equus

This might be a load of rubbish - it's only a point of view, something I think which might explain why it's sometimes hard to see the other persons perspective.

If you asked me to sum up the difference between myths and knowledge, I would say that:
*With myths the natural state is for questions to lead to answers.
*With knowledge the natural state is for answers to lead to questions.

I think each of us has our own natural leaning, our own tendency, and our own place of comfort. For me it's with answers leading to questions. When I try to put myself in the black and white of answered questions - it's like a slug sat in salt, eventually I question or shrivel! For others when they are asked to question their answers they also seem a little like a slug in salt - eventually refusing to defer course from the answer and shutting down the possibilities of questions.

As a believer in evolution, and social evolution, I think that both kinds of people are needed to hold us together, otherwise one kind would have died out and plainly neither has.

I've written this honestly - which means it has a bias, but it occurs to me that this is a bias we all have, whatever our side. On so many issues we can discipline ourselves to see another's point of view and yet I'm sure I've seen this one difference create the biggest flame wars on forums, the biggest rows between people and the most upset of anything.

I can't help but wonder if it really is the case that 'Never the twain shall meet'? But I hope not as I'm so sure both are needed, and both need to find the place for their natural comfort.

minnie

Aha! Now that might be why I have trouble understanding your posts sometimes! Because I tend towards questions leading to answers. That's not to say that I don't then question my answers. I think that's why I enjoyed counselling so much, because someone else was asking me questions that I needed to find answers to.

equus

I sometimes answer my qestions too, but it's never long before that takes me to even more questions.

Do you think that made sense then? I only really thought about it this morning but it's making so much sense to me. I could be just plain talking bilge though!

Rose56

GM Equus,
I think you have a point here. Hubby is so sure of himself, he makes these declarations about how things are and doesn't consider that he might be wrong. I am always questioning myself, considering other positions and information. Both ways of thinking have their pros and cons, but it sure makes it difficult for us to communicate. Its kind of funny, often I am so sure that his way of thinking or processing information is wrong, that I end up thinking just like him and not considering the possibility that he is right!!! Catch - 22. We humans are funny creatures, God definately has a sense of humor.

splendra

equus-

I have always asked lots of questions. Sometimes in asking questions I have experienced ridicule and also have experienced ridicule when stating answers that worked for me. I am an outspoken person I realize that I could be more laid back and not express my view. If I can't take the heat I need to get out of the kitchen if I do not want any critisizim then I need to keep my mouth shut.

We all have our bias and filters that keep us sometimes stuck or help us to be free.
I can stir myth and knowledge together and make myself a nice cake if the chunks don't blend then I can always spit them out and examine them or throw them out....

I do not accept ideas just because a person with a degree wants to prove themselves right. I am exceptionly leary of anything to do with modern medicine because in my opinion advances in modern medicine is much more about money than it is about healing....

gelfling

Very interesting post and I'm still trying to figure out which I group I would fit into most comfortably. I do love getting answers, especially going through the process of obtaining them, but I don't stop there because once I gain the knowledge, I continue seeking and asking. Is there a middle group somewhere? Or is this a trick question?

equus

Splendra,

I think both types of people are found both with and without education or degrees. My husband is a questioner and has a far greater mind than mine - but no degree. I also think both types are found inside and outside of all sciences - including medicine. Myths can easily be made from science, just as science can originate from myth.

My point was only that I think we have our own individual states of peace. I'm least peaceful and serene when being asked to believe and most serene while someone offers evidence and invites questioning. I'm only suggesting that the same might be true for those who need their solid answers - I can't know that's the case but they do seem to respond with an equal level of discomfort.

I think sometimes we all get forced into the wrong hole for us and that's when our own discomfort tells us to move.

You know the saying 'Square peg in a round hole'? I'm just wondering if this is the crux of that saying.

equus

At the moment it's just a thought - obviously one that led you to ask a question.... *giggles*

GettingBy

Hmmm... good food for thought.....

I don't think that most people stay in one position all the time. I know for me, I believe that it, like most things in life, is a cycle. In general, I start out in the myth state, which I believe most humans do. I start out like that because I don't understand enough to have knowledge, yet. So I ask questions... trying to get some elementary level of understanding. As I learn, I become able to pick the knowledge apart, and look at it from other view points. This, like you pointed out, results in more questions and then answers, and then ultimately a deeper understand and greater knowledge. At some point, I am usually satisfied that I understand something well enough and the cycle of questions and answers can end. I believe the end of the cycle is different for everyone.

Alcoholism has been that way for me. I had no clue what I was up against when I first started out, so I went to Al-anon and came here. I started asking questions, and I learned. The more I learned, the more I realized I had a long road ahead of me. So which each question, a new answer, and then more questions. Some I can answer, some I need some insight from others. I ask them here because I'm smart enough to know that someone here has been where I'm at, and they may have a view point that I just can't see right now. As for the cycle of learning about alcoholism, I don't know where it will end for me... or what questions it will lead me to. I know that right now it has directed me to start really looking at me and questioning myself, so I'm pretty gratiful for that.

Good topic, Equus.

equus

I think it's about which place is most comfortable, question and answers exists regardless of which ultimately tends to start or finish the process. For me the opening of new questions is most comfortable, getting an answer is fun largely because it opens a new set of questions. Where as I THINK for some people the questions are dealt with in order to find their place of peace - the answers.

I suppose the difference might lie in whether we seek 'an' answer of 'the' answer.

