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What to do about religious ministries

Old 11-19-2017, 12:19 AM
  # 21 (permalink)  
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Telling them you're not interested is not the same as decrying their religion or slapping them in the face. literally or methaphorically

I say that because I used to be a great people pleaser.

I used to go out of my way not to hurt people - I wish I could say it as always altrusitic... but often I could not bear the thought of people not liking me.

Thats not a good enough reason to spend time on things I don't want to do.

If you really think about it, like you said, you might be taking time away from someone who is really interested in what these people offer.

Set yourself, and them, free

D
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Old 11-19-2017, 05:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Meraviglioso View Post
I also just am, for better or worse, a nice person and it makes me happy to be nice.
I think this is the heart of the matter. You listen to them out of ego--it lets you tell yourself that you are a good person. And allows you to think that you are so important to them that your approval matters.

The reason this is so hard is that this is not about them, but rather about you.

I bet most of us have been where you are now with this....and will be there again.
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Old 11-19-2017, 05:30 AM
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Hi Mera:

Don't be nice, be YOU! Society tells us to be a "good" or "nice" girl...


You are a great person just by being you!
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Old 11-19-2017, 05:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Dee74 View Post

Set yourself, and them, free

D
I don't know if you were trying to be funny but you cracked me up!
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Old 11-19-2017, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by heavencanwait View Post
No disrespect to you for your post... but I really think this topic should be in another thread? Sorry...it just looks more like a religion discussion.
I'm gonna have to disagree with that.

Although it was sparked by a religious topic it is more about learning how to say no. It is learning how to deal with events that we were not able to handle in the past - and still. Yes it could be moved to a different board, but it's still here.
Not a day goes by that I am not asked to donate to a cause of one sort or another. Every single time I check out at the supermarket, every single time I check out at the 'home store' and pretty much everywhere, someone asks for a donation. I get the 'religious' coming to my door often, I also get the "window company" knocking on my door every other month trying to sell me new windows. Being polite to them does nothing but keep them on 'their game'. It took a time for me to learn to just say "no thanks". Whether it is the girl scouts - I can't buy cookies from every girl scout who comes to the door, or the youth cheerleader squad or the little league, the window guy, the lawn care companies, the list goes on...
Learning how to just say, "No Thank You", is a big part of the growth to becoming a sober person. And if 'they' try to hand you a pamphlet or other literature, just say "No Thank You" - you are saving them a few pennies by not throwing their papers in the trash.
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Old 11-19-2017, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by LBrain View Post
I'm gonna have to disagree with that.

Although it was sparked by a religious topic it is more about learning how to say no. It is learning how to deal with events that we were not able to handle in the past - and still. Yes it could be moved to a different board, but it's still here.
Not a day goes by that I am not asked to donate to a cause of one sort or another. Every single time I check out at the supermarket, every single time I check out at the 'home store' and pretty much everywhere, someone asks for a donation. I get the 'religious' coming to my door often, I also get the "window company" knocking on my door every other month trying to sell me new windows. Being polite to them does nothing but keep them on 'their game'. It took a time for me to learn to just say "no thanks". Whether it is the girl scouts - I can't buy cookies from every girl scout who comes to the door, or the youth cheerleader squad or the little league, the window guy, the lawn care companies, the list goes on...
Learning how to just say, "No Thank You", is a big part of the growth to becoming a sober person. And if 'they' try to hand you a pamphlet or other literature, just say "No Thank You" - you are saving them a few pennies by not throwing their papers in the trash.
Well sorry I disagree with your comment as well. Maybe we should start a thread saying "we liked pickles while drinking, but don't like pickles now". This has turned into a religious debate thread. So I am saying "no" to continuing to comment on this. Have a great day.
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Old 11-19-2017, 02:31 PM
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Anna and I both agree it's not a religious debate thread so I'd ask anyone who wants to debate religions, or whether this is a religious debate thread, to take it to PM

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Old 11-19-2017, 07:15 PM
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That's the sect I grew up in. Just firmly and politely tell the "no thank you". They will probably try to press you but just keep saying no. Don't give them a reason because they are trained to engage you in conversation over whatever reason you state and it will take you longer to get your point across.
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Old 11-19-2017, 07:39 PM
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I understand its a personal issue for you silentrun but it would be a shame if this thread was derailled by a discussion on particular types of religion.

