Do I need to kick him out
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Join Date: Jun 2020
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Originally Posted by dandylion 
Forever-----I don't think that you sound confused, from where I sit. You sound like someone who is in pain due to the situation that you are going through.
His feeling not good enough is surely something that he brought, within himself, to the relationship----as you recognize. You can't fix that for him, no matter what you do---and, he can blame you every day, if that is how he deals with it---but, unless he faces it and does the kind of self examination and self exploration in therapy, it will do him no good. Obviously, he has used the alcohol to deal with him emotions. And, you recognize that, also.
From where I sit, two things stand out----that he doesn't sound like he understands what a deep dive that would be for him, to deal with his issues. How much commitment and how much time and hard work it takes. He sounds, still, in so much denial about his alcoholism and is blaming it on you.
I say this, because he says that he wants to "cut down on his drinking". To be able to drink in a controlled way is the fondest wish of every alcoholic. And, it is the last one that alcoholics will give up. To face that an alcoholic does not have the ability to do controlled drinking----not for very long----seems unthinkable for them.
Forever----I hope that you realize this fact to your very bones---and, do not let the promises to curb his drinking, lead you to hang on, based on these promises. He probably has no idea that he can't ever do controlled drinking----but YOU will know that----and, knowing that can save you from many more heartbreaking rounds on the roller coaster.
I am giving you the following article, taken froim our library of articles (contained in the sticky section) that I think is a good yardstick to measure where the alcoholic is, in terms of being ready to actually reach for recovery. I hope you will read it, because it contains a lot of valuable information that I think you need, right now.
His feeling not good enough is surely something that he brought, within himself, to the relationship----as you recognize. You can't fix that for him, no matter what you do---and, he can blame you every day, if that is how he deals with it---but, unless he faces it and does the kind of self examination and self exploration in therapy, it will do him no good. Obviously, he has used the alcohol to deal with him emotions. And, you recognize that, also.
From where I sit, two things stand out----that he doesn't sound like he understands what a deep dive that would be for him, to deal with his issues. How much commitment and how much time and hard work it takes. He sounds, still, in so much denial about his alcoholism and is blaming it on you.
I say this, because he says that he wants to "cut down on his drinking". To be able to drink in a controlled way is the fondest wish of every alcoholic. And, it is the last one that alcoholics will give up. To face that an alcoholic does not have the ability to do controlled drinking----not for very long----seems unthinkable for them.
Forever----I hope that you realize this fact to your very bones---and, do not let the promises to curb his drinking, lead you to hang on, based on these promises. He probably has no idea that he can't ever do controlled drinking----but YOU will know that----and, knowing that can save you from many more heartbreaking rounds on the roller coaster.
I am giving you the following article, taken froim our library of articles (contained in the sticky section) that I think is a good yardstick to measure where the alcoholic is, in terms of being ready to actually reach for recovery. I hope you will read it, because it contains a lot of valuable information that I think you need, right now.
What really resonated in that article was the toxic relationships that the A forms just to enable their drinking. That is exactly what my AH does. It will be interesting if he does quit whether these people will still form part of his social group. They are all bonded over wanting to get drunk/high to escape their issues. It is sad and has much as I can be compassionate to a point, I find it really hard to respect those friendships. I have kicked one of his HFA friends out of our house before when they were drinking late on a sunday and I had to work the next morning and the kids had school. It is pretty awkward now between us! But I don't care, again I am just enforcing what I consider to be reasonable boundaries. This is in turn causes further problems between my AH and I because in his eyes, not only am I trying to control his drinking etc - but also who he can be friends with.
I see so clearly now that the addicition has caused so many of our relationship issues. It is such a hard one to solve.
Are there any happy stories about AH's who turned it around?! I'll have to dig around for them.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,644
I would also like to share a link to a thread that I just shared in gonefishin's thread as well, from the alcoholic's point of view:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...oderation.html (My guide to moderation)
It sounds like your session went as well as could be expected perhaps? It's sad, no doubt about that. Regardless of how someone is behaving at the time, there is a reason you married him and I'm sure he has many good things about him, they are just getting lost.
