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3 Choices - Florida

Old 05-19-2010, 08:37 AM
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3 Choices - Florida

I could use some advice on which of the 3 options I should take with my AH. His drinking is at his worst right now. 3 options: 1. Baker Act - IFFF he is a danger to himself or others, they can evaluate him for up to 72 hours. The police would decide and it could happen immediately. 2. Marchman Act - with 2 other witnesses, the court could determine that he must go into a treatment facility but it could take up to 10 days. 3. Do nothing, detach, "Let go and let God," hope he hits his bottom, don't interfere.

I truly can't decide. He's been at work for 3 days drunk. Our employees (at least 6) have seen the beer cans and had to walk over him to get to their supplies. He attempts to answer the phone, but he's incoherent. He pees and soils his pants (and it's obvious). He can't walk well but manages the 1/2 block to the store to get more beer when he starts coming down from the buzz. His family is involved but they are far away and also can't convince him to get help. He calls them in attempts to blame me for all his problems, but they try to get him to get help.

Part of me just wants to detach and practice non-interference. But I'm not sure if this is best when he so desperately needs help before he hurts himself. He has before, broken each leg on separate occasions, busted open his head, etc. Also, I don't know if I can just wait while he destroys our business. I can't get him out of here.

Please help.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:01 AM
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Last summer I, too, tossed around several ideas such as yours. I even wrote to the show "Intervention". My RAH was as bad as yours, in almost every respect, and healthwise, he was dying (he has ALD, and has almost died twice in the past). I decided to go w/option no. 3, let go and let God. I had been thru options 1 and 2 several times before. Didn't work for me, just kept the cycle of insanity going. Finally, he left me, and I really let it go. Went no contact, he called a million times, I put the answering machine on lowest, ringer off, didn't listen to the messages. Let him go to drink himself to death if that's what he chose. He was either gonna sink or swim. After two months gone, he got 3 dwi's in one week, spent time in county jail, and is now over 6 mos. sober. Was that his bottom? I don't know. We don't know what anyone's bottom is. Should he relapse, I have to let go and let God ... same w/my AD. I have temp custody of her two little girls, have not heard from her in over 2 weeks, don't know whether she's alive or dead, but again, I had to let go and let God. That's what works for me. She needs to hit her own bottom, whatever that may be. I believe you can't save someone who doesn't want to be saved, and me personally, I don't believe in interventions. Until they want help, the cycle will never end. JMO. You're in my thoughts. Hugs.
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Old 05-19-2010, 09:12 AM
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hi francis-

i would go with option #3, let go and practice detachment.

take all that energy you spend on him and turn it onto you: your recovery, your goals, your life.

you might want to explore your options for financial separting from him...things like bank accounts, credit cards and car insurance. perhaps discuss the business options with your accountant...how to protect yourself.

and then, i would just let him (hopefully) hit his bottom. i wouldn't engage him about his drinking anymore...i would imagine that's all been said and he's choosing to drink...he's his own person, it's his life.

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Old 05-19-2010, 09:15 AM
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In reading Al Anon literature, it really hit home when they say "We cannot make choices for other people, even for those most important to us. We are not gods, and we can't truly know what is best for anyone else, no matter how obvious a particular course of action may seem to us at the time." It can be so hard to detach and let go, but sometimes we have to do it for our sanity.
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Old 05-19-2010, 10:23 AM
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Thanks so much for responding. It reinforced the non-interference I had almost concluded. I was able to at least get him out of the office and home after 3 days. Aunt talked him into talking to our pastor again about an 11-month treatment program he offered before. So now we're really letting go and letting God.

I feel content in that I did all that I can do or should do. Option divorce probably. He claims he started the process but didn't know the name of the lawyer (more quacking).

Wow, 3 dui's in a week! Were you still married then? How scary!
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Old 05-19-2010, 11:27 AM
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Yep, still married, and after the first one, he called me, promised me if I'd go get him (about 200 miles away), he'd go to rehab, he'd learned his lesson. NOT. Brought him home, he refused rehab, and left the next day for parts unknown again! I said "best of luck to you" and he left. Got the next 2 dwi's in the same week, he called me, I did not even answer the phone. No point in it. He spent time in jail too, I wasn't going to bail him out! Then again, at that point, he didn't even ask me lol. Hang in there.
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Old 05-19-2010, 12:12 PM
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Still at work trying to clean up the mess he made. I just spoke with our biggest customer/client and he asked how ___ was. I said he's not feeling so well. Client said he could tell something was off when he was talking to him on the phone and to wish him well. I'm sure this guy knows after hearing how slurred AH's speech was yesterday or whenever. Sounds like it was a conversation because AH told him he was going to Orlando for the rest of the week. AH can't even drive because of his interlock device (it's supposed to come off this Friday if he can drive sober to get it to the appointment.) This nightmare just never ends.

