Onewithwings

I have worked the first 3 steps 3 times, 3 different ways. I go to meetings, come early, stay late, talk to other addicts, call my sponsor, pray, meditate, try to be of service... and yet, I find myself relapsing time and time again-- about 13 relapses in the last 6 months. I can not hold on to any clean time no matter how hard I try. My drug is easy to get anywhere in the country, no connections needed, so I can't run from it.

I have Borderline Personality Disorder. My biggest killer when it comes to staying clean is that I just stop caring. I am sure it is my BPD because I really do care when I'm in a good state of mind, but as soon as mania or depression sets in, I stop caring. I go use and I don't think twice. I don't call because I honestly want to use at the time. I don't care about my sobriety at all.

Recently, I went off my meds, relapsed, overdosed, went from the ER to the psych ward, got put on new meds, fiddled with those for a bit, and now I am waiting to put in my prescriptions (just haven't had time, since I need my husband to drive, I'm not a safe driver off my meds). I hope that this new cocktail will be better than the last, and I won't feel the need to get off of it (It's a bad idea to go off any psych med on your own) I just don't know...

I think sometimes that I am one who can not be honest with herself, can not form a working relationship with a higher power, or can not let go of control over her own life. Not sure which it is. I just want to WANT to stay clean. I want to care always, not just on good days. I want to be able to think things through before I try them. I want patience with myself to keep trying, but I need to know why I am failing so much! I don't want to be here again. I was just devastated to pick up another white key tag after 52 days clean (most I have had clean since I was pregnant with my 2 year old son). I now am on day 12 again and feel awful.

I have no optimism left, no resilience. I no longer look forward to meetings or learning new things. I feel it is not going to help me anymore this time than my last dozen attempts at recovery. I don't feel like doing step work or talking to my sponsor. It all seems like the same old thing-- Kati's screwing up while everyone else recovers. I don't see how I can change that. I did everything I was told.

I didn't even try to get high, I just popped 12+ pills and ended up kind of high, so I went to get my DoC and some other stuff, then the next day I was so devastated over my relapse that I took a box of CCC's, and called 911. Went to the hospital then the psych ward, and was there 11 days. I don't feel there was any help to recover from BPD or addiction. I also started having anxiety and eating disordered problems, which I was told I would have to stop if I ever wanted to get discharged, but I got no help or therapy for the ED.

Where can I possibly have gone wrong? It wasn't even like something traumatic happened, I just popped a bunch of pills because I could.

How does someone like me get clean?

Kitey

Aww, I really feel for you my love. Surely there MUST be help somewhere for you. Can you not ask your Doctor to send you to see a Specialist somewhere?

It seems as if You are continually crying out for help. It looks as if your BPD is taking control over you. I have took overdoses in the past when I have drank and become depressed and ended up in Hospital many times BUT it was always the Drink that made me do it. I wouldn't dream of doing such a thing while Sober ( Which wasn't often ).

I'm not suggesting you haven't seeked help in the past but I think by now you should Demand your Doctor to refer you to some-one who can deal with your problems, you shouldn't have to suffer like this..

I will keep you in my prayers, I really hope you can pull through! xx

Onewithwings

Thanks

I have not met my doctor, we transfered care a few months ago, and I haven't come in on appointment. I have been meaning to, but see, I had labs done on the psych ward for just about everything. Potassium was a bit low, as was kidney function, and I was a bit dehydrated.

Yes, I cry out for help a lot. I have never seriously tried to kill myself, yet there were times I felt compelled to take a handful of each sort of pills that I want. I have had a few things happen on this, when I make combos such as: celexa, ativan, tramadol, NyQuil, trazadone, remeron, etc. Once I blacked out for 3 days, another time I brought a dryer ball into the ER and insisted on keeping it with me, as it was my friend Brig, you just couldn't tell because she just got a haircut. Crazy stuff!

I am afraid one of these days I will actually kill myself. I have never been straight up suicidal, but some times more than others, my cries for help resemble nearly-successful suicide attempts.

So really, I am already not the sanest person around. But I feel like the only one who struggles this much with relapse. I can't even put 2 months together, and I've been at this since March.