We don't need to go there.

There's a very good discussion about learning to say no here.

In that sense, whether the door knockers are selling The Watchtower, vacuum cleaners, or life insurance is immaterial, imo.

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Old 11-19-2017, 08:57 PM
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The last time the Witnesses came to my house, I told them, ‘Sorry, but we’re Muslim here. I was only partly lying because my husband is actually Muslim (I’m not). I’ve found the ‘muslim’ card comes in handy a lot. 🙂 They’ve never come back.

Of course, in your case, Mera, you can’t lie. Like others have said, just be honest. It’s for the best.
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Old 11-19-2017, 09:44 PM
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Hey Mera. To be honest I don't really understand the problem. I took one pamphlet off them once and it took 3 times of me saying that I am not interested and shutting the door on them to get rid of them. Of course I felt guilty and thought they were just lovely girls. But they are misguided. If their religion has an appeal to you then keep talking to them. If not just rip the band-aid off and grow some balls. They will live. There's no way to keep them happy. Just say you don't want to see them again and shut the door. They won't persist for long. No great soul soothing explanation is required for them.
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Old 11-19-2017, 10:18 PM
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That's just the thing sweetichick, I don't "have the balls" to say no and I am trying to learn that. As Glimer pointed out, this is a perfect, low stakes opportunity for me to practice. Certainly it gets more difficult saying no to friends you truly care about, work mates you want to impress, etc.
And yes, this is not just religion, I also had the Folletto vacuum cleaner man in my house for over two hours once trying to sell me his product. I give money to everyone who stops at my door asking for money. That I actually don't mind so much because they re usually refugees and that is a cause close to my heart so I legitimately want to give, but there was one guy who pushed it a little too far and started asking for more and more, €5 wasn't enough, I gave him an iPhone (an old one I wasn't using) and he came back some months later asking for another one as he had given that one to his sister. I felt really uncomfortable and bad I couldn't help him. That I could even handle because the only negative there was the I was unable to do something (I didn't have another phone I could give) so saying "no" came out easier. But I see now saying yes to the vacuum cleaner person may have been my idea of being nice at the time but really wasn't nice because I wasted two hours of his time. Saying yes to the religious people is not nice because I am giving them the impression they might convert me. I am afraid I will end up doing what I always do which is to say yes yes yes until I just can't take it anymore (for example will be pressed to attend a church meeting or something) and will just blow up and it will come as a huge surprise and then really seem rude.
This has gotten me into trouble in the past at work. I say yes and yes and yes and overextend myself or take on something I am unequipped to handle and then end up messing everything up. We could take it even further to times in the past I have said yes to intimacy with a man that I wasn't entirely convinced about. It has many consequences both great and small.

As Dee points out, a big part of it is the idea that anyone would dislike me. Which is silly, I am fully aware that not everyone likes me and that is ok, but I always do try to do my best to be "likeable"
Another issue is just pure frustration. It is downright annoying to be in the middle of cleaning my house, a project or just relaxing and have someone interrupt my day. Once in a blue moon, ok, but it is now really frequent. And again, this is all my own fault for giving them the impression that their visits are welcome and ok. I can't be upset at them, this is my doing.

