Drug of Choice- Signs?
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 786
Drug of Choice- Signs?
I know I can't expect answers, but I'm curious for signs in addicts that real people have seen with different drugs. I'm not diagnosing. I just feel that the known literature is not helpful enough. I've read the signs and looked at pics. I feel like I've been all over the internet. But what about the more subtle signs that we see? I believe my own "denial" may prevent me from interpreting these things clearly.
I'm in a potential court battle with my X and trying to determine my odds for him testing positive based on what he uses. I don't know his DOC. Could be multiple. He hid it very well, except for the fairly sudden onset of significant behavior and physical changes. I don't want to call out the drug use if I can't "prove it", as he will skillfully deny. He doesn't know I know.
What I saw:
Instantaneous mood swings
DARK angry episodes
Volatile irrational interpersonal behavior
At least some pain pill use (this is confirmed, concurrent with very high narc requirement in hospital), but I suspect more
Major facial changes over a year (always perfectly clear skin turned to constant acne- not scabs he picks at, but acne-looking and all over)
Black hairy tongue (sorry, but gross!!!! I didn't know this existed)
Sudden desire for sweet things every night (quart of ice cream, cookies), previously NEVER ate them for years
Weight loss
Jittery, can't stand still behavior that often accompanies irrational, sometimes paranoid conversations
Unprovoked physical aggression/threats out of context (even at work- before fired)
Loss of track of time, inability to recall actual things that are happening or happened (more than just gaslighting- serious lack of recall)
Days and weeks can disappear without him seeming to realize time is passing
When you look at it this way, it's hard to believe a court would let a guy like this spend time with kids. But I know how the game works.
Looking for any experiences on what you've seen, whether I'm off base in thinking there's more than pills, etc... let me reiterate, I only care to use it to protect my kids' welfare if I need to...not to get in his business. Thanks for anything you can share or point me to. I'm sorry if it's here already.
I'm in a potential court battle with my X and trying to determine my odds for him testing positive based on what he uses. I don't know his DOC. Could be multiple. He hid it very well, except for the fairly sudden onset of significant behavior and physical changes. I don't want to call out the drug use if I can't "prove it", as he will skillfully deny. He doesn't know I know.
What I saw:
Instantaneous mood swings
DARK angry episodes
Volatile irrational interpersonal behavior
At least some pain pill use (this is confirmed, concurrent with very high narc requirement in hospital), but I suspect more
Major facial changes over a year (always perfectly clear skin turned to constant acne- not scabs he picks at, but acne-looking and all over)
Black hairy tongue (sorry, but gross!!!! I didn't know this existed)
Sudden desire for sweet things every night (quart of ice cream, cookies), previously NEVER ate them for years
Weight loss
Jittery, can't stand still behavior that often accompanies irrational, sometimes paranoid conversations
Unprovoked physical aggression/threats out of context (even at work- before fired)
Loss of track of time, inability to recall actual things that are happening or happened (more than just gaslighting- serious lack of recall)
Days and weeks can disappear without him seeming to realize time is passing
When you look at it this way, it's hard to believe a court would let a guy like this spend time with kids. But I know how the game works.
Looking for any experiences on what you've seen, whether I'm off base in thinking there's more than pills, etc... let me reiterate, I only care to use it to protect my kids' welfare if I need to...not to get in his business. Thanks for anything you can share or point me to. I'm sorry if it's here already.
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: maryland
Posts: 86
well, I was completely oblivious to my husbands use for almost 2 years.
and then, it all kind of spiraled. his DOC was & still is oxycodone as well as Xanax and valium. his eyes are the size of pin points and red. his nose always runs - hes always sniffling. unprovoked mood swings and sudden unpredictable outbursts - absolutely.
forgets everything...and will ask me something an hour later that we already had an indepth conversation about. he actually eats more than he ever has, and has put ON weight even though I know a lot of people go the other direction while using.
just my experience. hope it helps.
and then, it all kind of spiraled. his DOC was & still is oxycodone as well as Xanax and valium. his eyes are the size of pin points and red. his nose always runs - hes always sniffling. unprovoked mood swings and sudden unpredictable outbursts - absolutely.
forgets everything...and will ask me something an hour later that we already had an indepth conversation about. he actually eats more than he ever has, and has put ON weight even though I know a lot of people go the other direction while using.
just my experience. hope it helps.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 123
It all sounds like drug use to me. My AHs is opiates as well as other pills and he has most of these signs that you mentioned besides a few. The loss of track of time is a huge one for him, plus the consumption of sweets, my husband can also stay up all night and still manage to go to work the next day, skin complexion has gotten worse and he picks at his face like a freak, weightloss, irritability, dark episodes, zoning out, dozing off out of nowhere are a signs that my AH has.
