turned upside down and they need to rebuild it. They are also scared for everything and mostly about relapse.
I've learned not to contact him, to let him do what he needs to do. He is doing AA, after care meetings and has a Sponsor. He is doing what he should be doing.
Don't get me wrong. The week after next he will return to work and I am very anxious about what will happen then.....where does his family fit in with work and AA and other meetings? I don't know but my husband has to concentrate now in order for recovery to be succesful.
I hope this helps a little.
I've learned not to contact him, to let him do what he needs to do. He is doing AA, after care meetings and has a Sponsor. He is doing what he should be doing.
Don't get me wrong. The week after next he will return to work and I am very anxious about what will happen then.....where does his family fit in with work and AA and other meetings? I don't know but my husband has to concentrate now in order for recovery to be succesful.
I hope this helps a little.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,966
Originally Posted by Wamama48
That's just devastating. Its so hurtful that they have to be so selfish to recover. I can't wrap my mind around it. Honestly, I think after they quit drinking, it hurts more than when they were. I've been thinking about you all day, and I hope you can get what you want, need and deserve.
Member
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Sherman Oaks, CA
Posts: 123
Hello Wamama48,
Wow thank you for your post, I never thought or identified things the way you did. I have just recently been though the exact experience you fear. My exab went into treatment and from the first day it became all about him and his selfish self-seeking interests which had 0 to do with giving me any attention or reassurance.
What I know is that people really working a program in AA don't do that. They teach honestly and responsibility. Unfortunately my guy left his home group with that approach and joined another which is more about showing off and using recovery as an excuse to not face your wreckage or deal with me in anyway except if I praise his efforts to stay sober. So it's a tricky, I've seen AA save lots of lives, I have also seen people use it it act out in other addictions.
Like the other posts say, we can focus on our own recovery and make our own retreat. I did that in Dec/Jan, really slept and detached, took care of me. This prepared me to let go recently. I needed that time, take some for yourself in anyway you can.
Hugs
Wow thank you for your post, I never thought or identified things the way you did. I have just recently been though the exact experience you fear. My exab went into treatment and from the first day it became all about him and his selfish self-seeking interests which had 0 to do with giving me any attention or reassurance.
What I know is that people really working a program in AA don't do that. They teach honestly and responsibility. Unfortunately my guy left his home group with that approach and joined another which is more about showing off and using recovery as an excuse to not face your wreckage or deal with me in anyway except if I praise his efforts to stay sober. So it's a tricky, I've seen AA save lots of lives, I have also seen people use it it act out in other addictions.
Like the other posts say, we can focus on our own recovery and make our own retreat. I did that in Dec/Jan, really slept and detached, took care of me. This prepared me to let go recently. I needed that time, take some for yourself in anyway you can.
Hugs
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 681
I was hesitant to post what I did because I know many here have been very successful with AA. But I've learned here that feelings are feelings, and a lot of the time you don't get to choose them. Never in my life have I seen something that makes a person so selfish. It blows me away. It sounds like you are fine with your decision. You sound confident and ok. It must have been heartbreaking when he just stayed selfish and unapologetic. Thank you for sharing. Its encouraging to see someone who came through it, survived, and is doing well.
Wow thank you for your post, I never thought or identified things the way you did. I have just recently been though the exact experience you fear. My exab went into treatment and from the first day it became all about him and his selfish self-seeking interests which had 0 to do with giving me any attention or reassurance.
What I know is that people really working a program in AA don't do that. They teach honestly and responsibility. Unfortunately my guy left his home group with that approach and joined another which is more about showing off and using recovery as an excuse to not face your wreckage or deal with me in anyway except if I praise his efforts to stay sober. So it's a tricky, I've seen AA save lots of lives, I have also seen people use it it act out in other addictions.
Like the other posts say, we can focus on our own recovery and make our own retreat. I did that in Dec/Jan, really slept and detached, took care of me. This prepared me to let go recently. I needed that time, take some for yourself in anyway you can.
