iamthird

Funny how this thread comes about today because someone actually remarked on a thread I started yesterday how far I have come. That made me go back and read every post I made since joining. Wow. What a transformation! SR is such a great place for so many reasons.

When I first started SR, I was so downtrodden, sad, miserable yet thinking I was the exception somehow, that my husband would be the one to recover. I did not ever get combative but I remember staying off the site at times when I felt criticized. Today, I can ses how truly sick I used to be. Today, I am so thankful I am not there anymore. I am SO grateful to SR, it has truly sustained me.

unsureoffuture

For me, when I came here. I wasn't so much defensive but in denial. MY situation was different. MY AH was different. Yada yada yada. Even though at the time I didn't like the reponses in the back of my head those reponses were the only thing that truly made sense in my chaotic world. It took months for me to realize they were spot on. MY situation wasnt different. My A was just like every other A.

Even though people might not be accepting at that very moment, as they grow in their own recovery things become clearer.

Yurt

Yes, I received a digital "thunk on the head" when I suggested that my situation was somehow different from everyone elses, a year ago.
Truthfully, this site, and the posters, have helped me more than my local Al Anon or my counselor. Whenever I wobble (which is often), I merely have to browse the threads on this forum (as well as reviewing my old posts) to set my resolve. This morning, I am meeting with AH and the paralegal that I hired, so here I am again. Hopefully, it will be drama free...

Lovenjoy

fantastic thread! when i first came to SR i was broken and lost. it was a revelation to find so many others who were living the same nightmare. sounds a little heartless but i think the isolation i felt was the worst part. i truly credit SR for stopping the downward spiral i was on.

i don't recall that anyone ever berated me. lots of love and encouragement to take care of myself. self care. wow. brand new concept for me. now i couldn't live a day without loving my self and doing something nice just for me!

and once i found some balance i ventured to other parts of the forum and i learn and learn and learn. and i really feel connected to a global support system. i don't post a lot, no time!, but i read every day and SR is one of the most valuable tools in my belt.

i am grateful for all of you every day and add my prayers and energy for all the sick and suffering to find healing.

wanttobehealthy

When I came here I was looking for answers that I wanted to hear (but like many of the threads that get triggering bc I see my denial ridden self in them) I claimed that was not the case...

I came here saying I just needed to be "understood"- code for "see my point of view without asking tough questions that I do not care to answer since I like the blinders I am wearing and want to stay in denial".

And when I didn't feel "understood" (see above definition) I cried that people were too harsh and uncaring and not compassionate. I certainly FELT that was the case but feelings and facts arent the same (my xAH would debate that as would many other A's is my guess-- they "feel" persecuted so they must be!).

The reality is that the people whose posts made me cringe, made me anxious, made me hurt at times are the ones that helped me grow. They were honest, loving and compassionate because they were TRUTHFUL.

But what I liked when I first came were the "you're doing the best you can, your kids will be okay, you're a great mom, your AH is awful..." That way I could sleep at night and tell myself I was trying hard and it was okay if I continued to live in the insanity around me and subject my kids to abuse, because at least I was "trying"...

I LOVED the validation of those kind of posts bc they kept me firmly planted in denial land where I owned a whole lot of property for many years.

But the posts that stuck with me, that I remember still, that I read to this day, came from the members who were honest and asked hard questions and who at times told me bluntly that as ACOA's, I had no right to put my desire for a life with AH above the protection of my kids. Those posts angered me beyond belief bc much like an A drinks bc they can't face reality or truth, those posts were like holding a mirror up to me and I did not like it one bit.

So, I came here searching for a solution to fix my marriage and have the life I wanted with then AH and my kids... I wanted things to be how I thought they should be and I was bound and determined to make life be what I wanted it to be.

What I got in the end is the exact opposite of what I came here for... And for that I am eternally grateful.

We spouses/partners of A's arent all that different than A's at all... They angrily lash out at us for calling them out on the reality of their lives and we codies who come here looking for a cure all for the mess that our lives are, angrily lash out at those who suggest anything other than what we want to hear... Not so different at all from the A dance...

healthyagain

When I first joined this forum, I was looking for a solution . . . and that solution was for him, because he was an alcoholic, and I was the better half of the relationship, and of course I did not have any problems.

