I believe my saga is at an end... what to do?
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: New York
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Hey Crazed.. I can identify with so many things you said here. I have wished my exabf would get thrown in jail for a DUI, and have even thought about ways I could plot to make it happen: "If I know he is drunk, invite him over, and then call and report him to the cops?" Of course I would never actually do it, but the feeling is definitely there. I'm not sure if it's an actual desire for him to hit rock bottom, as much as it is a fantasy about him being punished for all the crap he put me through.
*I was also thrown out like a bottle of vodka (and in fact used those exact words in an email to him). It was for the same reason: that I had him figured out. He tried so many times to pretend to me that he was sober, but I saw through it every time. So he'd complain constantly that he felt like he was "under a microscope". (When someone calls you, slurring their speech, and lashing out at you for no reason, it doesn't take a microscopic examination of the behavior to see they are drunk. It's so obvious you could see it from outer space!)
I'm also dealing with the issue of "stuff". He is hanging onto a lot of stuff of mine, and I have a few things of his. I've been back and forth a hundred times about what to do, but have waited because I know deep down I still have an agenda. Sometimes it is to get him back in my life, and sometimes I fantasize about the meeting, and what I could do/say to punish him. If I really and truly wanted him out of my life forever, and had accepted that he will NEVER change, the issue of the stuff would be easy to figure out. You're so right that the stuff is a way of hanging on.
I've been doing the day by day thing which has been working. I get through each day without contacting him, and every day, things shift a bit and I feel better. This has given me real hope that in a few weeks, I will feel totally different about him. The more time you spend without contact the more clarity you will have. And if you really love her, and really want to help her, the best thing you can do is close the door to her... (I'm sure you already know that!)
I've noticed about five people asked you what you were going to do for you, and you never answered!
That is a great place to start. I spent the week being totally self indulgent: blew off as much work as I could, exercised a ton, bought new clothes, got my hair cut.. It really helped!
Take Care, Crazed.*
*I was also thrown out like a bottle of vodka (and in fact used those exact words in an email to him). It was for the same reason: that I had him figured out. He tried so many times to pretend to me that he was sober, but I saw through it every time. So he'd complain constantly that he felt like he was "under a microscope". (When someone calls you, slurring their speech, and lashing out at you for no reason, it doesn't take a microscopic examination of the behavior to see they are drunk. It's so obvious you could see it from outer space!)
I'm also dealing with the issue of "stuff". He is hanging onto a lot of stuff of mine, and I have a few things of his. I've been back and forth a hundred times about what to do, but have waited because I know deep down I still have an agenda. Sometimes it is to get him back in my life, and sometimes I fantasize about the meeting, and what I could do/say to punish him. If I really and truly wanted him out of my life forever, and had accepted that he will NEVER change, the issue of the stuff would be easy to figure out. You're so right that the stuff is a way of hanging on.
I've been doing the day by day thing which has been working. I get through each day without contacting him, and every day, things shift a bit and I feel better. This has given me real hope that in a few weeks, I will feel totally different about him. The more time you spend without contact the more clarity you will have. And if you really love her, and really want to help her, the best thing you can do is close the door to her... (I'm sure you already know that!)
I've noticed about five people asked you what you were going to do for you, and you never answered!
That is a great place to start. I spent the week being totally self indulgent: blew off as much work as I could, exercised a ton, bought new clothes, got my hair cut.. It really helped!Take Care, Crazed.*
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 458
I guess i will continue to torture myself. After several more text messages, and me feeling tremendous guilt, I went to EXAG apartment last night. She was in bad shape. I stayed with her for about 3 hours. She admitted to being on a 5 day heavy Vodka bender. I accidentally left my wallet there, and she dropped it off this morning. She entered my house, suited up for work, white as a ghost, and shaking uncontrollably. She started dry heaving, and finally called in sick to work. She stayed at my house all day with uncontrollable tremors and cold sweats. I did not have it in me to throw her out. She called two close friends from AA, and came clean about drinking for the last few months. She left at about 6 pm, still shaking.