Hugs[/QUOTE]
Wow thank you for your post, I never thought or identified things the way you did. I have just recently been though the exact experience you fear. My exab went into treatment and from the first day it became all about him and his selfish self-seeking interests which had 0 to do with giving me any attention or reassurance.
What I know is that people really working a program in AA don't do that. They teach honestly and responsibility. Unfortunately my guy left his home group with that approach and joined another which is more about showing off and using recovery as an excuse to not face your wreckage or deal with me in anyway except if I praise his efforts to stay sober. So it's a tricky, I've seen AA save lots of lives, I have also seen people use it it act out in other addictions.
Like the other posts say, we can focus on our own recovery and make our own retreat. I did that in Dec/Jan, really slept and detached, took care of me. This prepared me to let go recently. I needed that time, take some for yourself in anyway you can.
Hugs[/QUOTE]
Member
Join Date: May 2015
Location: Sherman Oaks, CA
Posts: 123
The Family Afterward?
Originally Posted by tomsteve
Why don't I want him to go to AA? I've read on this forum, and others, and research on the internet, and a few people we know who went through AA, they pretty much have to ignore everything else in life to concentrate on staying sober. And yea I know, don't believe everything you read on the internet. That's why I also talked to real live people.
now toss out everything youve read and researched and read what THE program of AA says. you will find the EXACT FACTS of what THE program says in the big book of alcoholics anonymous. heres a few snippets:
Since the home has suffered more than anything else, it is well that a man exert himself there. He is not likely to get far in any direction if he fails to show unselfishness and love under his own roof. We know there are difficult wives and families, but the man who is getting over alcoholism must remember he did much to make them so.
At the very beginning, the couple ought to frankly face the fact that each will have to yield here and there if the family is going to play an effective part in the new life. Father will necessarily spend much time with other alcoholics, but this activity should be balanced.
None of us makes a sole vocation of this work, nor do we think its effectiveness would be increased if we did. We feel that elimination of our drinking is but a beginning. A much more important demonstration of our principles lies before us in our respective homes, occupations and affairs. All of us spend much of our spare time in the sort of effort which we are going to describe.
They can just suck it up and deal with real life while they recover like the rest of us have to do
wamama, how are you dealing with life? arent you here receiving support?
He will, mark my words, get totally immersed in this in an unhealthy way.
his drinking was unheatlhy and now what hes doing for recovery is unheatlhy?
for the last month hes done nothing but be kind and respectful, listens to my rages, and in general is trying to make it up
but then say
If he ignores us any longer, I will call it quits
wamama, recovery is extremely early for both of you. 18 years of this isnt going to mysteriously,miraculously be resolved in 1 month. theres probably not gonna be sparkle fartin unicorns under rainbows in a field of daisies for a while. if there ever is.
you work on you, him work on him, and maybe even both of ya's workin on communication( ya's may not even know how to do that)- who knows. maybe good stuff will happen.
now toss out everything youve read and researched and read what THE program of AA says. you will find the EXACT FACTS of what THE program says in the big book of alcoholics anonymous. heres a few snippets:
Since the home has suffered more than anything else, it is well that a man exert himself there. He is not likely to get far in any direction if he fails to show unselfishness and love under his own roof. We know there are difficult wives and families, but the man who is getting over alcoholism must remember he did much to make them so.
At the very beginning, the couple ought to frankly face the fact that each will have to yield here and there if the family is going to play an effective part in the new life. Father will necessarily spend much time with other alcoholics, but this activity should be balanced.
None of us makes a sole vocation of this work, nor do we think its effectiveness would be increased if we did. We feel that elimination of our drinking is but a beginning. A much more important demonstration of our principles lies before us in our respective homes, occupations and affairs. All of us spend much of our spare time in the sort of effort which we are going to describe.
They can just suck it up and deal with real life while they recover like the rest of us have to do
wamama, how are you dealing with life? arent you here receiving support?
