underoath

With the inability to enjoy sobriety due to the desire to use drugs, and the fear of using drugs due to obsessive existential thinking and fear of mental illness (and other sh*t causing/relating to anxiety- also causing sobriety to suck)
I am stuck between a rock and a hard place...
I get the feeling that, although it obviously won't end well, I will be much happier for a short period of time using benzodiazepines along with the other drugs that plague my mind in the form of a mental obsession... I am convinced my last run in with the yayo didn't go so well due to the lack of benzos
I can't deny that nothing but destruction will come out of using, but to provide some sense of pleasure and relief for a short period of time seems well worth it to me.
I understand people have used more than me, had lower bottoms than me, and are living happily sober today, with years of clean time.
My sponsor made me promise this time around I'd wait until I got 180 days before I used again (if I was gonna use) but I don't think I will make it that far.
After all, it is a disease- and most diseases have a grim outcome. I think acceptance is more important than just denying that- of course I'm not gonna lie to myself and pretend everything is cool, but I plan on cherishing it, and just accepting it when it all starts going downhill.
I believe the "program" works, but I don't necessarily want to work the program anymore
My parents are in Florida for a week, my house is full of alcohol, and my mom generously left me more than enough money "in case of an emergency"...

I guess part of the reason I typed this out and posted it on this forum is because I guess I have some hope left, but mainly I just wanted to organize these thoughts...

I hope this isn't a discouragement to anyone trying to stay clean, if it is I'm truly sorry. Just remember that you can work a program to stay clean and sober if you really want it, but you have to want it. I have lost that desire.
I know this is incredibly selfish

Dee74

I'm sad to see you write this Underoath.

The trouble with giving up is sooner or later, drinking/drugging becomes untenable again, and you have start the whole damn process again.

Thats if you make it back. You said:

I'm one of those lucky ones. I'm not being melodramatic, but I shouldn't be here...I've fallen down stairs. fallen off balconies, been hit by cars, and suffered a series of mini strokes in my last detox.

Then there's the physical damage my actual drinking did.

I'm a lucky guy - but don't count on the fact that you'll make it through too.

Many - many - of my friends are no longer here.

I was an alcoholic but it took me months to feel anything like normal...I just had to trust those who assured me it would get better...and it did.

It won't if you keep going back tho. That's a certainty.

Don't use the idea of disease to absolve you of responsibility.
That's nonsense.

You can fight this. I did.

You said you had a sponsor - where are you in the Steps?

D

NVRAGAIN3PCT

I appreciate your honesty. Perhaps just writing your feelings was enough to get it out of your system?

If nothing else, thank you for sharing. I've had a moment today where I thought I needed 'just one' - after reading this I am reminded how much I WANT to get better.

Thank you.

Peace and blessings.

I hope you stay clean today and find some hope.

billsaintjames

Using again could set you back days, weeks, months, years, or perhaps your entire life. You said that "pleasure and relief for a short period of time seems well worth it to me." How is it worth it if "nothing but destruction" is the inevitable result?

Fandy

you have written about wanting to get into a school you have coveted. Do you think delaying the process is going to make you happy? or will you be back to square one...looking at your friends who are ahead of you.

Don't give in to this.....your mother trusted you enough to leave you $$$ how will you feel when you break her trust? pick the right path and be strong about this for yourself.

grab that 180 days...and think about all you CAN do with it....please. you do not want to go back to that dark place, it is going to be harder to bounce back..

i can say a whole bunch of rah-rah statements, but you know you can be so much more and be happy without using....move past this and do not let it drag you back to something that can never help you be a whole person.

and suppose you did NOT have your mother's $$$????? what would you do then?

MycoolFitz

Acceptance and giving in or giving up are not the same thing. Sorry.

underoath

Dee- I only made that statement to clarify that I know the program has the potential to work
I have only gotten through an "introductory workshop" of the steps, all 12- but it was a basic informative "practice" and my sponsor assured me he'd take me through a more in depth working of the steps... We were supposed to start last Sunday, but I lost track of time and didn't make it. We are supposed to get together again this Sunday though.

