Patsyd1

Dan, if you and your former sponsor are at peace with this decision, then thats all that counts. I would strongly suggest getting another sponsor Dan.

I would also like to ask you Dan, in this 4th Step..... did you do a 4th column and get input from your sponsor regarding the 4th column on the 4th Step inventory?

Love
Patsy

Patsyd1

Hi Mackat,

Isn't that the truth! lol

Love your share Mackat,
Patsy

Dan

I intend to get another sponsor Patsy. In fact, my former sponsor had some guys calling me a few hours after we met yesterday! Which wasn't much of a surprise really. As I've said, I chose my sponsor well...
On the fourth Patsy, yes and yes!
"Step Four is beginning of lifetime practice"
Thanks Patsy. I feel the spirit of a room in your words at all times.

Music

I meant exactly what I said Dan. I got sober and I stay sober by not drinking, going to meetings, calling my sponsor, and working the steps in my life. I go to AA dances, gatherings, dinner, conferences and online for entertainment, to pass time, to read what you and others have to say and like I said before, to tell myself, "There but for the Grace of God go I."

Sponsors come and go for different reasons. My questiong to you is, do you have another sponsor yet?

Patsyd1

Good for you Dan, keep on keeping on. Stay on the path to recovery, the journey is an unbeatable one

Love
Patsy

Dan

Thanks for the answer Music.
Read my last reply to Patsy if you will.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but are you suggesting I get a sponsor as fast as possible?
I hope not. At any rate, asking me if I have a sponsor yet when you know bloody well it's only been 24 hours is weird man.

Patsyd1

Hi ya (((((((((((((Music)))))))))))))))

I gotta tell you Music, I just love your recovery and the message of hope that you pass on so freely, and I couldn't agree more with you..."There but for the Grace of God go I."

Patsyd1

Hi Dan,

I don't know if Music is suggesting that you get another sponsor right away or not..... but I sure am

Love to you Dan
Patsy

Music

Dan,
I've never been a day without a sponsor since I came to AA. I've always thought well before making that move. When I get into my own head, sometimes I'm not in very good company. So, yes to your question. I am saying that sponsors should overlap, and if you think that's weird, that's ok too. I had one sponsor for 18 years. We kind of moved apart geographically so I got one a little closer. Not a week goes by that I don't call my current sponsor at least twice and see him at least once.

Ya see Dan, I have what's commonly called and ego. If go too long on my own, I start thinking maybe I'm smart enough to stay alone. We drunks tend to think we're too smart for our own good and that we know more than we actually know. A smart person "isn't" one who knows what he knows. A smart person is one who knows what he doesn't know. I don't know for sure if I could stay away from meetings, and my sponsor and God and still make it. I know for sure I don't want to find out.

Dan

Thanks Music.
You remind me a lot of my first and only sponsor so far in AA.
It does feel strange this morning. We actually just got off the phone! Turns out he needs my mechanical expertise for the piece of junk he drives around in...
Ego well in check Music.
Thank you.

Peter

Working the Fourth Step with our sponsor and then working The Fifth with a practical stranger is in my opinion self defeating.

Recovery doesn't teach me about honesty, it teaches me about RIGOROUS honesty and the fact that it is important for me to humble myself to another human being who I have to encounter on a regular basis.

Making myself "vulnerable" to a total stranger or to someone I have little contact with is easy for me to do.It is when I am vulnerable to my friends and sponsors that I develop a level of accountability and the disarming of my "character defects" begins.

It is important to work on relationships in recovery and a relationship with my sponsor is one of the more important relationships I will ever have.My sponsor was the first person I learned to practise honesty, trust , humility and openness with and it served as a springboard to other more meaningful relationships.

As an alcoholic my first reaction is to run at the first sign of trouble.Today I can understand and appreciate the fact that people will never be able to live up to my expectations of them but that by talking about things we can sometimes find soloutions to some of our issues.

That being said. No one can choose my sponsor for me. Sponsorship is an intimate relationship that only I can make a decision on.I myself have fired a few sponsors in my time and as a sponsor I myself have been fired.

Finding the right sponsor for us can sometimes be trial and error but the important thing is to keep looking and to have one.

Best of luck.

Dan

Thanks for your thoughts Peter. However, as you pointed out, I reserve judgement on who will hear my fifth. But I can assure you of this. A total stranger it will not be. As I said before, I believe that rigorous honesty is the only way I can reclaim my life.

Dan

In retrospect Don, and looking at some of the other responses I've seen here and those that have been sent to me privately, I'm starting to wonder a little bit about identity. By that I mean, I'm feeling a blurring of the lines in my relationship to my recovery program. The hair on the back of my neck stands up at some of the things I read and hear both here, and in my face to face dealings with the people I trust. While I can appreciate suggestions and strive to keep an open mind to all, I sense inside me a strong need for affirmation of the things that I am coming to believe. This flies in the face of a lot of what is suggested to me in the rooms. But it is what I feel, with as much sober and clear thinking mind as I can muster. There was a time not long ago when I had trouble forming my own opinions about what was best for me. That time is no longer. Progress, and rigorous honesty is what I expect of myself. Anyone is free to tell me I should get a real life. Or live a REAL life. So I ask myself when does a newcomer earn the opportunity to express concerns?
I remain, very confused and sober!
Again Don, thanks for the note the other day.

Janet L

Hey Dan. I hope you're doing okay. I know you will. I too had to change sponsors., Things just weren't the same anymore, and she was out of town a lot and couldn't be reached.

