YesImReady

Reading the many post here have me confused , I only started Subs 11 days ago
First 2 days 8mg per day
Next 3 days 6mg per day
Next 4 days 4mgs per day
Next 3 days 3mg per day ( until tomorrow )
Then I want to spend 5 days 2mg per day
Next 5 days 1mg per day
Next 5 days .5 mg per day
Then CT ( taking 1-week vacation from work )

My total detox I hope to complete in 4-weeks
As you guys know I was doing handfuls of Oxy's every day for over 10 years.
Right now If I was to do more than 3mg per day I know would feel over medicated.
I have no desire to do lager amounts than I'm doing now and actually feel better everytime I reduce my doses
My anxiety actually decreases & my sleep improves so that is part of why I'm confused reading all the post here.
That and reading that some people have been taking Subs for longer than 90 days I just can't understand.
Yes I know we are all different but believe me I think that has something to do with the difficulties that most are having.
Long periods on subs messes with your mind and plays games with your thoughts , anxiety , sleep , depression & so forth.
I & my wife both went into this with the same frame of mind , Suboxne was not going to be a maintenance program for us but just a medication to take to lessen the withdraws when we stopped the Opiates. We never even thought of Subs as a long term solution but a short detox from the opiates that were ruining our lives. So far so good and so far our plans have worked perfect up to this point.
Now I don't have a crystal ball so I don't know what is going to happen after I take that last Suboxone dose but I'm confident that it is going to be much easier than not using it to kick the Oxy's
I also believe in my heart that because we stayed on it for such a short time that the lasting effects will be much less than if we have used it as a maintenance program and stayed on it for 6 months or longer as I have read from so many others on this site.

Good luck to all ,

God bless and may sobriety come soon for everyone here and out there in the rest of the world.

sorb

glad to see youre doing good, YesImReady. if you follow that plan i think youll have a fairly easy time coming off subs. at least compared with C/T oxy withdrawal.

suboxone is a really powerful medicine tho. im still only taking .25mg per day and when i skip a day i can totally tell. mind you, i was on oxy/subs (oxy 5-6 days per week and subs when ever i didnt have oxy) for about 3 years then went to H/subs (same type of situation, either H or subs EVERY day) for almost a year so i feel like i had a long built up tolerance to opiates in general including suboxone so it makes me think im almost detoxing from a long term maintenance situation from suboxone.

either way, as ive said before, ill take physically dependent on a small amount of suboxone daily over being strung out on dope ANY DAY OF THE WEEK. keep up the good work tho man

YesImReady

Sorb I hear you ,, Subs are 1000 times better to be taking then either Oxy or H

Myself I just want my freedom so bad its driving me crazy.
I'm talking about the freedom from any type of meds ,
I hated the feeling when I was using Oxy's that I couldn't even plan a family vacation or even a weekend trip , dang I couldn't even plan a night out with friends more than a couple of days in advance because I wasn't sure if I would have any pills took take with me.
Now though it is the same with the Subs , I'm finally to the point that I only have to see my doctor to get more once a week but I can't plan any trips for say next month because I truly don't know have I'm going to feel or even are far I will be in my recovery by then. Yes I have a plan but we all know how plans go for addicts.

I really feel like I have been living in a prison for the last 10 plus years.
One that no one else but myself could see & because of that others couldn't understand why I wouldn't commit to a camping trip or night out with my friends.
Relatives wanted to visit from out of state and I would have to make up excuses why I wouldn't be around.

So that is what I mean by I can't wait until I have my freedom back and that is not going to happen until I'm completely off of everything including the Subs
Am I rushing it some ?
Maybe ,, but man I want my freedom and I want it bad !

Good luck to you & to all that are reading this

peanut44

I think it depends on how long you've been abusing drugs. 17 years for this girl.

I'm taking a small amount, actually today i totally forgot to take it. That never happened when i was taking vicodin!!!.

And you're right, i would plan everything around those stupid pills!! I hated living like that.

I think it's best to take the absolutely lowest therapeutic dosage that you possibly can and listen to what your body tells you and be honest about it. You may have rebound pain from taking pills for so long but that's all it is, rebound pain.

Personally, I'm going to make mine a shorter plan but everyone is different. I'm glad you and your wife are doing well

Lyoness

My motto is everyone is different and has a different set of experiences and path to follow. And everyone responds to subs differently as well. If you can get off the subs quickly and stay sober that is awesome!

For me, I was/am so seriously addicted to oxy, used it for so long and so high of a dose (450-500mg/day) and was snorting and injecting it so I feel like my long taper that had me at a high dose to start was right for me. Just me.