Perhaps she will now recommit to her recovery. Or perhaps she will continue the game. For today, she says she wants sobriety. I guess that is a start.
Today for me i did go to the gym, and got alot done at work - with her suffereing at the other end of the house.
Perhaps she will now recommit to her recovery. Or perhaps she will continue the game. For today, she says she wants sobriety. I guess that is a start.
Today for me i did go to the gym, and got alot done at work - with her suffereing at the other end of the house.
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
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I hope you checked your credit cards...
You wouldn't have had to worry about putting her out if you hadn't gone to her place to begin with. She has AA friends--it isn't as if you are the only human being on the planet who can help her. And, no offense, the AA friends can help her a lot more than you can.
So where is she now?
You wouldn't have had to worry about putting her out if you hadn't gone to her place to begin with. She has AA friends--it isn't as if you are the only human being on the planet who can help her. And, no offense, the AA friends can help her a lot more than you can.
So where is she now?
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 877
That sounds very rough, for both of you. When they break down, are vulnerable, and actually honest, it IS very hard to turn your back on them. Where was her new boyfriend while she was sick in your bed? (You said she has a new BF, right?). I'm also wondering if you are feeling better or worse right now.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,452
Crazed, hang in there, keep your resolve, do what you know you'll be glad you did in the long term, not what your anxiety and restless heart want you to do RIGHT NOW.
How do I know that? Because I've wanted at times, especially early on, wanted desperately to go back to my alcoholic verbally abusive porn addicted husband of 20 years...
Now, over 6 months gone, I can see that what I REALLY wanted was to go to my dream of what life could be like, would be like, should be like, if only my tormented and tormenting AH was who I wished he was and not who he is.
The pain in coming to that realization is so huge that my heart just didn't want to take it in. But my mind did, and somehow, put my wayward heart into a straight jacket and said "We're going MY way, dear, and it is NOT backwards."
Hang in there, we're here with you.
ShootingStar1
How do I know that? Because I've wanted at times, especially early on, wanted desperately to go back to my alcoholic verbally abusive porn addicted husband of 20 years...
Now, over 6 months gone, I can see that what I REALLY wanted was to go to my dream of what life could be like, would be like, should be like, if only my tormented and tormenting AH was who I wished he was and not who he is.
The pain in coming to that realization is so huge that my heart just didn't want to take it in. But my mind did, and somehow, put my wayward heart into a straight jacket and said "We're going MY way, dear, and it is NOT backwards."
Hang in there, we're here with you.
ShootingStar1
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,163
That white knuckling detox can be DEADLY.
Detox should be medically supervised.
Not to sound insenstive, or uncaring, but it obvious you haven't reached the end of your rope. It comes down to...... let go or be dragged...... and there is nothing left of you, you have been dragged so long, you are now raw meat. Yet, you cannot let go of that damn rope to save yourself. Best to get into some therapy, ASAP.
Here is another question, (without cruel intent) when is the last time you enjoyed the company of a sober woman ? A class act woman ? One with a sense of self worth? Educated? Kind? Sexy? Fun to be around? Someone who is truly interested in YOU? Someone that makes you smile?
I am not saying to jump from the pan into the fire, as you have to heal yourself, but at this point, i am recommending a change of scenery, get out there and just talk to people, you have been held hostage for so long, reintroduce yourself to the world.
You have been consumed by addiction for so long now, you have forgotten what a healthy, normal relationship/life even is.......
Detox should be medically supervised.
Not to sound insenstive, or uncaring, but it obvious you haven't reached the end of your rope. It comes down to...... let go or be dragged...... and there is nothing left of you, you have been dragged so long, you are now raw meat. Yet, you cannot let go of that damn rope to save yourself. Best to get into some therapy, ASAP.
Here is another question, (without cruel intent) when is the last time you enjoyed the company of a sober woman ? A class act woman ? One with a sense of self worth? Educated? Kind? Sexy? Fun to be around? Someone who is truly interested in YOU? Someone that makes you smile?
