TakingCharge999

good for you for sticking to your guns!!

do you realize there may be no "end" or bottom? this is as good as it gets... I can imagine him falling from the bike on purpose just to have an excuse to get a ride again...

whyamistaying... you still have not answered.. why are you staying?

anvilhead on boundaries should be in every self esteem and education program in the world!

whyamistaying

I know, I haven't answered the question and I don't know. After I got the kids to sleep, I just sat there crying. There must be something wrong with me to put up with this? I feel like we are 2 cars each heading different ways both to their bottom, but who will get there first? I KNOW I don't deserve this. I Know my kids don't. This isn't a life. It isn't normal to have a husband who doesn't come home. So maybe it is denial, I don't know. I just keep thinking "how did this get to this?"

He is out on the streets drunk. He called me again. He told me the train didn't work out and asked me to pick him up. Never made it to the train and said he didn't know where he was, but would call me back as his phone was dying. If I do hear from him tonight, I am not picking him up. So he is miles away from work, no money, no bike, and now no phone.

I look at other families on our block and I want what they have. I used to have it and I don't anymore. I guess a part of me thinks he has to be in there somewhere. I am scared to do parent alone, but on the same hand, I know I have been doing it.

sandrawg

I think it is important to get to the question of "how did you let the situation get this far"...for your own recovery, so that you never end up in a situation like this again... my sister went from alcoholic marriage to alcoholic marriage...THREE of them...wasted most of her life. She never paused in btwn to see, why do I keep attracting dysfunctional, wounded people?

However, I'd suggest that the main question you ask yourself right NOW not be "how did this happen" but "how do I get out of it"???

And yo're right-NO, none of the things you are dealing with are normal! They are total craziness and I'm glad you see it.

He is not the man you married, and he may never be, I hate to say it. My xabf may never be the guy he is, when he's not drinking, for any permanent length of time. I had to let go of that desire and focus on myself.

TakingCharge999

whyyy I am sorry you cried tonight its a very lonely place to be, but do not feel alone, we are all here for you...

I remember your previous posts and you have come very far, keep moving forward!!

You can regain what you lost, it may look different, but you can regain it... peace, joy, tranquility... its all in your hands and these are things that belong to you... always belonged to you and are right there inside you, those are yours for the taking... we all think you deserve them... do you believe you deserve joy and peace in your life...?

Freedom1990

That's the approach my sponsor takes with me-no more trying to figure out why, but rather to ask myself what can I do about it now?

There is plenty of time later on to ponder how/why.

If I'm not working on a solution, I'm still living in the problem.

LaTeeDa

I recognize that frustration. It comes from trying to control someone else. It's not getting better because you are still under the illusion that 'better' has something to do with him. That YOU cannot be better until HE does something differently.

People change. It's not just alcoholics, sometimes people just change. Clinging to what he once was, what your marriage once was, is futile. Once you accept that things are the way they are--NOW--you can begin to move forward from there. Life is not a car. You cannot put it in reverse and go back. It only goes forward. You can't make him be who you want him to be.

L

JenT1968

hello there,
i hope that you un-plugged the phone last night and got some rest. he is a grown man doing exactly what he wants to do.

you are a grown woman - are you doing exactly what you want to do? I'm guessing no.
I have had the pain that you have right now. The frustration, the anger with myself: WHY couldn't he see the damage?
WHY wouldn't he shape up and change?
WHY was I putting up with this?
WHY was I staying?
WHY didn't I just leave and take the kids and live somewhere else.
WHY was I hanging on to this horrible relationship?

mostly, I was angry at me, I hated me, and was ashamed of me for being so worthless, for believing I was so worthless, that this was all I deserved. I may have vented more about him (and don't get me wrong I hated what he was doing and most of the time I hated him too) but I thought I was pathetic.

I came up with answers, exhausted and disoriented as I was, but in reality most of them were excuses (e.g. I wanted to pay off my debts before I left: I didn't actually pay anything off because I had to keep staying in hotels to get away from him, or keeping the kids out all day etc).