I actually felt frustrated with my subs doctor at first because he kept insisting that my taper would be six months no matter what but that he also felt that my history of use was so bad I'd probably fail and have to go on methadone. Thanks for the confidence in me doc!

Now he's said that the research he sees says that 6-12 mos. on the subs shows the best success rate. And he seems to have more faith that I'll make it. I don't know how long my taper will end up being and sometimes I feel afraid to post what my story looks like because I'm not doing a super quick jump off taper and I'm not on a super low dose.

At the same time I know myself. I know if I wasn't on subs right now I'd have a needle in my arm. So which is better? To take it slow, give myself as much time as I need on subs to strengthen my recovery or rush off it because that's what everyone else does?

I know I don't want to be on subs forever, and maybe I'm addicted to it or just afraid. All I know is I've been using drugs for half my life (and I'm almost 50) and it's taking time to learn how to live without using/escaping. If subs can help me, or anyone do that, then I feel it is a good thing, a lifesaving thing.

cleaninLI

Hi yesimready,
That's great that you guys are doing well with your taper. Your probably not as confused anymore after reading some of our fellow sub posters comments. They all did a great job explaining why each person and situation is unique. I probably fall into the category of "maintenance" also. I want to get this right the 1st ...or wait a min.....The last time! I'm at the point in my life where another relapse would probably be a "death sentence" for me.

With that being said,
I am a little confused by your post.
I've noticed that your posts concentrate on the "physical" side of your addictions (you and your wife's) to Oxys. We all know that addiction is two-fold and has a much stronger "psychological" side. This "psych" side is the side that kept you and your wife on oxy for 10 years. So, let me ask you these questions. What made you and your wife "ready" to give up the oxys? What is going to keep you and your wife from picking them up again after you taper off the sub? Your insite would be greatly appreciated.

christin1225

Great questions, clean!

In the long run, it's the psychological component of addiction that breaks an addict. I know that's what gets me.

YesImReady

It would take me hours to explain why the physical side is the hardest part of this addiction for me to break but I will give it a try with the short version. First I have broke many other addictions in my life as you can see from my signature. Opiates I believe are going to be the easiest and for the simple reason I have never liked them as I did the others. Meth was the hardest because I actually enjoyed it every time I did it. I would get high every time I did it. That is not the case with Opiates. Let me back up a minute , the key to my success to breaking the other addictions was I learned to HATE the drug ,, I hated everything they did to me , my family and those around me. Now back to Opiates I never got high or had the euphoria that other got from them. From the very beginning I was in such pain from my sciatic nerve that I begged the doctors to cut my leg off. I was taking 15 ( 40mg Oxy ) per day and still living in constant pain until they finally got me into surgery 6 months later. By the time I healed from my back surgery another 6 months I was so addicted to them & had such a high tolerance that I could never take enough to feel the high as others. I simply was taking them to feel normal. Then when my doctors took me off them and I had to buy them off the streets they ruined my life. I spent all of my 401k , I took many personal loans , I lost my house , I had my new Harley repoed , all of my credit cards were maxed out. Many of the last months we have had no groceries in the house to feed the kids. Our water was shut off , by then I just hated the Oxy's so fringing bad I would do anything to get off them. I was not getting high or enjoying them in the least like most others. Then after doing much research I found that the insurance I had would cover treatment called Suboxone , I had never heard of Subs until about 6 weeks ago. I guess the best answer I can give is I just HATE Opiates so much that the mental part that keeps others addicted I don't have working against me. It was totally the physical part and that is now gone.

cleaninLI

Yesimready,
First of all, thank you for sharing your story with us. I could tell by your previous posts that you were FED UP with Oxys and anxious to be through with them. I just didn't actually know your story. I'm sorry that you were in so much pain and were forced to take them for your pain. I'm glad that the surgery was successful and you are now able to put them behind you. Like you, Oxys ruined my life as well. Like you, my 1st experience with them were doctor prescribed. I injured my shoulder at work. Unlike you I became psychologically addicted to them and took them to deal with the stresses of life. I felt they gave me energy to work fulltime, be a mother to my 4 kids, be able to care for my elderly mother who was suffering from cancer and my diabetic husband who was laid up at home recovering from a double-by-pass. I simply had too much on my plate. Unfortunately, as I'm sure you and your wife know, As time went on, I needed more and more to just feel normal. I would run out of my scripts too early to be refilled so I turned to the Internet. There were a couple sites I ordered from and would ship to my home. Then one day I received a notice that my shipment was confiscated. Along with that was a warning that purchasing controlled medicines from the Internet was illegal and that if I continued I would be prosecuted. Shortly after that my Drs. refused to prescribe any oppiates to me. So I went to the streets and found a connection. By this time, I was so desperate I paid the outrageous price. Fast forward 1 year. My husband went back to work and I continued to work. My entire salary went into those pills. Still it wasn't enough. I would trick my husband to give me money for various madeup reasons. All $$ was going to pills. I would call my father and ask for help with the rent, for grocerys, for car payment etc. Everthing my father sent me went for pills.Well, you can kind of see where this is heading and will have to be continued.....my kids want lunch. All I can say is I understand your hatred for those "devil" pills and how they destroy your life. Perhaps by sharing your story on this thread, others will learn from your experience to never take one. We learned the hard way that with oppiates "one is too many and 1000 is never enough." Thanks yesimready.

