Am I the abuser
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 75
Am I the abuser
This is going to be a long post - so thank you for reading.
I have been in Alanon for a little over a year now. I have not attended many meetings over the last 3 months - so I know one thing I need to do is go back to meetings.
Just before I joined Alanon - there was an altercation with my husband where he threw a set of keys at me hitting me in the chest while our small son ( 4 months old at the time ) was behind me. This was not the first time he threw something at me. Nor is it the last He had hit me in the past but this time I was not going to accept unacceptable behavior. I called the police.
Long story short - he called his mother - who told him I had over reacted and I was an unsafe mother and an unsafe wife - she has refused to acknowledge my existence ever since.
On to the present - I have done my step work. I feel I can see how I contributed in the past to much of our fighting and altercations - my insistence on trying to change through manipulation, fear, anger, guilt ... what essentially is not mine to change. I work day by day to change this. Somedays are better than other days.
His mother who lives across the country is about to get an IPad so she can connect with her grandkids. I felt now was a good time to bring up that it was important that we have a healthy and appropriate way to deal with his mothers clear lack of acknowledgement of my existence - it will begin to become more obvious as our son gets older - and I felt we could try and handle the situation together. I believe she is an abusive women who has abused and manipulated her children - it is infact not wanting to be like her that has pushed me to get help.
I know my husband well enough now to know that he needs time to process things. So I emailed him and let him know we had time to think about it but we should at least acknowledge that it has to happen and that we will both respectively come up with ideas.
I think it is processing this email that led to the Dr. Jeckyl and Mr Hyde act that occurred.
Saturday was a great day. Sunday was mothers day and started out great and then something happened and he was upset and not willing to talk about it. I repeated my mantra in my head " I did not cause this, I can not cure this, I can not control this" while we worked on a renovation project. Until finally I let him know I understood he had feelings he was trying to express but if he was unwilling to share them with me and deal with them or deal with them on his own I had to stop working with him. I was unable to work with him in the state he was in.
I left the situation and sat on the couch. I watched him get angry and throw some tools.
Eventually he was sitting on the steps alone so I went up and offered him a hug.
He said " I saw you posted a Ted Talk about violence against women" " you are not that women"
I froze and I lied. I know better now then to have a conversation with him about physical abuse. He thinks what happened was no big deal. Or will tell me all the things I said or did prior to it happening to "put it in context"
" I was trying to talk to you and you were on your phone so I slapped your phone out of your hand - you were abusing me by not talking to me "
" You were going to leave and clearly were upset and would not be able to function on the streets so I smacked you across the face because you would not listen to me"
" I threw the glass at the wall not at you"
" It was a plush toy that I threw at you in our counseling session"
"I threatened to smash your face with my helmet because you would not let me leave on my motercycle."
"I threw the keys at you because you clearly wanted all the keys and I wanted to take the car to AA instead of my motorcycle or bicycle because I might drink if I did not have the car" ( this one is not verbatum I have shortened it to the basic explanation)
______________________
I have decided to not have these conversations with him. So I lied I told him I posted it during violence against women month. And he said " when is emotionally abused by their wife month"
-----------------
I should have walked away.
But I hate so much that he does not acknowledge his abuse to me AND I know full well I can be emotionally abusive. I tried to listen t him tell me about thinking he is being abused. I tried to be honest and It seemed to go well and we went back to work.
Then he left and I started having a lot of feelings about the fact that he still is so unaware of his impact on me. I went down a spiral. The thing with his mom and how every time they talk I hear here talking to my son and I die a little inside. I know the impact this women has had on 2 of her sons and there is no acknowledgment of the sheer disfunction of this women. Her betrayal goes very deep for me for other reasons. I had a very inappropriate relationship with her - she originally came across as a therapist who could help me with my life ( she is not licensed but claimed to be qualified ) and my husband claimed she was legitimate ( we were not married at the time). I trusted her and developed a councilor patient relationship with her - to which she has used against me and used that information to publicly damage and humiliate me to others.
