Phoof418

Anyone have any experience or knowledge on the subject?? I've checked out the website and it seems to be very anti-AA/NA. It also claims to be the magic bullet of problems with addiction. It seems to be too good to be true....way too simple! AVRT(addictive voice recognition technique) seems to have the belief that you can quit on your own w/o recovery groups or forums. Part of me wants to believe this is true, and the rest of me is very skeptical. I believe that everyone shares the same wish; living a happy "normal" life. Just confused about this whole recovery thing, in general. I'm sure I'm not alone. ANY feedback,experience, knowledge (pos or neg) about this AVRT, rational recovery would be greatly appreciated. Or any feedback, period. Luv you all!!!
Thanx!!!:wtf2

doorknob

Welcome to SR, Phoof! I think AVRT can be a helpful technique and for some people may be enough in itself. SMART Recovery branched off from RR and offers a variety of cognitive tools for recovery as well as online meetings, forums, and f2f meetings in some areas. LifeRing is a secular support organization that encourages self-empowerment in recovery through the creation of a personalized recovery program or toolbox and peer support. They also have forums, online meetings, and f2f meetings in some areas. I've found both websites to be informative and helpful to my recovery.

bugsworth

Phoof...Welcome! I think I have explored almost every website there is on addiction...the internet has given us a wealth of information at our finger tips. I think that AVRT is extremely helpful as is Lifering and SOS. Each program gives us more insight into proper management of our addictions. Sobriety is indeed possible without meetings so you can believe it! Explore...read and learn the tools that will enable you to live a normal healthy life. Best of luck!

TryingSoHard

Hi Phoof,

I have the book Rational Recovery, which is an explanation of the program and how to use it, and The Small Book, which is their version of AA's Big Book. While I don't think AA is right for me, I wouldn't describe myself as anti-AA. The RR author/founder is DEFINITELY anti-AA. That's the only downside to his writings that I've discovered so far.

When I first bought and read Rational Recovery I literally felt like a weight had been lifted. I felt a glimpse of hope for the first time in a long time. I used the AA philosophy of "take what you need and leave the rest" as I read the book because I really didn't find it helpful to read all of his blatantly negative comments about the AA program. I don't care what he thinks about AA, I just want him to tell me how to use Rational Recovery!

I DO think it can work. I do NOT believe it is too good to be true. I think it's all about finding what works best for YOU.

Phoof418

I, too am a little turned off by the anti-AA overtones. On the other hand, what I've looked into it so far seems to be worth further investigating. Before I even posted this thread I had used that same quote (take... leave the rest). As I said earlier, we all have the same goal here and I appreciate the feedback very much. As much as Trimpey(author/founder of rational recovery) attacks AA/NA, they share one key idea. The fact that the urge to drink/use is very clever and cunning power and it's not just going to go away. We all have to keep that in mind. Thanx again for the support.:ghug2

bugsworth

I think any formal program will stress the devastating effects of long term alcohol abuse.
The urge to drink becomes a reaction out of habit...not sure if it is clever or cunning but it clearly is the reason many continue to drink. Change is scary...feeling emotions without booze is scary...even the thought of lifetime sobriety can be scary but one must go thru to get out.

Trimpey is absolutely anti-aa...no overtones about it! lol He does however make some valid points shared by many.

Again welcome...keep posting and share your journey!

JBones77

I don't think AA is something for me...but the fact that they are so critical of AA and are trying to "sell their product" as an alternative makes me wonder. I do like a lot of what I read on their site though...

Fubarcdn

Thanks for the links doorknob. I will check these out a little later. I need things to keep my pea brain busy, especially in the afternoon.

doorknob

How 'bout baffling?

I'm getting close to 90 days and I really do think that the gut reaction to drink (and smoke pot) is getting weaker. And being normal is starting to feel normal again.

bugsworth

Okay Dk I will go with baffling!!! LOL clever and cunning sounds too maniacal to me. My brain/disease isn't plotting against me...my brain is just doing what it has been trained to do.

I found after about 6 months it was odd to think about a drink...not nearly as natural as it once was.

BTW don't you know it isn't nice to stick out your tongue at people??? lol

CarolD

I think this is an interesting link about Rational Recovery

Rational Recovery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

No...I did not try it...I was already successfully using AA
for my recovery from alcoholism before I saw
a TV special on various recovery methods.

Several years later...I did work on another issue
by using SMART and it too was beneficial.

...There is no right or wrong way to find a
healthy sober future. I sure hope you do.

Good to see you here again...

shockozulu

We have some good discussions about SMART, LifeRing, and to a lesser extent RR over on the Secular Connections - SoberRecovery : Alcoholism Drug Addiction Help and Information (SC) section of the forum.

SMART broke off of RR due to some legit issues and Albert Ellis (the founder of Cognitive Behavioral Therapy) went to SMART which, unlike RR, has meetings which discuss the tools used to help those with addictions.

Personally, I don't like RR because they charge to post at their bulletin board, and seem focused on hating AA as much as CBT (which they call AVRT).

I hope to see you over at SC!

James13

One thing I noticed on the AVRT website is that it underscores that you cannot use a recovery group/AA with the AVRT program. Then it says that you will "systematically uproot" your personal beliefs and traditions in a 12 step program.

Then it says, "In a very short time, you will issue [your family] a personal guarantee that you will never drink again, along with an agreement that, as a user of alcohol and other drugs, you are unfit for family membership."

Then, for $29/month or $250/year, you can subscribe, and beat that addiction.

Hmmm......

Fubarcdn

Everybody is trying to make a buck. They have a 0% chance of ever getting money from me. In my opinion anyone who tries to profit from others misery is not the type of person I want anything to do with.

James13

What I also noticed on the AVRT site is that they repeat certain themes over and over, either directly or passively, such as anti-AA/recovery group rhetoric. This isn't exaggeration at all- it's all over the site from top to bottom. Then it decides for you that you will have to believe certain things in AA, which it outlines. (?)- It assumes you will be brainwashed (essentially questioning your capacity for independent/critical thought).

This is just my opinion, but it seems like snake oil.

doorknob

There's way better stuff out there for non-12 Step recovery than what Trimpey is offering...

and way better stuff as far as critical analysis of AA.

James13

DK, I agree wholeheartedly on both points.

SonOF

Could you suggest some material, sites, etc. in particular?

Anna

These are some alternate recovery programs:

Dually Diagnosed
Questions and Answers about DRA

LifeRing Secular Recovery
Home Page of LifeRing Secular Recovery

SMART
SMART Recovery®

SOS - Secular Organisations for Sobriety
index.html

Women for Sobriety
Welcome to Women For Sobriety, Inc.


Information and analysis about addiction treatment and harm reduction:

The Stanton Peele Addiction Website

Moderation Management, the one group that deals with moderate drinking; useful for the guidelines:
Moderation Management

Lenina

When I first read the Small Book I was really put off by the author's hatred of AA. I am not an AA person but I gained so much from RR I was able to set aside the hatred of AA and take what I needed from RR. It worked so much better for me than AA in many ways.

It gave me an understanding of addiction that I hadn't got from AA. It seemed to fit better into what I believed about the nature of alcoholism and drug addiction.

I guess my point is, study anything you can about addiction. Use what works for you, what makes the most sense. As long as you stay sober, AND happy, what difference does it make what path you take?

Love,

Lenina