mandybegins

Yes. I think if someone hugged me I would cry for an hour. lol Maybe I'm numb to it all. I don't even know. Because I've always been a pretty emotional person, so it's so unlike me to not be crying all day long. But I mostly just feel like puking.

I don't think I could live with myself if he died. I just don't. For all the crap he puts me through, I do love the parts of him that aren't crap. And I miss sooooo badly the man that he has been. My best friend. I just don't see him much anymore.

If he's a grown man and has a right to his choices.... then I just let him go? Because his choices are crap. If I go, if I leave him be. He will lose everything. If I let him make his choices and stop fixing it all WE ALL will lose everything. I feel like we're on the verge of losing it all anyway.

ARGH!!! I'm so TORN between what's best for him and what's best for the rest of us because it's almost the opposite at this point, and I just don't want to see him hurt so badly, because I do love him. I love non drinking him. And I hate him too, because he makes life hell and I'm just so TIRED of dealing with constant drama. I just want to have a normal life. I'm wasting my life.

mandybegins

I'm so sorry you are going through this, too! I do feel like leaving might kill him. To drown in his own self pity and misery. The only way would be is if he hated me and blamed me for it all. It might make him angry enough. Then he might stand up and fight a little. But unless I cheat on him or something I don't think he will blame me. And frankly, not only do I not want to cheat, I don't have the emotional energy for someone else! He brought home a puppy for our daughter's birthday and I could have killed him. Just another living creature dependent on me to take care of them and keep them happy. I'm going to crack!

It'll just be poor, pitiful him, life is crap and he messes everything up, etc. Because I'm always trying to reassure him that everyone has bad things happen to them and it's not all his fault. He wallows in self pity.

Sorry for just going on and on. I have never been able to say one word to anyone about all of this... ever. I just pretend like everything is perfect. Other wives complain about their husband and I build mine up like he's the best hubby in the world.

So now I just let everything loose all at once!

mandybegins

Goodness! My husband smokes weed also. Or at least he did. I haven't seen him do it in a few weeks. I just pretend like I don't know about it. It's just another log in the fire. He hides out a lot of the time. In the garage or at work. (He drinks there, he owns his own business....) I often feel like he doesn't want to be with us. But it's a relief in a way because we don't have to tiptoe until he erupts with some random angry statement from something innocent and normal we're talking about.

I don't know what detachment is per se. I'll try to do some reading on it. I feel like I have a lot of reading ahead of me... THANK YOU for taking the time to relate to me.

It's so nice to not be so alone, even if it's with strangers.

mandybegins

Codie?

Your statements though.... that it was the best thing they ever did, leaving you, and that you were loving her to death...

Can I really not help him? I mean, I don't always know if I even want to help him, but I feel like it's my job. But can I actually not help him?

Is it just him in his sinking ship and me choosing to either go down with him or bail before the ship sinks?

mandybegins

THANK YOU! It's so nice to not be alone. I don't know what I even have for boot straps. I'm scared to find them. lol I hope to get to where you are someday.

mandybegins

If I was strong, I would have left a long time ago. Because I wouldn't have put up with it so long.

But I'm nice.
Describe Mandy: "Nice"
Blech. Nice. I'm so nice. I just let people walk all over me.

But I get what you are saying. But is it all inevitable? Is he going down and I just have to decide weather he goes down alone or with the rest of us?

What a horrible, crappy choice.

Thank you for reaching out to me and being so kind. I'm sorry if I'm grumpy. I'm so all over the place with this. I go through like every emotion every time I think about it.

Uh, what a mess I am!

Katchie

I was married 22 years and have 4 kids also. It is/was terrifying. My kids are now ages 18-22 years old. When did I first suspect? Probably when I was 18 dating him but didn't have enough information to really put 2 and 2 together. Then fast forward and he asked me to marry him; I told him over dinner after the proposal that I wanted an alcohol free home when we raise our children, so I must have known something tho I must have been in denial. Fast forward to my 2nd pregnancy and he doesn't come home - he's somewhere passed out drunk and I begin the coverup that lasts for years. Fast forward to 2 of my sons being 5 and 3 years old and I'm finding hidden empty crown bottles EVERYWHERE they shouldn't be and I make my first call to AA to ask if my husband might be an alcoholic...dare I even think it! The man on the other end of the line told me the most loving thing I could do for my husband, myself and my sons was to leave -- I freaked and never thought that thought again.
Here I am today, 3 upper teens and one 22 and I finally had the nerve to make a run for it because I knew I was dying a slow death inside because of the anxiety and pain of it all. My health was declining. My kids, while they may have been home, as soon as their drunk dad staggered into the home from work, they took off never to be seen the rest of the evening because they didnt want to be around an alcoholic.
I know you're afraid, but know that as long as he is actively drinking, stuck in denial not willing to admit his need for help he will get worse. Things will get worse. My 22 years, your 19 years prove this.
So yes, start making yourself a plan. Thats what I did. It is scary as h*ll. It is, but I finally realized I had to set a better example for my sons and take care of myself. Everything is not rosy, but I have peace. And no, my ex, tho he went to rehab in an attempt to keep me as his wife, is still drinking. I once heard, "nothing changes if nothing changes" and it is soooo true! I had to be the one to change if I wanted something different, happier, healthier, more loving and peaceful. Hugs.