And I keep coming back because you were all so right.

AnvilheadII

actually when I FIRST got here I was struggling to get off crack (previously here at Anvilhead). the other site I used for support "went away" and I already knew the value of online support. the transition from the familiar to the new was a bit rough for me and there wasn't a LOT of recovering crackheads here at the time (7? years ago??).

since my other half hank also used, the firmer I got in my decision to quit and STAY quit caused a lot of "friction" since he wasn't THERE yet and would be damned if I was gonna tell him what to do! nothing will bring the codie side out quicker than the STRONG desire to get someone ELSE to quit. now.

then came the day that hank got off work early, way up north, and the guys started a pub crawl of sorts. the more he drank, the dumber he got. he didn't have a cell phone back then, so I started blowing up his buddies phone. the bank account looked like a bad day on wall street, where the "value" starts to plummet. the buddy's wife and I were on the phone, we knew by then they were closer to home, so she is out driving around in her cAR with me on the phone, hunting them down. ran into one of their dealers - have you seen them? uh, nope. (riiiiight).

I basically went insane that night. I had the phone # of a member here and cried and ranted to her for a good long time. I was beside myself, truly out of control. he did finally get home. I pretended not to notice. as soon as he crashed, I ransacked his car, found all the atm receipts and lo and behold, a baggie of coke. left them all on the counter. went OFF on his @ss when he woke up, told him that was it, took off - he's yelling, where the hell are you going? I spit back "as far away from YOU as humanly possible".

THAT was when I realized I need to learn about BOUNDARIES. not for him, but because I didn't want to be a crazy woman. I wanted to stay clean, I HOPED he'd join me, but I had to put ME first and was going about it all wrong! and I needed help.

boundaries saved my sanity. I was committed that if need be i'd leave. and I meant it. even tho the crack went away, and we bought a house, hank still from time to time got the itch for coke. not all the time, but boy it was a rough go for a year or so. he really loved this house tho......the boy from Wisconsin actually had a house on a lake with stocked trout and his own dock. and we had little Bucky. and it opened his eyes to what life really could be like, after a 20 year run with the dope. wasn't cuz I threatened to leave, or gave ultimatums. somehow, some way, the goodness of all it got thru to him. and he came to believe.

and so here we are 8 years later. couple weeks shy of 12 years together. hoo rah. he's out back right now with Buck, cleaning all the leaves off the patio. both have a bit of grey now - hank's brown/gold hair has lots of "blonde" streaks and Bucky has the distinguished old man muzzle. boundaries are different today - while we may pretty joined at the hip, it's important I remember when I end and he begins.

I still can't MAKE him do anything! learned a hard lesson last year when thru attitude and generally being a b!tch, I manipulated him into mowing the yard. on his second pass on the thin strip of grass on one side of the driveway, he ran over a rock, which shot out sideways and shattered the rear passenger window of MY car. a one in a million shot. and boy did the day disintegrate from there!!! the Universe makes sure I don't MISS the lesson!

in full disclosure, I've never been to an Alanon or Naranon meeting. I am quite familiar with the 12 steps (years of AA and NA before a relapse) and they are still a part of my life. I believe recovery IS possible for anyone who truly wants it and is willing to go to ANY length to get it. and keep it.

Bamawife

When I joined a week or so ago, my emotions were (and still are somewhat) so raw. Since this is all non-verbal communication, it is hard to detect someone's tone in a post. A couple of times I felt attacked. I now understand that was not the case!

Everyone should remember that gentle words go a long way in the beginning!

honeypig

This is a great thread with a lot of honest and thoughtful responses. I don't know that I can add anything, other than to agree w/those who said that often the responses that most offended me were the ones that turned out to be the most helpful in the end. I didn't want to hear what I didn't want to hear. Thank the powers that be that I finally WAS ready to hear what was being said to me. I could never have gotten anywhere w/o those voices sharing their ES&H.