By the time he came home and was still in his rather difficult to be around mood - I couldn't take it anymore and I had a pretty bad relapse of old angry behavior. I was mean and awful.
Eventually he brought me to tears by telling me " the police officer and I joked about the marks I left on you - they were a joke"
" you keep acting like this was a big deal and it was not"
---------------------------------------------------------------
We had to pack for a 3 hour drive and eventually talked a little bit before - the entire focus of what he wanted to talk about was how I was abusing him.
---------------------
I tried to be honest and let him know I know how I am abusive here is what I found in step 4 and here is what I am working on.
_____________________________
But it all sits wrong with me. He is an unrecovered A. He has been in and out of program. Has never done his steps. He is currently just sobering up again.
-----------------------
I know my behavior was poor. I know I relapsed into anger. BUT I can not help but feel like he spend an entire day pushing my buttons. I can not help but reflect on the day and try and think of how I should have better removed myself from the situation. I can not help but feel a bit wrong and like this is another way the disease is keeping his focus off himself.
------------------------
I can not help but wonder if me staying with him is a problem, because I know I am not perfect and I know I have to keep working hard on my own alcoholic behavior ( I might not have a drinking problem but I have a problem). As long as he can look at me to justify his actions - he will. I also know I am not strong enough to leave. I know I can not raise our son alone. I know that I can not return to my own family and re-enter their cycle of addiction. I know relapse and recovery is all part of recovery and I hope one day he does do more than just sober up.
---------------------
I love him of course. I love of our life. We keep trying to move forward, trying to be good parents, trying to make choices for our family. This disease get's in the way often.
----------------------
I do think this reflection on being abused by me could be good - at least he is thinking about and expressing his feelings - even if I do not like them and even if I wish he would focus more on what he does and not on what others do.
--------------------
Am I the abuser though? I did have to eventually stop the conversation because he was talking on and on about the ways I have abused him. I told him I did not feel emotionally strong enough to hear all his pain. I really at the time and still do think he was projecting a lot of his pain from the way his mom acts onto me.
The fact that I eventually could not hear him talk about the ways I have abused him - labeling things as abuse that I would not .... is not lost on me.
It is no different then what he does to me.
-----------------------------------------
I am very confused on how to process all of this.
thanks for listening and any thoughts are appreciated.
I have been in Alanon for a little over a year now. I have not attended many meetings over the last 3 months - so I know one thing I need to do is go back to meetings.
Just before I joined Alanon - there was an altercation with my husband where he threw a set of keys at me hitting me in the chest while our small son ( 4 months old at the time ) was behind me. This was not the first time he threw something at me. Nor is it the last He had hit me in the past but this time I was not going to accept unacceptable behavior. I called the police.
Long story short - he called his mother - who told him I had over reacted and I was an unsafe mother and an unsafe wife - she has refused to acknowledge my existence ever since.
On to the present - I have done my step work. I feel I can see how I contributed in the past to much of our fighting and altercations - my insistence on trying to change through manipulation, fear, anger, guilt ... what essentially is not mine to change. I work day by day to change this. Somedays are better than other days.
His mother who lives across the country is about to get an IPad so she can connect with her grandkids. I felt now was a good time to bring up that it was important that we have a healthy and appropriate way to deal with his mothers clear lack of acknowledgement of my existence - it will begin to become more obvious as our son gets older - and I felt we could try and handle the situation together. I believe she is an abusive women who has abused and manipulated her children - it is infact not wanting to be like her that has pushed me to get help.
I know my husband well enough now to know that he needs time to process things. So I emailed him and let him know we had time to think about it but we should at least acknowledge that it has to happen and that we will both respectively come up with ideas.
I think it is processing this email that led to the Dr. Jeckyl and Mr Hyde act that occurred.