Lyoness

YesImReady, add my thank you for sharing your story. You shed so much understanding on your situation and it makes so much sense that coming to hate the oxys will help you in your recovery. I think that is the piece that some of us were concerned and confused about, because for us, it is the psychological piece that can be the real downfall.

I have physical pain too and I also fear that could lead me back to using. I am working on it but it is a long, slow road. But I do (now) surely understand why you are much more concerned about that side of things.

I will be keeping you and "Too" in my healing thoughts and prayers. I hope this suboxone journey is truly your ticket out and a total success!

Lyoness

Thank you, too, cleaninLI for sharing your story. I can understand how easily you could have gotten addicted, how you survived all those stresses at all is amazing.

I am hoping and praying for success and peace for all of us in our recoveries!

GraceToo

I absolutely hear you Lyoness. Personally, I'm in no hurry to taper off of Suboxone. I still have SO much work to do, so many bad habits to unlearn, and need to focus on teaching myself a whole new way of living my life. This cannot happen overnight, and I dont expect it to. I have to work through all the damage I've done to the relationships that mean the most to me, I even have to repair my relationship with myself, as silly as that probably seems. I just cannot risk relapsing , and if I try to taper off these things right now, I know thats where I'm headed. Of course, it goes without saying that eventually ,my biggest goal is to be completely drug-free. However, I refuse to put a time stamp on my recovery. I dont expect everyone to understand this rationale, but so far its working amazingly for me. Today is Day 41

With that being said, I also realize that all of us have our own approach to recovery and what works for some may not work for others. I respect and support everyone here on SB and wish recovery and sobriety for us all, no matter how we get there

Lyoness

I hear you, too, GraceToo. I agree that repairing the relationship with self is the most important of all, that is certainly where my greatest damage lies. I want to be able to offer myself the same acceptance, understanding and compassion that I naturally feel for others. I need to learn that and how to survive, just be, without chemically altering myself.

I do understand and heed the concerns of others about trading one addiction for another. I do my best to be honest with my counselor and my doctor. I don't want to stay stuck on suboxone, and maybe I am just using it as a crutch, but right now it is helping me keep (mostly) on track in my recovery. I know without doubt I would be using right now without it. So if that piece can help me stay focused on the rest of my recovery, well, for me, that feels like the best choice.

That is what I love about SR, that we can share and learn from each other's experiences and ideas and help each other on the path of recovery.

BeFree4good

Dont worry yourself with what others are going through. I did Suboxone for about a year then came of not cold Turkey but pretty dam close. Understand every person is not the same and its gonna effect everyone different. My second time around coming off suboxone I did it like you did which is the way it was suppose to be done. When this drug was invented it wasn't suppose to be a year long process. It was a few days either inpatient or outpatient and when it waas over by God it was over. This drug was intended for in patient treatment only and money hungry pricks aka Dr's want you rto stay on it cause they know your gonna keep coming. Man don't let these people tell you anything. If you feelgood and want to continue then keep doing what your doing. And these people that say oh your in for it are full of ****. They don't know you and like I said everybody is different on how they come off this stuff. If you sit around all the time talking about how much your going to feel like **** then guess what ?your gonna feel like ****. Stay positive. Keep moving forward and keep the mind and body. I had really mild symptoms that I used something called Calm. It's all Natural. It's just Magnesium but it takes away cold and hot sweats. I never had severe or even close too sever WD's on this. Kept my skin from crawling. People say Oh the power of suggestion bla bla bla. If it works use it. Don't sit there and tell yourself theother shoe is gonna drop. Cause it won't if you don't let it. Stay busy,exercise. Try that supplement. And it's all natural. And do what feels working for you. Oh by the way I came off 240 mgs a day once. 1000 mgs a day of morphine. Suboxone 3 times .I have 8 years after following that last routine!! You can do it. Avoid the negativity and people saying oh it's coming tomorrow!! I hate assholes that tell people that.We're suppose to support one another not make each other question what's going on in our bodies which they have no idea about!! You can do it!!! I promise. Hit me up anytime!!

