I hate when people say it's a choice.
Recovered from Hopeless State
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 2,156
Originally Posted by Dee74 
Happy weekend all - look a bunny! 
I was invited today to go to church tomorrow with my neighbor and his family. I went with them a couple times a few years ago. Generally I'm not a church goer. But for Easter Sunday, and to celebrate my resurrection, I'm there baby!
Recovered from Hopeless State
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 2,156
Originally Posted by Cow
You know how like in physics, to get out door, you first has to go half way to door, then half way of half way, etc., and this half steps increments is infinite, yet, at some point, you out the freaking door.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,785
Originally Posted by SoulSister
Clarification and truth in the matter doesn't have to be taken as preachy or rigid.
Every book ever written and any story ever told written is open to interpretation, even the bible. People have been fighting over that for years because we are human and that is what we do.
There is no right or wrong. It is what works for us personally and who is anyone to say what works for me can't work for others. If 100 people stay sober your way and 100 people stay sober my way are we really going to point and say, okay but I know the REAL truth? Come on. Really? I have not once looked at you and said "You are wrong" because you are not since it works for you. Your truth and my truth may be different, that does not make one better than the other.
What I hear from you is "your sponsor is wrong, which in turn makes you wrong and that is wrong because you are going to pass that wrongness on to a newcomer and make them wrong too" or "Okay, your sober but you are not staying that way because you are doing it right".
I have heard people say many times here "Today, I have a choice not to drink" which is always backed up with, I have this choice because I work the AA program i.e the steps, the principles, etc etc.
I never knew I had a choice. I never knew that I could live and not drink. I had done it for so long that I did not know that was an option, a choice.
It is a clear to me as two cards on a table, One is marked the AA program and all that it entails and the other is my old life drinking and dying. I can choose one or the other. There are no other cards. One or the other. I chose the AA one. I have to do a LOT to keep my card but I am willing and open so I learn more and more. I don't stop learning because if I do, that will be my downfall. I can never say, I got this or I know it all now. Ever.
Listen, most of the meetings I go to are in Akron and I not throwing that out there so I can try and prove a point. The fact is that is where I live and that is what I have heard. I have heard "I have a choice".
You may need to come here and show us how we have no truth and clarify it for us because in your interpretation, we are doing it wrong, we are false. We have not learned the true AA program and in turn are not teaching the AA program correctly.
The part of Bill W's paper I love the most is this part....
"For most of us this last choice is really ours;"
I am one of those people in the most category or at least I feel I am. I do have a choice, I don't once I have that first drink.
It is that black and white to me which make is simple. I like simple.
I have gotten a little to wrapped up in all this, not sure why, I am normally very calm and serene. I think I have to look at that. I see a character defect peeking it's ugly head and on Easter of all days.
It is a time for new beginnings and I think I should take that as a suggestion from my HP and move on.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,479
If there's ever a problem just hit the report button 
- it's a better way to let all the mods and admin know that there's a problem in a thread
I think right of reply is a reasonable thing to expect here - but if you're going to continue to argue interpretations one on one, perhaps PM would be a better medium for that, guys.
thanks
D
- it's a better way to let all the mods and admin know that there's a problem in a thread I think right of reply is a reasonable thing to expect here - but if you're going to continue to argue interpretations one on one, perhaps PM would be a better medium for that, guys.
thanks
D
Grateful
Join Date: May 2013
Location: NC
Posts: 1,763
For me I have no choice when it comes to alcohol. As long as the obsession is present I WILL drink again. It might not be today or tomorrow, but it WILL happen. That is a given fact for me from my past experiences. I have taken the Steps working with a sponsor and the obsession with alcohol has been removed. Now I have a choice. In the 10th Step promises it tells me that the the alcohol problem has been removed (which I experienced), but it also tells me that it is contingent on keeping in fit spiritual condition.
On page 85 it goes on to tell me:
Resting on my laurels IS a choice I have. I can either live by the principals of the 12 Steps or I can become complacent and risk the obsession returning. If the obsession returns I then lose all choice in the matter of drink.
I think much of what has been debated regarding whether or not we have a choice when it coming to alcohol is a matter of semantics. I think most of us can agree that at times we have drank against our own will. IMO once we find a healthy way to remove the obsession to drink we then have a choice of whether or not we continue to live that way. It's kind of like the diabetic having a choice of whether or not to take their medicine daily to keep the symptoms from coming back. If they choose not to then they will have no choice of whether or not they become sick again.
On page 85 it goes on to tell me:
It is easy to let up on the spiritual program of action and rest on our laurels. We are headed for trouble if we do, for alcohol is a subtle foe. We are not cured of alcoholism. What we really have is a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition.
I think much of what has been debated regarding whether or not we have a choice when it coming to alcohol is a matter of semantics. I think most of us can agree that at times we have drank against our own will. IMO once we find a healthy way to remove the obsession to drink we then have a choice of whether or not we continue to live that way. It's kind of like the diabetic having a choice of whether or not to take their medicine daily to keep the symptoms from coming back. If they choose not to then they will have no choice of whether or not they become sick again.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: canada
Posts: 7,242
sigh
someone knows and will tell us the "real capital T Truth" of what's right in AA....and here i thought, with my limited understanding, that nobody speaks for AA. hm...that that is an AA tenet...
[]
easter. bunnies. chocolate. yum.
someone knows and will tell us the "real capital T Truth" of what's right in AA....and here i thought, with my limited understanding, that nobody speaks for AA. hm...that that is an AA tenet...
[]
easter. bunnies. chocolate. yum.
Recovered from Hopeless State
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 2,156
Thanks also Grungehead. I just got back from church with my neighbor and hjs family. First time in years. I stood up and accepted God. Got a free Tshirt as a result, lol. Got a LOT more too. I intend to make this, and AA meetings here and there, part of my spiritual maintenance now that I feel it has been awakened. SR is a big part of that maintenance as well.
Recovered from Hopeless State
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: New Jersey, USA
Posts: 2,156
Originally Posted by fini
sigh
someone knows and will tell us the "real capital T Truth" of what's right in AA....and here i thought, with my limited understanding, that nobody speaks for AA. hm...that that is an AA tenet...
someone knows and will tell us the "real capital T Truth" of what's right in AA....and here i thought, with my limited understanding, that nobody speaks for AA. hm...that that is an AA tenet...
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