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Old 10-31-2004, 11:27 AM
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Just a question

do you all think that addicts end up hurting those closest to them, even if they have no intention of doing so?
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Old 10-31-2004, 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by paragonlost
do you all think that addicts end up hurting those closest to them, even if they have no intention of doing so?
Yes but in the long run, I think it's themselves they hurt the most.
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Old 10-31-2004, 12:08 PM
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Without a doubt.
 
Old 10-31-2004, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by paragonlost
do you all think that addicts end up hurting those closest to them, even if they have no intention of doing so?
Hi Paragon,
I'm an addict named Dan.
You wrote this elsewhere in the Forums:
Originally Posted by paragonlost
I drink to overcome the thought that I'm not perfect, if that makes any sense at all
That kind of self-centered thinking common to a lot of us leaves very little room for consideration for other human beings, be they loved ones or not.
We hurt people without even thinking about it. It's easy really, because we're consumed with our own pathetic, sick obsessions.
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Old 10-31-2004, 12:15 PM
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From "somewhere in here"

"My name's Jon. I'm an addict. And this is what addicts do. You cannot nor
will not change my behavior. You cannot make me treat you better, let alone
with any respect. All I care about, all I think about, are my needs and how
to go about fulfilling them. You are a tool to me, something to use. When I
say I love you I am lying through my teeth, because love is impossible for
someone in active addiction. I wouldn't be using if I loved myself, and
since I don't love myself, I cannot love you.

My feelings are so pushed down and numbed by alcohol that I could be
considered a sociopath. I have no empathy for you or anyone else. It doesn't
faze me that I hurt you, leave you hungry, lie to you, break the promises I
make to you, cheat on you or steal from you.

My behavior cannot and will not change until I make a decision to stop
drinking and then follow it up with a plan of action.

And until I make that decision, I will hurt you again and again and again.

Stop being surprised.

I am an addict. And that's what addicts do."

I truly LOVE this post... it changed my life. Thank you Jon.
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Old 10-31-2004, 02:00 PM
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The motto I came up with for my husband is: "Good intention, Bad result". Because no matter how good his intentions were, he never followed through.
I believe that alcoholics (as well as any other addict whatever their drug of choice is) do hurt everyone around them - those that love them, they hurt the worse!
And sadly, I also think that most of the addicts know and realize this but they just do it anyway.
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Old 10-31-2004, 02:05 PM
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Do addicts hurt people around them?
Yep.
Do they hurt the people they love the most?
Yep to that too.
I got this gem of wisdom from Paulie, I think it explains a lot...
"Remember, he doesn't love himself, so he doesn't know how to love you right now. That is different than NOT loving you."
I don't think it's their intention to hurt.
They are just so caught up in their addiction that they aren't able to love.
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Old 10-31-2004, 03:27 PM
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paragonlost, now that others have replied to this post, I'm curious how you feel. Do you realize that though your motives may not be to intentionally hurt someone - you will hurt someone when you drink! And because people love and care about you, they will be hurt more than those that don't have that emtional attachment to you.

The last time I read one of your posts, I was unsure if you were hoping to stop the drinking or just trying to talk yourself into if you thought maybe you didn't want too. I don't know where you are now as far as your drinking goes but I hope that you realize that an addiction is progressive - it will get worse! And it also hurts not just the person that is drinking, but also everyone around them.

I hope that you are ready to stop drinking and ready to seek the help that you need.
((((Paragonlost)))))
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Old 10-31-2004, 03:36 PM
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Originally Posted by StandingStrong
paragonlost, now that others have replied to this post, I'm curious how you feel. Do you realize that though your motives may not be to intentionally hurt someone - you will hurt someone when you drink! And because people love and care about you, they will be hurt more than those that don't have that emtional attachment to you.

The last time I read one of your posts, I was unsure if you were hoping to stop the drinking or just trying to talk yourself into if you thought maybe you didn't want too. I don't know where you are now as far as your drinking goes but I hope that you realize that an addiction is progressive - it will get worse! And it also hurts not just the person that is drinking, but also everyone around them.

