jenniferlynne76

I'm never too proud to admit it, and we all know I have a steep learning curve. But you were all right. I need to end this thing with the ABF.

Last night's daily phone call went from normal to "I can tell you've been drinking" in the course of 40 minutes. We went from "let's get together and have dinner and talk tomorrow" to him dropping in a number of things that are obvious tells to me.

This morning I called him and confronted him head on:
Did you drink last night? 'Yes.'

Did you drink while you were still on the phone with me. 'Yes. It was that obvious? I guess you know me pretty well. It was my last one.'

For now. 'I didn't want to say anything to you and disappoint you.'

Oh. So you thought lying was better? 'You're right that's worse. I did lie.'

Yeah. And I'm tired of it. Look, I know we said you were going to come over tonight. I don't think that's a good idea. I need a night to myself to think about me and what I want to do next. I *do* care about you. 'I know.'

But I won't keep doing this. It's taking up too much of my head and heart space. 'Understandable.'

Try to have a good day. 'You too.'

I wish I could have just ripped the damned bandaid off. Instead, though I'm respecting my space and boundaries and needs right now, it still hurts. It's still not over and he'd have to be an idiot to not know it's coming. And still, still I have to resist the urge to go back on my word even though I know I'm at least headed down the path of doing what's right. Why do I care so freaking much? Why, even knowing I'm being played and manipulated and nothing is ever going to change is it so damned hard?!

You were all right. The collective wisdom of the group wins again. 😢

Liveitwell

Hugs, friend. I've been there (and I sooooo badly wanted wveryine on this board to be wrong-but they weren't). It does hurt so freaking bad!!! You're expecting logic from an illogical person. Just sending you hugs and prayers today.

Liveitwell

Just to add, if you go back on your word, your word is as meaningless as his. (Said with empathy as I went back on my word hundreds of times-it's a learning curve).

jenniferlynne76

I won't go back on my word. As much as it sucks, I'll endure the pain and the tears and I will NOT go back on my word.

I knew this morning when I woke up that I had to call him out and tell him he wasn't welcome to come over tonight. Because letting him come over--in my mind at least--would have been like an open invitation to manipulation. "I got away with drinking while talking to you last night and *still* get to come over and take advantage of you and your space and your food and your time and your feelings! Look at me! I'm king of the world!" I'm exaggerating, of course. But that's what it felt like.

Thank you for the hugs and prayers. I'm just feeling so incredibly, incredibly sad.

Txjeepguy

I know you want closure, and believe me, I do too in my situation. But since y'all don't live together and have that fun to sort out, I would just go no contact with him.

You're spinning your wheels getting the same reaction over and over. I don't think the closure is coming.

dandylion

Jennifer.....you ask why is it so damn hard. If you really want a concrete answer to that question of "why"....I think that I mentioned, before, a book called "The Saber-toothed Tiger". It is a small book, actually...
It offers an unusual look at why women stay in relationships that are not good for them....even when they are well aware that it is bad for them....
It is written by a female therapist who has done a lot of work and research with abused women. But, it applies to all sorts of dysfunctional relationships....

Even knowing the "why".....breaking off a relationship is not ever a totally pain-free thing. Not, if you invested a part of yourself...and if you are a feeling, compassionate person.
Now, it doesn't have to devastate you.....but, it won't be totally pain free...

I have found that, sometimes (not all the time, though), when people ask "Why".....it is really a redundant or rhetorical question. A statement, rather than asking for true information.....
One, here--SR---many, many times, people will ask, with much anguish, "why do I miss him so much"......so, Dandylion gives a long detailed explanation of this human situation.....a concrete answer to that question of "why"....
And, you know what....nobody ever says that it helps....they say "thanks for your reply, BUT IT STILL HURTS".......
Go figure..........lol.......

I'll just say that when the pain gets bad enough....you just have to do what you have to do.....

dandylion

jenniferlynne76

I am still planning to read that book, dandylion.