These weren't lies, but they weren't the real reasons, my real reasons were hidden and complex. I needed help to find them: a counsellor. I weave stories around myself to protect me, and I need help to strip away those layers and get to my real motives. Many of them when they come to light disappeared because they were illusory and false and once I examined them with a professional 3rd party this started to become clear.

Howevetr, for me, this was still very hard to do when I was still in the maelstrom of madness that living with an alcoholic involves. I don't live with AH now, I have not ruled out one day that I will again (of course he may decide to, as is his right). But I will never, ever, risk going back to the life I had with him before, and I am free to do that "how did I get here?" stuff: well rested, with space and peace and time to really feel and examine, not whilst trying to constantly fire-fight and detach and all the rest of it.

I LOVE my life now and I love me, who I am, what I do and that is priceless.

wanting

You know, a lot of good can come from reaching out to people - your neighbors, your family, his family, friends. I was ashamed of my husband's alcoholism for a long time and did a lot to cover it up. Only recently have I talked to people who said they wondered for a long time when I'd leave him. Only very recently did I talk to AH's father about everything, and I think his father knowing really helped. He seems to be finally taking his recovery seriously. I didn't do it to help; I did it because I have realized that speaking my truth is one of the most important things in my life right now. I've told AH that I won't share his private thoughts with anyone, but that I won't keep his alcoholism or the affair he had a secret. I think I was enabling my AH with my embarrassment before.

whyamistaying

Thank you everyone. I have millions of excuses, but really it boils down to I am scared. Scared to do it all by myself. Scared to say I failed at my marriage. As he gets worse and worse, I can't deny reality. My mind can't think this is going to go away. But my insides want it to be like it was.

Last night I gave him to God. I cried my eyes out while listening to worship music and prayed for him.

I came home from work (parents had the kids). Somehow he had made it home, but not by me. There was dirt all in the kitchen and a shovel in the backyard. He had buried beer and drank it.

There comes a time when I can't accept a little bit and deny the rest. I think I am seeing reality much much more, but I don't think I see it 100%.

sandrawg

whyamistaying, have you ever heard the phrase "feel the fear and do it anyway"?

So many of our human fears are erroneous.

What are you afraid of? Are you afraid that if you leave, your life will be worse than this one? How on earth could it be? What could be worse than what you're going through?

How many people on this forum, have left their alcoholics, then came back and said "wow, my life is SO much worse now that he's gone. I really miss that life. I miss the vomiting on the couch, the rolling around in poop...the lies, the excuses, the verbal abuse, the physical abuse..."

I recommend you sit and write down your fears. What's your worst case scenario? This is a form of cognitive behavioral therapy, and it works very well for depression and anxiety. You write down your fears. Then imagine, what if they came true? What's the WORST that can happen. Then ask yourself, is this really a realistic fear?

Now write down alternative scenarios.

For ex., one of your fears seems to be "People will think I'm a failure if I get a divorce." When you sit down and analyze that fear, do you really think it's valid? Whose opinion are you afraid of?

Is your fear of others' opinions of you that powerful, that you'd stay in this toxic situation??

You know what, I've been through a divorce. Nobody cares. Nobody looked at me as a failure. Divorce is so prevalent...nobody cares. do you think your neighbors, who've seen him at his worst, are gonna blame you for leaving?

Pls, when you evaluate the pros and cons of leaving, be realistic.

LaTeeDa

Scared is okay, even normal when the denial starts to melt away. Like Jen, I needed professional help to get from where I was to where I wanted to be. I'm so grateful that I finally got desperate enough to seek help. I'm also very grateful that the therapist I found had a complete understanding of alcoholism and codependence. She saved my life.

Another thing that helped me is journaling. Write it all down on paper. If you keep it in your head, then it's easy to lie to yourself. You can say "it wasn't really that bad," or "maybe I overreacted." If you write it down, it's harder to deny.