I feel like if I'm going to keep relapsing anyway, why don't I just use till I'm truly sick of it, THEN come try to recover. The one difference in my recovery from many others is that I am in recovery more for my husband and son than I am for myself. I don't really care if I am successful, but my husband does, and my son will in the future (He's 2 right now, and in daycare as part of a safety plan. I can't transport him or watch him alone either. That way my relapses won't put him in danger. But I really don't have the motivation to quit for my own sake. I still think it wasn't that big a deal, and now that my son is in day care and I am not transporting him, I can do it without hurting him. Sick thinking, eh? But I am really struggling with the idea of doing this for *me*.

Ananda

I relate hugely to your post

What I am doing now is going to meetings even though it feels pointless...When i get into the all or nothing thinking....when my perceptions go kilter...I drink....over some trivial reason...or for nothing that I can identify....once i realize that i have started the cycle over...I become suicidle and have experenced much of what you described. At this point I can no longer afford the medication that i was on for PTSD/BPD issues. I too feel hopless today...but how much of that hopelessness is from our black/white thinking associated with the borderline personality disorder???

I truly understand your pain.

If your going to meetings and reading the big book then you know that is typical of an alchoholic. So despite our mental illnes..it seems to me our symptoms are the same as described..therefore the solution should work.

It seems to come down thats some how I am unable to sustain the willingness or desire required for the program to work...and that perhaps i am consitutionally incapable of the honesty required ... I don't know..

I do know that I'm not giving up on AA...maybe on myself a bit..but not on the promise of recovery. I've felt hopless and like giving up on and off all day today...not like drinking, not like harming myself...just like i'm going through the actions already convinced its pointless...seeing only those ways I'm failing in the area of total willingess, honesty and stuff like that....

But last night i went to a meeting...today i did things i was supose to, tonight i will discuss step one with an alchoholic and tomarrow i'll get up and do it again. I just burned dinner and for me it seemed the end of the world...I dumped it..and even though I'm crying...I will give myself 10 minites to calm down..then go start over and cook it again...

The fact you and I posted today to me indicates that we have hope It may only be a flicker but in time it will grow. Its easy to be overwhelmed, but just keep doing the next indicated thing to the best of your understanding and ability...no matter how overwhelming and even if you cry the whole way

Thank you for letting me know I am not alone...Someone who has been here and done this and ended up in recovery will come along soon with some hope to share I am sure

nandm

I am sorry but as far as how to stay clean I can not answer for you. I know it took my realization that alcohol was a slow suicide for me and was killing everyone around me that cared as well. Once I realized that then I got serious and have not looked back. Yes, there are times I think about drinking but I play the tape through in my head. I know the depths alcohol has always and will always take me to.
I am wondering about the Borderline Personality Disorder since what you describe is actually Bi-Polar disorder (or manic/depressive disorder). Borderline personality disorder shows itself in how one reacts to and deal with people. You might check with your doctor and make sure you are being treated for the right thing.

chicory

OneWithWings,
I have not been here long, but have followed your posts.
first off, can you go to another doctor? Maybe get another opinion? Group therapy- did yousay you do that?

Just dont give up on yourself. YOu have been here, have been successful at having 52 days sober, that is great, I think! Just keep doing that, even if you falter, just keep doing what you have been doing.

what do you think helped you to achieve the 52 days? can you pinpoint it?
I am glad that you are here,sharing your struggles, and doing what you can.
I do think that perhaps getting another opinion about diagnosis, whether bipolar or borderline- sounds bipolar to me also with the mood swings, and that would take different drugs.
I can understand how frustrating this must be. How tough. but with a disorder, we need the right meds, and cant be expected to do it on your own.