I hope that you are ready to stop drinking and ready to seek the help that you need.
((((Paragonlost)))))
I am starting to realize that the drinking does hurt others. I don't mean to hurt them though. As far as addiction being progressive, I can see that also to a point. I mean what about the perosn who drinks but doesn't drive? or who doesn't get angry and hurt toehrs at the time----- or is this just something that hasn't got to that point yet? And of course the fact that drinking hurts your liver shold be reason enough. I don't know, I guess alcohol must really have a hold on me to doubt that I need to stop. On one hand I know I should, but the other one tells me as long as it hurts no one then its alright
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Old 10-31-2004, 03:37 PM
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We hurt the people closest to us, because the are the ones who are there, not because we want to. It doesn't matter if you're alcoholic, addict, codie, or so called "normal." At sometime in our lives, in some way, we have all hurt those that we love, and are closest to. Our A's don't go out and do what they do in order to hurt us. It's just an unfortunate by-product of addiction, or alcoholism. It's their disease, it does't only affect them, it affects those closest to them.
Trisha
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Old 10-31-2004, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Cadence57
From "somewhere in here"

"My name's Jon. I'm an addict. And this is what addicts do. You cannot nor
will not change my behavior. You cannot make me treat you better, let alone
with any respect. All I care about, all I think about, are my needs and how
to go about fulfilling them. You are a tool to me, something to use. When I
say I love you I am lying through my teeth, because love is impossible for
someone in active addiction. I wouldn't be using if I loved myself, and
since I don't love myself, I cannot love you.

My feelings are so pushed down and numbed by alcohol that I could be
considered a sociopath. I have no empathy for you or anyone else. It doesn't
faze me that I hurt you, leave you hungry, lie to you, break the promises I
make to you, cheat on you or steal from you.

My behavior cannot and will not change until I make a decision to stop
drinking and then follow it up with a plan of action.
See I don't think I do any of this. I don't think I am lying when I tell those I care about that I love them, I think you can love others without loving yourself. And it does bother me that I may hurt others I don't want to. So does all this mean I am not an addict?
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Old 10-31-2004, 08:00 PM
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Originally Posted by paragonlost
See I don't think I do any of this. I don't think I am lying when I tell those I care about that I love them, I think you can love others without loving yourself. And it does bother me that I may hurt others I don't want to. So does all this mean I am not an addict?
I can't answer that. You're here, I've read your posts in the Alcoholism forum as well as your posts here.

I think you already know the answer.
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Old 10-31-2004, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Cadence57
I can't answer that. You're here, I've read your posts in the Alcoholism forum as well as your posts here.

I think you already know the answer.

Yea I probably wouldn't be here if i didn't know the answer, but i guess i wonder if it will always be so under control, to me it seems like it will be and that it won't turn into a bigger problem
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Old 10-31-2004, 08:23 PM
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Dear Paragon,

I want to give it to you straight. My 24 year old son is an alcoholic. My husband is an alcoholic. The pain I went through with my husband is totally different than what I go through with my son.

I didn't fear for my husband's life. I prayed he would die. Enough pain?

My son...My life. My joy in birth and until to now. When he confessed to being an alcoholic, my world collapsed. The pain was as if someone told me he was dead. My heart felt as if it was going to explode. I know when he slips because he doesn't call and I fear for his life and wait for the phone to ring. I'm waiting for the cops or the hospital or the morgue to call to tell me he's dead.

He's my blood and only child. I know he doesn't want to hurt me and I want to believe he loves me when he calls, but I know the dealings of the disease and it's association with deceit and cunning.

You may say you love those around you, but when you continually hurt them, they will question your love. Not because you're an addict/alcoholic, but because it's not you talking most of the time. Did that make sense? I think you know what I mean.

Please, I beg you to get help. Anyone here and elsewhere on the site will do anything they can to stand by you and be here when you need someone. Don't do it for anyone but yourself.

Love and blessings to you, Kathy
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Old 10-31-2004, 08:28 PM
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I'm curious - who's controlling who? Are you controlling the booze or is it controlling you? It seems to me like you are the one who is being controlled...

If you are wondering if you are an alcoholic, you probably are.
If you're looking to control your drinking you will be the one who is controlled.
If you don't think you're hurting anyone - think again.

Denial - it ain't just a river in Egypt...
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Old 10-31-2004, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by gelfling
Dear Paragon,

I want to give it to you straight. My 24 year old son is an alcoholic. My husband is an alcoholic. The pain I went through with my husband is totally different than what I go through with my son.

I didn't fear for my husband's life. I prayed he would die. Enough pain?

My son...My life. My joy in birth and until to now. When he confessed to being an alcoholic, my world collapsed. The pain was as if someone told me he was dead. My heart felt as if it was going to explode. I know when he slips because he doesn't call and I fear for his life and wait for the phone to ring. I'm waiting for the cops or the hospital or the morgue to call to tell me he's dead.