Saturday was a great day. Sunday was mothers day and started out great and then something happened and he was upset and not willing to talk about it. I repeated my mantra in my head " I did not cause this, I can not cure this, I can not control this" while we worked on a renovation project. Until finally I let him know I understood he had feelings he was trying to express but if he was unwilling to share them with me and deal with them or deal with them on his own I had to stop working with him. I was unable to work with him in the state he was in.
I left the situation and sat on the couch. I watched him get angry and throw some tools.
Eventually he was sitting on the steps alone so I went up and offered him a hug.
He said " I saw you posted a Ted Talk about violence against women" " you are not that women"
I froze and I lied. I know better now then to have a conversation with him about physical abuse. He thinks what happened was no big deal. Or will tell me all the things I said or did prior to it happening to "put it in context"
" I was trying to talk to you and you were on your phone so I slapped your phone out of your hand - you were abusing me by not talking to me "
" You were going to leave and clearly were upset and would not be able to function on the streets so I smacked you across the face because you would not listen to me"
" I threw the glass at the wall not at you"
" It was a plush toy that I threw at you in our counseling session"
"I threatened to smash your face with my helmet because you would not let me leave on my motercycle."
"I threw the keys at you because you clearly wanted all the keys and I wanted to take the car to AA instead of my motorcycle or bicycle because I might drink if I did not have the car" ( this one is not verbatum I have shortened it to the basic explanation)
______________________
I have decided to not have these conversations with him. So I lied I told him I posted it during violence against women month. And he said " when is emotionally abused by their wife month"
-----------------
I should have walked away.
But I hate so much that he does not acknowledge his abuse to me AND I know full well I can be emotionally abusive. I tried to listen t him tell me about thinking he is being abused. I tried to be honest and It seemed to go well and we went back to work.
Then he left and I started having a lot of feelings about the fact that he still is so unaware of his impact on me. I went down a spiral. The thing with his mom and how every time they talk I hear here talking to my son and I die a little inside. I know the impact this women has had on 2 of her sons and there is no acknowledgment of the sheer disfunction of this women. Her betrayal goes very deep for me for other reasons. I had a very inappropriate relationship with her - she originally came across as a therapist who could help me with my life ( she is not licensed but claimed to be qualified ) and my husband claimed she was legitimate ( we were not married at the time). I trusted her and developed a councilor patient relationship with her - to which she has used against me and used that information to publicly damage and humiliate me to others.
By the time he came home and was still in his rather difficult to be around mood - I couldn't take it anymore and I had a pretty bad relapse of old angry behavior. I was mean and awful.
Eventually he brought me to tears by telling me " the police officer and I joked about the marks I left on you - they were a joke"
" you keep acting like this was a big deal and it was not"
---------------------------------------------------------------
We had to pack for a 3 hour drive and eventually talked a little bit before - the entire focus of what he wanted to talk about was how I was abusing him.
---------------------
I tried to be honest and let him know I know how I am abusive here is what I found in step 4 and here is what I am working on.
_____________________________
But it all sits wrong with me. He is an unrecovered A. He has been in and out of program. Has never done his steps. He is currently just sobering up again.
-----------------------
I know my behavior was poor. I know I relapsed into anger. BUT I can not help but feel like he spend an entire day pushing my buttons. I can not help but reflect on the day and try and think of how I should have better removed myself from the situation. I can not help but feel a bit wrong and like this is another way the disease is keeping his focus off himself.
------------------------
I can not help but wonder if me staying with him is a problem, because I know I am not perfect and I know I have to keep working hard on my own alcoholic behavior ( I might not have a drinking problem but I have a problem). As long as he can look at me to justify his actions - he will. I also know I am not strong enough to leave. I know I can not raise our son alone. I know that I can not return to my own family and re-enter their cycle of addiction. I know relapse and recovery is all part of recovery and I hope one day he does do more than just sober up.
---------------------
I love him of course. I love of our life. We keep trying to move forward, trying to be good parents, trying to make choices for our family. This disease get's in the way often.