He will, mark my words, get totally immersed in this in an unhealthy way.
his drinking was unheatlhy and now what hes doing for recovery is unheatlhy?
for the last month hes done nothing but be kind and respectful, listens to my rages, and in general is trying to make it up
but then say
If he ignores us any longer, I will call it quits
wamama, recovery is extremely early for both of you. 18 years of this isnt going to mysteriously,miraculously be resolved in 1 month. theres probably not gonna be sparkle fartin unicorns under rainbows in a field of daisies for a while. if there ever is.
you work on you, him work on him, and maybe even both of ya's workin on communication( ya's may not even know how to do that)- who knows. maybe good stuff will happen.
Is that excerpt in the big book from the Family Afterward chapter?
Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 49
Originally Posted by DontRemember
I agree it's devastating and I meant to respond to her earlier,but to me her husband seems really invested in his recovery. I'm only a bit over a year,but I 'unplugged' from life basically and just focused on myself. Is it selfish? Yes. Would you rather them 'unplug'/not be fully present for a few more months,or have the drunk them still there and not be present at all? Some relationships do not survive recovery. Mine didn't and I 110% knew it wouldn't when I started on this path for myself. I do hope that both of you(and everyone else), who still want the relationship to work, get it.
I do really hope he is just working in his recovery rather than slowly walking away. The day after he came out of rehab he said he wasn't sure about anything in his life, including our family, a week later he said he wanted to work to staying together and says he loves us but he's all confused and upset and doesn't know how to begin to rebuild with nasty memories of what he's done cropping up all the time. The last week I haven't seen him a lot of heard him a lot. My therapist tells me to give him time. My husband wants to do couples counselling, he calls it mediation, which I am more than happy to do. He should be coming over today but not tomorrow (Sunday) as he says it's the done thing for AA people to meet up before a meeting on Sunday. It hurts, it really does. I have started reading the AA big book. I am on this forum. He has therapy and AA and I have therapy and this forum as it's almost impossible to attend Al Anon with the 3 children of 5, 4 and 20 months and my friends all have kids too so evenings are difficult.
All I can do is wait but also prepare myself to return to Netherlands if things don't go well or my husband walks away. He did get upset when I said thwt but I have more unconditional help and support than I have here. I have friends, colleagues but on family you can always count (in my situstion, we are very close family)
Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,966
Originally Posted by Wamama48
I was hesitant to post what I did because I know many here have been very successful with AA. But I've learned here that feelings are feelings, and a lot of the time you don't get to choose them. Never in my life have I seen something that makes a person so selfish. It blows me away. It sounds like you are fine with your decision. You sound confident and ok. It must have been heartbreaking when he just stayed selfish and unapologetic. Thank you for sharing. Its encouraging to see someone who came through it, survived, and is doing well.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 49
Originally Posted by Wamama48
That's just devastating. Its so hurtful that they have to be so selfish to recover. I can't wrap my mind around it. Honestly, I think after they quit drinking, it hurts more than when they were. I've been thinking about you all day, and I hope you can get what you want, need and deserve.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,966
Originally Posted by Dutchy36
Hi DontRemember,
I do really hope he is just working in his recovery rather than slowly walking away. The day after he came out of rehab he said he wasn't sure about anything in his life, including our family, a week later he said he wanted to work to staying together and says he loves us but he's all confused and upset and doesn't know how to begin to rebuild with nasty memories of what he's done cropping up all the time. The last week I haven't seen him a lot of heard him a lot. My therapist tells me to give him time. My husband wants to do couples counselling, he calls it mediation, which I am more than happy to do. He should be coming over today but not tomorrow (Sunday) as he says it's the done thing for AA people to meet up before a meeting on Sunday. It hurts, it really does. I have started reading the AA big book. I am on this forum. He has therapy and AA and I have therapy and this forum as it's almost impossible to attend Al Anon with the 3 children of 5, 4 and 20 months and my friends all have kids too so evenings are difficult.
