AW man handled
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 297
I don't know where to find reliable stats on sexual harassment reporting, but here's the stats from a reliable source on rape reportage in the US: 50%.
*Statistics | RAINN | Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network
I would assume that people report rape more frequently than lesser sexual assaults.
Anecdotally, I've been sexually assaulted (though thankfully not raped) twice and I didn't report either assault. In neither case did I do anything leading up to the assault that I was ashamed of. But I still didn't report because, (i) my friends told me I was overreacting, and (ii) I knew from watching what happened to other women in my environment that my name would be mud forever if I reported. I'm cheered that some women, like Katie and Marie, think that they would definitely report inappropriate sexual advances. That's brave, and that's great. But I think it would be short-sighted to assume, contrary to all empirical evidence, that most women report. From what I've seen in my own life and in the stories of friends and acquaintances of mine who have been assaulted, harassed, and/or raped, the decision about whether or not to report is complicated and impacted by a lot of variables.
I don't want to take the conversation too far afield...the above is just a response to the people who are implying that she must be lying if she's not reporting. I think the AW's disinclination to report does not tell him anything about what did or didn't happen that night. With or without alcohol, it's complicated.
*Statistics | RAINN | Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network
I would assume that people report rape more frequently than lesser sexual assaults.
Anecdotally, I've been sexually assaulted (though thankfully not raped) twice and I didn't report either assault. In neither case did I do anything leading up to the assault that I was ashamed of. But I still didn't report because, (i) my friends told me I was overreacting, and (ii) I knew from watching what happened to other women in my environment that my name would be mud forever if I reported. I'm cheered that some women, like Katie and Marie, think that they would definitely report inappropriate sexual advances. That's brave, and that's great. But I think it would be short-sighted to assume, contrary to all empirical evidence, that most women report. From what I've seen in my own life and in the stories of friends and acquaintances of mine who have been assaulted, harassed, and/or raped, the decision about whether or not to report is complicated and impacted by a lot of variables.
I don't want to take the conversation too far afield...the above is just a response to the people who are implying that she must be lying if she's not reporting. I think the AW's disinclination to report does not tell him anything about what did or didn't happen that night. With or without alcohol, it's complicated.
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,218
I get the impression that the OP isn't so sure how accurate or even honest her description of events is.
It's not ok to be assaulted sexually no matter the degree of the assault, and your outfit, flirting, etc, doesn't mean "yes".
Women do lie sometimes.
I'm not saying she is or isn't lying about being man handled.
I have no idea.
Even if she has been proven as a liar in the past over such an issue, that doesn't mean she couldn't have been assaulted this time.
I think the OP isn't sure how much to trust her.
Just my 2 cents. If the OP isn't feeling those things I hope they correct me.
Peace.
It's not ok to be assaulted sexually no matter the degree of the assault, and your outfit, flirting, etc, doesn't mean "yes".
Women do lie sometimes.
I'm not saying she is or isn't lying about being man handled.
I have no idea.
Even if she has been proven as a liar in the past over such an issue, that doesn't mean she couldn't have been assaulted this time.
I think the OP isn't sure how much to trust her.
Just my 2 cents. If the OP isn't feeling those things I hope they correct me.
Peace.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Central America/Florida USA
Posts: 4,064
Originally Posted by LexieCat 
I don't CARE how drunk she was, no excuse for the guy. Victim-blaming IS rampant, and something I have to deal with professionally every day. Many women are assaulted while intoxicated, and it doesn't make them any less victims of inappropriate, if not criminal, conduct.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,163
in answer to your question Lexie, how bout a half assed confession?
He would say things to create drama, he would say/promise/lie to end the drama.
This is life with an addict.
XA would say many untrue things to relieve his conscience.
He would say things to create drama, he would say/promise/lie to end the drama.
This is life with an addict.
XA would say many untrue things to relieve his conscience.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
*shrug* I don't know why anyone would do that. Really, what would a person get out of that? It's a new job--presumably nobody is really close to her husband, so someone is going to go tracking him down and fill him in on something she was doing on a business trip? Makes no sense to me.
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,218
Originally Posted by LexieCat
*shrug* I don't know why anyone would do that. Really, what would a person get out of that? It's a new job--presumably nobody is really close to her husband, so someone is going to go tracking him down and fill him in on something she was doing on a business trip? Makes no sense to me.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Central America/Florida USA
Posts: 4,064
Originally Posted by LexieCat
I don't even know what the motive might BE for lying in this situation. To one's husband, particularly. What is the potential gain?