----------------------
I do think this reflection on being abused by me could be good - at least he is thinking about and expressing his feelings - even if I do not like them and even if I wish he would focus more on what he does and not on what others do.
--------------------
Am I the abuser though? I did have to eventually stop the conversation because he was talking on and on about the ways I have abused him. I told him I did not feel emotionally strong enough to hear all his pain. I really at the time and still do think he was projecting a lot of his pain from the way his mom acts onto me.
The fact that I eventually could not hear him talk about the ways I have abused him - labeling things as abuse that I would not .... is not lost on me.
It is no different then what he does to me.
-----------------------------------------
I am very confused on how to process all of this.
thanks for listening and any thoughts are appreciated.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Midwest, USA
Posts: 2,899
He's gaslighting you.
His behavior here is controlling, abusive, and reactionary. I won't even get started on his mom. That's some Grade-A Personality Disorder stuff there.
This is soul-killing behavior. Are you able to see a counselor for yourself, a real one?
" I was trying to talk to you and you were on your phone so I slapped your phone out of your hand - you were abusing me by not talking to me "
" You were going to leave and clearly were upset and would not be able to function on the streets so I smacked you across the face because you would not listen to me"
" I threw the glass at the wall not at you"
" It was a plush toy that I threw at you in our counseling session"
"I threatened to smash your face with my helmet because you would not let me leave on my motercycle."
"I threw the keys at you because you clearly wanted all the keys and I wanted to take the car to AA instead of my motorcycle or bicycle because I might drink if I did not have the car" ( this one is not verbatum I have shortened it to the basic explanation)
" You were going to leave and clearly were upset and would not be able to function on the streets so I smacked you across the face because you would not listen to me"
" I threw the glass at the wall not at you"
" It was a plush toy that I threw at you in our counseling session"
"I threatened to smash your face with my helmet because you would not let me leave on my motercycle."
"I threw the keys at you because you clearly wanted all the keys and I wanted to take the car to AA instead of my motorcycle or bicycle because I might drink if I did not have the car" ( this one is not verbatum I have shortened it to the basic explanation)
This is soul-killing behavior. Are you able to see a counselor for yourself, a real one?
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: FtW, Tx
Posts: 198
Sorry you are dealing with this and glad you took steps to protect yourself. His mother likely knows nothing, zero, zilch about alcoholism and the narcissism that it accompanies. Take care of yourself and your children as it progresses.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,913
He is doing what addicts do...turn everything around and make it all your fault. You deserve the abuse because you did this or you said that. It's all ********. You do not deserve his abuse and your child does not deserve to grow up in an abusive home. Chances are very good that it will just get worse.
I hope you will contact a domestic violence facility and at least talk to them. You need to get out of the situation before you will become clear-headed enough to realize just how bad it really is. Please take steps to protect yourself and your son. (((HUGS)))
I hope you will contact a domestic violence facility and at least talk to them. You need to get out of the situation before you will become clear-headed enough to realize just how bad it really is. Please take steps to protect yourself and your son. (((HUGS)))
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
I know I only have your side, but I believe YOU keep trying to move forward, and that YOU are trying to be a good parent, and YOU are thinking about the choices for your family. From what you have described, I believe HE is more preoccupied with winning the argument.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 75
Counseling
I think that would be a good idea. I had a great therapist prior to moving here to be with him. It was the loss of that therapist ( because of the move) that prompted his mom reaching out to help me.
I have had some mistrust issues relating to all of this. Mistrust of how I am remembering situations and of my own take on things as well as my own ability to even help myself.
Sometimes I have to remember that self care is really important.
We had seen a couples councilor for awhile but when he thew something at me in counseling I quit going. I moved out for a little bit but raising our son on my own was too much for me. I did not feel I could care for him adequately. I know that I can not.
