Left the program
Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bklyn. NY
Posts: 1,859
Originally Posted by Soberas 
Now my question is this, why in a program of recovery is there so much negativity towards someone who doesnt want to use AA to remain sober?
If you're leaving AA I strongly advise you find some other means of growth and support. I'm a firm believer that this is a disease (for those who actually have it and aren't just heavy drinkers), and needs treatment. If we don't work to continually change who we are to become healthier people, the disease will come back at us. With a drink, or without. That's my experince and what I've gleaned from the people around me. And I've been doin this a while.
Self recovered Self discovered
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto Canada
Posts: 5,148
There are many many more who never return to AA because they have found a different path to sobriety. But this is not a criticism, your only experience is of a different group of people. Extending your experience to the whole population is called selection bias.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bklyn. NY
Posts: 1,859
Originally Posted by freshstart57
Extending your experience to the whole population is called selection bias.
Outside of this forum (and the internet), I've never met a single person who chose or used a recovery method other than AA (or abstinance without any program). Other tools for recovery are not all that accessible, nor popular in my area. I'm not discounting other methods, advising against them, or saying they don't work. I'm just stating my experience, and what I've been witness to. And doing my best to give an honest answer to the OP's question.
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,580
Originally Posted by Johnny152
Congratulations!
You said you "attempted the steps" - I'm confused?
I think this was really cool of you to do! Kudos!
A reflection of their own fears, no? As you have discovered on your worldly travels, there is no big bottle in the sky waiting to tip over and get us drunk, is there?
Call the ones back that were cool and respectful, invite them out to dinner as a group or one by one and tell them of your travels! Living a "normal" life is the goal of the program and you seem happy to just that. It might be good for them to see that it is okay to be "normal".
Because we see people die all the time that leave the meetings and start drinking again. They like you and don't want to see that happen to you, that's my guess.
And so these things added to your new found sense of control added up to you being able to make different decisions about your compulsion. Great!
AA has the best track record. Is in not fair to say you are able to "remain sober and happy ... through the aid of A.A." that you received? Other things work for other people and people in A.A. tend to get religion about it.
And if you start having some life-issues that throw you for a loop, hit the tables again for a while and the message boards, etc. Perfectly valid because it works for you.
You have found your own spiritual way of moving through life. It isn't religious, okay. Your own self control and what you learned from others, by your own admission, added up to change that keeps you sober and that is fine. Be okay with your solution - it is valid today. Be okay with their solution as well - it works for them and is valid today.
I started going to AA in 1984. Been sober since. When I hit 18 years clean and sober, I was done with meetings, with the a@@holes, with the "get with god" crap and all the stuff I couldn't use. I was tired of the whinners and stopped going to meetings. Then, about three years ago (25 years sober) i started having issues with life - father died, mother dying, unemployment, family falling apart -- and while I still did not have the desire to drink (haven't had a desire to drink since august 85), I was angry and resentful, pissed off all the time and just ugly from the pain of it all. So I started going back.
I find lots of things there that help me maintain my --< emotional >-- sobriety at this time and it works for me.
I love it when I hear "You have to get down on your knees...." -- I haven't done that in my sobriety unless I was sick and puking, just like when I was drunk.....
Enjoy your freedom. Enjoy your happiness. Never forget where you came from and if you start to think you can control it, go back to AA and take a look at those that have continued to drink since you stopped and ask yourself "Do I want to trade what I have for what THEY have?"
Peace in your heart!
You said you "attempted the steps" - I'm confused?
I think this was really cool of you to do! Kudos!
A reflection of their own fears, no? As you have discovered on your worldly travels, there is no big bottle in the sky waiting to tip over and get us drunk, is there?
Call the ones back that were cool and respectful, invite them out to dinner as a group or one by one and tell them of your travels! Living a "normal" life is the goal of the program and you seem happy to just that. It might be good for them to see that it is okay to be "normal".
Because we see people die all the time that leave the meetings and start drinking again. They like you and don't want to see that happen to you, that's my guess.
And so these things added to your new found sense of control added up to you being able to make different decisions about your compulsion. Great!
AA has the best track record. Is in not fair to say you are able to "remain sober and happy ... through the aid of A.A." that you received? Other things work for other people and people in A.A. tend to get religion about it.
And if you start having some life-issues that throw you for a loop, hit the tables again for a while and the message boards, etc. Perfectly valid because it works for you.
You have found your own spiritual way of moving through life. It isn't religious, okay. Your own self control and what you learned from others, by your own admission, added up to change that keeps you sober and that is fine. Be okay with your solution - it is valid today. Be okay with their solution as well - it works for them and is valid today.
I started going to AA in 1984. Been sober since. When I hit 18 years clean and sober, I was done with meetings, with the a@@holes, with the "get with god" crap and all the stuff I couldn't use. I was tired of the whinners and stopped going to meetings. Then, about three years ago (25 years sober) i started having issues with life - father died, mother dying, unemployment, family falling apart -- and while I still did not have the desire to drink (haven't had a desire to drink since august 85), I was angry and resentful, pissed off all the time and just ugly from the pain of it all. So I started going back.
I find lots of things there that help me maintain my --< emotional >-- sobriety at this time and it works for me.
I love it when I hear "You have to get down on your knees...." -- I haven't done that in my sobriety unless I was sick and puking, just like when I was drunk.....