tomsteve

have you been able to help him so far?
NOONE could help me.

imo, welllll, yes its that choice you describe. I wouldn't say he WANTS to sink, but he isn't doing anything to stop it.

ya know what got me to the point of desperation- where the pain of getting drunk finally exceeded reality?
my( by then ex) fiancé telling me the morning after my last drunk some of the things I had done and said the day/night before, then saying ," GET THE F**K OUT!!!"
im not trying to say that's what will help him nor that you should do the same, but it was when the women I was going to spend the rest of my life with FINALLY got tired of my crap and started taking care of herself that I got help. she had absolutely no part in ME getting into action. it was all MY part and MY job to help myself.
this was the same women who at one time said," tom, your the most loving man ive ever known, but sometimes when you drink youre evil."
that changed to," youre the most loving man when your not drinking but when you drink youre nothing but evil."
which changed to," when you drink youre nothing but evil, and its happening a lot when youre not drinking."

didn't stop me from drinking either.

LexieCat

Hi, Mandy, and welcome. This might not seem like a "club" you want to belong to, but you are in very good company. We all know what it's like. Our situations may be slightly different, but we have more in common than not.

We ALL loved our alcoholics. We ALL were broken hearted to see what they were doing to themselves and their family.

First bit of advice: stop and breathe. I know it seems like an emergency, but from what you describe this has been going on for a very long time. One thing you can do for yourself and your kids right NOW, that (believe it or not) will provide some immediate relief, is to acknowledge the elephant in the room. Your kids know more than you might think they know. They, too, try to pretend everything is OK, even though it isn't. There is Al-Anon for you, and Alateen for the kids. School counselors can help, too. But most important for them is for you to acknowledge what they already know and are experiencing.

If you continue to read and post here, and start talking to people in Al-Anon (or some people go to Celebrate Recovery), you will feel less alone and your situation, and your options, will become clearer.

My first alcoholic husband got sober before we were married, and he's still sober today, 36 years later. My second alcoholic husband went back to drinking after almost dying of liver failure, but he's still alive (and still drinking) 20 years later. Don't ask me how, but he is. I loved my second husband, but I knew there was nothing I could do to save him, and I couldn't bear to watch what he was doing to himself. I had to leave for my own well-being. It was very painful and difficult.

After that, my own drinking escalated, and I have now been sober for almost 8 years. I am finally living the life I should have been living, and not trying to manage someone else's life.

I know it feels like he will die if you leave, but as Ladyscribbler points out, he will do what he does whether or not you and the kids are in his life. Your staying with him will not save him.

But the point is, you don't have to make any drastic changes this minute, this week, or this year. Small steps move you forward. Start focusing on yourself and your kids, do what you can to make your lives better, and eventually your decision will become clearer.

manicpanic156

Unfortunately you cannot help him or make him quit. That is the hardest and most painful lesson I had to learn when I first began coming here.

I tried everything I could for the past 5 years to try and get him to quit, try and get him to WANT to quit, even moderate it, or ONLY drink beer no vodka. Nothing, absolutely nothing worked. We had a wonderful, close marriage, two great kids, well paying careers. We were happy and loved our time together. He had everything to live a healthy life for. And he continually chose the bottle over his family. When I kicked him out, or would threaten to kick him - the promises would get trotted out. He went maybe a couple months max but eventually went back. This past year and a half I have seen a dramatic progression in not just the alcoholism but the abuse as well. Proving yet another thing Iearned here which is alcoholism is a progressive disease - it often gets worse with time.

Please listen to the advice on putting yourself and your babies first, forget about what he is doing and focus on yourself. And loved the advice where you don't need to make any dramatic changes right away. Now that your eyes have opened, it is amazing how the path and this journey unfolds in front of you. It took me a full year after the true realization of the power of addiction to finally break free.

ladyscribbler

I stayed for a long time even after it was obvious the kids and I were not only suffering but actually in danger. I'm definitely not urging you to any particular course. Only you can decide what you will do with your life.