I could make an appointment to talk to that councilor again. We saw him for two years. I think I resent how involved his mom became in even our counselling sessions and how we should frame that relationship.
I have had some mistrust issues relating to all of this. Mistrust of how I am remembering situations and of my own take on things as well as my own ability to even help myself.
Sometimes I have to remember that self care is really important.
We had seen a couples councilor for awhile but when he thew something at me in counseling I quit going. I moved out for a little bit but raising our son on my own was too much for me. I did not feel I could care for him adequately. I know that I can not.
I could make an appointment to talk to that councilor again. We saw him for two years. I think I resent how involved his mom became in even our counselling sessions and how we should frame that relationship.
Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Memphis, TN
Posts: 2,884
Unacceptable behavior is unacceptable behavior. It can not be justified. What do you plan to do if the next time instead of keys he throws a hammer, or instead of a slap it's a punch?
Your friend,
Your friend,
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
This is classic ABUSER behavior from him. It comes right from the abuser playbook.
Please read this site.
https://www.whengeorgiasmiled.org/do...uide_adult.pdf
Please read this site.
https://www.whengeorgiasmiled.org/do...uide_adult.pdf
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 75
Alcoholism is a progressive disease. I feel like in knowing that I have made choices that otherwise I would not have made.
We purchased a home 3 hours from where he works which cost us 1/8 of the cost of a home where he works. While I can not work right now When I can work my salary and work prospects in that area would be enough to cover childcare and care of the home. I am a special education teacher/ Preschool teacher so I will never make very much money but it would be enough to feed and clothe us and keep our home. We would be close enough that he could see his son but far enough that I could start to separate from what is happening. Things are not there yet - in terms of his progression and in terms of my ability to be out there full time alone.
This is killing my soul. I know from my history and my step work that this is a pattern I bring myself to. I think I also need to focus on what I did right on Sunday. It was the first time I walked away and said " I can not work with you when you are like this"
When I did that I acknowledged he had a right to his feelings ( I used to get mad at him for having them because they affected me ) but I also had a right to not be around him if he chose to express them in damaging ways. I exercised that right.
I made myself more important than the thing that needed to get done.
I should not have lied to him. I should have been honest " Yes you have never held a gun to my head but the abuse has had an impact on me. I am personally working to deal with my own contributions to those situations while trying to understand what it is about me that has allowed me to accept unacceptable behavior in the past. I am also working on healthier ways to detach from unhealthy situations. The story had a profound impact on me I related to her feelings and I know others who related to them as well" .... Maybe it would have resulted in him getting mad. Maybe it would not have. At least I would have been honest. At least later I would not have felt the strong need to lash out. Dishonesty with myself and others often leads to strong anger with in me and then turns to very poor irrational behavior.
We purchased a home 3 hours from where he works which cost us 1/8 of the cost of a home where he works. While I can not work right now When I can work my salary and work prospects in that area would be enough to cover childcare and care of the home. I am a special education teacher/ Preschool teacher so I will never make very much money but it would be enough to feed and clothe us and keep our home. We would be close enough that he could see his son but far enough that I could start to separate from what is happening. Things are not there yet - in terms of his progression and in terms of my ability to be out there full time alone.
This is killing my soul. I know from my history and my step work that this is a pattern I bring myself to. I think I also need to focus on what I did right on Sunday. It was the first time I walked away and said " I can not work with you when you are like this"
When I did that I acknowledged he had a right to his feelings ( I used to get mad at him for having them because they affected me ) but I also had a right to not be around him if he chose to express them in damaging ways. I exercised that right.
I made myself more important than the thing that needed to get done.
I should not have lied to him. I should have been honest " Yes you have never held a gun to my head but the abuse has had an impact on me. I am personally working to deal with my own contributions to those situations while trying to understand what it is about me that has allowed me to accept unacceptable behavior in the past. I am also working on healthier ways to detach from unhealthy situations. The story had a profound impact on me I related to her feelings and I know others who related to them as well" .... Maybe it would have resulted in him getting mad. Maybe it would not have. At least I would have been honest. At least later I would not have felt the strong need to lash out. Dishonesty with myself and others often leads to strong anger with in me and then turns to very poor irrational behavior.