Start with:

He stole jewelry and only came clean when he got caught.
He took checks without telling you.
He buries beer in the backyard.

I'm sure you can write a long list and I urge you to. Then, when you begin to doubt that it's really that bad, go back and look at the list.

The hardest of the three A's is Acceptance. Once you get that one, action is a piece of cake.

L

naive

hi whyamistaying-

from where i'm sitting, i see enormous progress in the last few months in you facing the reality of your situation.

i know for myself, i had to witness it for a while with "fresh eyes" and then, only afterwords, could i begin to establish healthy boundaries and make my move for freedom.

i had a sort of breakthru one day. i was peaceful and sitting outside in the garden. my xABF came and sat down on the bench. he started moaning about bills, car insurance, not having any money...i could feel my peace slipping away and him trying to draw me into his "stuff"...i looked at the sky and it was a sunny, beautiful day and at that moment bernadette's words came into my head: "you are free in this moment"

and i realized i was and it washed over me.

and then i was back in the yard and xABF was still moaning but it was different.

ItsmeAlice

whyamistaying - This chaos will end. Everything that has a beginning has an end. How it ends for your AH is for him to know and for us to find out later. How it ends for you is a matter of choice.

Have you ever seen instructions for or (God forbid) been in a car when it's being submerged?? There's this moment where a calm rational choice has to be made. You have to slow down the reflex to rage against the locked doors and rolled up windows and wait. You have to put the fear of drowning aside in order to save yourself from drowning, which is entirely likely given the circumstance your in. You have wait for the water to surround the and for the car to begin to fill. In some cases the car has to almost entirely fill for this to work, imagine that moment! Then...miraculously...the doors can open because a balance between the pressure outside and inside is achieved.

Before you can succeed in improving of your situation, you must first shed the immobilizing fear of it.

The car is sinking - His disease is progressing rapidly. The more his addiction is his own to bear by law or by boundary the worse he is getting. Entirely predictable to those who've been through it.
The water is rising outside and some is leaking in the car - He is out there running amok and bringing bits of chaos back for you to enjoy at home - dirt and a shovel? WTF?
You are starting to feel the panic and see the inevitability of what could happen here - he has been in a fight, he is not coming home and not caring for his family, he is badgering you for help though he knows full well your boundary. Things are coming to a head.

Here is where the fear is at it's greatest when you are on the brick of a breakthrough. Just before a balance is met and the door eases open for you is the most death defying time.

I understand this fear. I was there. When XABF got laid off from his job, we lost our housing. He went down hill faster than a soccer ball on Mount Everest. I was terrified!! I wrote here, I called friends, I emailed my family. I sought out support and I made some very tough decisions, but it was my time to escape. In spite of the fear I kept going. I kept my wits about me somehow and by divine intervention. I even wrote an old employer and worked behind his back to get him housing and a job to go to so I could get away without him following me. I took a journey in moving that I never could have imagined myself doing alone. But somehow a balance was struck between his addiction and my codependency and a moment in time laid out by my HP occurred where I stepped out of the chaos and into my new life.

Now, I didn't cross into nirvana. On the contrary. I'm not where I want to be but I'm out of that sinking car and on dry land.

The end is coming, honey, stay calm, HP has a plan for you, it's been there all along, it's just scary not being in the driver's seat any more, I know. That balance is coming hang on, hang on.

Alice

LaTeeDa

And just for the record, marriages fail, not people. Those of us who have been married to alcoholics are not failures. In fact, I gave my marriage one hell of a try, it (the marriage) failed, not me. Same goes for you.

L

bookwyrm

Thank you LTD. Realising this this was something that took me ages to get into my head!

HanahGoodness

WhyamIstaying,

I read your posts and feel that they are mine! When we both finally figure out what it is we want for ourselves then our path will be clear. For me, I gave my husband an ultimatum last week, and then went to see a lawyer. Now the ball is in my court and I need to make a decision that will be best for me. Are you seeing a therapist for you? Do you have a sponsor from Al-anon for you?

