Blogs


Notices

AVRT, Rational Recovery???

Old 01-19-2009, 03:20 PM
  # 1 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Youngstown, OH
Posts: 12
AVRT, Rational Recovery???

Anyone have any experience or knowledge on the subject?? I've checked out the website and it seems to be very anti-AA/NA. It also claims to be the magic bullet of problems with addiction. It seems to be too good to be true....way too simple! AVRT(addictive voice recognition technique) seems to have the belief that you can quit on your own w/o recovery groups or forums. Part of me wants to believe this is true, and the rest of me is very skeptical. I believe that everyone shares the same wish; living a happy "normal" life. Just confused about this whole recovery thing, in general. I'm sure I'm not alone. ANY feedback,experience, knowledge (pos or neg) about this AVRT, rational recovery would be greatly appreciated. Or any feedback, period. Luv you all!!!
Thanx!!!:wtf2
Phoof418 is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 03:31 PM
  # 2 (permalink)  
Knucklehead
 
doorknob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Davenport, WA
Posts: 4,005
Welcome to SR, Phoof! I think AVRT can be a helpful technique and for some people may be enough in itself. SMART Recovery branched off from RR and offers a variety of cognitive tools for recovery as well as online meetings, forums, and f2f meetings in some areas. LifeRing is a secular support organization that encourages self-empowerment in recovery through the creation of a personalized recovery program or toolbox and peer support. They also have forums, online meetings, and f2f meetings in some areas. I've found both websites to be informative and helpful to my recovery.
doorknob is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to doorknob For This Useful Post:
madeline4 (04-10-2010)
Old 01-19-2009, 03:34 PM
  # 3 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,876
Phoof...Welcome! I think I have explored almost every website there is on addiction...the internet has given us a wealth of information at our finger tips. I think that AVRT is extremely helpful as is Lifering and SOS. Each program gives us more insight into proper management of our addictions. Sobriety is indeed possible without meetings so you can believe it! Explore...read and learn the tools that will enable you to live a normal healthy life. Best of luck!
bugsworth is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 04:03 PM
  # 4 (permalink)  
I'm just a little unwell
 
TryingSoHard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 2,219
Hi Phoof,

I have the book Rational Recovery, which is an explanation of the program and how to use it, and The Small Book, which is their version of AA's Big Book. While I don't think AA is right for me, I wouldn't describe myself as anti-AA. The RR author/founder is DEFINITELY anti-AA. That's the only downside to his writings that I've discovered so far.

When I first bought and read Rational Recovery I literally felt like a weight had been lifted. I felt a glimpse of hope for the first time in a long time. I used the AA philosophy of "take what you need and leave the rest" as I read the book because I really didn't find it helpful to read all of his blatantly negative comments about the AA program. I don't care what he thinks about AA, I just want him to tell me how to use Rational Recovery!

I DO think it can work. I do NOT believe it is too good to be true. I think it's all about finding what works best for YOU.
TryingSoHard is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 04:40 PM
  # 5 (permalink)  
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Youngstown, OH
Posts: 12
Thank you all!

I, too am a little turned off by the anti-AA overtones. On the other hand, what I've looked into it so far seems to be worth further investigating. Before I even posted this thread I had used that same quote (take... leave the rest). As I said earlier, we all have the same goal here and I appreciate the feedback very much. As much as Trimpey(author/founder of rational recovery) attacks AA/NA, they share one key idea. The fact that the urge to drink/use is very clever and cunning power and it's not just going to go away. We all have to keep that in mind. Thanx again for the support.:ghug2
Phoof418 is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 04:48 PM
  # 6 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,876
I think any formal program will stress the devastating effects of long term alcohol abuse.
The urge to drink becomes a reaction out of habit...not sure if it is clever or cunning but it clearly is the reason many continue to drink. Change is scary...feeling emotions without booze is scary...even the thought of lifetime sobriety can be scary but one must go thru to get out.

Trimpey is absolutely anti-aa...no overtones about it! lol He does however make some valid points shared by many.

Again welcome...keep posting and share your journey!
bugsworth is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 04:52 PM
  # 7 (permalink)  
Member
 
JBones77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Phila, PA
Posts: 41
I don't think AA is something for me...but the fact that they are so critical of AA and are trying to "sell their product" as an alternative makes me wonder. I do like a lot of what I read on their site though...
JBones77 is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 04:58 PM
  # 8 (permalink)  
Resident
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 4,150
Thanks for the links doorknob. I will check these out a little later. I need things to keep my pea brain busy, especially in the afternoon.
Fubarcdn is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 05:38 PM
  # 9 (permalink)  
Knucklehead
 
doorknob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Davenport, WA
Posts: 4,005
Originally Posted by bugsworth View Post
The urge to drink becomes a reaction out of habit...not sure if it is clever or cunning but it clearly is the reason many continue to drink.


How 'bout baffling?

I'm getting close to 90 days and I really do think that the gut reaction to drink (and smoke pot) is getting weaker. And being normal is starting to feel normal again.
doorknob is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 05:49 PM
  # 10 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,876
Okay Dk I will go with baffling!!! LOL clever and cunning sounds too maniacal to me. My brain/disease isn't plotting against me...my brain is just doing what it has been trained to do.

I found after about 6 months it was odd to think about a drink...not nearly as natural as it once was.