I dunno, like maybe she got a little physical in a bar with another employee, and her co-workers saw it. And she is worried the story might get out, eventually. So to minimize potential damage, she plants the seed in her husband's mind that something happened that night and it wasn't her choice. Now, if anyone ever comes to the OP and says "hey someone saw your wife with another guy doing xyz" - she's already got her defense lined up for any confrontation that might arise. She's got control and power going into any kind of infidelity argument. Alcoholics are very clever. When I was an unfaithful alcoholic you wouldn't believe the little breadcrumbs I'd drop. If I ever got caught I could point to a story I'd mentioned in the past "I told you two weeks ago about that crazy random girl who tried to kiss me", etc, etc. I meticulously planned so many excuses that I was almost disappointed when I wasn't caught because some were brilliant (at least in my mind) and I never got to use them.
*That being said I stand by my first response. I realize people in the F&F forum are used to hearing about sleazy and dishonest alcoholics, but saying you are "on the fence" about whether or not to blame his wife for being sexually assaulted? That is just not right.
Behold the power of NO
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: WA
Posts: 7,764
It is really sad that just because that woman is an alcoholic, some people assume she has to be a lying s..t 
Her drinking makes her more vulnerable to predators that's true but it does not make her immoral and "asking for it".
I thought we lived in more enlightned times but I guess there is still work to be done.
Her drinking makes her more vulnerable to predators that's true but it does not make her immoral and "asking for it".
I thought we lived in more enlightned times but I guess there is still work to be done.
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
I'm not suggesting that such things are never fabricated. I know for a fact that SOMETIMES (not often, and not NEARLY as often as some people believe) people do lie about crimes. I had "victims" of car theft who traded their cars for drugs. I don't think women lie about being assaulted any more often than anyone else lies about any other crime if their is something to be gained by it.
Usually, in sexual assault (or even harassment) situations, the ordeal of reporting outweighs any potential gain from lying. I simply don't see anything in the account that was given by the OP to indicate such POTENTIAL motive for lying.
Usually, in sexual assault (or even harassment) situations, the ordeal of reporting outweighs any potential gain from lying. I simply don't see anything in the account that was given by the OP to indicate such POTENTIAL motive for lying.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 588
The incidence for false reports of sexual assault is no higher than the incidence of false reporting of other crimes, something around 2% I believe.
I don't see anywhere in OP's original post that he doubts that it occurred. I believe he questions his response to it and the appropriateness of his response.
I think I see in some of the responses here to the original post, including the ones that were removed, exactly why victims are reluctant to make a complaint.
I don't see anywhere in OP's original post that he doubts that it occurred. I believe he questions his response to it and the appropriateness of his response.
I think I see in some of the responses here to the original post, including the ones that were removed, exactly why victims are reluctant to make a complaint.
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,218
Originally Posted by wellnowwhat
The incidence for false reports of sexual assault is no higher than the incidence of false reporting of other crimes, something around 2% I believe.
I don't see anywhere in OP's original post that he doubts that it occurred. I believe he questions his response to it and the appropriateness of his response.
I think I see in some of the responses here to the original post, including the ones that were removed, exactly why victims are reluctant to make a complaint.
I don't see anywhere in OP's original post that he doubts that it occurred. I believe he questions his response to it and the appropriateness of his response.
I think I see in some of the responses here to the original post, including the ones that were removed, exactly why victims are reluctant to make a complaint.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 340
This is tough because the OPs desire to not be supportive leads me to think that she has lied before and her actions have lead him to question the truth. Who knows what the truth is? She could have blacked out and remembered things wrong, or not, I don't know.
He can be supportive just not spend energy on it and go lead the quest himself, in an extreme it would be him reporting the incident. It's his wife's call on if to report it or not. If she were underage I would say otherwise. If there are repeated incidents of this and she still does not act I would question her motives. If there is anything remotely criminal I would jump on that.
What I wonder about is
The following is unrelated to the harassment incident:
Piratessmile I hope you aren't worrying too much or are making progress on your own to not let this get to you. Many of us have been there and it's not healthy and imo unacceptable behavior out of a wife/spouse. WTH MAN.
He can be supportive just not spend energy on it and go lead the quest himself, in an extreme it would be him reporting the incident. It's his wife's call on if to report it or not. If she were underage I would say otherwise. If there are repeated incidents of this and she still does not act I would question her motives. If there is anything remotely criminal I would jump on that.
What I wonder about is
It is consistently her choice to stay out with a bunch of strange guys and get drunk. This instance is exactly one of my codie brain imagined scenarios that results from her drinking too much.
Piratessmile I hope you aren't worrying too much or are making progress on your own to not let this get to you. Many of us have been there and it's not healthy and imo unacceptable behavior out of a wife/spouse. WTH MAN.
