Kassie2

The Journey from Abandonment to Healing - chap two -

This is how far I got - the intro - "the withdrawal stage is... like an addiction, you crave the other, your inner child tries to reconnect with the other, you think your life is over, you get angry with others who nurture you and avoid what helps you, you cling to false hope, you cry..."

" W is the part where you listen to the cries, recognize your own needs and learn how to fulfill them.."

OK! Choke! Acceptance - there is that word again! Why do I keep hearing so much of it. Oh, I get it now. Well, this hit me in the gut. My first thoughts were yes, yes and yes. While I do recognize what is not working and my own needs - and take action - I then recoil with the outcome b/c in my mind -if I ask you to stop something that is hurting me - I expect you to stop and come back. He did many times but stopped. He is right - it doesn't work the way he wants it to or the way I want it to. But I was amazed to see how I dropped out of therapy b/c I didn't want to hear that I had to take care of myself even if it meant letting go. I didn't want to hear that I had to take care of myself - shouldn't that be someone else's job? But NO! No one knows me like I do and isn't everyone else looking out for themselves? Why am I so different? I 'm dense!:rotfxko

So pray or be with me in spirit as I read the rest of the chapter that I get it! For my own sake! I will be looking forward to reading others' thoughts and process.

Wicked let me know when you start the yoga and maybe we can cheer each other on if that is ok with you. I need to be accountable now too.

Kassie2

Still reading - finding this stuff hard to face. Having a terrible time today as I took my daughter back to school yesterday.

Learn2Live

Thank you for these. I too understand this. I was like this for a long time. I am not sure whether or not what I felt was Anger but I do know that these feelings kept me in a bad relationship or two. The first time I became involved with an addict/alcoholic I felt so close to his mother. It was like finally having the parent I had always wanted. I was in my late twenties at that time and got along so well with his Mom, it was so difficult to let that go so I held on and I suffered through A LOT, stuck it out with him after being treated so poorly, it is unbelievable to me now. But she had created something and she shared it all with me. I would go to her house and just hang out, walk in the door just like Home. If I wanted to go swimming, I could just go over to her house, make myself a sandwich, grab a Coke out of the fridge, lay by the pool all day. We would sit and talk all day and half the night, she and I. She would buy me Xmas and birthday presents equal to what she bought her son. The whole family called me her daughter.

But I had to let all that go in order to save myself. For so much of my life I have had this feeling of LONGING. Wishing. Wanting. And Loneliness. It was as though there was no one who loved me. I think I felt sorry for myself but I am not sure if that is what it was. Maybe it was just sadness. They tried to tell me it was Codependence. I don't know, maybe those feelings were just normal human feelings. I remember crying so much during the holidays, alone, wishing that I had a family. I remember trying to do things in life, maybe things around the house, or with my car, and being so frustrated and no one was around to help. No one to turn to who cared. That made life even worse.

I always wanted to create a family with someone. I never had children but it seems all my BFs did. I would always do my best to get everyone what I thought they wanted or needed, spent so much money, expended all my time, energy and money on trying to create that--family. Always reliable to others, going out of my way to help them when no one ever asked for help. INVESTED MY FEELINGS AND EMOTIONS! Gave them my loyalty and my LOVE!!! But no one ever gave back what I put into it. People have done such hurtful things. STILL doing hurtful things, like keeping my niece and nephew from me after all those YEARS of emotional investment, all the help I gave her, just so many things, time, money, resources. I would babysit at the drop of a hat, weekend after weekend. Whenever they called, I went. I have not seen those kids in years. I miss them.

Whatever relationship I got into, whatever family I tried to fit into, no one could ever give me what I wanted. I was still sitting on the sidelines. So, I made my own place in the world. I have gotten my own house and have my own career and take steps and make effort to create what I want for myself by myself. I have learned that no one is going to create that for me and that people, like BF families, have their own lives and their own issues they grapple with that they do not want to create anything with me. I've learned that. Maybe that was the wrong lesson, IDK. It's like no one wants to participate. I guess I gave up, IDK.

I can't believe I am starting to get choked up writing this.

Kassie2

LTL - It took awhile to read your post. This book and my stuff are really kicking up the emotions and anxiety. But once read, I wanted to say that this is the first time I heard someone say all the things I could say about myself! It could have been me writing that post instead of someone else. I am amazed and don't think I am so alone in my thoughts and feelings.

Reading this book is helping me to put it all in perspective in a way that is really meaningful and helpful. There is so much to say... I have more than serious abandonment issues and traits and PTSD - the weird part is that I can and do things independently when needed. I just am tired of doing it all alone and not having that backgrounding support that is discussed in the book.

I would like to hear from anyone who has started the exercises. Everyone seems quiet and I am not sure if this material is so tough or people are on vacation. I have done the one mentioned in chapter on Withdrawal off and on through the years. It was something I thought up myself very long ago and it really does work. Started to pull it out again this past year but the child in me is being very resistant on all levels. I am being reminded to listen more carefully and take a different response argh!