You can most definately request a drug test for a custody battle, the judge just may make you both drug test to be fair.
Good luck to you in this battle.
You can most definately request a drug test for a custody battle, the judge just may make you both drug test to be fair.
Good luck to you in this battle.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 93
The weightloss & sweet tooth both happened with my husband. I have no idea when the heroin addiction really took hold on him, but he's been doing pills for years and never had a sweet tooth. Its the exact same though as far as the insane amounts of ice cream & cookies. He also ate a TON of cereal. And was drinking a lot of water, or at least always had water with him, due to the dry mouth. Crying a lot-I didn't see most of it but my sis in law said he told her he would cry in the car coming home everyday. His personal hygiene was lacking compared to what it had been, but he was also doing the face-picking. He was cleaning his face like a crazy person.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
it can, certainly! when you're up for 2,3,4 days and you don't eat, and you don't bathe, and you are usually locked inside with no fresh air, crawling around carpet farming, you tend to get a tad unclean, inside and out!
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
i had NO idea!
Certain lifestyle habits and conditions can make people more likely to develop black hairy tongue. They include:
poor oral hygiene
smoking tobacco
drinking a lot of coffee or tea
using antibiotics (which may disrupt the normal balance of bacteria in the mouth)
being dehydrated
taking medications that contain the chemical bismuth (such as Pepto-Bismol for upset stomach)
not producing enough saliva
regularly using mouthwash that contains peroxide, witch hazel, or menthol
getting radiation therapy to the head and neck
Black hairy tongue is more common in men, people who use intravenous drugs, and those who are HIV-positive.
Certain lifestyle habits and conditions can make people more likely to develop black hairy tongue. They include:
poor oral hygiene
smoking tobacco
drinking a lot of coffee or tea
using antibiotics (which may disrupt the normal balance of bacteria in the mouth)
being dehydrated
taking medications that contain the chemical bismuth (such as Pepto-Bismol for upset stomach)
not producing enough saliva
regularly using mouthwash that contains peroxide, witch hazel, or menthol
getting radiation therapy to the head and neck
Black hairy tongue is more common in men, people who use intravenous drugs, and those who are HIV-positive.
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Black Hairy Tongue!!! That's a new one I have never heard...gross...(sorry). Learn something new every day.
My AH mixes booze w/Xanax.
Slurring, but only just a little. Never alot. Just a slight change.
Holds posture much more upright and folds his hands when he sits there (weird right, but he ALWAYS does this if he has been drinking, and only then).
Goes from being a relatively quiet guy to being very talkative
Odd trips to the garage
Farts (gross)!
Goes from very friendly to a complete jerk in 5 seconds
Little $2 and $3 debit card purchases at gas stations (those huge beers are cheap)...he carries no cash, this is his choice.
Snores more
legs twitch when he sleeps
That is what I can think of off the top of my head. I am sorry for what brings you here.
XXX
My AH mixes booze w/Xanax.
Slurring, but only just a little. Never alot. Just a slight change.
Holds posture much more upright and folds his hands when he sits there (weird right, but he ALWAYS does this if he has been drinking, and only then).
Goes from being a relatively quiet guy to being very talkative
Odd trips to the garage
Farts (gross)!
Goes from very friendly to a complete jerk in 5 seconds
Little $2 and $3 debit card purchases at gas stations (those huge beers are cheap)...he carries no cash, this is his choice.
Snores more
legs twitch when he sleeps
That is what I can think of off the top of my head. I am sorry for what brings you here.