And I think some of my question is rhetorical, because deep down I know why it hurts. It hurts because I am invested and I am compassionate. Ergo of course it's going to hurt. *sigh*

jenniferlynne76

I haven't tried yet though, to be fair. I've just been dragging my feet. Over the last month I've been progressively hinting that I'm unhappy with the way things are going. And since I started therapy and coming here I've become stronger and more firm in stating my opinions about what is acceptable and not for me, as well as the fact that I have to start putting myself first. But I haven't yet told him that until he has at least 6 months to a year of sobriety under his belt I want no contact with him.

Btw Txjeepguy, I've been following your thread and want you to know I'm sending you continued strength and hope. I hope you're able to find peace soon.

suki44883

At least a year...that's what you said in your other thread. You are backtracking.

FireSprite

A very wise member once posted that "you can't get closure from an active addict, you have to provide it for yourself."

It sucks, but it rings true.

Sorry Jen, we'd all really like to NOT be right.

atalose

It’s like you’re breaking through that big old wall of denial, you peek your head out and see reality then the heart begins to hurt and emotions run rampant so you pull back in again hoping all of these unpleasant feelings you need to feel will go away.

But you can no longer feel that comfort of hope behind the wall of denial because there is this big whole and all you can feel is the fear of what’s through that whole which is your reality.

Here’s another reality, let go or be dragged! This last month you have been dragged and by your own doing by not letting go. This is no longer about him or about his drinking or how his drinking affects you and the relationship. This is all about your relationship with self and your lack of compassion for yourself.

Letting go doesn’t mean you stop caring. It means you stop trying to force others to.

If this guy was really bothered by his own drinking as much as you are bothered by it then he’d be moving heaven and earth to do something about that but clearly he is not.

Wisconsin

Much love and support to you, JL. Your conversations with your ABF sound an awful lot like the conversations I had with my STBXAH a couple of years ago, when he was working far away. My constant questioning, my constant "reminders" that the lying was as bad, if not worse, than the drinking...I have been there.

I know that, at times, it has perhaps felt like some of us here have been maybe a tiny bit hard on you. I just want you to know that it just breaks our hearts every time someone new rolls in, with the same story and the same hopes and the same EVERYTHING. While deep down we KNOW that we cannot make things easier or better for a new member, or bring a new member to any given state of realization before that member is ready, we are still co-dependents (no matter where we are in recovery). We want to save other people the pain we have endured, even if it's just a little bit of pain.

Your story has resonated with me since you joined, not just because of some of the factual similarities, but also because it is obvious from your posts that you are very well-educated and highly intelligent. When it became apparent that my STBXAH was in the midst of a major, long-term relapse, I hung on to my case of "terminal uniqueness" for a looooong time. My AH was DIFFERENT. I was DIFFERENT. I was smart. I have advanced degrees. I have a good career. I was BETTER than this disease. Even as I came to understand the disease more and more (I had zero exposure to it before STBXAH), there were many ways in which I continued to believe this was all just different for me and my AH. I was smart and well-spoken, and I was just sure that if I explained my feelings in the right way, he would suddenly understand. Even as I came to accept that the disease had rendered him completely irrational and insane, there was part of me that still thought I could somehow do what nobody else in the history of the universe has done--use my smart lady words to convince someone else to change when that person was not ready to change. I was able to talk the recovery talk very well--I could talk about how detached I was, and how accepting I was of my powerlessness. But my actions showed otherwise. This place was one of the few environments where people loved me enough to call me out on that.

Later, as it became apparent that I had to leave, my focus shifted. It was no longer about using my smart lady words to convince AH to sober up and get back into recovery. It was about using my smart lady words to conduct myself with HONOR and RESPECT, and to navigate the end of our marriage with an attitude of cooperation and "I care about you and want you to be happy and I wish you well." For better or for worse, it took me a full year to get my logistical ducks in a row to actually leave, and I spent that whole year trying to manage and control the breakup so I could feel like I had been the best version of myself every step of the way. In truth, I was just perpetuating the cycle of insanity and abuse. I was continuing to think that my words and actions had any impact whatsoever on STBXAH. The more "reasonable" I tried to be, the worse things got. It was not until I truly detached and stopped caring about being "reasonable" and looking good that I found peace.