I am not saying to jump from the pan into the fire, as you have to heal yourself, but at this point, i am recommending a change of scenery, get out there and just talk to people, you have been held hostage for so long, reintroduce yourself to the world.
You have been consumed by addiction for so long now, you have forgotten what a healthy, normal relationship/life even is.......
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: SAN FRANCISCO
Posts: 1,176
Originally Posted by marie1960 
That white knuckling detox can be DEADLY.
Not to sound insenstive, or uncaring, but it obvious you haven't reached the end of your rope. It comes down to...... let go or be dragged...... and there is nothing left of you, you have been dragged so long, you are now raw meat. Yet, you cannot let go of that damn rope to save yourself. Best to get into some therapy, ASAP.
Not to sound insenstive, or uncaring, but it obvious you haven't reached the end of your rope. It comes down to...... let go or be dragged...... and there is nothing left of you, you have been dragged so long, you are now raw meat. Yet, you cannot let go of that damn rope to save yourself. Best to get into some therapy, ASAP.
Just to chime in with what Marie is saying... I realized when I got into therapy I was putting up with terrible treatment because I was afraid to be alone. I have no idea why I put up with my verbally abusive, manipulative angry A. for YEARS.
Perhaps I had some hopes that he would change and we could make things work. That is not love, it is magical thinking. Now he thinks I am the evil one and wants nothing to do with me. I sure wish I had spent all that time doing something else!
take care
-z
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 458
I have been busy with work today and yesterday. The support at this forum is really great. If I only would follow some of the suggestions. The EXAG went home early evening on Wednesday, still shaking. She did make it in to work on Thursday, as well as to a meeting last night. She picked up a white chip. Perhaps temporary, but I feel that her downward spiral has at least been slowed - codependence kicking in. Time will tell.
Her EX-sponsor agreed to work with her, under the condition that she severs all contact with me and 3rd party.
My issue is that she has so many of these traits (Highly successful career woman, albeit alcoholic), and generally exhibits them. Unfortunately they get lost when she relapses. You have probably heard this 1000 times, but when things are good, they are SOOOO good. And our relationship has weeks on end of these times. Crushed by a few days of SOOO Bad.
Obviously the dynamic changed after she moved out at the beginning of November.
Yes, I continue to be dragged.... But I continue to go to Alanon, and am looking for a therapist. Anger-Pity-Anger-Pity, etc. My internal merry-go-round.
I am hopeful for my EXAG- She has finally (AGAIN) admitted that her life has become unmanageable, and will perhaps follow the correct path... this time.
Now to work on me...
Her EX-sponsor agreed to work with her, under the condition that she severs all contact with me and 3rd party.
When is the last time you enjoyed the company of a sober woman ? A class act woman ? One with a sense of self worth? Educated? Kind? Sexy? Fun to be around? Someone who is truly interested in YOU? Someone that makes you smile?
Obviously the dynamic changed after she moved out at the beginning of November.
Yes, I continue to be dragged.... But I continue to go to Alanon, and am looking for a therapist. Anger-Pity-Anger-Pity, etc. My internal merry-go-round.
I am hopeful for my EXAG- She has finally (AGAIN) admitted that her life has become unmanageable, and will perhaps follow the correct path... this time.
Now to work on me...
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Aurora, CO
Posts: 85
Oh crazed - I am sorry you are hurting right now!! I know how very difficult it is to see them hurting and want to fix it. BUT YOU CAN'T. YOU can't fix HER. Nothing you say/do/think/feel means anything to her right now. And yes, scary that she might end up like her mom (and that is a reality you have to face) but her choices are not your fault nor your responsibility. Her choices are hers, as are the consequences that may come with them.
You must let go. You deserve better than this. And if you say no contact, it is for your own mental and emotional well-being that you stick to it, no matter how hard it is. If you had cancer and were receiving chemo, would you tell the doc not to give it to you because it made you feel sick?? Of course you wouldn't. It makes you feel sick, but it is healing you. Same thing here - she is cancerous to your life and well-being.