Anyway, I plan on staying at work and exercising every day during my lunch break this week, so it will be Saturday when I see them again, and I am pretty certain they will show up. I need to prepare myself for this conversation now because I really need to take care of this. I need to remember too that it is going to be extra difficult only due to my own mistakes. Had I just said "no thanks" from the get-go I think it would have been a lot easier. The fact is I made them think it was ok to stop by for going on a year now and it is only my feigned interest that has encouraged them to bring bigger and bigger books and stop by more frequently. The conversation is going to be more difficult because it will come as a surprise that I am not interested in their religion (vacuum cleaner/refugee plight/sex/drinking) in the least bit- but again, that is all my fault. If I learn to say no at the beginning I won't get myself into these situations.
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Old 11-19-2017, 10:50 PM
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Hey Merv. Do you have a friend who could talk to them on your behalf or can you put the book outside for them with a letter? You have to understand that in their own way these people are using you. I am sure they get brownie points for saying they have a potential convert. I have difficulty saying no but not to people knocking at my door. You are a very caring person. The problem is that some people will use that to gain something for themselves. It's like my ex partner used to Tex me and say he needed sex. I eventually learner that I was under no obligation to help him out.
I don't get refugees here which is good. Can you put a sign on your door saying no traders? If you have been talking to these people for a year a lot of strong no and shutting the door on them will be needed. That vacuum cleaner thing was a bit funny I must admit.
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Old 11-19-2017, 11:16 PM
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Those are really good suggestions sweetichick, and otherwise might be useful, but I think this time I am really going to need to learn to stand up and say no, so the only way is to directly deal with it.

The vacuum cleaner, oh my god, I would have actually bought the damn thing, there was nothing it couldn't do. It was the best thing I have ever seen and a legitimately exhilarating two hours of my life (um, I suppose that is saying a lot about my life, and not good things...) I was like "SOLD!!!" and he said "ok, that'll be €3800!" I was floored! i honestly had no idea that a vacuum cleaner could cost so much. No idea whatsoever. I knew it would be expensive but was so impressed by it I was even willing to stretch my budget, thinking at max I'd end up spending, oh I don't know, €400, €500. When he told me the price I could not believe it. You can buy a used car for that much money!
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Old 11-19-2017, 11:19 PM
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Oh and I realise that with my last post I am starting to sound not just nice to a fault but naive. I do not consider myself naive. Seriously, would any normal person guess that a freaking VACUUM CLEANER would have the starting price of a CAR????
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Old 11-19-2017, 11:39 PM
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Lol Mera. Must have been the world's best vacuum!!
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Old 11-20-2017, 01:08 PM
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What's appropriate here?

Originally Posted by silentrun View Post
That's the sect I grew up in. Just firmly and politely tell the "no thank you". They will probably try to press you but just keep saying no. Don't give them a reason because they are trained to engage you in conversation over whatever reason you state and it will take you longer to get your point across.

Hi- thank you for this! I'm wondering if there is another forum where you've seen questions regarding your upbringing in that religion?
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Old 11-20-2017, 01:43 PM
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Mera, where were you when my kid was selling magazine subscriptions for his middle school? Sounds like we could have made a killing.

Seriously though, it took me many years to realize that "no" doesn't mean "I dislike you" (or your vacuum cleaner, or your religion). It just means I don't want you to waste your valuable sales time on someone who ultimately will not be buying what you are selling. Saying "no" is saving them time and, really, doing them a favor. It frees them up to spend there time on someone who might actually buy what they are selling.
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Old 11-20-2017, 02:00 PM
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A few weeks ago I had two women stop at my home to sell their Christian religion. I just told them no thank you I'm not interested and I closed the door. Not rude but firm.

No explanation needed it's not their business. Additionally when someone stops at my home uninvited and unexpected they should be completely understanding if i don't want to speak with them. At least that's how i see it.

This is conceptually the same thing I would say if someone offered me alcohol to drink.
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Old 11-23-2017, 03:42 PM
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This is also the religion I was forced to practice for much of my childhood. My siblings and I had to knock on doors on Saturdays and Sundays. My father kept a book of all the neighborhoods we visited, and he logged every address where the people seemed receptive, so that he could make “callbacks.” Yes, they do get credit for literature sold and time spent talking to people. Be firm, but not rude. If someone had been mean to me as a kid knocking on the doors, I am sure it would have frightened me to death! My husband is Muslim, and when they want to talk to him about their religion, he replies that he will listen to them if they will agree to listen to him about his beliefs. That makes them turn right around and leave!
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