Scorpion and the frog (and GABA receptors)
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Join Date: May 2019
Location: UK
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Scorpion and the frog (and GABA receptors)
I’m supposedly a science teacher so here goes. I’ll try and explain why we can’t drink again.
There’s a chemical in our brains called GABA. If you have high levels of GABA, you feel chilled. If you have low levels of GABA, you’re stressed. Our brains have receptors to check our GABA levels and tell us to chill out or run away! Alcohol stimulates these GABA receptors which is why we feel chilled after a drink. For an occasional drinker, that’s great, but for long-term drinkers, the GABA receptors are permanently affected. That’s why a drinker feels stressed when they don’t drink, and so starts the great myth that drinking helps people to relax. It would be funny if it wasn’t so deadly as it’s the above that makes people dependent on alcohol for the rest of their life.
In the fairy tale, the scorpion promises not to sting the frog if he carries him across a pond. The scorpion stings the frog anyway, and whilst both are drowning to death, the scorpion justifies his actions to the frog saying that’s what scorpions do.
A scorpion’s brain tells him to sting. An alcoholic’s brain tells him to drink. Luckily, we have some sort of self control and help such as this forum to stop us acting like the scorpion, but our altered brains will always have that instinct to drink if we stray.
There’s a chemical in our brains called GABA. If you have high levels of GABA, you feel chilled. If you have low levels of GABA, you’re stressed. Our brains have receptors to check our GABA levels and tell us to chill out or run away! Alcohol stimulates these GABA receptors which is why we feel chilled after a drink. For an occasional drinker, that’s great, but for long-term drinkers, the GABA receptors are permanently affected. That’s why a drinker feels stressed when they don’t drink, and so starts the great myth that drinking helps people to relax. It would be funny if it wasn’t so deadly as it’s the above that makes people dependent on alcohol for the rest of their life.
In the fairy tale, the scorpion promises not to sting the frog if he carries him across a pond. The scorpion stings the frog anyway, and whilst both are drowning to death, the scorpion justifies his actions to the frog saying that’s what scorpions do.
A scorpion’s brain tells him to sting. An alcoholic’s brain tells him to drink. Luckily, we have some sort of self control and help such as this forum to stop us acting like the scorpion, but our altered brains will always have that instinct to drink if we stray.
Blue Belt
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Soberville, USA
Posts: 4,174
Yup.
Sober by any means. I can be nice about it or I can be a meany.
Doesn't really matter to me if I hurt someones feelings by not drinking.
I just consider that one of the million triggers.
Addict for life.
Thanks.
Sober by any means. I can be nice about it or I can be a meany.
Doesn't really matter to me if I hurt someones feelings by not drinking.
I just consider that one of the million triggers.
Addict for life.
Thanks.
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Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: NSW - Australia
Posts: 14,598
I declined it whitejay.
Just wanted to remove all things alcohol related and accept that I could not, and did not, want to drink again.
Everyone is different, and if you decide to take this route hope it works well for you.
Just wanted to remove all things alcohol related and accept that I could not, and did not, want to drink again.
Everyone is different, and if you decide to take this route hope it works well for you.
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 2,279
Hi Hodd - You've set me off reading on the subject of GABA. I'm not a scientist but am fascinated by the neuro science of addiction.
Could you point me in the direction of any websites or information for beginners on the subject? I've watched Dr Kevin McAuley lecture on YouTube and that's about my level!!
Could you point me in the direction of any websites or information for beginners on the subject? I've watched Dr Kevin McAuley lecture on YouTube and that's about my level!!
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Hi Be123, well done for reading up on it. There’s not much easy to read info on the net, is there? Scientists mean well, but they try and show off and raise their language beyond that of us lesser mortals. It’s such an important topic, and it’s amazing GABA and alcohol haven’t been put into a nice accessible article or video. If that message was out there, people might stop wasting their lives trying to moderate and failing again and again. Maybe we should write our own article, Be123?
This video is fairly entertaining and informative.
https://youtu.be/1RxATXURxQM
This video is fairly entertaining and informative.
https://youtu.be/1RxATXURxQM
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 2,279
Originally Posted by Hodd 
Hi Be123, well done for reading up on it. There’s not much easy to read info on the net, is there? Scientists mean well, but they try and show off and raise their language beyond that of us lesser mortals. It’s such an important topic, and it’s amazing GABA and alcohol haven’t been put into a nice accessible article or video. If that message was out there, people might stop wasting their lives trying to moderate and failing again and again. Maybe we should write our own article, Be123?
This video is fairly entertaining and informative.
https://youtu.be/1RxATXURxQM
This video is fairly entertaining and informative.
https://youtu.be/1RxATXURxQM
I read some articles this morning and they nudged me that direction. Science and nature are my higher powers (I'm not in AA) because they do their thing with no regard for me, and maybe (I said maybe), they're going to be the one that saves me (Thats saves me).
