AA vs. Rational vs. Jason Vale/Allen Carr approaches - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:00 PM   #1 (permalink)
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AA vs. Rational vs. Jason Vale/Allen Carr approaches


Does anyone find comfort in just quitting booze for good vs. day to day? It seems like the AA approach is to constantly remind yourself that your sick being an Alcoholic.
None of these approaches are a 1 size fits all.

It nice this site shows the different quit theories and does not hide them. It also great to have folks that can relate and that have been sober for many years as support.

Has anyone tried the Jason Vale or Allen Carr approach?

Thanks for your feedback.
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:04 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I read the Allen Carr book but only after I got sober.
It had some good ideas in it.

I think you can say the same for all the approaches you've mentioned
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:06 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I got, and stay, sober with a combination of counseling and daily visits to SR. It's been working for over four years now so I must be doing it right.
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:28 PM   #4 (permalink)
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There has to be room for lots of ways to help us out of the addiction.

I am not AA, but it has been one of the first places I have headed to get some momentum into that initial stop drinking.

AVRT, RR, SR seem to be a better fit for me as it fits in with my personality.

I just googled Jason Vale as I have never heard of him....He appears to be quite the sales person and I would be interested to hear of others that are familiar with him.

I loved, loved Allen Carrs book for quitting smoking, It is almost 5 years since I quit smoking using his book. I quit cold turkey and also joined a support forum (QSMB)
I would love to get a copy of his quit drinking book as I find his writing style of a logical, practical, slightly brainwashing and enthusiasm fascinating.

Ironically he died of lung cancer albeit smoke free.
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:30 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I've read the Carr book, Rational Recovery and probably have read around 40 different books during my recovery. I've learned things from each one of them and don't regret reading any of them. I've taken part in SMART, Women For Sobriety, used AVRT and now I'm working my way through the 12 Steps of AA. I'm doing whatever it takes.
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Old 05-17-2014, 07:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Just my thoughts,I think its a personal choice and doing nothing does not work. Especially in early recovery you need a group, a therapist, something. Too many emotions and you cant keep them inside. I am involved in SMART just more applicable for me
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Old 05-17-2014, 08:42 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I read three different versions of the Carr book. I then read Vale, which seemed like a rip off of Carr. My only gripe with that school of thought is the premise that everyone is in early stages of alcoholic behavior yet they don't know it. I find this implausible. I still think we are statistically unique from normies. I will say, I gained some power from all of these source. I guess it is a personal thing.
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Old 05-17-2014, 09:05 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I loved Jason Vale's book. I keep it close at hand as a good reference. It made me look at alcohol in a whole new light. Tang, I actually agree with Vale's premise that anyone who drinks alcohol is on a slippery slope. Alcohol is a poisonous, addictive drug. It is not good for anybody's body ~ alcoholic or not. I think the effect alcohol has on people's minds is either appealing or not appealing. Honestly, I don't believe I would ever get addicted to pain pills easily. I do not like the way that they make me feel. However, if I had to take them daily due to an illness, I think I could get addicted. Some of my so-called "normie" friends barely drink alcohol because I don't think they really like how it makes them feel at all. They almost drink out of "politeness", so to speak. My mother really didn't start drinking alcoholically until she and my father were retired, and she didn't feel responsible to anybody or anything anymore. I get that there are many alcoholics that were hooked almost instantly and drank dangerously and out of control from the get-go, but I know many more who gradually got more and more unhealthy and addicted as time went on, hence the "progressiveness" of the disease.
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Old 05-17-2014, 09:20 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I loved Jason Vale's book. I keep it close at hand as a good reference. It made me look at alcohol in a whole new light. Tang, I actually agree with Vale's premise that anyone who drinks alcohol is on a slippery slope. Alcohol is a poisonous, addictive drug. It is not good for anybody's body ~ alcoholic or not. I think the effect alcohol has on people's minds is either appealing or not appealing. Honestly, I don't believe I would ever get addicted to pain pills easily. I do not like the way that they make me feel. However, if I had to take them daily due to an illness, I think I could get addicted. Some of my so-called "normie" friends barely drink alcohol because I don't think they really like how it makes them feel at all. They almost drink out of "politeness", so to speak. My mother really didn't start drinking alcoholically until she and my father were retired, and she didn't feel responsible to anybody or anything anymore. I get that there are many alcoholics that were hooked almost instantly and drank dangerously and out of control from the get-go, but I know many more who gradually got more and more unhealthy and addicted as time went on, hence the "progressiveness" of the disease.
Duly noted. By this definition everyone I know outside my Muslim friend are alcoholics. Yet I know some who have only ever had 1-2 drinks a week and they are in their 80's. If you ask them they still enjoy and look forward to their few drinks yet are clinically non-problem drinkers.
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Old 05-17-2014, 09:21 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by letitgo View Post
Does anyone find comfort in just quitting booze for good vs. day to day? It seems like the AA approach is to constantly remind yourself that you're sick being an Alcoholic.
LetitGo, I felt as though a monstrous weight of sadness and despair was lifted when I understood I had just quit drinking for good, that all of that misery was gone now forever. It was this sense of relief that actually gave me the momentum to keep going through those first few days. When I got it that I didn't have to or need to drink anymore, it almost made me giddy.

