PaperDolls

Agreed augustwest ......... I don't think it was ulverston's intent to argue but from what I understand they are correct. The Lord's Prayer is not strictly a Catholic prayer ..... it is a Christian prayer. Since AA was founded on Christian principles, it's not surprising it's still a tradition to be said at many meetings.

Not a thing wrong with people choosing not to say it at a meeting. That's what I do.

ulverston

true august.
but they forget that god believes in them

PaperDolls

Let's not get sidetracked from the actual topic of this thread. This discussion may be best for a private conversation.

Dee74

....and noone even saw my lips move, lol.

Thanks PD - I agree...the Lords Prayer/HPs etc is a whole *other* can of worms thread
let's refocus guys.

D

augustwest

for me its not about forgetting. my higher power doesn't have beliefs or opinions about anything. it is a power, not a being. but hey, whatever works works! Thats the beautiful thing. I'm thrilled with my spiritual practice and the program works as long as you have a God of your understanding, not necessarily someone else's.

Dee74

double post

Dee74

seriously - let's move off that and refocus on the original post.
PM any further discussion on that, thanks

D

MentalLoop

Let's see if i can bring this back on track

1. Wait ---- Dee is actually a woman?? I've been on SR a little shy of two months, and i didn't get that until this thread. OK WAIT, NOT THE POINT OF THE OP

2. I think higher power is.....Damn, ever since this sober thing, have been having trouble with my attention span note to self: Higher Power Discussion = Bad; Pot Sobriety = Good

Serious thought. If i'm posting on SR drunk as a skunk, but tell everybody I'm 51 days sober, who am i hurting? As far as i can tell, neither SR nor AA are keeping score, they're just trying to help. If you want help great, if you don't well then don't. Many on this thread have said this a million times, but so true: To Thy Own Self Be True. Your friend knows if Pot is a problem or not. If it isn't, then nobody should get in his way for the medal. If it is, then he is only fooling himself, neither AA nor SR are going to sleep with him at night with his conscience and his medal.

As for boycotting, i'd bet the boycott is supported with a few bottles of booze. Boycott = Anger or Disapproval = Resentment = Fast Track to Drunk!

brandon06

u will be ok

flamingredhair

But I'm pretty sure Dee is a man.

Mark75

Back to the original topic...

You know, I've thought about this from another perspective... As a member of AA, with a home group and a sponsor, recovered and all... I go to meetings for many reasons, one of them is to be there for the newcomer.

Do I want the message to the newcomer that it's OK and sober and all that ... to smoke a joint (for non medical purposes)... that that is somehow recovery?

I really don't know.

Mark75

Dee is a man.

2granddaughters

A good friend in AA who came to his first meeting in 1962 faithfully takes the wine at Communion in his Church. He is one of the finest members in the group and nobody says anything when he celebrates his birthday.

Mark75

I take communion on Easter and Christmas... No big deal. But it's not wine, it's the Eucharist.



That's way different from getting stoned on marijuana for the purpose of, well, getting stoned.

gaffo

I quit drinking alcohol. That's all. If I want to smoke pot to get through another alcohol free moment I have given myself standing permission. It's a powerful tool in my personal medicine cabinet and I'm glad to have it. After almost three months of not drinking (*****!) it has not led me personally to want a drink and my pot smoking has gone down significantly. For some reason, pot seems much stronger to me without a few beers.

I've never been to a meeting and most of what I know about AA I learned through SR but I really don't like the feeling of this particular episode. I'm feeling judged and defensive just reading about it, to tell you the truth. Quitting alcohol by itself is a BFD!

langkah

Dee is a man's man.

Dee74

Thanks for the affirmations LOL.

Let's stick to the topic tho - if we cant it might be a sign this thread has run its course...

D

underoath

I don't see anything wrong with that, it's not like they are getting drunk off the communion wine. As long as it's not a trigger for them then I don't see a problem with it; there's more alcohol in my mouth wash. I know when we take communion at church, there isn't even enough wine to get my tongue wet. It all comes down to motives really, and whether or not you would be putting yourself at risk. If for some reason communion consisted of rubbing trace amounts of cocaine on our gums then I would stay FAR away from church. I have a sponsor who has severe injuries from when he was in the army as well as motorcycle accidents (I think) and occasionally he has to take opiates. It's a highly controversial subject. Communion, prescription medication... where do we draw the line? Like I said it all comes down to motives, and the tricky part is deciphering the truth from your disease. Sometimes my mind (especially early in recovery) would convince me of things that seemed right, but upon further examination I would realize it was my addiction. I take communion. I drink coffee occasionally. I quit smoking a few months after I got clean. I use mouth wash with alcohol in it. And if for some reason, God forbid, I had to have surgery- I would be taking the painkillers they prescribe, or the sedatives they use to knock me out. But I hope those situations never arise because I will have to carefully examine myself and the temptation will be there to take more than I am prescribed. Given the vague details of the OP's friend's situation... I would, if it were me, be picking up a white chip. But those are my standards.