HealingWillCome

Hey, Kassie. I've been working the exercises for a couple of months. I've had some trouble with the first exercise -- staying in the moment, experiencing the moment as a way to manage pain. I find that the pain (after break-up with XABF) is still there under everything even when I'm doing other things. It has gotten better, but I still have trouble with really "experiencing" the moment as opposed to listening to and entertaining thoughts of XABF.

I wrote some things about the Little and Big exercise in the Chapter 3 thread. That one took me a long time to get comfortable with, but it really did and still does help when I use it. It sounds like it's worked for you, too.

This book has really helped me to understand me and why I am devastated when bad relationships end. My first abandonment was by AF who left us for alcohol and women when I was 7. Thanks to my counselor and this book, I figured out that what I've been searching for all my life is someone just like AF who would pursue me, fall in love with me, and not leave me...ever. Problem is, anyone like AF is going to leave...it's what they do.

This is exactly the way it has been for me. Just reading the words on the pages and having someone validate and articulate what has been buried in me all my life has been healing. What I went through when XAH left our family is written on these pages. And...even though I left XABF, it feels like abandonment times 100, because I knew he could never give me what I was looking for, and I was/am still very much in love with him. Leaving him has completely ripped open the old abandonment wounds that were never really healed, just festering underneath.

It took me several weeks to actually work through the chapters and work the exercises because I was so physically affected while I was reading it. I would have adrenaline surges that would sometimes last for a couple of hours. I was feeling abandonment fear all over again and trying to deal with my breakup at the same time. But it has been good for me, so good, because I can put a name to my issues, and have started to face them. It has pointed the way to my path to full healing. I was wandering before, looking for answers, trying to figure out why I ran the good guys off, but hung on to the ones who I subconsciously knew couldn't commit to me.

Like you, I am very independent. I'm strong, capable, and have a lifetime full of happy stories in all of my relationships, except the ones with XAH and XABF. Like you, I am tired, very tired, of doing it all alone. Exhausted, actually. But I know I'm on the right path now.

wicked

Yes, I have been very quiet about the book.
But astounded by the common feelings.
Really, that there are others who are aware of what is happening with me.
Like with alcoholism, I knew others existed, but not like me. No one like me.
Now, I know that others exist like me, are struggling like me and we can help each other.
My feelings are all over the place right now. Just swirling around.
No words now.

Thank you so much for sharing so eloquently and putting into words how it is.

Beth

HealingWillCome

I understand this. We're here when you find your words. I'm glad you guys are all here for this topic. My counselor was just starting to dig into this with me when her daughter was tragically killed, and understandably, I haven't met with her since. I was having a hard time just reading the chapters. She was going to read them with me and help with the exercises. I went ahead and forged through it, and I'm glad I did, but I kept wishing I had a support group to discuss it with. I think an abandonment support group should be as available as any of the 12-step programs. Maybe some day they will be.

Hugs to you, Beth.

coyote21

I'm here, but being quiet too. I'm finding any way I can to put off doing this, it's very similar to my feelings about my 4th step I've been putting off for 2-3 years. I know it will make me better, but the discomfort it's dredging up is pretty big.

I was wondering why so many of us were so gung ho, and then..........cricket sounds. Must be big for a lot of us.

Thanks and God bless us all,
Coyote

Learn2Live

I am not silent on purpose. I didn't have internet access for at least a week and I also have not been able to make the time to READ the damn book! I haven't even finished chapter 1

I wanted to say, though, that while writing my last post, I was thinking "I really need to work through this stuff, just like Coyote said a couple weeks ago."

As soon as I am able, I am going to post more.

coyote21

Dog ate my homework. J/K!

Thanks and God bless us all,
Coyote

Kassie2

L2L - I have had problems off/on with my computor - I hate being so dependent on it! I thought I was late to the party in getting the book and reading, altho I cheated some - I have been taking a lot of time off and that gave me time to read. I am also reading b/c I am going through this stuff now anyway. I think we all can benefit especially with the support.

Coyote - I wanted to say that we all have our own timing and that is just the way it is! I also have listened to many 4th steps and while I can muster compassion easily for others - I wonder why it doesn't come easy for myself. Someone suggested that I pretend to be listening to myself and see if I can offer myself the same compassion and support that I have given to others. Glad you are here.

HWC- Your idea about a support group for survivors of abandonment has been one I wondered about for many years - I even had someone who wanted to help me get started - except he ended disappearing due to family problems one day and then I left town with my family. Oh well, maybe this is as close as can get for now. Maybe we can turn this into more.

Heard from my little me last night and it was a kicker! I really don't know how to deal with her issues! She's a pain in the ..... good to hear from everyone.

I would like to suggest that we take our time in going through the book since it requires a lot of introspection and stirs up a lot emotion. And perhaps make this more of a supportive thread in addition to the reading.

HealingWillCome

I second that.

Kassie2

Finished Chap two on Withdrawal this week: did the exercise and boy what a conversation we had- little me, big me and the negotiator. I kind of came to the conclusion that I am doing the best I can, I see where I am stuck and will try to work on that area. Most things were just about misperceptions.