There is a thread that I've sometimes referred newbies to when they're feeling attacked: http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...y-they-do.html

And this is a thread regarding that "but we're different/special" feeling that plugs up our ears and stops growth:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...special-i.html
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...pecial-ii.html

Those threads all proved powerful for me in the earlier days, and I still find it helpful to read thru them once in a while just to reinforce what I'm learning.

I'm in a struggling time right now and relating a LOT to being brand new...I appreciate this topic being raised and the comments of everyone who's posted.

dbh

This is a great thread.

I am an adult child of an alcoholic. I started my recovery on another message board, but then found a home here when that board was taken down.

I find myself drawn to respond and give advice whenever I read a post involving children. I guess I know how much my father's alcoholism affected me and my siblings and I want to prevent it from happening to more children.

However, a person living with an active alcoholic does not need more shame and guilt. My parents have been divorced for 35 years and my mother STILL can't admit her role in our family's dysfunction. She still blames my father and feels like she did the best that she could to hide things from us so that we could have a "happy" childhood (ha!).

On my old message board, we were strongly encouraged to only share our experience, strength, and hope (ESH). I try to use this practice when responding to a post or when interacting with people in real life. It helps to keep my codependency in check.

I often need to remind myself that people recover at their own rate and that some will never recover. Denial acts as a protection. It can help us live through some really awful things. Forcing someone to admit that they are in denial is actually cruel. It is like pulling a blanket off of someone trying to stay warm.

I have included one of my favorite readings about denial below. Hope you enjoy it.

Hope everyone has a good day.

db

===
You are reading from the book The Language of Letting Go

Denial

I've been recovering many years. I've used denial many times. It has been a defense, a survival device, a coping behavior, and, at times, almost my undoing. It has been both a friend and an enemy.

When I was a child, I used denial to protect my family and myself. I protected myself from seeing things too painful to see and feelings too overwhelming to feel. Denial got me safely through many traumatic situations, when I had no other resources for survival.

The negative aspect of using denial was that I lost touch with my feelings and myself. I became able to participate in harmful situations without even knowing I was hurting. I was able to tolerate a great deal of pain and abuse without the foggiest notion it was abnormal.

I learned to participate in my own abuse.

Denial protected me from pain, but it also rendered me blind to my feelings, my needs, and myself. It was like a thick blanket that covered and smothered me.

Eventually, I began to recover. I had a glimpse of awareness about my pain, my feelings, and my behaviors. I began to see myself, and the world, as we were. There was so much denial from my past that had the blanket been entirely ripped from me. I would have died from the shock of exposure. I needed to embrace insights, remembrances, awareness, and healing gently, gradually.

Life participated in this process with me. It is a gentle teacher. As I recovered, I was brought to the incidents and people I needed in order to remind me of what I was still denying, to tell me where I required more healing from my past, as I could handle these insights.

I still use, and break through, denial--as needed. When the winds of change blow through, upsetting a familiar structure and preparing me for the new, I pick up my blanket and hide, for a while. Sometimes, when someone I love has a problem, I hide under the blanket, momentarily. Memories emerge of things denied, memories that need to be remembered, felt, and accepted so I can continue to become healed - strong and healthy.