I don't classify communion, mouth wash, nicotine, caffeine, and OTC meds (non controlled, if taken THE RIGHT WAY) as not being sober or being in recovery. Because the effects of nicotine and caffeine (in small amounts, I mean you COULD overdose on them but you could overdose on anything) never severely altered my mood/perception in the intense levels that marijuana, alcohol, cocaine, amphetamines, and benzodiazepines did. I don't like taking medication, and I figured if I am going to be sober, I will give up smoking too. So my life is no longer under the control of various drugs. It feels great. I do have other addictions/vices but none of them are drug related and in case you didn't know, alcohol is a drug. So is marijuana.

I never skipped school to drink coffee or take communion. I never lied or stole in order to obtain some caffeine or some ibuprofen. These drugs never had any control over my life. However, I couldn't go a day without smoking pot. I also have numerous friends, all of whom I painfully watch as their lives revolve around getting stoned. If I didn't have pot I would drink alcohol. If I didn't have alcohol I would drink large amounts of dextromethorphan (which can be obtained over the counter, but I don't even take that when I am sick, and if for some reason I ever have to, I will be very careful to be honest with myself and take the dose reccomended instead of drinking the whole bottle.) I always tried to keep a large amount of cocaine on hand but I would run out and when I did I used other drugs to fill in the gap. In my opinion, replacing alcohol with weed isn't recovery. But also, people smoke more cigarettes and drink more coffee when they get sober. However, in my experience, I found that I smoked less when I got sober, because for some reason all the drugs I was on led me to crave cigarettes. But cigarettes and coffee don't significantly alter the users perception of reality.

I used to have dreams where, I would think "well if I only drink half of this beer and take one hit off of this joint and use one small bump of cocaine, and take these drugs for anxiety as prescribed- that won't count as a relapse because I didn't use enough to get high". But that sort of thinking is just insanity. As far as I am concerned there is no reason for someone to be smoking marijuana unless they want to get high (except for severe medical instances, but in cali they prescribe that **** for anything, just like here if I really wanted to I could walk out of my doctors office with a script for adderall, xanax, and hydrocodone all in the same day). I never got high off of coffee. (only jittery, anxious, and nauseated but it certainly wasn't a "high"). Nor is my intentions for drinking coffee to get high. Personally the stimulating effect is so subtle I don't even realize it. It doesn't wake me up in the morning. I drink it because it's there and because it's something warm and tastes good. My intentions aren't "I wanna get ****** up off this coffee". But yes, people do replace their alcohol with cigarettes and coffee. Is it healthy? Not at all. But at least they aren't severely impaired to the point of endangering themselves and others. They can still perform daily tasks. I know, marijuana supporters insist "I drive better high! I work better high! I do everything better high!!!" but it's rubbish. It's nonsense. The point is it significantly alters your brain chemistry to the point of impairment. If your goal is to abstain from alcohol only, and you smoke marijuana instead- then great. My goal is to stay sober. Period. So it may not be fair for me to hold other people to the same standards as mine, since these standards are strictly personal. I do know that the AA meetings I used to attend preached total abstinence- marijuana included.

karilynn27

Haven't been able to get to my meetings due to family illness but this would really freak me out if word was spreading to boycott his 1 yr. Feels a little high schoolish

soberlicious

Well a boycott is a means to an end...a way to exact change (as in the Montgomery Bus Boycott) but I guess I would question the reasoning of a boycott in this particular situation. Would the boycott be used to show your friend that he is wrong about his definition of sobriety? Would this get him to somehow "see the light" and start living "real sobriety" by the boycotters' standards? Is it to show him he doesn't "deserve" the support of the fellowship? I am having trouble wrapping my head around how this would be helpful to any parties involved. Seems such an aggressive tactic could be harmful to not only the recipient of it but to the group as a whole.