Yes, what he said could be some bit of progress for him, but honestly it sounds more like a panicked reaction, but you know him best. Actions, not words is the thing to keep uppermost in your mind perhaps.
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...oderation.html (My guide to moderation)
It sounds like your session went as well as could be expected perhaps? It's sad, no doubt about that. Regardless of how someone is behaving at the time, there is a reason you married him and I'm sure he has many good things about him, they are just getting lost.
Yes, what he said could be some bit of progress for him, but honestly it sounds more like a panicked reaction, but you know him best. Actions, not words is the thing to keep uppermost in your mind perhaps.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,644
Yes, some alcoholics do get clean, usually with a lot of support (from outside).
It does happen, we just don't see it very often. I have known a few alcoholics, I have never known a recovered alcoholic though.
Here is one recent hopeful thread:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...t-abandon.html (Hope is not a Plan, but don't abandon it)
Below is the first time this person posted:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ml#post7239669 (The journey for a Newbe)
Historically we were able to click on a user's name in a thread and choose to view all their previous threads, now it's just posts (which isn't very helpful when you're looking for history). Hopefully this is being worked on!
It does happen, we just don't see it very often. I have known a few alcoholics, I have never known a recovered alcoholic though.
Here is one recent hopeful thread:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...t-abandon.html (Hope is not a Plan, but don't abandon it)
Below is the first time this person posted:
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...ml#post7239669 (The journey for a Newbe)
Historically we were able to click on a user's name in a thread and choose to view all their previous threads, now it's just posts (which isn't very helpful when you're looking for history). Hopefully this is being worked on!
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forever-----the happy stories t hat I know are the ones where the alcoholic committed themselves to working a diligent program----AA---for the rest of their lives. You will notice that the people who come to this forum are almost all in crisis due to an alcoholic who has not committed themselves to living a life in recovery.
I have known many recovering alcoholics---who have many years of recovery under their belt.
You might want to attend some AA meetings yourself----you are allowed to attend the "Open Speakers Meetings" as a guest. When you check the schedule of AA meetings---they will be marked as such. You will be welcome and you are not required to speak or participate. It could be very eye opening for you.
Keep in mind that there are millions of alcoholics who are living in recovery, around the world. It is possible for those who want to live a sober life.
I have known many recovering alcoholics---who have many years of recovery under their belt.
You might want to attend some AA meetings yourself----you are allowed to attend the "Open Speakers Meetings" as a guest. When you check the schedule of AA meetings---they will be marked as such. You will be welcome and you are not required to speak or participate. It could be very eye opening for you.
Keep in mind that there are millions of alcoholics who are living in recovery, around the world. It is possible for those who want to live a sober life.
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Boston
Posts: 2,936
I am a strong, capable person with strong values and expectations and I will not sit back and let this AH cycle happen to my family. I would rather be alone than expose us to a lifetime of that.
Yes THIS!
Pin it to your mirror and say it every day.
Protect those minor children, not the adult alcoholic. It will be painful and sometimes difficult, but you'll be giving them a real lesson in how to value themselves and their experiences and relationships in life. You'll be showing them how to take action to deal with pain not numb it with drugs/alcohol. Be honest with them (age appropriately) about alcohol being a problem. Doesn't mean they can't love Dad or that Dad doesn't love them. But alcohol abuse breaks all the rules of normal relationships, it twists and tricks love to keep scoring points for Team Alcohol.
They will grow up learning what is unacceptable behavior (drunk driving!!), not having dysfunctional behavior normalized by 2 ppl staying in an unhappy marriage. All stuff I wish I had learned but there was never an adult in my childhood who was honest with us about my father's alcoholism, so instead my mother became more and more warped and codependent and we kids all got saddled with baggage, and all 3 of my beautiful brothers ended up alcoholics :-(
Keep reaching out and seeking and accepting help. You're not alone.
The past is gone. You are free in this moment.
Peace,
B
Yes THIS!
Pin it to your mirror and say it every day.
Protect those minor children, not the adult alcoholic. It will be painful and sometimes difficult, but you'll be giving them a real lesson in how to value themselves and their experiences and relationships in life. You'll be showing them how to take action to deal with pain not numb it with drugs/alcohol. Be honest with them (age appropriately) about alcohol being a problem. Doesn't mean they can't love Dad or that Dad doesn't love them. But alcohol abuse breaks all the rules of normal relationships, it twists and tricks love to keep scoring points for Team Alcohol.
