Question about AA
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Question about AA
Hello everyone, I finally got a sponsor in AA and we have been meeting up for an hour once a week and reading the big book together..... right before we began working the steps I relapsed ( I had 40 days sober at this time). She suggested that I have atleast 30 days sober before we start working the steps and so instead we have been reading the book Sober Living .... she said that we would resume the big book after that 30 days of sobriety period..... well I relapsed again before this period (this time I had about 20 days). I was honest with her and asked her if we could continue moving forward with the big book and she basically said not at this point.... she says that I am now back in early recovery and she suggest that I make it to atleast 3 meetings a week, and call her twice a week, find a way to engage in service, unity, recovery regularly and that after I've had some time of sobriety we can reassess. This was a bit surprising to me because isn't relapse common in recovery??? I'm very serious about getting sober and think that these recommendations are a bit strict... at this point im willing to do anything to get sober so I told her I would follow through. I don't wanna start over with a new sponsor because I have already disclosed so much to her... but I have a feeling she might drop me if I relapse again. Is this typical of a Sponsor Sponsee relationship? To be so, strict with relapse. Does working the steps require a certain amount of time sober? Right now im on day 4.... just trying to see what im really getting into. Thanks for reading
Sobriety is Traditional
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Orcas Island, Washington
Posts: 9,067
Hi Sweetpie! Four days is great!
I'm sorry you're struggling with relapses. For me, it was important to start working the Steps as soon as possible, especially Step One. If you can't get your sponsor to help you, maybe you should find a new sponsor.
I'm sorry you're struggling with relapses. For me, it was important to start working the Steps as soon as possible, especially Step One. If you can't get your sponsor to help you, maybe you should find a new sponsor.
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dancing in the Light
Posts: 61,512
Hi Sweetiepie,
I'm not an AA person but I would want to feel comfortable with the suggestions a sponsor makes. If you aren't, then maybe moving on is the best idea. The main thing is to stay sober and Day 4 is fantastic. Please know that you will find lots of support here, too, so I hope you use SR as one of your tools in recovery.
I'm not an AA person but I would want to feel comfortable with the suggestions a sponsor makes. If you aren't, then maybe moving on is the best idea. The main thing is to stay sober and Day 4 is fantastic. Please know that you will find lots of support here, too, so I hope you use SR as one of your tools in recovery.
~sb
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: MD
Posts: 15,967
Find a sponsor who understands that those 12 steps are the program of recovery and there is NO reason to wait on any of those steps. Step one: know deep in your heart you can't drink safely and move on to step 2, do you think the steps will help you? If yes, know you will be cared for during the writing of the 4th and discussing the 5th (step 3 in action) and schedule your 5th step, and work the 4th the day before. Get through steps 5, 6, & 7 at once for relief.
Blue Belt
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Soberville, USA
Posts: 4,174
Those clean days add up.
Over the years, I unknowingly relapsed hundreds of times. I did not realize that quitting for a few days and having a binge was a relapse. Back then, taking a few days off proved to me that I didn't have a drinking problem. Wrong!
The off and on drinking caused kindling and paws. The brain damage is deep. This didn't heal as much as I got used to it.
Hope this helps you break the cycle forever. There are other ways to get high, but it took well over a year clean for my body to start to get high on life. Until then I required major stimulation to get natural highs.
For example, riding a roller coaster worked like a charm. Obviously, I can't ride roller coasters every day.
I primarily used/use exercise to get high now.
Thanks.
Over the years, I unknowingly relapsed hundreds of times. I did not realize that quitting for a few days and having a binge was a relapse. Back then, taking a few days off proved to me that I didn't have a drinking problem. Wrong!
The off and on drinking caused kindling and paws. The brain damage is deep. This didn't heal as much as I got used to it.
Hope this helps you break the cycle forever. There are other ways to get high, but it took well over a year clean for my body to start to get high on life. Until then I required major stimulation to get natural highs.
For example, riding a roller coaster worked like a charm. Obviously, I can't ride roller coasters every day.
I primarily used/use exercise to get high now.
Thanks.