That's why I felt this was relevent here. We do make our journeys in different ways and everyone here is seeking to learn from others as well as offer stuff where they can. If there's anything at all in this it would matter here.

minnie

I think I seek "my" answer and it might be "an" answer or even "the" answer. I feel uncomfortable without reaching some sort of conclusion, as GB says, I need the cycle to end somewhere. That doesn't mean to say that I am then closed minded if more information crops up in the future, just that can let it go until then.

GettingBy

If the person is satisfied with the answers, then I do believe they become a source of peace and contentment. I know for me (like you) finding answers tends to lead to more questions but that's a pretty generalized statement.

I think a good example for me is with math. I believe most people are content to know how to add, subtract, multiple and divide. For me (being a dorky engineer), I had a quest to understand more... loved trigonometry and calculus, but that's pretty much where it ended for me. I was satisfied with that level of understanding. Is that all there is to know about math, absoluletly not. But I'm content to end with the answers I've got, and not ask anymore questions. Same goes with Chemistry, I can't even count the number of courses I've taken, but I did get to a point where I felt I had learned enough and no longer needed to keep working towards a PhD. Several people I know kept going, and they know things that just blow my mind... but I'm content with myself and am comfortable saying, "I don't understand that, and that's okay!"

Even though I've reached contentment in those few areas, I didn't stop asking questions about other stuff. I'm always asking questions because I love to learn. I like to understand how things work. How and Why are two of my favorite words.

Maybe there are some people who are satisfied with not knowing... but I believe that every human being, to some extent, likes to learn and grow. I think it is human nature to be in a state of continuous evolution. The rate of evolution may increase or decrease (or remain constant), but I believe we are all changing, learning and growing. Each new experience or encounter presents a learning opportunity. What's the expression, "You learn something new every day?"

So what did I learn today? Hmmm..... I don't know yet... I'll get back to you!
Shannon

CarolD

You ask..I answer from my ESH.

I am a problem solver.

My more fulfilling relationships have been with men who were pleased for me to make decisions.

Interesting...Thanks!

GettingBy

LOL! I just had a funny thought... which has lead me to some insight into myself!!

I kept re-reading the thread and something was making me uneasy, but I didn't know what. I kept feeling the need to argue MY point of view. I didn't feel like I had to be right, but I also couldn't understand why I couldn't "let it go!" LOL! After reading it again... it dawned on me. I don't like the word MYTH. That word, to me, brings the following conotation: "false, untrue, unfounded." I don't think that asking questions and being at peace with an answer equates to MYTH. Just like I don't think that someone (like me!!) who finds peace in an answer is settling for a "myth"... maybe it's not the whole truth, but that doesn't make it a myth either... just a partial truth! LOL!

I guess for me, I've found contentment in knowing that I'll never know all there is to know (though for a long time I thought I already did know it all!! LOL!). I just don't want to even think that I may be settling for myths.... but maybe I am! Dang!

Again... I love challenging conversations that force me to questions my own ideas! Thanks again Equus!!

equus

Gettingby,

I find that my answers lie on a sliding scale - those that 'will do', those 'I like', those 'I love' and 'my favourites'. I enjoy them but largely because they lead me into deeper questions, sometimes in different directions.

I agree we all want to learn and grow and I think we all do - regardless of whether we prefere the questions or answers. I can't ever hold enough 'facts' to be worth anything but I can learn how to question 'facts', I can learn better reasoning.

I think maybe the comfort comes from whether we learn best from answers or whether we learn best from questioning, I think that may be the case because I'm certain you're right to say we all want to grow and learn.

Carol - that leaves me with a question. What is ESH?

minnie

GettingBy - I hear you!! I prickled at that word too.

equus

Some myths are true!!

I used the word from my own slant - but I knew it was biased, you know that feeling when you're aware you're not objective but don't know how to be? I tried to excuse my bias away as honesty because I didn't know how else to write it!!

Please don't be offended - I still think we need both ways to make a world or one would have died out.

equus

[QUOTE]myth ( P ) Pronunciation Key (mth)
n.

1. A traditional, typically ancient story dealing with supernatural beings, ancestors, or heroes that serves as a fundamental type in the worldview of a people, as by explaining aspects of the natural world or delineating the psychology, customs, or ideals of society: the myth of Eros and Psyche; a creation myth.
Such stories considered as a group: the realm of myth.
2. A popular belief or story that has become associated with a person, institution, or occurrence, especially one considered to illustrate a cultural ideal: a star whose fame turned her into a myth; the pioneer myth of suburbia.
3. A fiction or half-truth, especially one that forms part of an ideology.
4. A fictitious story, person, or thing: “German artillery superiority on the Western Front was a myth” (Leon Wolff).

Edit - I should have looked the word up first!! I think I meant it more as stuff people tell you to believe as true.

Please accept my apologies....

GettingBy

Absolutely no offense taken!!! My reaction to the word "myth" wasn't one of offense, it was just unease. It was up to me to figure out why! Ultimately it comes back to me not liking being wrong and not having all the answers!! That's where the insight came for me! It's a bit of irony because all of your answers led me to more questions!! LOL!


Absolutely! And some are not! And again, one of my biggest fears is that I've settled on an answer that is wrong/false! It's that whole black & white thinking that's getting me in trouble! I love right and wrong... and have a hard time handling anything in between!

GettingBy

[QUOTE=equus] No apologies needed... I like where the first definition is going. Maybe for me, the better way to look at it is:

A myth is something that can't be fully explained (especially something like a super-natural phenomenon) but may beg for further exploration and understanding. Maybe it's something that can't be explained and just has to be accepted as is (thus the question is the answer!?!?!?).