Nvragain- Honestly it's been dancing around in my head for quite a while, not too sure I can just shake it off this time

Bill- I wasn't entirely planning on coming back, although it may be possible

Anvil- I know it is... but I'm tired of fighting it. The farther away I get, the longer I stay sober, the stronger the desire to use is to be honest

Fands- believe me, I know

Fitz- I was just saying I still accept the fact I'm an addict, I won't be in denial of what is happening, I won't be surprised when it doesn't end well... I fully embrace the idea that I am powerless... In other words, I accept my fate if I go back down that path

recoverywfaith

Can you go to a friends house and get out the house (away from the booze) for a week?

FT

Underoath,

Yours is a prime example of why I can't use the "disease" model for my own personal recovery. While I think pure "willpower" is crap, there is something to be said about deciding to live your life as a non-substance-abuser. I don't personally choose to give myself over to something outside of myself to empower me in my recovery (i.e., "higher power") because that just doesn't work for me. What does work for me is having made a conscious decision not to use again. Ever.

Depression, illness, whatever, can override the kind of resolve I seek. If I have one of those things going on, I choose to fix it by legitimate means (i.e., not self medicating) before deciding that using substances again resembles a good decision in any way, shape, or form.

I do wish you luck. To me, it sounds like you have other things going on.

FT

underoath

Ft- in the past I tried making the decision not to use again, ever.... and would end up using within the next 24 hours... I'm not sure what you mean by having other things going on but I do have anxiety issues. The problem for me is I can make the decision not to use, and change my mind with a flip of a switch. I'm not sure anything can directly replace the effect I got from drugs. The problem with the anxiety crap is even though I'm getting better by natural methods I still miss the relief benzos provide. The main reason I got sober was because of the panic attacks I started developing while using cocaine and marijuana. Which never happened when I had benzos at hand. Sorry if this doesn't make any sense or if I misunderstood you, I'm about to fall asleep haha ....

Soberpotamus

Underoath... somehow what's in your head just hasn't made it to your heart yet. You're playing with fire, and while you know this... you seem like you don't take it seriously. Age may have something to do with it, and maturity level... I do remember when I was in my late teens/early 20's having panic attacks, and drinking to help with anxiety... I'll never forget it. But... you have to want to be sober for specific reasons... what are your reasons?? Find the reasons you have to live for. And realize... that for all those nice, long-term goals you might have... try imagining yourself adding on 10 years of your life, or even 15 to reach the goals you think are so close within your grasp... that could very well be the reality of what is going to happen to you if you don't take your sobriety seriously.

I hear a lot of myself 10 - 12 years ago in what you're saying... forgive me if I came across as preachy.

wellwisher

Fear was something I needed to conquer in order to succeed. The way I was taught is that I could use FEAR to Fxxx Everything and Run or Face Everything and recover.

I chose the latter. You can too.

When I stopped drinking (also used to mask anger, fear, frustration and pain), it was kind of like chopping off my arm. There was a void there. I had to do something to compensate for my missing arm. That's where my recovery program came in. Not the existential thinking about doing it, but in the ACTION of doing it.

I also feared a diagnosis of a mental illness. As a matter of fact, I started going to a therapist before I got sober because I thought I was mentally ill. I had myself in the old chicken or the egg routine - was it a mental illness causing me to use or was it the using that was making me mentally ill. She told me she could make no such diagnosis until I was sober for some time.

Then came the "bottom" so many refer to that they have to hit (I don't buy that theory, by the way). I drank myself into such a frenzy I had to go to the emergency room, then detox, then inpatient rehab and AA.

I had to face everything and recover. Don't buy into the temporary relief of the benzos. They'll turn on you, and then you will be on to the next thing, which will then turn on you again.

Ask yourself, is it better to stay with the devil you know, or the devil you don't know. You already know what the outcome will be through the devil you know.

Face everything and recover! You can do this.

FT

Hi underoath,

No, what you are saying makes perfect sense. You sound just like I did during the two years of my addiction where I just could not stop increasing my dose, while lying to myself and my husband that I was tapering off. I totally get your rationale.