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
Originally Posted by suki44883 
He is doing what addicts do...turn everything around and make it all your fault. You deserve the abuse because you did this or you said that. It's all ********. You do not deserve his abuse and your child does not deserve to grow up in an abusive home. Chances are very good that it will just get worse.
I hope you will contact a domestic violence facility and at least talk to them. You need to get out of the situation before you will become clear-headed enough to realize just how bad it really is. Please take steps to protect yourself and your son. (((HUGS)))
I hope you will contact a domestic violence facility and at least talk to them. You need to get out of the situation before you will become clear-headed enough to realize just how bad it really is. Please take steps to protect yourself and your son. (((HUGS)))
I agree, it typical addict behavior but it is also classic abuser behavior.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 75
This is an amazing resource! Thank you!!!
[QUOTE=LoveMeNow;4646259]This is classic ABUSER behavior from him. It comes right from the abuser playbook.
Please read this site.
( I am not allowed to post a link yet so my reply is missing the link)
[QUOTE=LoveMeNow;4646259]This is classic ABUSER behavior from him. It comes right from the abuser playbook.
Please read this site.
( I am not allowed to post a link yet so my reply is missing the link)
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
Posts: 6,516
Sweet friend, it's not his mother you need to be concerned about. It's him.
Not only are all the examples you have listed definitely abuse -- he is being physically abusive to you, and he is being emotionally abusive by trying to make you believe you "made him" be abusive -- he is also unrepentant about his behavior.
What this tells me is that his behavior will not change. It may very well get worse. Abuse usually does.
Forget about being honest to him about the impact of his abuse. I wouldn't advocate lying, but when you are dealing with an abuser, telling him how his abuse impacts you is giving him the tools to continue, and to make it worse. I think it's one of those situations where you have to be conscious of your every move and protect yourself.
Have you seen the sticky with the contact information for domestic violence counselors? What he has done to you is not "minor" stuff. In fact, any single one of those examples would qualify as domestic violence. You calling the police when you did was a brave thing to do, and it was the right thing to do. You may consider doing it again the next time he hurts you.
Not only are all the examples you have listed definitely abuse -- he is being physically abusive to you, and he is being emotionally abusive by trying to make you believe you "made him" be abusive -- he is also unrepentant about his behavior.
What this tells me is that his behavior will not change. It may very well get worse. Abuse usually does.
Forget about being honest to him about the impact of his abuse. I wouldn't advocate lying, but when you are dealing with an abuser, telling him how his abuse impacts you is giving him the tools to continue, and to make it worse. I think it's one of those situations where you have to be conscious of your every move and protect yourself.
Have you seen the sticky with the contact information for domestic violence counselors? What he has done to you is not "minor" stuff. In fact, any single one of those examples would qualify as domestic violence. You calling the police when you did was a brave thing to do, and it was the right thing to do. You may consider doing it again the next time he hurts you.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Bristol TN/VA
Posts: 12,431
1) to hell with his mother and the broom she rode in on. She's toxic to you and there is no reason to expose your son to her.
2) florence is right. He is gaslighting you big time. Learn what this is and how to recognize what he is doing.
3) I agree with all the prior posts.
4) Consider getting free additional DV counseling.
5) No matter what you do, it will not get better. He will constantly and unexpectedly move the bar and change the rules. This is called shifting sands. You will always feel off balance and will never measure up.
6) Get the book "Why Does He Do That~Inside the Minds of Angry & Controlling Men"....hide it from him, it is a huge eye opener. By Lundy Bancrofft. You can look him up on the web, he has a site.
7) Abusers do not reform themselves, he will get worse. Start packing an emergency get away kit and stashing any money you can aside hidden from him.