Queen, did the DWI's also cost you financially because you're still married?
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Old 05-19-2010, 06:45 PM
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Option 3.

Every day I come home from work and get off the Turnpike. And everyday there's a homeless person at the first stoplight. Usually it's a woman. Sometimes she disappears, but she always comes back in new clothes and a new backpack. Over the years she looks worse and worse and worse. She used to hold up a sign, "Need money to get to family in AZ". Now her sign says, "Hungry, thirsty, any help needed. Bless us all". I watched her hair grow from ear length to mid back length. I watched her get fatter and fatter. I watched her go from someone who looked like she was in her early 30s to someone who looks like one of those old dried up apple ladies. She limps now, very heavily. She didn't used to. She looks a lot like my xAH's exwife who has some kind of psychotic/bipolar/schizophrenic problem and is as far as I know is a street person who gets Baker Acted a couple times a year. It never helps.

About a week ago, she was sitting on the rail and was peeing on herself. She didn't care. As I sat at the red light, I saw the dark stain spread down her inner thighs, she just sat there staring into space.

Probably her problem is mental illness, not alcoholism. But like xAH's exwife, I guess she gets Baker Acted regularly, and when she's not there, there's this short, rotund, grizzly guy who clearly does have alcohol problems (how they figure out who gets to be at which corner when is a mystery to me, but there's only one and it's clearly the woman's corner and the guy gets it only by default). I've seen him drop trou and poop right there by the side of the road.

Baker Acting doesn't help these people. All you get is, "Yep, she/he's an alcoholic; yep, he/she's mentally ill; yep, they need to take their meds/quit drinking; good luck and hope you straighten out." Baker acting doesn't help anyone who is not ready to help themselves. They go in for a few days, whine about being there, connive to look like they don't belong there or are willing to comply with the program, whatever it takes to get released...and then they go right back to the lifestyle they had before.

No one gets better until they decide to get better and decide to follow their treatment program. It's not illegal to pee on yourself in public (unless you drop trou). You aren't a danger to yourself or others.

You will get all worked up trying to get them in a hospital against their will, be anxious the whole time they are in there that they are being held long and enough and if the doctors see 'the truth', turn yourself inside out hoping hoping hoping that THIS will make them see reality, that THIS will be 'their bottom'; and they will get out and go right back to what they were doing because they still don't want to get better.

Let it go. Let HP. Focus on yourself and don't interfere. You really can't help or harm him; but you can do both those things to yourself.

(A long way of saying the State of FL doesn't much care and won't give people the treatment they REALLY need because it's expensive, there are too many people who need it, and it doesn't work anyway until they want it.)
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Old 05-19-2010, 08:18 PM
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Yep, Bucyn, that's exactly how it is. You nailed it.
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Old 05-20-2010, 05:41 AM
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francis,

if your husband has a driving device, he's been in trouble with the law already over drinking-related behaviors?

my heart hurts for your ah, but even more so, for you.

i would support stepping in ONE time, to get a person into rehab, if they were so bad off. i have seen and heard of people go to rehab unwillingly, but they have become transformed while in there. it needs to be a long-term program, though. it takes time just for the brain to clear up.
but if it's repetitive, you just get sick right along with the addict.

did he speak with your pastor? that seems to be the best option. with a back-up plan for you to protect your assets, and sanity. as you already know, even if he talks a good talk, it's the follow-through that matters.
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Old 05-20-2010, 08:37 AM
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Yes, I have already stepped in before, 3 times, 3 days each time. I am letting go and it feels so much better. Thankfully, Pastor did come over. It seemed to make a difference. Only time will tell if he will go for the 11 month treatment. He said he probably will, but you can only lead an alcoholic horse to water.... Afterwords, I talked with Pastor alone to explain a little more how serious the situation was and also inform him that I felt I had done everything I could and would have to divorce him (financially necessary) if he didn't get help but AH would also want it anyway. I said that God didn't intend for me to live this way, and He'll forgive me. Pastor said there is only one unforgivable sin and divorce isn't it. I was proud that I didn't ask permission or feel religiously oppressed by a strict God; God is more loving. Still don't know where all this will end up. I just hope I will find strength and get past the tears.
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