The truth of the matter is that you are not going to stop using substances until the benefits of staying clean outweigh the "benefits" of using. If that never happens, you may die from your abuse. Fact.

The trouble with you is that your rational brain and your "addict brain" are having an argument inside your head, and the "addict brain" is still so strong it may win. There is no "flipping the switch" going on. It's just your rational brain losing the fight. There is no switch, unless you want to use the "switch" analogy as your allowing yourself to switch the "addict brain" part of you on or off.

When it becomes less attractive to use than to stay clean, your rational self may stay in control better. I mentioned "something else going on" in just the way you suggest. Your anxiety issues can derail you. The worst thing you can do with anxiety is to self medicate, either with benzos, opiates, alcohol, or whatever. The anxiety is only masked and left untreated, and while untreated, the cause of the anxiety is left to get worse without your even knowing it. And there it is again when you stop using. You've got to get with some help for the anxiety or you may lose the addiction battle.

I also understand the concept of "I'm not sure anything can directly replace the effect I got from drugs".

You are NEVER going to directly replace the effect you get from drugs with anything other than drugs. That is because drugs put us in an UNNATURAL state. No "runner's high", endorphin rush, or "natural high", is ever going to replace a drug rush, because it can't. Our bodies and brains are not SUPPOSED to be artificially stimulated in the way that drugs stimulate them. It is unnatural, and it can't be sustained. It can't be sustained even WITH drugs, because the drugs eventually turn on you and just make you sick and not high. Maybe you never used long enough to find that out. I can't think of one mind altering drug that doesn't turn toxic on the user at some point.

It does take a certain amount of rational, conscious effort to decide to be a non-substance-abuser. Most of us made that decision while we were still high. Imagine that. How can you make that decision while high? For me, I made that decision after the drugs made me so sick I was at risk of dying in my sleep from using them. I was still using, but the fear over-rode my "addict brain" enough to where I finally woke up and my rational brain took over.

Sorry for the long-winded answer. I realize that coming to terms with being a non-substance-abuser is not easy. It means you deliberately deprive yourself of stuff that you know would make you feel instantly better. That unsustainable drug rush that, in reality, lasts only a short time. But the sensation is like no other, unmatchable by "natural" methods. The pleasure of the rush is enticing. But it is an "addict brain" lie that you can sustain it. You can try, but you find yourself chasing after it continually, once you are back in the hamster wheel life of using.

I hope you don't do that. It is such a waste of a life.

FT

Fandy

Under-o;

I hope you woke up today with some strength....call someone to meet with IRL to get you in a better frame of mind.

underoath

FT- that makes a lot of sense- I wasn't using the switch thing as a literal explanation, it just seems that way because one second I want one thing, and the next second I want another. I'm not sure about how the addicted mind works, but learning so much about anxiety disorders and how they work, I get the feeling that addiction may be similar.

I could type a book on the subject, but I'm just going to keep it short and say it's got something to do with my conscious mind always at war with my subconscious mind. That's how anxiety works, when on the road to recovery, and I'm almost certain addiction is very similar. With the anxiety, my subconscious (through habit and repetition over the years) is always trying to drag me down, causing symptoms and sensations at the most unnecessary times. This is where me, armed with knowledge and therapy- I have to use my conscious mind to constantly interrupt my subconscious... Not fight it- but interrupt it. And I have to do that doing numerous things, mostly stuff that requires a lot of mental focus (to divert my attention away from the anxiety sensations), and self talk telling myself I'm having anxiety, nothing more- all of this, in turn, causes me to be extremely tired (mentally), as it is a very exhausting thing (when conscious thought and subconscious thought are always clashing with each other) throw the whole addiction sh*t in the mix and it's a very tiring battle that just seems freaking hopeless at times. With the anxiety at least, the goal is, eventually I will be able to build new neural pathways through learning and positive experience, therefor pretty much becoming "normal" again. With the addiction, I'm not so sure it works this way, although others may feel it does, and I understand that.
You said something about benefits of staying clean and the benefits of using- What made me want to quit was the fact that I got to the point where everyday I would use cocaine despite having panic attacks every time I used. Each time I would swear, never again, and then shortly after the panic attack stopped I'd do more cocaine. (causing the same ****).... The crazy thing is, I wasn't getting any pleasure out of using, I was actually feeling WORSE while I used, yet I could NOT stop. This was enough to make me want to quit. I understand benzos, for anxiety, are not the answer. They only mask the symptoms/sensations, they don't solve the problem. You're also talking about risk of dependence, and all the fun stuff that comes with that. If I knew for a fact that I could use again without having anxiety, I would. If I never had anxiety issues, I never would have accepted help to quit using. So with improvements of my anxiety, the desire to use is growing stronger. Anxiety or not, benzos help out a lot... I'm just tired, of being tired... I was tired when I used all the time, but now that I'm sober all this conscious/subconscious rational/irrational intelligent/primitive sh*t going on inside my head is enough to wear me out to the point I just can't fight it. I can't keep fighting it like this everyday of my life...