irisgardens

This is a wonderful thread and I am so inspired by every post here...and one of the things that keeps me in recovery (even though I seem to keep going through endless layers of things--thanks Sparklekitty...you described it to a 't' and even my old addictions like shopping and eating don't help anymore)--I am glad every time I come here as I keep taking steps and even if they are miniscule...they are steps and evident to me... I have a good memory (it is a curse mostly) and I so remember how I entered recovery 19 years ago and it was to 'help' someone else...and I hated it and I rejected it and I had to go the scenic path and get a therapist who could help me learn some of the techniques and other programs that helped at the time too...and I just kept trying...so guess that is why I empathize with newcomers as they really don't know and don't believe and it is not faked...I like the term 'terminal uniqueness' as I can see myself there and how dumb I was...and I am so grateful that as I make a bit of progress...and it sometimes seems that the pain is going to kill me before I make that progress...I know that there is more recovery where the last bit came from as long as I am willing and working my program to my best ability. Thank you to all...I so respect the longtimers as I know now what it takes to get out of that terminal uniqueness that I allowed myself to believe in so long...and I remember other 'aha's' that surely came way after any good enough student would have gotten them...but I am working those steps I can...and praying for that serenity and when life interferes (another addict in the family)--I am trying to not crash and burn with feeling as if I 'can't do this again' because it is not again...it is now...and time for another set of steps (the same steps really) and going deeper than before. Thank you all for being here...I am beginning to feel more comfortable but found this site when I was in a country where the 12 steps are practically non-existant and non-culturally acceptable and am so grateful how far I have come since February 2013...and so grateful that my HP (God to me) is continuing to help although I can't help but feel as if there are 20 tons of garbage weighing down my insides and I don't want to do anything...but I am here...and I am doing some phone alanon or online naranon meetings and I went to a f2f meeting last week and will go again this week and I set a boundary with a RLO over the weekend and it is slow by slow...by faith and following the instructions and guidance of my HP. I know that I implode when I try to do everything all at once now...and yet...I haven't gotten to the place where I don't worry. Don't know when that comes in...but am just taking and working my program...slow by slow...and trying not to make up outcomes that only exist in my head because I know that I cannot trust my mind when it comes to those outcomes. Then, just for today... Thank you for this post...it illuminated something for me...

Flavia2

I only felt attacked about one really opinionated post that I should get my kids out of the house because of the exposure to an alcoholic parent. In reality, my AH was hardly home and my kids would have seen MORE of him if we separated back then.
Otherwise, the thing that stands out about my posts is that I was so blind. I didn't think my situation exceptional, but I didn't see the patterns. And didn't see a way out.

Ixi

That is a perfect way to phrase it, and that was absolutely me. If I'm being honest with myself, it still is, to some degree. No, my XABF didn't cheat on me. He wasn't abusive. He knew he was an alcoholic and wanted to get sober. But obviously every person, every relationship, is going to be slightly different. But the underlying things we all share are the same: the lies, the disappointment, the secrets. And, above all, the loneliness. Thankfully, that last one kept me coming back until I was ready to accept the rest-and that my case isn't that different than everyone else's.

BrokenInPieces

I lurked here for a bit initially. At the time, I was looking for any shred of hope that my now-ex bf was not an alcoholic - that it was me being judgmental or too critical or my expectations were too high, etc. Maybe there was something I could do or say that I hadn't done or said yet. Anything that I could change about me so that he didn't have to change (because - by that time - it was clear he wasn't going to)
I didn't want to walk away from an otherwise wonderfully good man.

I found no shred of hope.

I figured surely someone would tell me there was hope if I posted my own story... because it was different, y'know? But, unfortunately, it wasn't. The only difference was that the behaviors and situations that others had already experienced hadn't happened with my A... yet.

Admittedly, I am still wrestling with denial and reality. He is a good man and I love him dearly... but he drinks every single night, and it was affecting our relationship.

I continue to come here and read/post as I work through the feelings and emotions that remain.

DoubleDragons

I first came to SR and I went to Alanon meetings to FIX my mother's drinking problem. I arrogantly thought that I was the only one in the family strong enough to be up to this task. I really believed that I had this tremendous caring heart, this wonderful nurturing quality and therefore, that meant I had to be executive director of the lives of everyone who I cared about. It did not matter to me that I was full of resentment and none of my "nurturing" was working.

When I let the shock wear off that I wasn't quite the "wonderful, caring" person that I believed myself to be, but more of a codependent control freak, I started really working on the only person whom I could help . . . . myself. I realized that while my drinking patterns weren't at the levels of my mother's habits, they were never healthy, so I quit drinking and I have been sober for over a year. I learned the difference between boundaries and manipulative control tactics and I learned to nurture myself. My mother is still an active alcoholic but I am mostly at peace with that. I trust God with her life and all of our lives, really. It is a really big relief to give a lot of this to God. So, SR helped bring about the biggest positive transformation of my life and yet, none of it went the way I expected to, when I still had my delusion of control. I like that I have lost a lot of my "victim mentality", realizing that a lot of my pain was self-inflicted with weird "shoulds and rules and lofty expectations of myself and others" that I put upon myself. I feel freer and more confident than I ever have felt in my life. Thank you all for helping me along the journey . . . .

atalose

When I first came to SR I truely was at-a-lose. Al-anon wasn't working quick enough for me. I wasn't getting it, it seemed to move slowly and all my questions weren't getting answered.