Thank you for sharing. Your story is going to help others, who may be going thru the same things. For you are not alone. I wish for you that you had a support group.

am sending good thoughts and prayers for you to find answers and some rest and peace. It is good that you have daycare for your son- that must be a little bit of comfort, so you can focus on what you need to.

hang in there. keep posting, and dont give up trying to find the right treatments. perhaps with the right meds, you would sail along in recovery.
hugs,
chicory

Onewithwings

I have BPD as well as bipolar tendencies (but no official diagnosis). I am medicated for both. Currently, I am unsure which one presents the biggest challenge. Right now, it is my black and white thinking. "I relapsed so I'm a failure. Better take some more." or "My little brother and I vastly disagree on a subject I am passionate about. Let's not speak to him for a few years." or "So-and-so hasn't called me back. I think she hates me. This gives me an excuse to do hurtful things to myself that I feel I deserve because so-and-so is ignoring me. I also do go through cycles of depression and mania, although it is much more rapid than those with Bipolar-- I will be depressed and hardly come out of bed for a few days, and then manic going a million miles an hour for days on end, often not sleeping, even if I take something for sleep. It takes a good bit of adjusting my meds, routine, diet, etc. Before I level out a bit.

For the sake of this post, let's just say I'm messed up, lol, however that may be. What is important for me is "Do I have the capacity to be honest with myself?" I am not sure how one would find the answer to that question. I did recently come out about some things I had been hiding/lying about... things that were difficult to even admit to myself, let alone someone else. That took honesty. However, I may still be in denial about the dangers of DXM. I have heard stories of everything from seizures to death, and I didn't watch my intake, I just figured it would never happen to me. Then there was my 'test' of step 1 by trying to take just one klonopin. Wound up taking them ALL (13-15 pills) and they were not even mine, they were my mother in laws. She had to withdraw from it cold turkey on her vacation. I ended up in the hospital getting my stomach pumped.

Now I am striving for a relationship with God. I had no real higher power for a long time, so I made one up. Nothing wrong with that, but it turned out my HP was not strong enough to restore me to sanity.

I am trying to work step 3, but I feel like I need a better connection with my higher power. I pray and meditate, but none of it seems real. I believe in God, but I feel like I don't have his number or something. I just can't connect enough to trust God with my will and my life. I believe that if I can achieve this, I will be able to move on. But I never feel the third step anymore, even when I pray it. I am lucky enough to have some very strong women who come teach me lessons throughout the week. This helps me understand God better. I know He wants me to be happy, I just need to know how to manifest it.

With all this knowledge and 52 days clean, I relapse without a second thought. When I look in the mirror I don't see me anymore. I see a failure, someone who should just give up.

I also do NA and never feel like I fit in. I am always the umpteenth wheel. I have low self esteem, and figure my sponsor is sick of hearing from me, so I don't bother to call her when something bad happens, or is about to happen. I didn't even think to pick up the phone because I hadn't really meant to get that high, I just for whatever reason took a handful of pills that I only needed one or two of. Next thing I know I am buying drugs thinking I already screwed up, why not go for it. Next day I felt like crap so I took twice as much of my drug, overdosed, and called 911. Had an 11 day mental institution stay.

I don't know if I can do it. I no longer feel motivated to stay clean. I am clean right now just because I haven't felt much like using. I am kind of hoping the mood won't strike again, but I am an addict so that is doubtful.

I just want to never have to try to get clean again. It is disappointing.

Ananda

Just wanted to share with you that I am "diagnoised" BorderlinePD..whatever that means...whether the drs got it right or wrong???? well I've read the guidlines for the diagnoisis and it certainly seems to fit me.

And yep.....its pretty much what you descibed...except that my moodswings tend to be so rapid without meds that I change moods every 5 minites

No one here is supose to give medical advise....just share experience...

ITs a struggle hon..but lets look at this with as little black and white thinking as possible...

You are still sober...thats REALLLY GOOD....so am I

I will focus today on that, and on what desire I do have...I make a list of simple things that need to be done and do them regardless of what I think or feel....doing that is a start.

In some of my buddist texts, it talks about how our senses bring information to our brains, but the brain interprets that information that is collected in such a way as to PROVE what ever it is we already believe. I read about that most days to help me remember as i go through my day that things are not as they appear...Some days that doesn't really change much..but gives me just enough awarness to be able to not react to what I think others think or feel about me or to what I think or feel about me

mindfulness (an element of budhism) is OFTEN recommended for borderline personality disorder...I try to practice mindfulnes meditation some each day...I understand it actually helps brain function...and when I was sober for 7 years (a long time ago) I was an avid practitioner of meditation on a daily bais...didn't believe in god..but worked the steps in a secular way....