The whole idea of keeping the possibility alive of drinking again someday, maybe even tomorrow, has never made any sense for me. I was finally free, and never going back.
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Old 05-17-2014, 09:35 PM   #11 (permalink)
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i never got hooked on drink from the word go i just got drunk almost from the word go. i didnt know that once i took the first drink it would then start a craving inside of me that needs another drink and another until i end up drunk.
i thought life with drink was all there was i would work all week and look forward to drinking at the weekend i only ever wanted to have a few and get a buzz from it but the problem with me was i couldnt hardly ever stop at a few i got drunk to the point that i couldnt remember the next day waking up what i had done and i had fear inside me that i had done wrong to people, i used to spend my hangovers trying to remember who i had upset or what silly thing i had done and i would be ashamed of myself etc but sure enough as time would go on i would try the drinking again and try the controled method only go out with a little money didnt work as i would bum a drink from anyone once i had the hunger for it
and on it goes untill after years of it i eneded up drinking every time i woke up just to start my day off or to stop the shakes as it seemed a good idea to have another drink to take the effects away it just gets worse and progresses until you end up not being able to be without it
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Old 05-17-2014, 10:50 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I read lots of books and tried lots of methods to get sober that involved no real life interaction with people, that didn't work for me. So i needed regular face to face support, interaction with others, a tangible solution, proof that the method could work (actually meeting people it had worked for) and something that had been around for some time; that is why i ended up in AA.
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Old 05-18-2014, 12:06 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by letitgo View Post
...Does anyone find comfort in just quitting booze for good vs. day to day? It seems like the AA approach is to constantly remind yourself that your sick being an Alcoholic...Thanks for your feedback.
I quit using the 'AA approch;' the one described in the Big Book, pg 181, where it states.............: "...But if you really and truly want to quit drinking
liquor for good and all..." Yup; that's what I did; I quit 'for good and all;' no constantly reminding myself "I'm sick," or using "Im an alcoholic" as some kind of excuse or as a mantra.

That for me was the AA approach, and it's worked for a while; think I'll stick with it.

(o:
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Old 05-18-2014, 12:38 AM   #14 (permalink)
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I've utilized different methods, different groups, and did my fair share of reading. I heartily agree with the sentiment that you've got to do something. Try anything and everything until you find what works for you. Keep an open mind.
My experience (and I know others have had their own, different from mine) with AA has not been a "quit for only one day" mindset. There are no rules or requirements in AA. I go to listen to people talk about how bad things were, what happened, and how they are now free. It has been helpful and inspiring.
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Old 05-18-2014, 02:21 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I have read all of the literature and books listed above! They all have something to offer in my view. I especially like Carre's and AVTR's way of turning the tables on alcohol and re-framing it as the 'enemy' out to get you rather than a friend one is giving up.

However some of us seem to need the fellowship and support of other alcoholics and in my neck of the woods that means AA pretty well exclusively. I have had the longest periods of sobriety with AA's help for sure. I take the bits I feel are helpful and ignore the rest. That includes god, which I don't believe in and at times the 'one day at a time' thing. I like to feel I have a long term commitment to sobriety. On the other hand there are times when knowing all I have to worry about it today is helpful too.

I thing the approach is called 'eclectic'!
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