You absolutely CAN begin to detach yourself from his drama though, and start making the choices that are best for you and the kids. Your husband is an adult and is already doing what he wants, regardless of what is best for the family.

Lexie's suggestion of having an honest talk with the kids is an excellent one. I was in my twenties by the time I connected the word "alcoholism" with my father's behavior, and by then the damage had been done. Never underestimate the power of simple honesty. It will validate their experiences and maybe even give you a starting point for what next right action you can take.

It sounds like your husband is deteriorating, with the nightly rages and the drinking at work. I used to think that I had some kind of control over the situation, that I knew what was best for him and I made it my business to try to "fix" everything that I thought was causing him to drink and rage. What I was really doing was making it easier and more comfortable for him to continue drinking.

This is a helpful reading on detachment from Al Anon literature. It's just a little bookmark, but we've had entire meetings about it. Very helpful stuff, though it will seem counter-intuitive to one who is used to keeping all the plates spinning in the air, I know.

http://www.mb.al-anon.alateen.org/Detachment.pdf

mandybegins

My oldest is 17. She'll be a Senior. I have so many conflicting thoughts. Then I have a 15 year old, a 10 year old and a 7 year old. The youngest is a boy. The rest are girls.

The oldest two disappear most nights. Shut up in their room. When he's not home we can sit and talk for hours. How I delight in those two girls!

When he's here we all tip toe around him. I need to be by his side or he pouts.

When he's home, he likes to sit in the garage and smoke. I need to stand there and talk to him. If I don't, he pouts. When he comes inside he likes to sit in his chair and watch TV. I need to sit in the living room with him and watch TV. If I am on my phone, or the computer, or reading a book. He pouts. He doesn't speak to me, he never comes to find me, he never, EVER makes sure he's by MY side, but if I don't follow him around like a dog, he's mad.

I need a plan, I know. I have to get out. I'm too old to act like this. To old to believe that anything will ever be different, and once I've given up hope, then what do I have left? I live for my kids. But what about when they start graduating and leaving. The thought of it just being he and I?

But I only work part time. I once was in IT, and made a good salary, but we moved from the city to a rural location and now I make about 12k a year. My IT skills are completely out of date, and I can't make a living wage here. I'd need to move back to the city and rent an apartment. That means taking my children out of school. My daughter, her senior year. Unless I bear through this year, but then that means taking my other daughter out before her Jr. year, and she is so involved with the school and all sorts of sports teams and clubs and stuff. It would be so hard to do.

But I can't live here if we aren't together. I don't even like living here with him, I couldn't without him. I have no friends here, they are all in the city. I have family here, as does he as it's where we grew up, but I'm so isolated here, I'm just his wife. I have no identity of my own. I think that's why he wanted to leave the city so bad, I was too independent.

I thank you so much for relating your experience to me!

Nothing changes if nothing changes. I've always been a person who hated change. lol but things just can't stay the same either!

hopeful4

I have two girls, age 16 (nearly 17) and 10. My X was very demanding of my time as well. One thing I realized is that I was exhibiting to my children how a woman should act in a marriage, all to keep the peace. That was not the way I wanted to show them, nor is it what I hope for them in their own futures.

I would say to begin to see what you can do to sharpen your skills. Is it possible you could do some in home consulting with an IT background? Just a thought. I know here where I live, IT is very in demand, even on a small, local level. I work for a mid size conglomerate. Our IT person is five hours away, so remember, a lot can be done remotely. I have only seen her about twice in the entire past year.

So, just take this time to work on you. No decisions have to be made this moment. Each step forward, even small ones, count towards making your future a better one!

Hugs!

mandybegins

Thank you for the advice of talking to my children. I will be talking to my oldest two children. I'm sure they know but don't know. They feel it, but escape from it. Perhaps it's part of why they are never, ever home. I say they can invite their friends to our house instead of always going over there, but they never, ever do. I always thought it was because they have younger siblings who intrude on them, but it's probably more than that.
That hurts.

It gives me a little calm that I don't have to get out this second. I simply couldn't. There are so many things to handle. Last summer, without even understanding that my husband is an alcoholic, I started putting a plan together to leave. I called it my 5 year plan and part of that was establishing my own credit (everything is in his name, and what wasn't he messed up) and opening my own bank account.

So my credit rating should be around 700 in a year if the credit service I use is correct and nothing crazy happens. That will be very useful, because when I started it was only 560 and i'm going to need some credit to get started on my own, including credit for renting an apartment.