XXX
Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 1,698
Hi, this sounds remarkably like manic meth use. My son (ormer meth user) described paranoia, seeing things, believing his life was in imminent danger, he had horrible mood swings, weight loss and his entire personality had changed. Not sure about losing time, but I do know as a former meth user (before it got as pure as it is now) that I could get lost in the tweaking zone for hours on end all night long as that is the way meth affects the brain. I have heard of meth addicts also going completely bonkers while high after not sleeping for days on end.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: WA
Posts: 124
Heroin and meth are my daughter's...
I always suspect meth with the following:
extreme weight loss
scaby face - she will pick till they are deep and bloody
jittery
very little sleep
manic movements (especially after a few days awake - HORRIBLE flailing)
slurring words
"hard" facial look - scowling or moving her mouth weird
she's lost all but about 3 teeth...her beautiful smile is completely gone
Heroin, she's been doing for longer, at first it was:
extreme sleepiness, nodding off instantly if she sat still
would jerk when asleep, sometimes violently, mostly little quick movements
unable to manage time
sugar-a-HOLIC, oh my gosh
she was mostly calm and agreeable, until she started withdrawals and then manic, panicky, and super agitated.
LYING non-stop. Absolutely about everything, doesn't matter what.
Now that she's several years into heroin use she is actually "normal" when actively using. You wouldn't know it at all. It's when she's withdrawing that she turns into an obsessed junkie trying everything to get another fix.
I always suspect meth with the following:
extreme weight loss
scaby face - she will pick till they are deep and bloody
jittery
very little sleep
manic movements (especially after a few days awake - HORRIBLE flailing)
slurring words
"hard" facial look - scowling or moving her mouth weird
she's lost all but about 3 teeth...her beautiful smile is completely gone
Heroin, she's been doing for longer, at first it was:
extreme sleepiness, nodding off instantly if she sat still
would jerk when asleep, sometimes violently, mostly little quick movements
unable to manage time
sugar-a-HOLIC, oh my gosh
she was mostly calm and agreeable, until she started withdrawals and then manic, panicky, and super agitated.
LYING non-stop. Absolutely about everything, doesn't matter what.
Now that she's several years into heroin use she is actually "normal" when actively using. You wouldn't know it at all. It's when she's withdrawing that she turns into an obsessed junkie trying everything to get another fix.
Drug Addiction Has No Mercy
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Milwaukie Oregon
Posts: 875
Originally Posted by Praying 
Instantaneous mood swings
DARK angry episodes
Volatile irrational interpersonal behavior
At least some pain pill use (this is confirmed, concurrent with very high narc requirement in hospital), but I suspect more
Major facial changes over a year (always perfectly clear skin turned to constant acne- not scabs he picks at, but acne-looking and all over)
Black hairy tongue (sorry, but gross!!!! I didn't know this existed)
Sudden desire for sweet things every night (quart of ice cream, cookies), previously NEVER ate them for years
Weight loss
Jittery, can't stand still behavior that often accompanies irrational, sometimes paranoid conversations
Unprovoked physical aggression/threats out of context (even at work- before fired)
Loss of track of time, inability to recall actual things that are happening or happened (more than just gaslighting- serious lack of recall)
Days and weeks can disappear without him seeming to realize time is passing.
Sounds like crystal meth to me.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 786
Thanks all. I decided he's doing all of it 
But I definitely don't think I'm crazy that there's something more than the alcohol and pills.
I did forget to mention the CRYING. He was SO teary for months, but couldn't show any real emotion in conversation or interaction. Even though he was emotionally completely cold and absent, I assumed maybe the crying was emotion over the divorce or his desire to leave.
He's had jerky movements in bed for a long time, but they did get very pronounced near the end when we were still together (18 mths ago)
Interestingly, in hindsight, whenever he was GONE and I'd call him, he was very calm, mellow, sleepy, slurry, and pleasant. Confusingly nice. But only then. I haven't spoken to him in almost a year, so I don't know how that is now.
He has always been SUPER concerned with his appearance. I have a hard time believing he'd let his hygiene go. But let's be honest here, I have a hard time believing a lot of things.