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,444
Hi sweetiepie
I’m not in AA but what Sugarbear and Coldfusion has posted is totally line with what a lot of my friends in AA have said over the years.
Use us too - when you’re in ganger of relapse why not post here first?
I’m not in AA but what Sugarbear and Coldfusion has posted is totally line with what a lot of my friends in AA have said over the years.
Use us too - when you’re in ganger of relapse why not post here first?
Member
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: I'm sitting right here ...
Posts: 918
I used to have a sponsor and attend AA. AA is no longer something I participate in, but - there are numerous other programs and philosophies out there that might be helpful. Refuge Recovery is one. Rational Recovery is one. Secular Sobriety is one. You have options.
Your sponsor has every right to protect her own sobriety by directing you down a different AA path since you continue to relapse. Relapse is not always a part of getting sober.
You might not want to get a new sponsor because you've already shared so much, but maybe you need to not share so much in the first place. Your sponsor is not your therapist or your counselor.
Your sponsor has every right to protect her own sobriety by directing you down a different AA path since you continue to relapse. Relapse is not always a part of getting sober.
You might not want to get a new sponsor because you've already shared so much, but maybe you need to not share so much in the first place. Your sponsor is not your therapist or your counselor.
Life Goes On
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Baltimore, Maryland
Posts: 6,069
Hey sweetiepie,
I could write for hours on the topic of sponsors and suggestions, but I will spare you my personal drama unless you want to talk about it. I've got no trouble sharing (just PM me or ask on this thread), but I have tended to "overshare" in the past.
My experience with my first three (!) sponsors is that they were sort of all cut from the same cloth. They sponsored me the same way they had been sponsored, and their "suggestions" turned out to actually be directives. They told me how to run my program and saw it as a lack of surrender that I had my own ideas. You know what? I will surrender all day long to the idea that I cannot control my drinking. But I can't surrender to someone else's way of doing the program. (By which I mean the bells and whistles that are mainly from the mainstream AA community not from the book.) Believe me, I tried. Although there's a lot of antiquated language and some outdated ideas in those first 164 pages, I believe that program is sound - I can totally get behind it. You may not know it yet, but there is no discussion of sponsorship in there. There is simply the idea of one alcoholic working with another and a good outline of how exactly to work the steps.
Part of my problem was that I didn't know what I was looking for - I mainly knew what I didn't want. You're ahead of me in that regard. You know you want to get on with reading the BB and working the steps. I say, do it! And while you're getting a start, do go to plenty of meetings and keep your ear out for a woman whose share strikes you. It took me a couple of months going to Zoom meetings every day, but I eventually did hear the right woman speak, and I knew instinctively that she was the one. We've been meeting for about six weeks and I couldn't be happier with her. She knows the book inside and out, had experiences similar to mine in her formative years, and understands how deeply hurtful it can be (and was to me) when a sponsor acts more like an authority figure than a mentor. I'd wager you've had enough of 'being less than' in your lifetime. If that's the case, I think you need someone to be your sober buddy that will help to affirm you and lift yourself up.
Keep looking. It's worth it. This is the most important fight of your life and you need the best support you can get.
For what it's worth, I think 3 meetings/week is not enough at this stage. While I don't really ascribe to the notion that "meeting makers make it," I do believe that constant immersion in deliberately sober company is tremendously helpful. Well, at least it is to me. And it's so easy with Zoom right now, I can't think of any good reason NOT to attend at least 1/day.
O
I could write for hours on the topic of sponsors and suggestions, but I will spare you my personal drama unless you want to talk about it. I've got no trouble sharing (just PM me or ask on this thread), but I have tended to "overshare" in the past.
My experience with my first three (!) sponsors is that they were sort of all cut from the same cloth. They sponsored me the same way they had been sponsored, and their "suggestions" turned out to actually be directives. They told me how to run my program and saw it as a lack of surrender that I had my own ideas. You know what? I will surrender all day long to the idea that I cannot control my drinking. But I can't surrender to someone else's way of doing the program. (By which I mean the bells and whistles that are mainly from the mainstream AA community not from the book.) Believe me, I tried. Although there's a lot of antiquated language and some outdated ideas in those first 164 pages, I believe that program is sound - I can totally get behind it. You may not know it yet, but there is no discussion of sponsorship in there. There is simply the idea of one alcoholic working with another and a good outline of how exactly to work the steps.