SR was direct and REAL. I heard here all the things that seemed to never get answered in al-anon.

In experiencing both I was able to understand addiction and addict behavior and my Un-healthy reactions towards it. I am able to continue to work my recovery and continue to learn and grow.

The cold hard truth that came from some very special people here are what helped me the most even when at times it stung and wasn't what I wished to have heard. It would have been easier NOT to have come back, bury my head in denial but it's true-----once you know something you can't Un-know it no matter how hard you try. You can leave here but you take what you've heard with you and at some point you eventually accept it. And once you accept it you can take action for yourself towards a more peaceful and happy life.

PohsFriend

I felt attacked. I completely get the venting and get that many here are not really friends with the alcoholic but are trying to get over them. It was good for a shot of reality though. Did not like the name calling toward my then deeply troubled and very sick woman who is now my wife, a great mom and 25 months sober this week.
But it helped me find the steel I'd need to get where we are today. I needed hope and honestly getting mad at many who are now dear friends helped. She needed me to be protective of her and hate the disease that was killing her. Coming here - completely ignorant of alcoholism - made me face reality and I had a tough choice to make. I could see myself after ten years of the roller coaster and it terrified me. Nope, wasn't going to do that. It pushed me very quickly to a crossroads and our rock bottom moment. I kicked her out and told her I loved her enough to help her if she chose to get well but far too much to watch her die - selfish maybe 'sorry, you dying in front of my eyes would be tough for me, pass.' ...but I was lucky. I'd been enabling til then and learned what a boundary was. Never was allowed those growing up with an npd mom.
Kicking her out forced her to bottom out and she's been climbing since 12/26/2011 with one slip nine months in.
Today she is a wonderful wife and mommy. A sought after sponsor and a devoted member if a great aa group. People said we had a 2% chance and I got mad but I needed it for what was ahead! I looked around the room and wondered who the other 1 was and felt bad for the other 98. I was lucky. I made a decision early on - life with a recovered alcoholic or life away from an active one and I was ok with it. I know tomorrow could change all that but I have the tools to cope and she knows what she would lose and that I'd miss her and pray and welcome her home once she got back in her program assuming she did. Fear paralyzed so I decided to skip that. If she relapsed tomorrow it has been well worth it. We are winning together and happy... No sense overthinking that ;-)

NYCDoglvr

Yesterday I celebrated 23 years of recovery by going to AA meetings and not drinking one day at a time. My relationship with another (sort-of) recovering alcoholic was the worst of my life and the worst experience I've had during that period. I still need the help of other codependents so I don't pick another screwed up person who brings tragedy into my life. When I came here I was out of that bad relationship but helping others is a way of helping myself.

Kboys

I am still very new here, and have a lot to learn... but I have SO appreciated all the wisdom and support. I have to say though, that at this point, I feel a bit embarrassed to post anything else. Two weeks ago my AH had moved out, and I felt I was on the right path, though it was hard. And, well, I let him come back. He hasn't been drinking for about 10 days. And while the past 10 days have been mostly very nice, I know I am not unique. I know that it's only a matter of time before the s*** hits the fan again, but against my better judgement, and against all of the comments I received, I let it happen again.
So now I feel as though I would just be embarrassed to keep posting my woes, like you all would feel as though you wasted your time and your encouragement on someone who apparently wasn't ready to follow through

honeypig

Kboys, never be afraid to post. I surely didn't "get it right" on the first try (haven't "got it right" yet, as a matter of fact!), and I don't think it's MY place to judge YOUR progress. Keep reaching out, keep learning and growing and following your own path. Like they say in Alanon, keep coming back. There is no one right way.