Why would you even think you could drink again?
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Join Date: Nov 2018
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This is my first attempt at sobriety. I am just over 4 months sober. For me, I just can't relapse. If I do relapse one time, I'm going to relapse two times, then over and over again. I know myself. I have to make this one work. It is my one and only chance. I'm not going to blow it.
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: sydney nsw
Posts: 785
Staying. I did it for me as well. The benefits of removing the bottle has benefitted everything that involves me. My partner, health, work life everything. Being so new into my recovery I know I cant become complacent. The pink cloud has faded away and come back less intense and I know it eventually will disappear. Its a reality that I am ready to face. While its still hanging around I am preparing my toolbox so I am ready when it goes. The inner peace that I so desperately was after I have now. It is worth more than anything else that I own. While I nurture it I know this is possible. Congratulations Sassy!!!
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Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: sydney nsw
Posts: 785
Originally Posted by Rd2quit 
This is my first attempt at sobriety. I am just over 4 months sober. For me, I just can't relapse. If I do relapse one time, I'm going to relapse two times, then over and over again. I know myself. I have to make this one work. It is my one and only chance. I'm not going to blow it.
. Real intent, real desire to be done with it, strong language!
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: canada
Posts: 7,242
. Abstinence becomes a sign we carry around announcing that we failed, usually miserably so [at drinking].
Think about it. Drinking requires no special skills whatsoever. How big of a loser are you when you fail at that!?
ha, DriGuy, nah, i didn’t fail at drinking.
at all.
was pretty good at it, in fact.
it was the control i failed at.
Think about it. Drinking requires no special skills whatsoever. How big of a loser are you when you fail at that!?
ha, DriGuy, nah, i didn’t fail at drinking.
at all.
was pretty good at it, in fact.
it was the control i failed at.
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Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 5,169
Originally Posted by Stayingsassy
In rational recovery, there is a mantra. It gets said every day, all day, all night, at every occasion....the repetitiveness of this mantra worms it’s way into your subconscious and becomes part of you. The mantra is, “I don’t drink, no matter what, and I will never change my mind.”
Do not leave the door open!! Use language every day all day that shuts down any possibility of future drinking.
I’ve been reading here a long time. Way too many chronic relapsers saying “I want to believe it’s forever but I don’t know.” Or “it’s just for now, for now I don’t drink.” Or “I really wish I could drink and I’m pretty sure I won’t make it.”
Your subconscious is listening. Tell it your intent. Make it so. Then it will become part of you.
Anything less than “never” becomes an eventual relapse, because from day one you’re making it ok to drink again. Think this addiction isn’t too powerful to overcome a “maybe?” Think again.
Do not leave the door open!! Use language every day all day that shuts down any possibility of future drinking.
I’ve been reading here a long time. Way too many chronic relapsers saying “I want to believe it’s forever but I don’t know.” Or “it’s just for now, for now I don’t drink.” Or “I really wish I could drink and I’m pretty sure I won’t make it.”
Your subconscious is listening. Tell it your intent. Make it so. Then it will become part of you.
Anything less than “never” becomes an eventual relapse, because from day one you’re making it ok to drink again. Think this addiction isn’t too powerful to overcome a “maybe?” Think again.
"You can never say, you will not drink again," was a statement I heard in AA repeated several times by the oldest member of the group, and restated by others. He said it knowingly, and the group all nodded their heads in agreement. It too, was a mantra, and I was mortified at how easily people accepted the act of giving in. It seemed like they were paving the way for their own failure.
In that group, about half the members were constantly falling off the wagon. They would disappear for a few months and then return, often with two black eyes and multiple abrasions. The wise old timer would say, "You can never be sure you won't drink again. You are an alcoholic," and everyone would obediently nod in agreement.
Of course you can say you will never drink again. I did a week after I started AA, even in defiance of that wise old timer. I went to AA to quit, not to fall off the wagon. Drinking would be unacceptable, and if I didn't believe that old timer was dead wrong, I would have packed up and left the group.
I'd already done the self processing attempts at moderation before I got to AA. I can't remember once in the last 10 years prior when even in the misery of a hangover, I ever said I would never drink again. I knew it wasn't over, and I drank again and again.
When I finally got sick enough of watching my own downward spiral, I was so bad off, I went to AA, where I was willing to go to any lengths and willing to surrender myself to a life of sobriety. I wasn't doing this for the fellowship or the spirituality. I was there to stop drinking, because drinking was the single biggest problem in my life, and none of my other problems would I deal with without several years of sobriety under my belt. And many of those problems were there as a direct result of my drinking.