Enjoy your freedom. Enjoy your happiness. Never forget where you came from and if you start to think you can control it, go back to AA and take a look at those that have continued to drink since you stopped and ask yourself "Do I want to trade what I have for what THEY have?"
Peace in your heart!
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 350
Left the program??
Left the program???
Hi! I'm a grateful, recovering alcoholic and my name is Johnny!
I think I'd like to back up to the title of the original post (OP).
"Left the program."
I hope not. "The Program" isn't an external thing. It is that which is inside of us that gets us through the day clean and sober.
Whether or not AA is in the picture, you'd better keep up with your program.
Leaving the fellowship or staying in it is optional for some - leaving the program is a first class ticket back to which ever one of the Seven Planes of Hell you skidded into the fellowship from in the first place.
And let me also plant a seed about this: the needs in my life for that program have changed somewhat with the passage of time, stage of life, life events, etc.. - learning how to apply the principles I've learned to new life situations is something I still do at meetings - I've never been a sober father before and learning how to maintain my serenity with triplet nine year olds is a trick!
What kept me sane (clear minded), serene (absence of internal conflict), stable (mentally, emotionally) and secure (in my place in the universe) was slowly forgotten over the ten years I didn't go to meetings.
What I learned in my twenties about sobriety (physical and emotional) has not allowed me to coast through life.
Humans naturally have euphoric recall about life. We forget the pain and suffering, the bad times and aspects about our relationships with people and things. For alcoholics, addicts and compulsives, this can be catastrophic and deadly.
"A daily reprieve contingent upon the maintenance of my program." if you prefer.
I'm not saying "Go back or suffer the flames of eternal damnation" nor anything of the sort. I'm saying: Keep an open mind, you might find meetings useful again in the future.
Each and every alcoholic, in and out of the fellowship, sober or not, teaches us valuable lessons about ourselves and recovery. And THAT is the real gem of it! THAT is what we miss when we stay away from the fellowship - whether that fellowship is AA or this message board system. Stop going to meetings if you must, but don't ever stop learning -
We either move forward, or backward - there is no standing still!
Hi! I'm a grateful, recovering alcoholic and my name is Johnny!
I think I'd like to back up to the title of the original post (OP).
"Left the program."
I hope not. "The Program" isn't an external thing. It is that which is inside of us that gets us through the day clean and sober.
Whether or not AA is in the picture, you'd better keep up with your program.
Leaving the fellowship or staying in it is optional for some - leaving the program is a first class ticket back to which ever one of the Seven Planes of Hell you skidded into the fellowship from in the first place.
And let me also plant a seed about this: the needs in my life for that program have changed somewhat with the passage of time, stage of life, life events, etc.. - learning how to apply the principles I've learned to new life situations is something I still do at meetings - I've never been a sober father before and learning how to maintain my serenity with triplet nine year olds is a trick!
What kept me sane (clear minded), serene (absence of internal conflict), stable (mentally, emotionally) and secure (in my place in the universe) was slowly forgotten over the ten years I didn't go to meetings.
What I learned in my twenties about sobriety (physical and emotional) has not allowed me to coast through life.
Humans naturally have euphoric recall about life. We forget the pain and suffering, the bad times and aspects about our relationships with people and things. For alcoholics, addicts and compulsives, this can be catastrophic and deadly.
"A daily reprieve contingent upon the maintenance of my program." if you prefer.
I'm not saying "Go back or suffer the flames of eternal damnation" nor anything of the sort. I'm saying: Keep an open mind, you might find meetings useful again in the future.
Each and every alcoholic, in and out of the fellowship, sober or not, teaches us valuable lessons about ourselves and recovery. And THAT is the real gem of it! THAT is what we miss when we stay away from the fellowship - whether that fellowship is AA or this message board system. Stop going to meetings if you must, but don't ever stop learning -
We either move forward, or backward - there is no standing still!
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 350
Thank you SO much for giving me the opportunity to get these things clearer in my mind. You have helped me a good deal today. Add the 12th step to those you've worked in your program!
H.O.P.E. = “Hang Onto emPowerment Everyday”
H.O.P.E. = “Hang Onto emPowerment Everyday”
Guest
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 4,580
Originally Posted by Johnny152
Thank you SO much for giving me the opportunity to get these things clearer in my mind. You have helped me a good deal today. Add the 12th step to those you've worked in your program!
H.O.P.E. = “Hang Onto emPowerment Everyday”
H.O.P.E. = “Hang Onto emPowerment Everyday”
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Chicago, Illinois
Posts: 146
Hi Soberas. Remember that AA members are in recovery and some, especially the "last gaspers," look upon AA as a saving grace--the ONLY thing that stood between them and the grave or jail. They and others can easily become sort of religious about it, believing that without this "salvation" all alcoholics, like them, will be lost. Yet the authors of the Big Book themselves never presented AA as a crusade nor claimed it to be the ONLY solution. They simply claimed that it was an approach that had worked for themselves and other alcoholics in their lives. I say, you're on your path. You learned what you needed to learn. I wish you well! Those who were not accepting of your choice are probably more afraid than anything. Alcoholism is, after all, not a thing to take lightly.
Blessings,
Zorah
Blessings,
Zorah
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