Hang in there! Letting go is difficult, but you will be very VERY glad you did when your life is your own again!
You must let go. You deserve better than this. And if you say no contact, it is for your own mental and emotional well-being that you stick to it, no matter how hard it is. If you had cancer and were receiving chemo, would you tell the doc not to give it to you because it made you feel sick?? Of course you wouldn't. It makes you feel sick, but it is healing you. Same thing here - she is cancerous to your life and well-being.
Hang in there! Letting go is difficult, but you will be very VERY glad you did when your life is your own again!
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Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,163
So are you willing to sever all contact?
Will you be able to ignore her texts and calls? Because we both know she is going to be calling....... Will you be able to NOT contact her ?
I know this is almost impossible in this day and age, but I would throw that phone right out the window.
Its going to take discipline on your part, I would be looking for a new hobby/outlet to keep myself on track.
You need to make a plan...... what are you going to do to keep yourself occupied?
Will you be able to ignore her texts and calls? Because we both know she is going to be calling....... Will you be able to NOT contact her ?
I know this is almost impossible in this day and age, but I would throw that phone right out the window.
Its going to take discipline on your part, I would be looking for a new hobby/outlet to keep myself on track.
You need to make a plan...... what are you going to do to keep yourself occupied?
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Join Date: Jun 2011
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Hey Crazed,
this a post of a member by the name of Cyranoak. I can only suggest you search some of his older posts. His words and experience are spot on. And it is coming from a man's perspective, and his trials of dealing with his AW.
He hasn't been on in awhile and I really miss his direct approach. I hope he is well.
I've been seeing a lot of love stuff lately...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...but rather than post in an existing thread and hurt people's feelings directly, I'll risk it indirectly by just saying this:
Love doesn't matter to alcoholism and addiction. It can't cure it, it can't control it, and it sure as hell doesn't stop it. Not love for children, not love for husbands and wives, and not love for mothers and fathers.
It is the single worst enemy of the victims of alcoholism and addiction because it is so useless in the face of this disease, and delays for so long the decisions and actions that can and should be made to help those suffering from it. "I love them so much," "I'll love them until the day I die," "they're my soul mate," "I'll never find anybody else like them," "nobody will ever love me like they love me," "I'll never love anybody like I love them."
Please. It's all so melodramatic, poetic, and Shakespearean. It's also not true.
I love the drama of love, and I struggle with my addiction to it (and perhaps my alcoholic wife), but make no mistake that it has been absolutely my worst enemy in my battle with the disease of alcoholism. "Love" is a barrier to recovery-- for some it is the barrier to recovery.
Let go of the drama, let go of the Hallmark fantasy, and start making your decisions based on reality. What people do (NOT what they say), how you want to live, and when it applies what is truly best for your children and you-- not your addict or alcoholic.
Take what you want and leave the rest.
Cyranoak
__________________
Aspiring realist
this a post of a member by the name of Cyranoak. I can only suggest you search some of his older posts. His words and experience are spot on. And it is coming from a man's perspective, and his trials of dealing with his AW.
He hasn't been on in awhile and I really miss his direct approach. I hope he is well.
I've been seeing a lot of love stuff lately...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...but rather than post in an existing thread and hurt people's feelings directly, I'll risk it indirectly by just saying this:
Love doesn't matter to alcoholism and addiction. It can't cure it, it can't control it, and it sure as hell doesn't stop it. Not love for children, not love for husbands and wives, and not love for mothers and fathers.
It is the single worst enemy of the victims of alcoholism and addiction because it is so useless in the face of this disease, and delays for so long the decisions and actions that can and should be made to help those suffering from it. "I love them so much," "I'll love them until the day I die," "they're my soul mate," "I'll never find anybody else like them," "nobody will ever love me like they love me," "I'll never love anybody like I love them."
Please. It's all so melodramatic, poetic, and Shakespearean. It's also not true.