It is highly unlikely that I will ever have real closure with STBXAH. I have accepted that. I cannot imagine a situation in which he will EVER truly accept responsibility for certain things--even if he is sober and working a program. Ultimately, I discovered that I was waiting for his reactions to me to change, to validate how I had handled myself. Well, his reactions aren't going to change until HE changes. There are many, many things I regret about the last 7 years of my life, but I am proud of myself for leaving, proud of myself for fighting for my sanity, and proud of myself for FINALLY putting myself and my children first in deed, not just in word.

Progress, not perfection. One day at a time. One MINUTE at a time. It is obvious to me that you are definitely past the point of no return on this road. You may not have reached your destination yet, but there's no going back. And that, my friend, is amazing.

FireSprite

Every time someone says this^^ phrase I immediately think of that scene in Gilmore Girls when she's explaining letting go of her relationship with Luke. (different circumstances, but the words still work):






ETA: Excellent post Wisconsin, thanks!!

Wisconsin

I forgot to say that all of my questioning, and my admonitions of "I KNOW you were drinking, don't LIE to me" were all signs that I wasn't done yet. If I had truly been done, making him acknowledge that he was lying and that I was RIGHT would not have mattered anymore. By the last 6 months before I moved out, I no longer cared. I knew he was lying. I didn't care if he knew I knew, or if he admitted anything. I KNEW, and that was enough.

redatlanta

Its very hard to change behavior. I'll ask you to re read your post as out of the box as you can. You don't sound like his girlfriend you sound like his mother. This is not good!

Its ok to not be able cut loose immediately, but you do need to stop certain behaviors that are causing you to cling further to this relationship. Stop asking him if he is drinking, you already know the answer. Stop inquiring or being pulled into discussions about how much he drank.

Yeah. And I'm tired of it. Look, I know we said you were going to come over tonight. I don't think that's a good idea. I need a night to myself to think about me and what I want to do next. I *do* care about you. 'I know.'

But I won't keep doing this. It's taking up too much of my head and heart space. 'Understandable.' Why do you feel the need to continuously input how much you care about him? How many times have you had this exact conversation? When we exhibit this type behavior its to make US feel better not them. You are justifiably irritated - why gloss it over with "I do care about you" statements? How about "I don't want to see you this evening goodbye".

We codies are the worst at being wishy washy. You want to end the relationship, but do it with him thinking he is the most loved person in the world at the same time with out hurting his feelings. Impossible!!

Baby steps. 1) Stop inquiring about the drinking 2) stop putting yourself in a position to be lied to 3) Don't quasi apologize for cancelling an evening. These things will start helping you detach more from him and do what you need to do later.

jenniferlynne76

I may have said a year. My therapist has said "he shouldn't have an intimate relationship with anyone for at least six months to a year." This wasn't an intentional backtrack on my part.

jenniferlynne76

Thanks FireSprite. Wise words as
usual.

jenniferlynne76

Amen, atalose. Amen...

suki44883

Why should you care how long it will be before he should have an intimate relationship? If you are done, you are done. It doesn't sound to me like you are done. You just want to say something...anything...that will suddenly make a light bulb go on over his head and convince him that he is about to lose you and decide to straighten up his act.

I know what I say sounds harsh, but it comes from experience and I know I am not the only one here who believes this. The fact that you are dragging this out is evidence that you aren't yet truly done.

jenniferlynne76

*tears* Thank you for sharing so much of yourself and your story with me Wisconsin. I'm proud of you for taking the steps that you did -- as hard as they were/are -- and for sticking around here to not only continue on your journey, but help others, like me, on mine.