When I came into AA, I was advised to look for a sponsor who had what I wanted(as far as working a good program) My old sponsor just didn't have the experience I felt I needed. Whenever I had a problem, it was always the same answer. And often times I didn't feel like I had her full attention when I was talking to her.

I love my new sponsor. She has a lot of experience, both in the program and in life. A she is always right on with her advice. We're going to do another 5th step, including that problem I had at the clubhouse Wed. night, Saturday.

I'm very glad you come here and share with us. I'm glad to know you! :smoker:

Ninerfan

To answer your queston Dan, now is when newcomers express their opinions. Now is the time to make all the silly mistakes you need to make and say all the stupid things you need to say. Dont be in to big a hurry to take back control. Let your sponsor guide you. If he asks you to do something that you disagree with just remember that your thinking got you into AA. And he just might know what he is doing. That thought was ever present inmy mind.

I would suggest that at your early stage in recovery that you are the wrong person to decide what is right for you. If you have picked someone who has their **** together and you want what they have then listen to them and try to do what they ask. Argue all you want, we arent slaves, but if a trust has been built between the two of you then do what is 'suggested.'

Just curious Dan, who was going to hear your fifth step if not your sponsor?

Me2

For me as a Christian I find the 12 steps are like breathing and I can impliment them as easy as anything Ive ever done.To me they seem like one action not a 12 step process. I must confess I went into a recovery program and left that after the girl leader in group gave me back a paper I wrote and said it was total crap and her remarks continued.......I went to some AA meetings and never got a sponser. Basically it was because people in the meetings just talked about thier memories of drinking...and smoked. I decided with my wifes suggestion to see my Pastor. He came from a drinking background and we hit it right off.Ive been fine since. So I support your decision Dan. Its yours to make. For as much as you may get flack for it,the decision to recover is yours alone and its your decision who you have as a sponser...if you even want one.

Part of what I went through in my Christian experience was a leaglistc movement called sheperding. I got saved at the end of the Jesus movement of the 60's...had a radical conversion. It wasnt religion...it wasnt joining a Church or denomination....I met Jesus in a spiritual sense. When I went into sheperding like everyone in my church did it dried out my spiritual life..it was choking out the life and the vitality...the relationship.I was accountible to a man...and everything from there got confused. I would buy something and have to consult my sheperd,,,I would mow his lawns and baby sit his kids.It was so sad. It was the opposite of the Bible. I was vulnerable because I just accepted it and had a lot of love in my life. I survived and eventually renewed my relationship with my Savior and those 3 years are but a blip on my radar screen now. I said all that to say this...Its so easy for mans ego and pride to get involved..and supplant truth in its various forms. When anyone in authority over another allows self to invade things get wierd.It could be you just dont like the guy...and thats not wrong..it could be that hes got some pride and wants to stroke his leadership ego...which is wrong...or it could be its just time for a change of sponsers..two things are for sure, your decision to quit drinking is right....and the 12 steps are tried and true.....but please Dan dont make the mistake I did when your vulnerable and trusting and give a man more trust than they are capable of handeling....its your recovery..and yours alone and you have the greater responsiblity in it, so based on that I support you ....These things I shared are not meant to cause debate...they are my personal oppinions only....and based on my experience in hopes they help...steve

Dan

Man, the only control I claim is that of being able to make choices. Did you even bother to read this thread? I've said more than once that it was our decision. Mutual. Two way. What is it about this you don't understand? ...silly mistakes... stupid things I need to say... You're showing yourself to be very presumptuous again Niner. I read all of your posts with interest as I recognize in them much value and much sober experience. Early sobriety or not though, I have this moron thing I like to do and it's called forming my own opinions. So in the interest of that, and of further discussions about sponsorship and it's basic core values, back off from telling me what you think I should do.
That's twice today you've told me what to do.
Who's going to hear my fifth? The person who's in the room along with my HP. Could be ol' Bill, who's got 45 years and the heart of a newcomer. Could be my sponsor when I find another one. Simply wasn't going to be my last sponsor. That was his way.

Janet L

[. The hair on the back of my neck stands up at some of the things I read and hear both here, and in my face to face dealings with the people I trust. While I can appreciate suggestions and strive to keep an open mind to all, I sense inside me a strong need for affirmation of the things that I am coming to believe. This flies in the face of a lot of what is suggested to me in the rooms. But it is what I feel, with as much sober and clear thinking mind as I can muster. There was a time not long ago when I had trouble forming my own opinions about what was best for me. That time is no longer.


Dan, I hear you. But whenever I think I've gotten something figured out, I run it be my sponsor or another alcoholic with time whom I trust. My thinking has been and often still is, that I find it important to do that. It has never failed me. I'm not talking about denying who you think you are, I'm jusst saying that when I comes to my program, it's a good idea to check it out. :okay:

Janet L

I tried to do a quote but it didn't work right.

Ninerfan

Dan perhaps it comes off as me telling you what to do but I think if you reread my posts I'm 'suggesting' what was suggested to me.

The only real choice I made was 'my name is Jerry and I'm an alcoholic.' After that, since I didn't know squat about AA, I followed directions(suggestions). If that offends anyone, i'm sorry. But we have a program of recovery and it works best if we work it the way it was intended.

This is not personal Dan so don't make it personal.

I repeat, my thinking got me here, AA thinking got me out of the hole I dug for myself. And it took a lot longer than a couple months for me to learn this program. And longer still to incorporate it into my being.

My only concern is right now and what goes forward from here.