Member
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 1,218
Originally Posted by Carlotta
It is really sad that just because that woman is an alcoholic, some people assume she has to be a lying s..t
Her drinking makes her more vulnerable to predators that's true but it does not make her immoral and "asking for it".
I thought we lived in more enlightned times but I guess there is still work to be done.
Her drinking makes her more vulnerable to predators that's true but it does not make her immoral and "asking for it".
I thought we lived in more enlightned times but I guess there is still work to be done.
The OP seems to view her as someone who drinks and flirts too much. Maybe he's afraid she has been unfaithful before. And maybe again. I think he's confused as to what to believe given her collective history.
No one asks for it. Anyone with that mentality is a jackass.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: PA
Posts: 25
Your answers, thoughts and passion are SOOO appreciated. Thank you all.
For what it is worth – I am struggling with the matter of TRUST. It is a running theme in our relationship that she gets drunk and makes bad decisions including email and phone cheating. Not sure if she has consummated that deal but we are trying to work through it. With that in mind - I can not imagine a situation where a guy in a professional group (around and near 15 of his work colleagues and management) would catch a woman coworker outside the WC, grab her by the arm and say “we are having sex tonight” and physically pursue the matter until she had to slap him. It is an easy jump to think she displayed some type of behavior that led this jackass to conclude he and she were hooking up. It is my bet that her actions were at some point over the top in context of our marriage. This is a hurtful consideration that was caused by her being drunk..again. I am absolutely not blaming AW for another’s actions. I think it is flat wrong.
She is asking me to support her and I am. I am struggling to offer TRUST that she did nothing inappropriate considering the probability that there was some inappropriate actions from her side in the context of our marriage. Yes, she will lie and spin to front an, “I was snow white”, image to garner my support and prevent an argument about her (potential) inappropriate behavior. It is possible that she did nothing inappropriate but it is not probable based on her MO after being over served.
Again – her actions do not constitute approval for said jackass’ behavior. It is wrong.
I also, really appreciate the groups experiences and shared view on why she would not report it. Some of the words used in the thread are EXACTLY what she had to say. I can not image this situation as a guy and so your feminine view points are super appreciated to help vet what her motives might be. You have helped me bring that piece into clearer view. Thank you.
Thanks for your thoughts – keep em coming!
PS
For what it is worth – I am struggling with the matter of TRUST. It is a running theme in our relationship that she gets drunk and makes bad decisions including email and phone cheating. Not sure if she has consummated that deal but we are trying to work through it. With that in mind - I can not imagine a situation where a guy in a professional group (around and near 15 of his work colleagues and management) would catch a woman coworker outside the WC, grab her by the arm and say “we are having sex tonight” and physically pursue the matter until she had to slap him. It is an easy jump to think she displayed some type of behavior that led this jackass to conclude he and she were hooking up. It is my bet that her actions were at some point over the top in context of our marriage. This is a hurtful consideration that was caused by her being drunk..again. I am absolutely not blaming AW for another’s actions. I think it is flat wrong.
She is asking me to support her and I am. I am struggling to offer TRUST that she did nothing inappropriate considering the probability that there was some inappropriate actions from her side in the context of our marriage. Yes, she will lie and spin to front an, “I was snow white”, image to garner my support and prevent an argument about her (potential) inappropriate behavior. It is possible that she did nothing inappropriate but it is not probable based on her MO after being over served.
Again – her actions do not constitute approval for said jackass’ behavior. It is wrong.
I also, really appreciate the groups experiences and shared view on why she would not report it. Some of the words used in the thread are EXACTLY what she had to say. I can not image this situation as a guy and so your feminine view points are super appreciated to help vet what her motives might be. You have helped me bring that piece into clearer view. Thank you.
Thanks for your thoughts – keep em coming!
PS
A work in progress
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
Well, maybe here's one way to look at it without doing violence (figuratively speaking) to either one of you. Do your best to separate any inappropriate conduct she MAY have engaged in (hurtful to you, and to your marriage) from the inappropriate conduct done TO her by someone else.
Because really, I think that is sort of what we are all getting at, in one way or another. She could have been in the wrong, which still does not mean she was not wronged by this other person. Both could occur, without one being the "cause" of the other. She is responsible for her own actions, but not the other person's.
So I think you can rightfully support her for the wrong done to her without giving your approval to what she might have done. Two different things.
Because really, I think that is sort of what we are all getting at, in one way or another. She could have been in the wrong, which still does not mean she was not wronged by this other person. Both could occur, without one being the "cause" of the other. She is responsible for her own actions, but not the other person's.
So I think you can rightfully support her for the wrong done to her without giving your approval to what she might have done. Two different things.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