I don't understand how a plan to stop drinking should make allowances for drinking. That is the very life that causes all the problems in the first place. You can't call something new, if it's the same old thing. I wanted something new, and obviously, it had to be different than what I was already doing.
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Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 5,169
Originally Posted by fini
. Abstinence becomes a sign we carry around announcing that we failed, usually miserably so [at drinking].
Think about it. Drinking requires no special skills whatsoever. How big of a loser are you when you fail at that!?
ha, DriGuy, nah, i didn’t fail at drinking.
at all.
was pretty good at it, in fact.
it was the control i failed at.
Think about it. Drinking requires no special skills whatsoever. How big of a loser are you when you fail at that!?
ha, DriGuy, nah, i didn’t fail at drinking.
at all.
was pretty good at it, in fact.
it was the control i failed at.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
Sassy:
Anything less than “never” becomes an eventual relapse, because from day one you’re making it ok to drink again. Think this addiction isn’t too powerful to overcome a “maybe?” Think again.
And there it is.
Anything less than “never” becomes an eventual relapse, because from day one you’re making it ok to drink again. Think this addiction isn’t too powerful to overcome a “maybe?” Think again.
And there it is.
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Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Pacific Coast
Posts: 785
Originally Posted by DriGuy
I agree with this completely. Not everyone does, but it's one of those things that I feel strongly enough about to believe those who won't fully surrender to sobriety are unequivocally wrong.
"You can never say, you will not drink again," was a statement I heard in AA repeated several times by the oldest member of the group, and restated by others. He said it knowingly, and the group all nodded their heads in agreement. It too, was a mantra, and I was mortified at how easily people accepted the act of giving in. It seemed like they were paving the way for their own failure.
In that group, about half the members were constantly falling off the wagon. They would disappear for a few months and then return, often with two black eyes and multiple abrasions. The wise old timer would say, "You can never be sure you won't drink again. You are an alcoholic," and everyone would obediently nod in agreement.
Of course you can say you will never drink again. I did a week after I started AA, even in defiance of that wise old timer. I went to AA to quit, not to fall off the wagon. Drinking would be unacceptable, and if I didn't believe that old timer was dead wrong, I would have packed up and left the group.
I'd already done the self processing attempts at moderation before I got to AA. I can't remember once in the last 10 years prior when even in the misery of a hangover, I ever said I would never drink again. I knew it wasn't over, and I drank again and again.
When I finally got sick enough of watching my own downward spiral, I was so bad off, I went to AA, where I was willing to go to any lengths and willing to surrender myself to a life of sobriety. I wasn't doing this for the fellowship or the spirituality. I was there to stop drinking, because drinking was the single biggest problem in my life, and none of my other problems would I deal with without several years of sobriety under my belt. And many of those problems were there as a direct result of my drinking.
I don't understand how a plan to stop drinking should make allowances for drinking. That is the very life that causes all the problems in the first place. You can't call something new, if it's the same old thing. I wanted something new, and obviously, it had to be different than what I was already doing.
"You can never say, you will not drink again," was a statement I heard in AA repeated several times by the oldest member of the group, and restated by others. He said it knowingly, and the group all nodded their heads in agreement. It too, was a mantra, and I was mortified at how easily people accepted the act of giving in. It seemed like they were paving the way for their own failure.
In that group, about half the members were constantly falling off the wagon. They would disappear for a few months and then return, often with two black eyes and multiple abrasions. The wise old timer would say, "You can never be sure you won't drink again. You are an alcoholic," and everyone would obediently nod in agreement.
Of course you can say you will never drink again. I did a week after I started AA, even in defiance of that wise old timer. I went to AA to quit, not to fall off the wagon. Drinking would be unacceptable, and if I didn't believe that old timer was dead wrong, I would have packed up and left the group.
I'd already done the self processing attempts at moderation before I got to AA. I can't remember once in the last 10 years prior when even in the misery of a hangover, I ever said I would never drink again. I knew it wasn't over, and I drank again and again.
When I finally got sick enough of watching my own downward spiral, I was so bad off, I went to AA, where I was willing to go to any lengths and willing to surrender myself to a life of sobriety. I wasn't doing this for the fellowship or the spirituality. I was there to stop drinking, because drinking was the single biggest problem in my life, and none of my other problems would I deal with without several years of sobriety under my belt. And many of those problems were there as a direct result of my drinking.