He will chip away at you until there is nothing left.
8)You can't open up and talk to him in good faith as it all becomes weapons in his arsenal.
9) It's nigh impossible to think and see clearly when in the middle of the storm, so I hope you do get that counseling and find other ways to step out of the madness.
((hugs)))
T
2) florence is right. He is gaslighting you big time. Learn what this is and how to recognize what he is doing.
3) I agree with all the prior posts.
4) Consider getting free additional DV counseling.
5) No matter what you do, it will not get better. He will constantly and unexpectedly move the bar and change the rules. This is called shifting sands. You will always feel off balance and will never measure up.
6) Get the book "Why Does He Do That~Inside the Minds of Angry & Controlling Men"....hide it from him, it is a huge eye opener. By Lundy Bancrofft. You can look him up on the web, he has a site.
7) Abusers do not reform themselves, he will get worse. Start packing an emergency get away kit and stashing any money you can aside hidden from him.
He will chip away at you until there is nothing left.
8)You can't open up and talk to him in good faith as it all becomes weapons in his arsenal.
9) It's nigh impossible to think and see clearly when in the middle of the storm, so I hope you do get that counseling and find other ways to step out of the madness.
((hugs)))
T
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 75
Originally Posted by LoveMeNow
If you decide to download the app, it is well hidden so your husband can not see it.
It is progressive - early warning signs appeared with past girlfriends. ( I am friends with a few of them they departed the situation ). When he is active in his addiction - he is docile and happy and easy to get along with. All of this behavior occurs around him sobering up or after he has been sober for a few weeks. The weird paranoid stuff happens when he is active and that I have developed a way to cope with.
Not trying to save him - I know it is progressive and could get worse. I just do not want to completely play the helpless victim here and make him a monster.
I have to recognize that with out this experience I may not have found Alanon. I am emotionally abusive. I read the lists and I see my actions on there. I see how my fear of being abandon has led me to do some very crazy things. I can see how my you hurt me so I will hurt you behavior has been damaging in the past. I can see how trying to control a situation that is uncontrollable led me to be punishing, shaming, angry, resentful, hurtful and very damaging in retaliation ( not physically violent but irrational and damaging ). I am desperately trying to change those behaviors in myself and 1 year of trying to change is a drop in the bucket when you look at 30 years of learned behavior.
I know that there are times when he takes a step forward or when we take a step forward together. I also know there are times when I take a step back or he does or we take a giant leap back together.
Maybe I will feel differently after I review the whole app.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 75
Originally Posted by Live
1) to hell with his mother and the broom she rode in on. She's toxic to you and there is no reason to expose your son to her.
2) florence is right. He is gaslighting you big time. Learn what this is and how to recognize what he is doing.
3) I agree with all the prior posts.
4) Consider getting free additional DV counseling.
5) No matter what you do, it will not get better. He will constantly and unexpectedly move the bar and change the rules. This is called shifting sands. You will always feel off balance and will never measure up.
6) Get the book "Why Does He Do That~Inside the Minds of Angry & Controlling Men"....hide it from him, it is a huge eye opener. By Lundy Bancrofft. You can look him up on the web, he has a site.
7) Abusers do not reform themselves, he will get worse. Start packing an emergency get away kit and stashing any money you can aside hidden from him.
He will chip away at you until there is nothing left.
8)You can't open up and talk to him in good faith as it all becomes weapons in his arsenal.
9) It's nigh impossible to think and see clearly when in the middle of the storm, so I hope you do get that counseling and find other ways to step out of the madness.
((hugs)))
T
2) florence is right. He is gaslighting you big time. Learn what this is and how to recognize what he is doing.
3) I agree with all the prior posts.
4) Consider getting free additional DV counseling.
5) No matter what you do, it will not get better. He will constantly and unexpectedly move the bar and change the rules. This is called shifting sands. You will always feel off balance and will never measure up.