I haven't seen him since last summer, and I kept my distance so couldn't really tell how he looked. (I didn't "know" about the drugs then.) My boys said when they were there a few months ago his face was still horribly broken out, he was still eating sweets like crazy (a whole pie at 9pm every night, etc), and he was SO mellow--just laid around all the time and did NOTHING. But he wasn't angry or agitated. (He never used to be able to sit still, so this is an odd behavior in their eyes and unnerved them a bit, but they were very glad he wasn't angry.)
LOL at your comments on black hairy tongue. I believed the "from coffee" explanation and started scraping my own tongue like nobody's business so I didn't get it. Talked to a friend in health care who said...it's never from that. It's always something else behind the scenes affecting the body. Smoking crack, meth, or heroin are common reasons, as is IV drug use due to the same reason as HIV- immuno compromisation.
I vary between thinking it's heroin and meth/crack or coke. He hated needles when I knew him, but loves to smoke things. Eventually I know the needle fear wouldn't matter if he wanted the high bad enough.
Can I admit something horrible? I "hope" it's heroin because it's harder to sneak through a drug test with optimal timing. Meth seems easier to test clean from. And I know that's not a very nice thing to say...but at this point his spiral is going to happen and all I care about is keeping my kids safe.
I'm really, really afraid if I had him tested that he'd show up clean and the courts would say I'm defaming him.
My own test would show a massive diet coke addiction, lol! I'm working on that one way down the road.
But I definitely don't think I'm crazy that there's something more than the alcohol and pills.
I did forget to mention the CRYING. He was SO teary for months, but couldn't show any real emotion in conversation or interaction. Even though he was emotionally completely cold and absent, I assumed maybe the crying was emotion over the divorce or his desire to leave.
He's had jerky movements in bed for a long time, but they did get very pronounced near the end when we were still together (18 mths ago)
Interestingly, in hindsight, whenever he was GONE and I'd call him, he was very calm, mellow, sleepy, slurry, and pleasant. Confusingly nice. But only then. I haven't spoken to him in almost a year, so I don't know how that is now.
He has always been SUPER concerned with his appearance. I have a hard time believing he'd let his hygiene go. But let's be honest here, I have a hard time believing a lot of things.
I haven't seen him since last summer, and I kept my distance so couldn't really tell how he looked. (I didn't "know" about the drugs then.) My boys said when they were there a few months ago his face was still horribly broken out, he was still eating sweets like crazy (a whole pie at 9pm every night, etc), and he was SO mellow--just laid around all the time and did NOTHING. But he wasn't angry or agitated. (He never used to be able to sit still, so this is an odd behavior in their eyes and unnerved them a bit, but they were very glad he wasn't angry.)
LOL at your comments on black hairy tongue. I believed the "from coffee" explanation and started scraping my own tongue like nobody's business so I didn't get it. Talked to a friend in health care who said...it's never from that. It's always something else behind the scenes affecting the body. Smoking crack, meth, or heroin are common reasons, as is IV drug use due to the same reason as HIV- immuno compromisation.
I vary between thinking it's heroin and meth/crack or coke. He hated needles when I knew him, but loves to smoke things. Eventually I know the needle fear wouldn't matter if he wanted the high bad enough.
Can I admit something horrible? I "hope" it's heroin because it's harder to sneak through a drug test with optimal timing. Meth seems easier to test clean from. And I know that's not a very nice thing to say...but at this point his spiral is going to happen and all I care about is keeping my kids safe.
I'm really, really afraid if I had him tested that he'd show up clean and the courts would say I'm defaming him.
My own test would show a massive diet coke addiction, lol! I'm working on that one way down the road.
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
My husbands DOC was pills.....lots of them. He has now added alcohol.....lots of it.
When he was using pills he was mellow, yet irritable too.
He was irrational.
Lost time.
Terrible memory.
Went to be early and slept hard.
He would sweat a lot during the night. That was always a dead give away.
Very selfish
Cheap about money (which he normally wasn't )
This one is weird, but true. His upper lip got thinner or different.
And be had 2 expressions that he always used while in active addiction but didn't realize it but I did. lol...He would say "simple as that" and "that's the way it is." Huge triggers for me.
When he was using pills he was mellow, yet irritable too.