Part of my problem was that I didn't know what I was looking for - I mainly knew what I didn't want. You're ahead of me in that regard. You know you want to get on with reading the BB and working the steps. I say, do it! And while you're getting a start, do go to plenty of meetings and keep your ear out for a woman whose share strikes you. It took me a couple of months going to Zoom meetings every day, but I eventually did hear the right woman speak, and I knew instinctively that she was the one. We've been meeting for about six weeks and I couldn't be happier with her. She knows the book inside and out, had experiences similar to mine in her formative years, and understands how deeply hurtful it can be (and was to me) when a sponsor acts more like an authority figure than a mentor. I'd wager you've had enough of 'being less than' in your lifetime. If that's the case, I think you need someone to be your sober buddy that will help to affirm you and lift yourself up.
Keep looking. It's worth it. This is the most important fight of your life and you need the best support you can get.
For what it's worth, I think 3 meetings/week is not enough at this stage. While I don't really ascribe to the notion that "meeting makers make it," I do believe that constant immersion in deliberately sober company is tremendously helpful. Well, at least it is to me. And it's so easy with Zoom right now, I can't think of any good reason NOT to attend at least 1/day.
O
Member
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 743
I was a few weeks in by the time I picked a sponsor. We started step work pretty quickly. My sponsor wanted me to call everyday in the first 90 days. I wouldn't say he was particularly strict and trying to run my life. Maybe kind of counter punching a lot of my nonsense. What do you plan on, oh this is what I would do. This is what happened when I did that. I think calling my sponsor every day in those first 90 was huge. My sponsor had a similar pattern of using. We both found a lot of humor in our thinking patterns and how we would rationalize using. I had some of the best laughs back then, like wow how nuts I could actually be. We had a lot in common, the upbringing, education, careers were sort of related but totally different skill sets. We both wished we had the other's skill set. Somebody that used much like I did but already had 10 years of sobriety.
My lawyer already had me trying to do 90 meetings in 90 days for court. My sponsor wouldn't have required that many. I had a lot going on and I guess I averaged like 5 maybe 5 point something a week. The constant bombardment of meetings was extremely helpful. My AV was getting smacked back down every time it tried to get up.
A lot of it was lucky. I was ready to turn 42 and been an alcoholic since 14. I was, like they say of athletes, in the zone. The right ingredients came together at the right time and I saw so much hope in this brand new way of life.
Constant contact with a sponsor kind of injected some clear thinking in my head everyday.
My lawyer already had me trying to do 90 meetings in 90 days for court. My sponsor wouldn't have required that many. I had a lot going on and I guess I averaged like 5 maybe 5 point something a week. The constant bombardment of meetings was extremely helpful. My AV was getting smacked back down every time it tried to get up.
A lot of it was lucky. I was ready to turn 42 and been an alcoholic since 14. I was, like they say of athletes, in the zone. The right ingredients came together at the right time and I saw so much hope in this brand new way of life.
Constant contact with a sponsor kind of injected some clear thinking in my head everyday.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
I understand my sponsor is not my therapist, and the reason that I did share my personal information with her was because it was a part of an assignment she gave me to do as a way to prepare me for working the steps.... but once I relapsed the first time that was put on hold.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: South Bay, So Cal
Posts: 6,124
My family (myself, husband & adult son) are 7 , 14, & 11 years sober. We got sober via AA Meetings, The Big Book, taking action, living the 3 sides ( Unity, Service & Recovery) of the Triangle. And we each have continued our own meetings via ZOOM during this COVID-19 Pandemic.
None of us 3 have relapsed. Personal opinion here: How do you relapse when you really don’t get sober? “Going Out” OFTEN is not Recovery IMHO. If you: stay connected, go to meetings, do the Steps(in order) to the absolute best of your ability,and be of Service, GREAT!!