Jadmack25

The surprise for me is not that marriages with addictions involved fail, it is that anyone is sane enough to get help or even gets out alive.

So called "normal" marriages and relationships break down for many reasons, but for people to persevere for years in a marriage that has the misery of an alcohol or drug addiction nightmare added to the mix, says a lot for their strength and commitment.

When the marriage finally ends, and we are left mourning, bewildered and afraid, then as much strength and commitment is needed to keep going, and build our lives over again. Please God, with help they will be healthier and happier for everyone.

I asked 4 questions of myself one day, before I walked out of my 27 year marriage.

1) What the hell can I do to change his stupid mindset and insane behavior?
2) Is this what I want for the next 20 years, if it doesn't kill him or me sooner.
3) Can I stay with him, ignore him and do my own thing or not?
4) Why am I staying now?

My answers were
1) He is past listening to me, there is nothing I can do for him to change.
2) I can't face this for another month, let alone another 20 years.
3) I am his wife, how can I ignore him? Where would I go, and do what?
4) Because I loved him. If we split it will hurt and shock kids, friends and church.

I moved out a week later, and had to get used to my living alone for the first time in my life, and in a pokey little flat.

I spent the first 6 months lonely, miserable and bored out of my mind, also ashamed of being such a failure as a wife that my ah preferred getting drunk to being with me.

I often thought about going back to him, but being afraid he'd just laugh at me for wanting to, kept me from making any moves, Thank God.
That was back in 1991.

A friend finally aimed me at Alanon, which saved my sanity and I began learning to trust myself and really live again.

I had plenty of mixed feelings at my XAH's funeral, 2 weeks ago, and tears were many, but I do not regret leaving.
Staying,I could not have changed his drinking habits which made his later years a living hell for him, but it would have sure changed mine, and only for the worse.

God bless

sandrawg

Wow, wow, wow. Powerful powerful words. I think we can all learn from your experiences! Thanks for sharing.

whyamistaying

I haven't had much energy to do much...just soaking it in. I walked the dogs last Friday (I think) and ever since then, have just been blah and kinda in a fog.

I walked my dogs and a neighbor came up. She told me AH had gone to neighbor's door looking for a ride to the store and to buy beer. That they had bought him beer. I didn't know what to say. This cloud engulfed me. We talked and I told her I would pay her back for beer, but that this would be the last time. So all together he talked to 3 neighbors while drunk.

Lots of anger. Of sorting things through. He didn't come home Thurs night and then Sat was out with his brother and had no beer.

That is when I don't get it. It is a disease, yet he can decide to not drink it. So what you all say is true...he picks beer before us. I see that, but I get caught up into the entire body wanting it, disease....

I've been reading the One Day At A Time and will ask my question in a new thread.

ItsmeAlice

I'm so sorry about the neighbor. I do hope that was not their reason for approaching you....to get paid back for the beer. You don't owe them anything. AH can pay them back himself. Don't let that embarrassment over his behavior creep back in. These are his consequences, not yours.

As to your question, try to remember that there is a need to drown emotions at work here. When he is at home, I'm sure there are alot of emotional, financial, and spiritual triggers that he would rather numb away than deal with. When the triggers are lessened, the need is less. The addict mind can also justify some amazingly backward thinking as we have all witnessed at one point or another. Your AH can easily justify why he needs to drink anytime he is in a certain situation and can go without in others.

My XABF was very proud of the fact that he could go without smoking or having any beer when he was having dinner with family. He'd crow the whole way home about he really wanted to light up right there at the table or get spitting drunk in front of everyone, but he has self control and that's why he wasn't really an alcoholic and that's why the problem was really mine. Made for some pretty uncomfortable car rides home I'll tell you. Of course the next night he would dash right home from work with a 12-pack and announce he was treating himself for abstaining the night before and proceed to drink until he passed out. I guess what got him through those nights away from his drug of choice was dreaming of the binge that would follow.

Trying to understand the 'whys' is futile. Tough to let go of but futile all the same.

Alice