I too have very little hope...cause my experience the past year has involved relapse. And as you said...being stuck in the first 3 steps it feels like it's just a matter of time

BUT...I guess I take actions of hope as much as i can each day....that is...do the next indicated thing...regardless of concequence...just because it is what I need to do next...maybe it will keep me sober, maybe not...but it is still what i need to do and remember..today I am sober (as are you)....

I'm trying to stay out of my emotions as much as I can and seem to be able to stay out of them enough to get stuff done...

I believe my sobriety is to be built as much on things like doing the dishes, applying for jobs, taking care of things as it is out of my step work...in fact i think doing those things IS step work...I too don't have gods phone number...or even his zip code or full name LOL....but I am in some way working step one two and three to the best of my ability when i simply do stuff even if it seems pointless at the moment .. cause it's there to be done

Try it just for today and see what happens...thats what I'm doing!

nandm

Quote by me: This was in no way "medical advice" it was simply stating my experience and encouraging the OP to speak to their doctor to clarify things. Sorry you took it that way Ananda. "Medical Advice" would not be telling the OP to speak to their doctor to clarify things for them.

Zencat

I see 'having a capacity to be honest' as being fully aware of all the harm addiction causes for those around them and with themselves. IMO, as long as one is honestly seeking help for their illness and giving addiction treatment their full attention, then I believe they are doing the right thing and recovery is possible.

Onewithwings

Well, I am generally very honest, but whenever I relapse, it is like I am two separate people. One is about to take drugs. Personality two can either call one out on her actions, call the sponsor, find something distracting to do, all that stuff. OR personality two can quietly turn her back and pretend not to see what's going on. THAT is a relapse. To me, anyway. It's like personality one is the id and just wants to get high. Personality two has to do the right thing by stopping personality one in her tracks. In this way, I am able to look at my relapse as involving 2 people, and thinking "What went wrong?" 9 times out of 10 it was just personality 2 deciding to ignore personality one. If I turn my back on addiction, it will jump right up and begin. If I stay facing it, and fighting it, I can stay clean.

PS: I have 6 months in the program but only 2 weeks clean due to frequent relapsing, so take all this with a grain of salt.

chicory

you know, as you say that, i think that it may be like that for all of us, two minds , fighting over what choice to make. i just dont analyze it as two people. It sounds like you are a very deep thinker, and maybe that activity makes it harder on you. maybe you are harder on yourself than most of us. you, me, we are all only human, and that is not always glorious.
I enjoy and have always enjoyed your posts. I think it says a lot that you belong to this forum, and that you find it very important to be here.
I am a christian, but I really have been liking some Buddah sayings (wow- i spelled that wrong each time , about 12 times) wish spell check would just spell if for me.
anywayyyyy- if you could quiet your mind, and practice that each day, and be easier on yourself, maybe you could see the precious person that you are. You are not just a mom, a wife, a recovering person- you are a one of a kind, good person.you deserve peace.
I pray for peace for you. You can do it- you have been doing it. some people never do.
just keep trying, practice makes perfect. you are learning from each thing that has hurt you. you are bigger than the pills, the drink, etc. your higher power is , anyway! and whether you believe in one, or can connect with one, or know his address or not- he is still there, and he knows your name, and where you live.
sending hugs tonight, and hope your evening is peaceful.

chicory

kelsh

MAY TRIGGER MAY TRIGGER



Hi OneWithWings,

When I read your posts my heart ached to see the words you had put down. I was close to the same with my thinking & seeking all the information I could to help me want to stay sober. I was 48 when I asked for help again and this time I had just enough sense left to know I had to get sober for "myself" not one other person, place, or thing would work unless I did it for myself.

I had a medical detox from alcohol in the local hospital & the Alcohol Program Manager came to the hospital three times a day to give me the shot to put me back to sleep....I was titrated down some every day & went home on the sixth day & to my first AA Meeting that evening.

I also was treated for my lifelong depression/anxiety=probably self-medicating my mental health issues=at the same time with separate counselors for each.