You can and I’d recommend you start reading the Big Book immediately. You can and I’d recommend you start the Steps immediately. Lastly, I recommend finding another Sponsor. The Sponsors job is to take you through the Steps. Not all Sponsors are a for everybody. We are all unique, look around the Room. Are there individuals who seem like they are doing the walk, not just the talk?
Best of Everything,
Bobbi
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: canada
Posts: 7,242
sweetiepie, yeah, relapse is fairly common, but that does not make it part of recovery, as some might tell you. relapse is part of addiction, and as such is just announcing that you have not found or implemented a “solution”.
as far as doing the stepwork: the steps are the suggested solution to alcoholism in AA. if you are not taking them, you are not implementing that offered solution. it makes no sense to me to wait to get going on the offered solution. seems backwards to me to ask folks to wait for the solution while they’re slip-sliding in the problem.
as far as sponsorship, i urge you to find a sponsor who knows their job is to guide you through the steps. that’s all. not to ask you to stay sober while they try to “prepare you” for the suggested program for recovery.
you might find the AA pamphlet on sponsorship an interesting read:
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j...uekR__kh45gmxJ
as far as doing the stepwork: the steps are the suggested solution to alcoholism in AA. if you are not taking them, you are not implementing that offered solution. it makes no sense to me to wait to get going on the offered solution. seems backwards to me to ask folks to wait for the solution while they’re slip-sliding in the problem.
as far as sponsorship, i urge you to find a sponsor who knows their job is to guide you through the steps. that’s all. not to ask you to stay sober while they try to “prepare you” for the suggested program for recovery.
you might find the AA pamphlet on sponsorship an interesting read:
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j...uekR__kh45gmxJ
Member
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 103
I think I understand where your sponsor is coming from - I don't know how I would try to go through the steps myself, let alone guide someone through the steps, without 100% commitment to the program and sobriety. Relapse can happen, but as fini said it is not a part of recovery and it most certainly isn't a part of the steps. In my opinion, it also isn't a "relapse" after a few weeks of sobriety - you haven't stopped drinking. While I don't believe working the steps requires a set amount of sober time before starting, I do believe it requires a complete buy-in, and repeatedly drinking while attempting the steps is not complete buy-in. Along those lines, a few of your comments suggest strongly that you see "relapse" in your future - and your sponsor likely sees that too. I suspect that once you are ready to fully commit, with the actions to back that up, your sponsor will be more willing to commit her time to you. Wishing you the best.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: ohio
Posts: 3,615
Fini said almost exactly what I was gonna say. 
Don’t get fooled into thinking relapse is part of recovery. I got stuck there and it’s not s good place. Recovery is the path to freedom, and relapse has no place on that path. Do we sometimes lapse back into active addiction, and is relapse part of that? Yep. But it sounds like you don’t want to go there. So don’t go back there.
The steps ARE the program. Anything else us really how folks interpret the program. You’re going to have as many versions of that as there are alkies, lol.
Personally I would say get started on thisesteps ASAP. You don’t have to work up to them. Jump right in. HOWEVERRRR, one sip of booze and start all over. Perhaps chronic relapse Rd get sick of all that starting all over and quit altogether. Maybe your sponsor is trying to avoid that. I dunno.
All i I know is, once I got through those steps, I felt freedom from alcohol for the first time. It’s been glorious.
You deserve that feeling too!
Don’t get fooled into thinking relapse is part of recovery. I got stuck there and it’s not s good place. Recovery is the path to freedom, and relapse has no place on that path. Do we sometimes lapse back into active addiction, and is relapse part of that? Yep. But it sounds like you don’t want to go there. So don’t go back there.
The steps ARE the program. Anything else us really how folks interpret the program. You’re going to have as many versions of that as there are alkies, lol.
Personally I would say get started on thisesteps ASAP. You don’t have to work up to them. Jump right in. HOWEVERRRR, one sip of booze and start all over. Perhaps chronic relapse Rd get sick of all that starting all over and quit altogether. Maybe your sponsor is trying to avoid that. I dunno.