I love the drama of love, and I struggle with my addiction to it (and perhaps my alcoholic wife), but make no mistake that it has been absolutely my worst enemy in my battle with the disease of alcoholism. "Love" is a barrier to recovery-- for some it is the barrier to recovery.
Let go of the drama, let go of the Hallmark fantasy, and start making your decisions based on reality. What people do (NOT what they say), how you want to live, and when it applies what is truly best for your children and you-- not your addict or alcoholic.
Take what you want and leave the rest.
Cyranoak
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Agreed--if you want to support her, then support her sponsor's suggestion and stop the contact. Her sponsor knows better than you do what she needs to do.
I haven't heard a single person here suggest it's a good idea for you to maintain contact with her. Her sponsor agrees.
Maybe it's time to have a little faith that maybe people not as intertwined with the situation might see something you don't.
I haven't heard a single person here suggest it's a good idea for you to maintain contact with her. Her sponsor agrees.
Maybe it's time to have a little faith that maybe people not as intertwined with the situation might see something you don't.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 166
Marie thank you for posting that. I so needed it. I am feeling sad tonite, not just for myself but my xagf who is going to be missing the kids. I have to keep remind myself of consequences! Her choices! And first and foremost my four kids. Actions....not words. Her actions didn't show love at all.
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Join Date: Jan 2013
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Hi all. Late night. Emotional night. Lets just say that today is again the first day of no contact. I am fueled by anger. No more pity. All numbers blocked, all email blocked.
The circumstances in addition to what you already know- I went to EXAG's place tonight. We were to spend tomorrow together - the decision to move everything out was put on hold as she stated she wanted to move toward reconciliation on Tuesday, and would be telling the 3rd party no more contact. Tonite when I inquired about her actions regarding 3rd party, she started to backpedal. On Tuesday it was "I will no longer see him and no longer talk with him." Today it was "I need to start putting some space between her and 3rd party, and define some boundaries." "I don't want to hurt him." BS. I guess hurting me is still acceptable. I left, taking a new iPad that I gave her a few weeks ago. It happened to be opened to her ***** account (really) and I found the email - now the true extent of her relationship with him is known- she can no longer sugarcoat. Lies after lies after lies. I acted very immaturely, and honestly don't care. I wrote a dissertation email to the 3rd party about the extent of her lies and manipulation over the past 3 months. Not a nasty email, just a statement of the facts. I forwarded him emails and texts backing up my points. Not my place, but at least he will know the truth. I even let him know of the dates that we had recently slept together (I left that part out about Tuesday's visit). Perhaps I will come off as the "crazed" jilted lover. Don't care. Pride gone. Dignity gone.
Regarding her sobriety - Right now I could care less. I am now awake and listening and going to fend for myself.
The circumstances in addition to what you already know- I went to EXAG's place tonight. We were to spend tomorrow together - the decision to move everything out was put on hold as she stated she wanted to move toward reconciliation on Tuesday, and would be telling the 3rd party no more contact. Tonite when I inquired about her actions regarding 3rd party, she started to backpedal. On Tuesday it was "I will no longer see him and no longer talk with him." Today it was "I need to start putting some space between her and 3rd party, and define some boundaries." "I don't want to hurt him." BS. I guess hurting me is still acceptable. I left, taking a new iPad that I gave her a few weeks ago. It happened to be opened to her ***** account (really) and I found the email - now the true extent of her relationship with him is known- she can no longer sugarcoat. Lies after lies after lies. I acted very immaturely, and honestly don't care. I wrote a dissertation email to the 3rd party about the extent of her lies and manipulation over the past 3 months. Not a nasty email, just a statement of the facts. I forwarded him emails and texts backing up my points. Not my place, but at least he will know the truth. I even let him know of the dates that we had recently slept together (I left that part out about Tuesday's visit). Perhaps I will come off as the "crazed" jilted lover. Don't care. Pride gone. Dignity gone.
Regarding her sobriety - Right now I could care less. I am now awake and listening and going to fend for myself.
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