6) Get the book "Why Does He Do That~Inside the Minds of Angry & Controlling Men"....hide it from him, it is a huge eye opener. By Lundy Bancrofft. You can look him up on the web, he has a site.
7) Abusers do not reform themselves, he will get worse. Start packing an emergency get away kit and stashing any money you can aside hidden from him.
He will chip away at you until there is nothing left.
8)You can't open up and talk to him in good faith as it all becomes weapons in his arsenal.
9) It's nigh impossible to think and see clearly when in the middle of the storm, so I hope you do get that counseling and find other ways to step out of the madness.
((hugs)))
T
If I can read the list of what constitutes emotional abuse and see my own behavior on there ... am I unable to reform myself? I keep trying to believe I can. I can not deny he is correct that I have done things that are emotionally abusive.
the changing of expectations - I understand ... I ran on an expectation treadmill for years until I joined Al Anon. I was constantly trying to be good enough for him. Now I just do not even try. Do not bother to adjust myself for his expectations and in truth he kind of seems to have given up on them. Or at least appears to understand they are his expectations and not mine and that means they are his problem. Climbing out if the depression and self esteem hit of that treadmill has been hard. I am actually very proud of myself because I have done it so far with out resorting to my own past bad behaviors - such as using some one else to provide me with self esteem.
Thank you for the support re to hell with his mother - I have been wrestling with saying " No she can have nothing to do with him." I think I will be strong enough for that some day. He is still only 18 months old so I have a bit of time. Thankfully she not only lives on the other side of the continent but in a different country! The internet is a blessing and a curse here.
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8) --- I think I do that as much as he does. I do feel I do it less now that I have become aware of it.
9) Yes agreed - having a safe place to go though is something I am working on completely establishing. I may just have to think this needs patients and waiting on my part and continue to do my work. Get out to more meetings. Work to slowly remove myself enough so I can see clearly.
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Being able to deal with the consequences of leaving is important. I am not there yet.
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
Great insight and discovery about your own behavior. I had some of the very same behaviors. I worked hard at changing them. When I saw my husband was still unable to see his behaviors, I told my therapist "I feel like I have outgrown him." She hugged me and said "I have been waiting to hear you say that."
My husband and I started our recoveries together. He still hasn't grasped step 1, much less grown in other areas. I got tired of waiting but it took a while and I did it on my own time. You will too, if or when you decide what path you will take,
My husband and I started our recoveries together. He still hasn't grasped step 1, much less grown in other areas. I got tired of waiting but it took a while and I did it on my own time. You will too, if or when you decide what path you will take,
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 303
I lived with this for 13 years. I also began wondering if I was the controlling, abusive one. It was really only after I left and got distance that I've begun to see the extent of the crazy making, gaslighting, blame and abuse. When you are in it, you start questioning your own sanity-- especially if you are involved emotionally with his family and they help build the denial because "that's just normal marriage stuff."
You have to ask yourself, is this the way I want to live the rest of my life? Is this the relationship I want modeled to my child? Only you can answer that.
You have to ask yourself, is this the way I want to live the rest of my life? Is this the relationship I want modeled to my child? Only you can answer that.
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
Originally Posted by Bullfrog
I lived with this for 13 years. I also began wondering if I was the controlling, abusive one. It was really only after I left and got distance that I've begun to see the extent of the crazy making, gaslighting, blame and abuse. When you are in it, you start questioning your own sanity-- especially if you are involved emotionally with his family and they help build the denial because "that's just normal marriage stuff."
You have to ask yourself, is this the way I want to live the rest of my life? Is this the relationship I want modeled to my child? Only you can answer that.
You have to ask yourself, is this the way I want to live the rest of my life? Is this the relationship I want modeled to my child? Only you can answer that.
So true. I was so busy holding myself accountable for my behaviors that I continued to give my STBXAH a lot of excuses for his. In hind sight, I think I had to, so I could forgive his and let go of my resentments.
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