All i I know is, once I got through those steps, I felt freedom from alcohol for the first time. It’s been glorious.
You deserve that feeling too!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Originally Posted by Obladi 
Hey sweetiepie,
I could write for hours on the topic of sponsors and suggestions, but I will spare you my personal drama unless you want to talk about it. I've got no trouble sharing (just PM me or ask on this thread), but I have tended to "overshare" in the past.
My experience with my first three (!) sponsors is that they were sort of all cut from the same cloth. They sponsored me the same way they had been sponsored, and their "suggestions" turned out to actually be directives. They told me how to run my program and saw it as a lack of surrender that I had my own ideas. You know what? I will surrender all day long to the idea that I cannot control my drinking. But I can't surrender to someone else's way of doing the program. (By which I mean the bells and whistles that are mainly from the mainstream AA community not from the book.) Believe me, I tried. Although there's a lot of antiquated language and some outdated ideas in those first 164 pages, I believe that program is sound - I can totally get behind it. You may not know it yet, but there is no discussion of sponsorship in there. There is simply the idea of one alcoholic working with another and a good outline of how exactly to work the steps.
Part of my problem was that I didn't know what I was looking for - I mainly knew what I didn't want. You're ahead of me in that regard. You know you want to get on with reading the BB and working the steps. I say, do it! And while you're getting a start, do go to plenty of meetings and keep your ear out for a woman whose share strikes you. It took me a couple of months going to Zoom meetings every day, but I eventually did hear the right woman speak, and I knew instinctively that she was the one. We've been meeting for about six weeks and I couldn't be happier with her. She knows the book inside and out, had experiences similar to mine in her formative years, and understands how deeply hurtful it can be (and was to me) when a sponsor acts more like an authority figure than a mentor. I'd wager you've had enough of 'being less than' in your lifetime. If that's the case, I think you need someone to be your sober buddy that will help to affirm you and lift yourself up.
Keep looking. It's worth it. This is the most important fight of your life and you need the best support you can get.
For what it's worth, I think 3 meetings/week is not enough at this stage. While I don't really ascribe to the notion that "meeting makers make it," I do believe that constant immersion in deliberately sober company is tremendously helpful. Well, at least it is to me. And it's so easy with Zoom right now, I can't think of any good reason NOT to attend at least 1/day.
O
I could write for hours on the topic of sponsors and suggestions, but I will spare you my personal drama unless you want to talk about it. I've got no trouble sharing (just PM me or ask on this thread), but I have tended to "overshare" in the past.
My experience with my first three (!) sponsors is that they were sort of all cut from the same cloth. They sponsored me the same way they had been sponsored, and their "suggestions" turned out to actually be directives. They told me how to run my program and saw it as a lack of surrender that I had my own ideas. You know what? I will surrender all day long to the idea that I cannot control my drinking. But I can't surrender to someone else's way of doing the program. (By which I mean the bells and whistles that are mainly from the mainstream AA community not from the book.) Believe me, I tried. Although there's a lot of antiquated language and some outdated ideas in those first 164 pages, I believe that program is sound - I can totally get behind it. You may not know it yet, but there is no discussion of sponsorship in there. There is simply the idea of one alcoholic working with another and a good outline of how exactly to work the steps.
Part of my problem was that I didn't know what I was looking for - I mainly knew what I didn't want. You're ahead of me in that regard. You know you want to get on with reading the BB and working the steps. I say, do it! And while you're getting a start, do go to plenty of meetings and keep your ear out for a woman whose share strikes you. It took me a couple of months going to Zoom meetings every day, but I eventually did hear the right woman speak, and I knew instinctively that she was the one. We've been meeting for about six weeks and I couldn't be happier with her. She knows the book inside and out, had experiences similar to mine in her formative years, and understands how deeply hurtful it can be (and was to me) when a sponsor acts more like an authority figure than a mentor. I'd wager you've had enough of 'being less than' in your lifetime. If that's the case, I think you need someone to be your sober buddy that will help to affirm you and lift yourself up.
Keep looking. It's worth it. This is the most important fight of your life and you need the best support you can get.