Being stuck has more to do with my age and list of experiences. When I got to chapter three I realized further that the number of my experiences of loss goes up and my internalization prior had been a healthy one - I mean that I used to feel some of the same things but I was always ready to move forward - to learn something new, try something new, get out more and take better care of myself than ever. I fought hard to move forward and it did feel much better. This time though seems different. I am older and "wiser"???? well yes and no.

I have posted many times how this time is different for me - I have tried all the advice in the past and it has worked to move me forward. But this time, I feel and think that it has all been a waste of time and the outcome will still be the same. It always has been so what is going to be different? I heard it on a show last week - (just a script but words to think about) "relationships always end" through break ups or death. So, there is no getting away from it unless you just don't have relationships - which leaves me feeling the same way. Somebody has to see through my illogic huh?

Chap three on Internalizing: not finished but figured out something strange - I am usually the one who says - stop - I don't want to go this way - and when the guy chooses to leave I tell myself that I shouldn't have done that. I end up feeling like the one left behind when in reality maybe they felt I left them? So why am I assigning those words to my situation? In the book, she talks about death as an abandonment that we understand and accept because there is no control over it and the person can't come back. Well, my father died forty years ago - and until five years ago I believed that he left on purpose! I remember having a sudden shift in my beliefs and realized that I thought he had a choice when he didn't. Today I am realizing that when I am giving people a choice to stay or go - there is a choice involved but I get angry that they don't want to work on it. That somehow it is a reflection on me that they have made that choice instead of seeing it as a reflection of who they are.

Ok, will stop here b/c this is getting overwhelming. Send some support! I feel like I will drown here. Sorry, didn't expect to say so such.

coffeedrinker

me too!

My life is so busy now, with working on opening a new restaurant (long hours, lots of space taken up in my head) and getting ready to move, and putting in time with N.L.I....when my head hits the pillow, I pick up the book and three minutes later am sleeping.

Sorry guys....

posiesperson

Ditto! Still working on Chapter 1. Not trying to procrastinate, but plenty busy with the kids going back to school, work, house, puppy, single parenting...yikes.

Anyway, I'm trying to read bits and pieces at night before bed, not get too overwhelmed with it, and really work through what I'm reading (but not perfectly--LOL).

Thanks for the thread. I need encouragement to keep going. Funny thing is, I keep seeing it from my ex's perspective, because I was the one to leave the relationship. Interesting, huh? I obviously need to keep up on my Alanon meetings at the same time, I'm definitely getting codependency-triggered around the abandonment issue instead of keeping the focus on myself. Wow. Didn't expect that, and am still noticing how prevalent it is for me. Good info for me to keep in mind!

Hugs all around,
posie

Kassie2

posie- I also keep seeing it from my spouse's view - I keep getting the feeling that we both are going through the same stuff only I am getting help to do something about it and he isn't.

coffeedrinker

yes, i do as well. whenever i read stuff like this, i put the xabf into the picture.

this book makes me feel tremendously sympathetic to him. man, the odds are completely stacked against him. where i am at, is that i can sympathize, but that doesn't mean i allow my boundaries to collapse. understanding doesn't change the fact that we were really not meant to be together, long-term, after all.

shattering:

again, great to put words to something that i have experienced, but didn't truly understand.
when i was at my flippin-out worst, and could do almost nothing except self-destructive behavior and hand-wringing, there was something else going on, linked to a terrifying earlier event.
goes to the very core of what we need.

parts about early trauma - and not necessarily having cognitive memory of them, yet reacting (meaning having emotional memory) really makes sense. so much so, that i'm kind of excited about some really effective tools for recovery here.

and thank you, susan anderson, for giving us ways to practice staying in the moment! wow, i've heard about this kind of stuff for years, but always wonder the same thing: what exactly does that mean and how the heck do you do it??


i practiced

Jenny1232

and thank you, susan anderson, for giving us ways to practice staying in the moment! wow, i've heard about this kind of stuff for years, but always wonder the same thing: what exactly does that mean and how the heck do you do it??

I have an extremely hard time trying to stay in the moments, and just let my thoughts flow and be gone. My psychotherapist is trying to help me with this.. and he says to just breathe, and be aware of it. It seems so silly to me, but I tried it the other day when I couldn't shut my mind down. I kept paying attention to the fact that I was breathing.. and it really did help. Hard to remember and keep practicing, but it can become natural!

So.. maybe that's one way how.

Kassie2

I practice this a lot b/c it does work. Wanted to share something I recently learned too. Not only does breathing slow down things, but it allows one to experience some "space" or "separation" from the event or emotional response. That space then allows time to change the reaction.

Mindfulness or being in the moment, actually does the same thing.

I never put the two together before. If I create distance from what is upsetting then I have a moment to release and reconsider what I want to do. LIVE!

Learn2Live

Let's get this damn book club started again. Who knows? Maybe Coyote will sense we've started it back up again and come back.