He's my blood and only child. I know he doesn't want to hurt me and I want to believe he loves me when he calls, but I know the dealings of the disease and it's association with deceit and cunning.

You may say you love those around you, but when you continually hurt them, they will question your love. Not because you're an addict/alcoholic, but because it's not you talking most of the time. Did that make sense? I think you know what I mean.

Please, I beg you to get help. Anyone here and elsewhere on the site will do anything they can to stand by you and be here when you need someone. Don't do it for anyone but yourself.

Love and blessings to you, Kathy
I'm sorry to hear about your son and your husband. I think maybe I am starting to see how much it hurts others, even though it doesn't seem like it does
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Old 10-31-2004, 08:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Cadence57
I'm curious - who's controlling who? Are you controlling the booze or is it controlling you? It seems to me like you are the one who is being controlled...

If you are wondering if you are an alcoholic, you probably are.
If you're looking to control your drinking you will be the one who is controlled.
If you don't think you're hurting anyone - think again.

Denial - it ain't just a river in Egypt...
I know its probably frustrating to read my posts and see the isues that I have. I probably am an alcoholic. At times I wish someone close to me wold drag me off to a center, make me go because I know I won't stop on my own and then well that makes me even more angry becasue they don't and therefore they in my mind that means they don't care. Sorry for wasting all of everyone's time, thanks for trying to help
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Old 10-31-2004, 09:58 PM
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Please don't be discouraged and no you didn't waste anyone's time. Coming on here and asking people questions is the right thing to do. I can relate to your confusion about not knowing if you are an alcoholic or not. I can also understand your apprehension in wanting to admit it if you are. It took me a very long time to admit to myself that I had a problem. It took me even longer to accept that I could ask someone for help if I needed it. When I did ask for help it wasn't always apparent to others close to me. I too felt like no one cared about my well being. Now today I see that they did care, they just didn't know how to deal with my alcoholism. I needed help beyond them from others that were going through the same thing as me. I believe that if they aren't putting you in treatment it means that they have faith in you that you can make that decision when you are ready. It certainly doesn't mean they don't care. You can't control anyone but yourself. You hold the cards.In my experience It also took a while to accept that I hurt others. All of these things you are confused about seem pretty normal to me. By being here you are on the right track and eventually it will all make sense to you one step at a time. Please keep coming back and know that regardless of what you don't understand we are here to listen and help.
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Old 11-01-2004, 10:17 AM
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Dearest Paragon,

The last thing you're doing is wasting our time. We all come here for the same thing. Help with alcoholism. If it was a waste of time, we wouldn't be here. One of the teachings of AA and alanon is that we pass our love, support and help to others who are in need of support. This helps us remain in control of our lives.

I think that if you were to sit down with someone close to you and tell them what you've been telling all of us, you would find that they care more then you realize. Give them a chance. Ask for their support and love. Admit to them that you are having problems with alcohol. Tell them of your desire to get help and quit.

My son has been working a program for about a year now. We couldn't help him. He lives 300 miles away. We had no idea what was happening until he told us. He knew what alcoholism was all about because of his Dad. He always talked about and feared the idea that he might also be an alcoholic.

The one thing he did, for which I give thanks to God, he walked into an AA meeting not knowing anyone or anything because of his state of mind at that time. That's all he needed to do. It's like walking into a room full of friends/relatives/co-workers. They will accept you, take you under their wings, love and support you. Find you a sponsor if that's what it would take to help you stay sober. He discovered the meaning of a true blue friend. They stick by you through everything. If you slip...no biggie. They don't beat you down, belittle you or give you hell. They will give you a hug and welcome you back.

And the only thing that's frustrating about your posts is that I can't take you by the hand and tell you that you can do it. Go with you to meetings and hug you when you need it the most.

Millions have done it. As long as you keep telling yourself you can't, you won't. Get rid of the negative attitude. And have faith.

Hugs, Kathy
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Old 11-01-2004, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by paragonlost
do you all think that addicts end up hurting those closest to them, even if they have no intention of doing so?
I'm going to weigh in here.

My husband is a recovering alcoholic. He was never mean, never abusive, never anything. He was simply a drunk who would drink until he passed out.

He hurt us, his family by simply not being there for us, by never participating in his family or their lives. Yes, he hurt us tremendously by not being there mentally for support and love.

He held a good job, kept his job, kept his drinking well hidden from his bosses and others. He was a good father when he was mentally there.

So do all addicts/alcoholics hurt those closest to them? A resounding YES .... even if they have no intention of doing so.
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