For what it's worth, I think 3 meetings/week is not enough at this stage. While I don't really ascribe to the notion that "meeting makers make it," I do believe that constant immersion in deliberately sober company is tremendously helpful. Well, at least it is to me. And it's so easy with Zoom right now, I can't think of any good reason NOT to attend at least 1/day.
O
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
Originally Posted by Ringside
I think I understand where your sponsor is coming from - I don't know how I would try to go through the steps myself, let alone guide someone through the steps, without 100% commitment to the program and sobriety. Relapse can happen, but as fini said it is not a part of recovery and it most certainly isn't a part of the steps. In my opinion, it also isn't a "relapse" after a few weeks of sobriety - you haven't stopped drinking. While I don't believe working the steps requires a set amount of sober time before starting, I do believe it requires a complete buy-in, and repeatedly drinking while attempting the steps is not complete buy-in. Along those lines, a few of your comments suggest strongly that you see "relapse" in your future - and your sponsor likely sees that too. I suspect that once you are ready to fully commit, with the actions to back that up, your sponsor will be more willing to commit her time to you. Wishing you the best.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 63
HOWEVERRRR, one sip of booze and start all over. Perhaps chronic relapse Rd get sick of all that starting all over and quit altogether. Maybe your sponsor is trying to avoid that. I dunno.
All i I know is, once I got through those steps, I felt freedom from alcohol for the first time. It’s been glorious.
You deserve that feeling too!
Wehave2day I'm sick of starting over.... and after I drank last weekend (though it was not as much as I have in the past) it took me 5 days to start to feel normal.... I didn't really feel foggy but just so depressed, and fatigued. I deserve to be free.
All i I know is, once I got through those steps, I felt freedom from alcohol for the first time. It’s been glorious.
You deserve that feeling too!
Wehave2day I'm sick of starting over.... and after I drank last weekend (though it was not as much as I have in the past) it took me 5 days to start to feel normal.... I didn't really feel foggy but just so depressed, and fatigued. I deserve to be free.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 2,909
I was a repeat relapser for years despite attendance at AA meetings. When I finally worked the steps, the relapses stopped and that was 17 years ago. A sponsor's job is to guide you through the steps. Look for a sponsor who will guide you through the steps now, not one who thinks they know when you are ready. A sponsor can't make that determination and it is not their job, theirs is to guide.
Early AA got people into the steps much quicker than seems to happen today.
As written in Back To Basics, The Alcoholics Anonymous Beginners’ Meetings. Wally P. page 152) Clarence Snyder (Founder of A.A. Cleveland) would take newcomers through the Steps in a weekend. He called the process "fixing rummies." "He’d say, "come to me on Friday evening on Step One and by the time you leave on Sunday morning you’ll have taken all Twelve Steps. Then, in order to stay ‘fixed’, you’ll need to practice Steps Ten, Eleven, and Twelve on a daily basis."
As written in A Guide to the Twelve Steps of Alcoholics Anonymous in 1940 and commissioned by Dr. Bob."It is important that the newcomer be introduced to the twelve steps at as early a date as possible. On these rules depends his full recovery."
The steps are the program (meat) of AA. Slogans and meeting attendance are not a substitute, they are additional support tools.
Early AA got people into the steps much quicker than seems to happen today.
As written in Back To Basics, The Alcoholics Anonymous Beginners’ Meetings. Wally P. page 152) Clarence Snyder (Founder of A.A. Cleveland) would take newcomers through the Steps in a weekend. He called the process "fixing rummies." "He’d say, "come to me on Friday evening on Step One and by the time you leave on Sunday morning you’ll have taken all Twelve Steps. Then, in order to stay ‘fixed’, you’ll need to practice Steps Ten, Eleven, and Twelve on a daily basis."
As written in A Guide to the Twelve Steps of Alcoholics Anonymous in 1940 and commissioned by Dr. Bob."It is important that the newcomer be introduced to the twelve steps at as early a date as possible. On these rules depends his full recovery."
The steps are the program (meat) of AA. Slogans and meeting attendance are not a substitute, they are additional support tools.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