I don't understand how a plan to stop drinking should make allowances for drinking. That is the very life that causes all the problems in the first place. You can't call something new, if it's the same old thing. I wanted something new, and obviously, it had to be different than what I was already doing.
The whole premise of AA is that no human agency can relieve alcoholism, but God can and will if he is sought. Sobriety is contingent on the maintenance of a fit spiritual condition, not on willpower. As alcoholics, we're likely to drink again if left to our own devices.
I think this is probably all the old-timer was trying to convey. Yes, it's subtly different from deciding never to drink again and never changing your mind, but the results are the same.
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Rd2Quit - I don't have another chance in me. It's one reason I am so adamant about some of these discussions and any wiggle room, so to speak. I am a believer that any alcoholic is risking their very last chance to get sober with the first drink.
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Join Date: Nov 2018
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Originally Posted by Andante
My guess is that the AA old-timer (and others like him) didn't intend for his comment to be interpreted as making allowances for drinking.
The whole premise of AA is that no human agency can relieve alcoholism, but God can and will if he is sought. Sobriety is contingent on the maintenance of a fit spiritual condition, not on willpower. As alcoholics, we're likely to drink again if left to our own devices.
I think this is probably all the old-timer was trying to convey. Yes, it's subtly different from deciding never to drink again and never changing your mind, but the results are the same.
The whole premise of AA is that no human agency can relieve alcoholism, but God can and will if he is sought. Sobriety is contingent on the maintenance of a fit spiritual condition, not on willpower. As alcoholics, we're likely to drink again if left to our own devices.
I think this is probably all the old-timer was trying to convey. Yes, it's subtly different from deciding never to drink again and never changing your mind, but the results are the same.
He also said at times that even if a person relapses, at least they had a month or two or a year or two of sobriety, but that doesn't fit very well with my definition of quitting drinking. What newcomers took from it, I don't know. Many heads nodded in agreement, but that is often a knee jerk response of acknowledgement, and may not mean anything.
I've seen too many fall off the wagon for no apparent reason, and I've seen maybe ten of those end in hospitalization or suicide. I'm not going to beat this horse anymore, because I'm only responsible for my own sobriety, and he did me no personal harm. I think I'll just put this away.
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Join Date: Nov 2018
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Originally Posted by August252015
Rd2Quit - I don't have another chance in me. It's one reason I am so adamant about some of these discussions and any wiggle room, so to speak. I am a believer that any alcoholic is risking their very last chance to get sober with the first drink.
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Originally Posted by DriGuy
I'm not going to beat this horse anymore, because I'm only responsible for my own sobriety, and he did me no personal harm. I think I'll just put this away.
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 3,027
Well, driguy,
There’s a fine line between advising a hard line in the sand, but also wanting others to know they are welcome in the recovery group.
They have to be welcome: that’s what it’s for. The disease is relentless. Some don’t make it. But they must always, always have a place they feel they can go.
The message can be clear without making someone feel unwelcome, but it’s tricky, and old man AA was probably trying to be kind.
“You can never be sure you won’t drink again” is a dangerous thing for me to even think about, I even felt a tiny spark typing it.
It’s why I don’t say that.
There’s a fine line between advising a hard line in the sand, but also wanting others to know they are welcome in the recovery group.
They have to be welcome: that’s what it’s for. The disease is relentless. Some don’t make it. But they must always, always have a place they feel they can go.
The message can be clear without making someone feel unwelcome, but it’s tricky, and old man AA was probably trying to be kind.
“You can never be sure you won’t drink again” is a dangerous thing for me to even think about, I even felt a tiny spark typing it.
It’s why I don’t say that.
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Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,408
Originally Posted by ScottFromWI
That sounds like a good idea. Trying to figure out what other people think or "why" they do what they do is almost exclusively an exercise in futility. People say all kinds of things that they shouldn't, but don't let it stop you from doing what you know is the right thing for YOU.
In the beginning, the only thing that worked for me was "just for today". Anything else would have made me run to the bottle. Now, that mantra doesn't work so well. So I decided I will go "just for a year". After all, I made it six months before. I know I have a year in me. What happens when I get to a year? I don't know- but there was a time when a year was a delusion...now it's a reality.
Not only is the context of our current experience different but I believes our minds and thought processes are different. Perhaps one day I will also be saying "I will never drink again- and I will know it and mean it" but if I do, I know it won't be from where I am standing now. It will be different...a different time, a different place, a different me.
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