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When we’re young, we think we’re invincible. Fat bald old people are a different species as far as young people are concerned. At school, I could run a mile in five minutes and could never understand why adults ran so slowly. Surely it’s just a matter of keeping fit?
Now I’m 50, although I’m fit and run more than ever, it’s physically impossible for me to run a mile in 5 minutes. My 50-year-old cardiovascular/respiratory system can no longer produce enough energy for that level of performance. I’m just being a normal human being. It’s nature and can’t be changed.
Likewise we can’t change what’s happened in our brains to make us alcohol dependent. You have as much chance of that as I have of doing that five-minute mile.
I don’t know if it’s arrogance or foolishness on the part of an ex-drinker to think they can somehow bypass the science of addiction. If I posted on a runners forum every day that I was trying to run a 5-minute mile at 50, I’d be laughed at. Einstein’s quote about insane people repeating the same thing again and again would be mentioned.
Our drinkers brains have been altered irreversibly. There’s no moderation option available. The only options left are not to drink again or be a heavy drinker.
Now I’m 50, although I’m fit and run more than ever, it’s physically impossible for me to run a mile in 5 minutes. My 50-year-old cardiovascular/respiratory system can no longer produce enough energy for that level of performance. I’m just being a normal human being. It’s nature and can’t be changed.
Likewise we can’t change what’s happened in our brains to make us alcohol dependent. You have as much chance of that as I have of doing that five-minute mile.
I don’t know if it’s arrogance or foolishness on the part of an ex-drinker to think they can somehow bypass the science of addiction. If I posted on a runners forum every day that I was trying to run a 5-minute mile at 50, I’d be laughed at. Einstein’s quote about insane people repeating the same thing again and again would be mentioned.
Our drinkers brains have been altered irreversibly. There’s no moderation option available. The only options left are not to drink again or be a heavy drinker.
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Hodd, you have posted a lot of helpful information here. For some of us it really helps to understand the science behind it, because it takes away the sense of personal failure and makes clear what the path forward has to be. Thank you.
As a result of heavy drinking, many of us are also deficient in basic nutrients like magnesium, and B-vitamins.
And there are herbs that help to increase GABA and provide a calming effect, like Chamomole, Passion Flower and Valerian Root.
Totally natural solutions, that along with exercise and proper diet can go a long way in reducing anxiety.
As a result of heavy drinking, many of us are also deficient in basic nutrients like magnesium, and B-vitamins.
And there are herbs that help to increase GABA and provide a calming effect, like Chamomole, Passion Flower and Valerian Root.
Totally natural solutions, that along with exercise and proper diet can go a long way in reducing anxiety.
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Join Date: May 2018
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Originally Posted by whitejay
Has anyone had experience with naltrexone ? I am starting it
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Thanks adv, we’re not failures, though. We’re a tough bunch of winners if we’ve fought off a very nasty addiction. The failures are sadly those who’ve left it too late and became seriously ill from drinking.
No GP or counsellor ever explained this GABA stuff to me. It was only when I was prescribed the drug Campral (which helps reduce cravings) and read it worked by restoring the brain’s chemical balanced did I then read about GABA. All we need to know is that our brains have been permanently rewired, and we can’t drink.
I like the supplement info. I actually take magnesium as it helps with heart health. Vitamin D is good too for people in cold places like me
No GP or counsellor ever explained this GABA stuff to me. It was only when I was prescribed the drug Campral (which helps reduce cravings) and read it worked by restoring the brain’s chemical balanced did I then read about GABA. All we need to know is that our brains have been permanently rewired, and we can’t drink.
I like the supplement info. I actually take magnesium as it helps with heart health. Vitamin D is good too for people in cold places like me
Seeking wisdom
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 259
Originally Posted by CincyFin
I took it for awhile and I think it helped a bit with cravings. I figured it certainly couldn't hurt. Eventually I stopped taking it as I no longer had much of an urge to drink.
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Join Date: Jul 2017
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Originally Posted by advbike
Hodd, you have posted a lot of helpful information here. For some of us it really helps to understand the science behind it, because it takes away the sense of personal failure and makes clear what the path forward has to be. Thank you.
As a result of heavy drinking, many of us are also deficient in basic nutrients like magnesium, and B-vitamins.
And there are herbs that help to increase GABA and provide a calming effect, like Chamomole, Passion Flower and Valerian Root.
Totally natural solutions, that along with exercise and proper diet can go a long way in reducing anxiety.
As a result of heavy drinking, many of us are also deficient in basic nutrients like magnesium, and B-vitamins.
And there are herbs that help to increase GABA and provide a calming effect, like Chamomole, Passion Flower and Valerian Root.
Totally natural solutions, that along with exercise and proper diet can go a long way in reducing anxiety.
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