He was irrational.
Lost time.
Terrible memory.
Went to be early and slept hard.
He would sweat a lot during the night. That was always a dead give away.
Very selfish
Cheap about money (which he normally wasn't )
This one is weird, but true. His upper lip got thinner or different.
And be had 2 expressions that he always used while in active addiction but didn't realize it but I did. lol...He would say "simple as that" and "that's the way it is." Huge triggers for me.
Nature Girl
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: By The Lake
Posts: 60,328
LMN, my son used crack and meth and he too had certain phrases that gave him away..."this and that" and "maybe shoulda"...as in "maybe shoulda called my sponsor" He never used those expressions when he wasn't using. I forgot about that and it strikes me as very weird.
Getting there!!
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 5,750
Originally Posted by Ann
LMN, my son used crack and meth and he too had certain phrases that gave him away..."this and that" and "maybe shoulda"...as in "maybe shoulda called my sponsor" He never used those expressions when he wasn't using. I forgot about that and it strikes me as very weird.
I even told him he had certain expressions that were a dead give away but he thought I was just making it up.
Funny, in a sick kind of way, I told him about his upper lip many times. One time, I told him...I know you're using because of your upper lip. He said "no way, I just looked at it and it was fine." I said "hmmm.....why would you look at it, if you weren't using." He was speechless.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 864
Black Hairy tongue? Well that is a new one for me too. Now this something I don’t ever want to see.
As you write your second post Praying I think opiates more.
Alcoholics and opiate addicts are sugar fiends… Although my husband ate awesome using, the sugar thing came in recovery.
Alcohol, can be a very volatile drug, I think at times some miss that when looking at the outbursts and severe mood swings.
I also see opiates in pill form as more moody, irritable and aggressive than heroin. I have been wondering if the pills with Tylenol in them contribute to some of the moody, angry type behavior.
Crying, heroin …
And the acne, opiates in general, bet it wasn’t only on his face … staph infections, folliculitis and even shingles are common with opiate addiction.
Hated needles … my husband loathes needles, I never kinda got what the big deal was. It took a while to realize that hate isn’t what we think in terms of normal, people just with that fear of them. For my husband is was more lust, more a I can’t stand seeing a needle unless it is filled with heroin.
Twitching too, at one point I wondered if he had Parkinson’s because he shook so damn much….and at night the twitching and the leg kicks but then he was using so much heroin he was in wd every morning when he woke up.
As I write this I think, omg what insanity it all was.
I am not sure you really have to know the drug of choice. If he is using then he is. Hopefully he will show exactly who and what he is and you will have no worries.
Make sure you keep detailed records of anything that you think will lend to his character and ability to see and take care of the children.
As you write your second post Praying I think opiates more.
Alcoholics and opiate addicts are sugar fiends… Although my husband ate awesome using, the sugar thing came in recovery.
Alcohol, can be a very volatile drug, I think at times some miss that when looking at the outbursts and severe mood swings.
I also see opiates in pill form as more moody, irritable and aggressive than heroin. I have been wondering if the pills with Tylenol in them contribute to some of the moody, angry type behavior.
Crying, heroin …
And the acne, opiates in general, bet it wasn’t only on his face … staph infections, folliculitis and even shingles are common with opiate addiction.
Hated needles … my husband loathes needles, I never kinda got what the big deal was. It took a while to realize that hate isn’t what we think in terms of normal, people just with that fear of them. For my husband is was more lust, more a I can’t stand seeing a needle unless it is filled with heroin.
Twitching too, at one point I wondered if he had Parkinson’s because he shook so damn much….and at night the twitching and the leg kicks but then he was using so much heroin he was in wd every morning when he woke up.
As I write this I think, omg what insanity it all was.
I am not sure you really have to know the drug of choice. If he is using then he is. Hopefully he will show exactly who and what he is and you will have no worries.
Make sure you keep detailed records of anything that you think will lend to his character and ability to see and take care of the children.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by YouWillBe
Now that she's several years into heroin use she is actually "normal" when actively using. You wouldn't know it at all. It's when she's withdrawing that she turns into an obsessed junkie trying everything to get another fix.
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