I need to update my job skills (See previous post) and I'd like to do that this year. That's a whole battle that my husband doesn't understand. I had enough money to go back to school and my husband spent it. I don't know on what, I honestly, because I hate confrontation so much, I never even asked. It was just gone, and... I have my own hidden money now. I hope to save up enough to get started with school by the end of the year.

I'm nearly 37. I feel way too old to essentially be starting my entire life over. My ENTIRE life! But I either start over, or I stay in this walking nightmare where I do nothing but worry about him all day and all night long.

I will take any advice on preparation. Because I think, I have made up my mind... But I don't know how long it will take....

I kind of feel bad, living here and having him support me while I essentially make preparations to leave him. It seems immoral? But if I left now, I'd be homeless, and I am taking the kids with me. I need to be in a place where a judge will grant me custody.

mandybegins

Many years ago we split up. It was before our last two children were born. I only let him back if he gave up the hard alcohol. He did.

Who knew he could get so blasted drunk daily on beer?

Thank you for sharing yourself with me! It's so nice to see I'm not alone!

Katchie

Mandy, you're not too old...I'm 44 starting over w/o any work experience other than raising my sons and home educating them over the years. I married at 20 and don't have a college degree either. You have goals and that's good. I know you feel badly, but when you have a moment to sit and reflect on everything that has happened over the years you'all see that guilt is misplaced. You deserve better. You deserve a spouse who is present and supports you instead of pouting when you don't follow him around like a pet. You deserve a sober spouse.

You'll be surprised at how much your children know and understand. I was shocked by the understanding my sons had. I'm still amazed at how my sons always knew before me that their dad was drinking again. Maybe I was so use to him always being drunk I forgot what the sober man was like..it did always hit me square between the eyes when he sobered up -- now that was noticeable!

I asked my kids one day if when they married and had kids of their own, if their dad was still drinking, would they bring their children to visit and stay with me. They said no. It broke my heart. I want to be a grandmother someday. I want my grandchildren to come stay with me, but I would expect nothing less than my sons to protect their own from a drunk grandpa who may try to drive them somewhere as their dad did with them. It was terrifying to my sons when that happened.

Hugs...you have a lot on your plate. Take your time -- one step and one day at a time. You and your kids are going to be ok!

TropicalWinter

Just chiming in that you're DEFINITELY not too old - I turned 40 this year, and I'm starting my life over. My AH quit his job and left us, essentially abandoning us. If it weren't for the generosity of his parents, I don't know what I would have done - I'd been a stay at home mom since 2001, with little work experience and no real marketable skills. I'm back in school now studying medical lab technology, and I'm old enough to be the mother of most of my classmates, LOL.

It's scary, but there is a ton of support here. All the best to you.

CentralOhioDad

I'm over 50 with a 6-yr old, and I'm contemplating divorce. Talk about starting over at THAT advanced age!! I do look 10 years younger, however - not my assessment, but others. Regardless, it sucks to have to start over, but if it's without the company of an active A, then I'll do it.

LexieCat

I'd suggest talking with your younger kids, too, in an age-appropriate way. There are books out there to help explain alcoholism, and as I mentioned, enlisting the aid of a school counselor can be EXTREMELY valuable.

Your younger kids may need it even more than the older ones. They are still trying to figure out how the world works, and you don't want them thinking that the way things are at your house is normal or OK. You don't have to (and shouldn't) paint their dad as a bad guy, but he is a sick guy, and not the kind of dad he probably would like to be.

Do some reading, talk to some professionals, before you try to talk to them. You don't need to do that this minute, either, but it should be part of your plan of action. Even after you leave he will still be their dad and will be impacting their lives for years to come. Best to deal with it now than try to repair the damage later.

ladyscribbler

When he's home, he likes to sit in the garage and smoke. I need to stand there and talk to him. If I don't, he pouts. When he comes inside he likes to sit in his chair and watch TV. I need to sit in the living room with him and watch TV. If I am on my phone, or the computer, or reading a book. He pouts. He doesn't speak to me, he never comes to find me, he never, EVER makes sure he's by MY side, but if I don't follow him around like a dog, he's mad.

That sounds like a big, irritating waste of your time, like a pile of resentments in the making. What if he gets mad? Is that something you actually need to be afraid of, or is he just a crybaby when he doesn't get his way? If he's just whining, then this is a place where you can begin to detach. Instead of volunteering to be the audience for his drunken one-man show, why not go find something you would enjoy doing? Take the kids out for ice cream. Do you have any hobbies? You could take an online class. Take back those hours of your life.

I'm 38, btw. I left my ex and started over when I was 35. The only thing worse than leaving when I was 35 would have been wasting any more of my precious life waiting for my ex to get sober.