BTW don't you know it isn't nice to stick out your tongue at people??? lol
bugsworth is offline  
Old 01-19-2009, 05:57 PM
  # 11 (permalink)  
Forward we go...side by side-Rest In Peace
 
CarolD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Serene In Dixie
Posts: 36,740
I think this is an interesting link about Rational Recovery

Rational Recovery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

No...I did not try it...I was already successfully using AA
for my recovery from alcoholism before I saw
a TV special on various recovery methods.

Several years later...I did work on another issue
by using SMART and it too was beneficial.

...There is no right or wrong way to find a
healthy sober future. I sure hope you do.

Good to see you here again...
CarolD is offline  
Old 01-21-2009, 01:05 PM
  # 12 (permalink)  
Reach Out and Touch Faith
 
shockozulu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: On a Sailboat
Posts: 3,871
We have some good discussions about SMART, LifeRing, and to a lesser extent RR over on the Secular Connections - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information (SC) section of the forum.

SMART broke off of RR due to some legit issues and Albert Ellis (the founder of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) went to SMART which, unlike RR, has meetings which discuss the tools used to help those with addictions.

Personally, I don't like RR because they charge to post at their bulletin board, and seem focused on hating AA as much as CBT (which they call AVRT).

I hope to see you over at SC!
shockozulu is offline  
Old 01-21-2009, 03:52 PM
  # 13 (permalink)  
Moving out of Limbo
 
James13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Today
Posts: 343
Blog Entries: 6
One thing I noticed on the AVRT website is that it underscores that you cannot use a recovery group/AA with the AVRT program. Then it says that you will "systematically uproot" your personal beliefs and traditions in a 12 step program.

Then it says, "In a very short time, you will issue [your family] a personal guarantee that you will never drink again, along with an agreement that, as a user of alcohol and other drugs, you are unfit for family membership."

Then, for $29/month or $250/year, you can subscribe, and beat that addiction.

Hmmm......
James13 is offline  
Old 01-21-2009, 04:05 PM
  # 14 (permalink)  
Resident
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 4,150
Originally Posted by James13 View Post
One thing I noticed on the AVRT website is that it underscores that you cannot use a recovery group/AA with the AVRT program. Then it says that you will "systematically uproot" your personal beliefs and traditions in a 12 step program.

Then it says, "In a very short time, you will issue [your family] a personal guarantee that you will never drink again, along with an agreement that, as a user of alcohol and other drugs, you are unfit for family membership."

Then, for $29/month or $250/year, you can subscribe, and beat that addiction.

Hmmm......
Everybody is trying to make a buck. They have a 0% chance of ever getting money from me. In my opinion anyone who tries to profit from others misery is not the type of person I want anything to do with.
Fubarcdn is offline  
Old 01-21-2009, 04:27 PM
  # 15 (permalink)  
Moving out of Limbo
 
James13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Today
Posts: 343
Blog Entries: 6
Originally Posted by Fubarcdn View Post
Everybody is trying to make a buck. They have a 0% chance of ever getting money from me. In my opinion anyone who tries to profit from others misery is not the type of person I want anything to do with.
What I also noticed on the AVRT site is that they repeat certain themes over and over, either directly or passively, such as anti-AA/recovery group rhetoric. This isn't exaggeration at all- it's all over the site from top to bottom. Then it decides for you that you will have to believe certain things in AA, which it outlines. (?)- It assumes you will be brainwashed (essentially questioning your capacity for independent/critical thought).

This is just my opinion, but it seems like snake oil.
James13 is offline  
Old 01-21-2009, 04:35 PM
  # 16 (permalink)  
Knucklehead
 
doorknob's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Davenport, WA
Posts: 4,005
There's way better stuff out there for non-12 Step recovery than what Trimpey is offering...

and way better stuff as far as critical analysis of AA.
doorknob is offline  
Old 01-21-2009, 04:41 PM
  # 17 (permalink)  
Moving out of Limbo
 
James13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Today
Posts: 343
Blog Entries: 6
DK, I agree wholeheartedly on both points.
James13 is offline  
Old 04-20-2009, 05:10 PM
  # 18 (permalink)  
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 9
Originally Posted by doorknob View Post
There's way better stuff out there for non-12 Step recovery than what Trimpey is offering...

and way better stuff as far as critical analysis of AA.
Could you suggest some material, sites, etc. in particular?
SonOF is offline  
Old 04-20-2009, 05:21 PM
  # 19 (permalink)  
Administrator
 
Anna's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dancing in the Light
Posts: 58,228
These are some alternate recovery programs:

Dually Diagnosed
Questions and Answers about DRA

LifeRing Secular Recovery
Home Page of LifeRing Secular Recovery

SMART
SMART RecoveryŽ

SOS - Secular Organisations for Sobriety
index.html

Women for Sobriety
Welcome to Women For Sobriety, Inc.


Information and analysis about addiction treatment and harm reduction:

The Stanton Peele Addiction Website

Moderation Management, the one group that deals with moderate drinking; useful for the guidelines:
Moderation Management
Anna is offline  
Old 04-20-2009, 06:15 PM
  # 20 (permalink)  
Member
 
Lenina's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, California
Posts: 8,326
When I first read the Small Book I was really put off by the author's hatred of AA. I am not an AA person but I gained so much from RR I was able to set aside the hatred of AA and take what I needed from RR. It worked so much better for me than AA in many ways.

It gave me an understanding of addiction that I hadn't got from AA. It seemed to fit better into what I believed about the nature of alcoholism and drug addiction.

I guess my point is, study anything you can about addiction. Use what works for you, what makes the most sense. As long as you stay sober, AND happy, what difference does it make what path you take?

Love,

Lenina
Lenina is offline  

Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:57 AM.