This all started 22 years ago & I am still sober & still get follow-up appointments with my doc for my depression/anxiety & blood-draws & meds. I use this program to keep me in the day & to remind me that I am just as far from a first drink leading to death as some others just starting the program.

My Brother came last week to see me, with a sober driver & he was drunk, he lives an eight hour drive away from me...he is 68 & I just turned 70. It breaks my heart to see my Brother the way he is now...he has had two heart attacks since he started detoxing off Meth with alcohol & is still drinking. He had two stints put in his heart when he had his second heart attack.

We have a 40 year old son that was in the Navy four years after highschool & he came home with a big drinking problem, depression/anxiety. In a few years he was losing one job after the other due to drinking on the job. Then in 2002 he got drunk while driving in the hills & drove over a 150 foot cliff & didn't die but is a quadriplegic now living in an Adult Home for People with Special Needs.

I feel so strong about what alcohol has done to my family and some people tend to disbelieve this. I was never addicted to drugs mainly because I was afraid of them. I did stay sober through having my babies & lucky that none were damaged by my alcoholism.

My thoughts & the Serenity Prayer is what helps me everyday. I wish you luck in finding someone to help you that might be a Specialist in Addictions.

kelsh

Ananda

OWW...hope to hear from you today.

You have a lot of support for you here.

:ghug3

Onewithwings

Kelsh, I am sorry about your son. That is really awful.

I have hope today that I CAN do this. I just have to get really honest with MYSELF. I can't pop a handful of these pills and a handful of those just because I think I won't get a real high from it. Why I do it, I do not know. I feel constantly compelled to take pills. And when I do get any sort of buzz, I feel I've screwed up anyway, so I might as well use. And the next day I think "ah, what's one more day? I'm going to do a lot today!" and overdose, call 911, and end up in a psychiatric unit for a week and a half. Right, so worth it.

Ananda

must be the weather or something...

My day started out scking...and i was not functioning well...though i did struggle through and do some things....

And i'm leaving for a meeting in 15 minites and actually am not like freaked out at having to face people....hope this lasts long enough to get through the meeting.

Doing the work for my sponsor, doing the daily stuff, a little bit of stuff i've put off....not exactlly productive..but not a total wash.

didn't burn supper although i didn't time it right so it's not done yet.

Stayed sober

just keep pluggin away OWW...i was thinking a few minites ago...something I heard...A winner's a looser who never stops trying.

I don't think sobriety has to be this way, but if we stay sober and keep putting the effort we can into recovery...just maybe things can become less constantly fearful and painful

Zencat

Hi One

One way I deal with the compulsions to use drugs is to make a list of all the negative emotions and consequences I will experience if I do pick up the first drug. As I write my list I become distracted away from the urge to use. As I continue to write, the urge begins to go away. Eventually as I have more and more clean time the urges to use become less frequent and intense.

Margee

Please my friends - Watch this 'you tube' closely.Turn it up and listen carefully. If you want to know more after watching it, I will direct you to the books - I have been studying this issue for a long time. Bill Wison got rejected from his own medical board for trying to promote this and so do I so I.

I will only tell those who are really interested - why some people continue to relaspe. They say iF Bill had lived another 10 years - this would have been in the Big Book!

It's NOT just about doing the steps and Bill W knew this! Although doing the steps is a very important part of the program. They have learned so much more in the last 50 years about addiction. Let me know what you think? I hope this helps at least one person and I'll be happy. Margee

YouTube - Dr Abram Hoffer

Onewithwings

Very interesting stuff! I will look into it more.

nandm

Margee, although your methods worked for you they do not cure a chemical depression. When body and brain chemicals are not at the right levels no amount of positive thinking is going to do much of anything for that depression. This I know from personal experience.

Addiction and depression are not the same thing. I am an alcohol as well as bipolar, chronic depression, anxiety, and PTSD. Positive thinking is not going to fix that. The Steps of AA are not going to fix anything but my alcoholism and since I have not drank in nearly 10 years and work the program of AA daily I do believe that the Steps help me treat my alcoholism. But they still do not relieve my other mental health issues. Those are caused by brain chemicals being out of wack.

Thank you for your advertisement but I will stick with what my doctor prescribes.