But for those of you who were wondering, I am sober today, I stayed sober last night- I did have some friends over though and drove em somewhere while they smoked weed... And nah it wasn't a big deal really, I used to smoke pot all the time and enjoyed it but towards the end there some of my worst panic attacks were on pot so due to such negative experiences burned in my mind the last thing I wanted to do was smoke it. If I had some klonopin or xanax or something I'm sure I wouldn't have had a problem smoking...

But just so you guys know I'm sober today and plan on staying sober the rest of the day, I can't promise anything about tomorrow or the rest of the week but I'm certainly gonna need to do something about all this crap going on in my head. Coming on here helps tremendously but there's certainly much more I need to be doing.

Looking back on my last relapse I don't want to make the same mistake- but like I said it is so much of a struggle in my mind it's just so exhausting. Saps the energy right out of me... But I'm sure I'm no different than any of y'all

MycoolFitz

Sober today is good since that's all there really is and all that there really will be.

suki44883

I'm sober today and plan on staying sober the rest of the day

That's all anyone can ask of you, and that's really all you can ask of yourself.

FT

Hey underoath,

You clearly have a good grasp on what is going on inside your head. What I didn't anticipate when I got addicted was the chemical nature of what is going on when substances are used. What I mean by that is the drugs mess with the brain chemicals in such a way that normal reasoning is shot out the window. For me, it happened before I realized what was going on.

My chemically altered brain had me convinced I could not live without oxycodone. I went merrily along for many months believing I could responsibly take oxycodone, and manage my pain symptoms (for me, severe osteoarthritis, total knee replacement surgeries, etc.) with regular dosing of oxycodone. Before I saw addiction coming, my doses continued to increase to get the same effect, and then I couldn't even achieve that without getting dope sick. Lord in heaven.

You are right about anxiety and depression have a lot in common with addiction. Only then you are dealing with the subconscious as opposed to the "addict brain", and maybe they are one and the same. Even the psychiatrists don't really know. With most of the psych drugs, they have "theories" but not "evidence" about how they even work on the brain.

I also get the "tired of being tired". Anxiety and depression are truly incapacitating, and can be so to the point of total dysfunction. Who wouldn't want to seek something out to bring you out of that state. Some people are able to responsibly use benzos under medical supervision. Some people are helped tremendously by psych drugs to manage their functionality.

I would suggest to seek a balance. You deserve to feel better than you do. Finding a good doc/shrink/counselor whatever can be really difficult. For me, I went through 6 or 7 who were a crappy fit for me, and nothing helped during a time I suffered from deep depression, anxiety, or whatever. It doesn't matter what the label is. You're miserable. I finally found one after being misdiagnosed for a couple of years.

I believe there are answers for your anxiety that don't involve self-medicating. It took me years to climb out of my mental hell, but I managed to do it with some real, conscious effort to make some changes in my life to get unstuck. I just hope I have enough years left to enjoy the changes. That's why I love to see young people figuring this out before they have wasted their whole lives.

FT

billsaintjames

Congrats on staying sober today, buddy. We are all in this thing together.

Fandy

Under-o;

i was so glad to read your statement today...GOOD decision. don't over think it. just remember what a relief it can be to wake up and not worry about what you have done to your mind and body the night before....no anxiety about your actions at least.