They will grow up learning what is unacceptable behavior (drunk driving!!), not having dysfunctional behavior normalized by 2 ppl staying in an unhappy marriage. All stuff I wish I had learned but there was never an adult in my childhood who was honest with us about my father's alcoholism, so instead my mother became more and more warped and codependent and we kids all got saddled with baggage, and all 3 of my beautiful brothers ended up alcoholics :-(
Keep reaching out and seeking and accepting help. You're not alone.
The past is gone. You are free in this moment.
Peace,
B
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
You keep referencing "HFA"s, and I just want to add here that "high-functioning" is not a type of alcoholism; it's merely a stage. Left untreated, addiction progresses, and there is no way to determine how fast or when it will begin to decline. Alcoholics who were formerly high-functioning one day, aren't.
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Originally Posted by SparkleKitty
You keep referencing "HFA"s, and I just want to add here that "high-functioning" is not a type of alcoholism; it's merely a stage. Left untreated, addiction progresses, and there is no way to determine how fast or when it will begin to decline. Alcoholics who were formerly high-functioning one day, aren't.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
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Yes, what SK said and after all, what is high functioning with relation to alcoholism? Does it mean they go to work and support their family financially? Maybe. Does it mean they are nice to their community, coach soccer? Maybe. But the question remains, are they present for their family? How can you be present for another? How can you care for a child if you are drunk? The truth is you can't. As mentioned I had an alcoholic Father, my Mother brought us up. My Father played no role in it. He supported us, financially, very well. He always worked always brought home a pay-cheque. Had a very responsible job that took us to live different places in the world. I am grateful for that, but there was no "Father" role. It's just not possible. Parenting takes commitment and self sacrifice (not as a martyr, of course).
Alcohol will always be the first priority, then maybe their job and maybe their drinking buddies - the partner, the children might get a 3 or 4th place on the list of priorities.
Honestly, just looking at the list you had in your first post, he doesn't seem very "high functioning"? It's funny how when there is this other HUGE problem the other things get pushed to the wayside.
Alcohol will always be the first priority, then maybe their job and maybe their drinking buddies - the partner, the children might get a 3 or 4th place on the list of priorities.
Honestly, just looking at the list you had in your first post, he doesn't seem very "high functioning"? It's funny how when there is this other HUGE problem the other things get pushed to the wayside.
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Join Date: Jun 2020
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Originally Posted by trailmix
Yes, what SK said and after all, what is high functioning with relation to alcoholism? Does it mean they go to work and support their family financially? Maybe. Does it mean they are nice to their community, coach soccer? Maybe. But the question remains, are they present for their family? How can you be present for another? How can you care for a child if you are drunk? The truth is you can't. As mentioned I had an alcoholic Father, my Mother brought us up. My Father played no role in it. He supported us, financially, very well. He always worked always brought home a pay-cheque. Had a very responsible job that took us to live different places in the world. I am grateful for that, but there was no "Father" role. It's just not possible. Parenting takes commitment and self sacrifice (not as a martyr, of course).
Alcohol will always be the first priority, then maybe their job and maybe their drinking buddies - the partner, the children might get a 3 or 4th place on the list of priorities.
Honestly, just looking at the list you had in your first post, he doesn't seem very "high functioning"? It's funny how when there is this other HUGE problem the other things get pushed to the wayside.
Alcohol will always be the first priority, then maybe their job and maybe their drinking buddies - the partner, the children might get a 3 or 4th place on the list of priorities.
Honestly, just looking at the list you had in your first post, he doesn't seem very "high functioning"? It's funny how when there is this other HUGE problem the other things get pushed to the wayside.
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Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 8,644
From the little I have seen of the alcoholic parent, with other people, having a Father that is an A has more impact on the male children than the female if the Mother is a strong person (which mine was). There are many one parent households that thrive, my Mom was a great Mom.
I don't really like to surmise about the impact it has had on me, I just don't think it's worth it to me.
I don't really like to surmise about the impact it has had on me, I just don't think it's worth it to me.
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