All I can do is wait but also prepare myself to return to Netherlands if things don't go well or my husband walks away. He did get upset when I said thwt but I have more unconditional help and support than I have here. I have friends, colleagues but on family you can always count (in my situstion, we are very close family)
I do really hope he is just working in his recovery rather than slowly walking away. The day after he came out of rehab he said he wasn't sure about anything in his life, including our family, a week later he said he wanted to work to staying together and says he loves us but he's all confused and upset and doesn't know how to begin to rebuild with nasty memories of what he's done cropping up all the time. The last week I haven't seen him a lot of heard him a lot. My therapist tells me to give him time. My husband wants to do couples counselling, he calls it mediation, which I am more than happy to do. He should be coming over today but not tomorrow (Sunday) as he says it's the done thing for AA people to meet up before a meeting on Sunday. It hurts, it really does. I have started reading the AA big book. I am on this forum. He has therapy and AA and I have therapy and this forum as it's almost impossible to attend Al Anon with the 3 children of 5, 4 and 20 months and my friends all have kids too so evenings are difficult.
All I can do is wait but also prepare myself to return to Netherlands if things don't go well or my husband walks away. He did get upset when I said thwt but I have more unconditional help and support than I have here. I have friends, colleagues but on family you can always count (in my situstion, we are very close family)
Member
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: London, United Kingdom
Posts: 49
Originally Posted by DontRemember
Do what's best for you and the kids! I hope he stays sober for himself and you guys too,but that's on him. Outta your control.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 11,481
Originally Posted by DontRemember
Would you rather them 'unplug'/not be fully present for a few more months,or have the drunk them still there and not be present at all? Some relationships do not survive recovery.
A) he is selfish, unavailable, etc. b/c of drinking, with the only prospect being that things get worse over time
B) he is selfish, unavailable, etc., b/c of quitting drinking, with at least the chance of things getting better in the future
I didn't put in an option of "have him enter recovery and right away realize how wrong he was and turn into the exact person I wish he would be and come back and make everything right" b/c that simply isn't going to happen, at least in this world.
I understand that feeling of anger and of being OWED, big time. I really do. But putting your life on hold while you stew in a pot of bitterness and anger, waiting for HIM to get himself together and come back to you, asking forgiveness and ready to make up for all the wrongs, is not the way to set yourself free. (Set YOURSELF free--not wait for HIM to set you free.)
I became aware of XAH's issues when I was 49, but I delayed beginning my own recovery and ignored red flags "b/c I didn't want to be starting over at 50." Know what happened? He kept drinking, faking sobriety (which I swallowed partly b/c I knew no better and partly b/c I had such a vested interest in not rocking the boat), and I ended up starting over at 55 instead of 50. Good call on my part, right?
I will be 58 this summer and will also be 3 years out of a 21-year relationship. I'm not going to say it's been easy or pretty, and I'm also not going to make it sound like I have arrived and I have it all figured out. In fact, a lot of the time it's painfully apparent just how much I DON'T have it all figured out.
BUT--and here is the big BUT--I have gained the freedom to make my own mistakes and to learn from them. I'm not held hostage to someone else's bad decisions or irresponsibility. It is scary to have only my income w/no other backup in the household. It is scary to be responsible for everything from maintaining the snowblower so I can get out of the driveway to get to work, to buying a car, to being the sole "parent" to 2 aging dogs, knowing that their needs will keep increasing and will only end when their lives end, breaking my heart yet again.
But I have learned that I can do all that and more.
I posted this quote from a wise SR member recently in another thread. I'll repeat it here: I never wanted to feel like my life depended on keeping someone else in it ever again.
It is true. Your life depends on you, and NOT on who else may or may not be a part of it at any given time. Rather than tie yourself in knots about what your A will or will not do, who he may or may not be, heal yourself, and no matter what else happens, you will be capable, strong and whole for yourself and your children.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Its so hurtful that they have to be so selfish to recover.
you have to be selfish,too. instead of letting him live in your head,time to boot him out of there and focus on your recovery. time to pull up your britches- no more self pity about how much you have to do and he doesnt have to.
you have to be selfish,too. instead of letting him live in your head,time to boot him out of there and focus on your recovery. time to pull up your britches- no more self pity about how much you have to do and he doesnt have to.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Midwest
Posts: 11,481
Wanted to share this from my "Wisdom of SR" folder:
In hindsight I can see that the resentment was not about carrying the load because I am for sure carrying the load now and I don't have resentment.