BeFree4good

Maybe a little help for those coming off Suboxone. I had a guy call me because powerlifters, body builders, people that work out a little harder than someone just trying to stay in shape and I don't mean your not working hard but there's a bit of a difference. Two things that worked well for me were called CRASH by ProSupplements and CALM ( which is magnesium ) but it really helped with the sweats and creepy crawly skin and sleeping was phenomenal. They're both all natural and helped me tremendously. They even helped my anxieties quite a bit. I'm not saying your gonna be feeling 100 percent but you should feel much better. I don't have the link for the Calcium ascorbate which is calcium and vitamin C but it's suppose to help tremendously as well. It worked wonders for me when I went through withdrawals. Plus exercise, I never missed the gym once so try your best to stay moving and get this crap out as fast as you can.IT's been 8 years clean and I can't remember everything I did but I know these WD's this time were nothing compared to the ones in the past. If I can help in anyway please ask any questions and I'll try to answer them the best I can. I hate going through WD's There's a reason terrorist get you hooked on this stuff and then try to get you to talk!!! Because it's bad. God Bless and hang on to all of those who still suffer!

YesImReady

Just an update as to how it has been going for myself after 14 days off Opiates & on Subs

I have been tapering myself , my doctor still thinks I'm taking 5mg per day.
Actually I have been only taking 2mg per day some days 1.5mg because I simply forget to take my last dose.
Stating tomorrow I'm going to drop down again , my plan is to take 1.5mg per day.
Below was my original schedule I was planning to keep and I'm staying pretty close to it.

First 2 days 8mg per day
Next 3 days 6mg per day
Next 4 days 4mgs per day
Next 3 days 3mg per day ( until tomorrow )
Then I want to spend 5 days 2mg per day
Next 5 days 1mg per day
Next 5 days .5 mg per day
Then CT ( taking 1-week vacation from work )

I can't say right now how long I will stay at 1.5mg per day until I have been there for a few days.
By then I should know if dropping and by how much will be comfortable but right now I still feel like I'm over medicating myself.
I say that because with out thinking, two days ago I took 1mg only 4-hours after taking 1mg and I started getting heavy sweats instantly.
It took about 4 more hours until I felt normal again. So taking 1/2 what my doctors are telling me to take seems to be the right dose for me plus I feel if I can function on a lesser dose now, that when I do come off the subs I'm hoping to have an easier time of it.
Now my wife only started at 4mgs per day and has stayed at that dose the entire time. Choosing to do the program exactly as her doctor lays out.
I was probably taking 150 mgs of Oxy more than her each day so that shows that each of us do react differently to Subs.
I was taking many more Oxys and I'm able to function great on less Subs.

So to rap it all up ,
14 days down and I'm feeling great. Excited as ever to go to the next level. My finances are already looking up, still behind on some of the bills but no shutoff notices , plenty of food in the refrigerator , gas tank is full & we even had extra $$ to go to the movies over the weekend. Man its been a long time since I could say all of that.

cleaninLI

Wow that's great yesimready, looks like you know what's good for you! Already, you are are reaping the benefits of life without Oxys. Hoping for the best to you and your family!

YesImReady

Thanks ,,, yes I was feeling fantastic until a little while ago when I read the post just below this one titled " help suboxone user "

Read that post from someone thinking about ending it all over these stupid frigging Opiates ,, man that just gets to me

I tell you right now I can't even work thinking about it.
If I ever read another post like that again and I won't be able to come back here.
Crap that sucks !

cleaninLI

Yeah, yesimready, that's so sad....so devastating! I really wish someone could help her! The only thing we can do is pray for her.

There is a thread in the newcomers section you might be interested in reading. I strongly disagree with the op when he says that we "pill addicts" are not "angry" with our doc's and defend them. (Painkillers) after reading how angry you and many of us feel about these "devil" pills and how many lives have been destroyed by them.

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...lcoholics.html

Anyway, yesimready, don't leave the forum. Your posts are helping a lot of us. I am afraid of tapering off my subs. Afraid I will be very sick from WD. You know I had a very bad experience when I first switched from morphine pills to subs. I was so sick. Also tell "too" to post sometime. If she's not too busy.

Lyoness

Congratulations, Yes, sounds like you are doing great on your taper. That is awesome and inspiring!

I read the post you are referring to (as best I could because posts written like that, a big wall, are very difficult for me to read physically) and responded. I have to say from my perspective that she has many and deep problems that far predate her drug usage.

It's great that you reached out to her, too, hopefully she'll listen!And keep up the fantastic work in your recovery!