My resentment, and it was deep and overwhelming, was that I felt I was being forced to accept a situation I found unacceptable. I was resentful that I could not force/coerce/convince him to make a different choice, and I was angry and resentful because I was unwilling to make a different choice myself. I didn't see that I had any choices but I did, I just didn't like them or give myself permission to make them.
In hindsight I can see that the resentment was not about carrying the load because I am for sure carrying the load now and I don't have resentment.
My resentment, and it was deep and overwhelming, was that I felt I was being forced to accept a situation I found unacceptable. I was resentful that I could not force/coerce/convince him to make a different choice, and I was angry and resentful because I was unwilling to make a different choice myself. I didn't see that I had any choices but I did, I just didn't like them or give myself permission to make them.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
My resentment, and it was deep and overwhelming, was that I felt I was being forced to accept a situation I found unacceptable. I was resentful that I could not force/coerce/convince him to make a different choice, and I was angry and resentful because I was unwilling to make a different choice myself. I didn't see that I had any choices but I did, I just didn't like them or give myself permission to make them.
I hated the Alanon saying "do you want to be right or do you want to be happy?" -- BOTH!!! -- but this is the essence of it. As long as I hang on to my attitudes I'll be miserable; the way to peace is letting go of expectations and judgment of others.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 681
*Just an FYI, I'm reading Codependent No More and loving it! Counseling starting at the end of the month.*
Im thoroughly confused. I have read on SR feelings are feelings, they aren't right or wrong. But I keep reading I should let go of the anger. I know I should, but
1- it's just how I feel even if it's not right. It's not a pity party.
2- Is there a time limit to it?
3-I DO want to let it go. I'm miserable with it. But I'm stuck, I don't know how. Thats what Ive told RAH, Im stuck where I'm at right now.
Many have asked if I want to stay in the marriage. I do. There was never any abuse, and I can tell he is truly sorry and humble, so that goes a long way in bringing back some of the love. But still no trust is involved, he has to earn that. I can tell he is hurting for what he did. I catch him looking at me sometimes with that look, knowing hes hurt me and feels bad about it. I got that look on occasion when he was drinking. Feeling bad that he hurt me, but not bad enough to stop drinking.
I expect a relapse(s?) I can deal with that. Progress, not perfection. What matters is if he gets back up and keeps going. If he chooses not to keep going, 110% I am done. He knows that. He has promised if that happens he will leave. Im not positive he will leave, so I have some money saved in my own account, and am working on a back up plan. I dont have the details yet, but the framework is there.
Im thoroughly confused. I have read on SR feelings are feelings, they aren't right or wrong. But I keep reading I should let go of the anger. I know I should, but
1- it's just how I feel even if it's not right. It's not a pity party.
2- Is there a time limit to it?
3-I DO want to let it go. I'm miserable with it. But I'm stuck, I don't know how. Thats what Ive told RAH, Im stuck where I'm at right now.
Many have asked if I want to stay in the marriage. I do. There was never any abuse, and I can tell he is truly sorry and humble, so that goes a long way in bringing back some of the love. But still no trust is involved, he has to earn that. I can tell he is hurting for what he did. I catch him looking at me sometimes with that look, knowing hes hurt me and feels bad about it. I got that look on occasion when he was drinking. Feeling bad that he hurt me, but not bad enough to stop drinking.
I expect a relapse(s?) I can deal with that. Progress, not perfection. What matters is if he gets back up and keeps going. If he chooses not to keep going, 110% I am done. He knows that. He has promised if that happens he will leave. Im not positive he will leave, so I have some money saved in my own account, and am working on a back up plan. I dont have the details yet, but the framework is there.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 681
This made me think...... "Would you rather them 'unplug'/not be fully present for a few more months, or have the drunk them still there and not be present at all?" I would rather he was never selfish and put us in this position in the first place. But since he did, I would rather him unplug for a few more months and be sober. Good point, it helps.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
