A Cautionary Tale...
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Join Date: Nov 2013
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And you owe it in fairness to yourself. He sure isn't being "fair". Usually self-centered, selfish, manipulating control freaks easily become alcoholics. It's easy, all those characteristics are already there. Just bc he's taken away the alcohol for 6 months doesn't mean those characters flaws will go away too. He'll probably try and shame you and manipulate how you aren't a supportive wife during HIS recovery next, so watch out for that manipulation. And I'm glad you're back here on SR for support for YOU as you step off the crazy train!
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Join Date: Jul 2015
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Originally Posted by Refiner 
He'll probably try and shame you and manipulate how you aren't a supportive wife during HIS recovery next, so watch out for that manipulation. And I'm glad you're back here on SR for support for YOU as you step off the crazy train!
My husband viewed the crazy train comment as a veiled threat. It's not a threat. We promised the marriage counselor we would work on the marriage for the next six months to one year. And, I will do it. I simply choose to do it with my sanity intact.
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Holdonloosely......It is hard to read your post.....because I can "feel" his sexism and condescending attitude toward you. He obviously has a double standard---one for him and another for you.
You are his equal....not his property....
If your counselor doesn't pick up on this....It would make the hair o n the back of my neck stand u p......!!
dandylion
He, himself had been watching PORN!!! How come he "gets" to look a naked women....but you can't supposed to speak to someone with a male name---in a therapeutic relationship?
Grrrr.....
I wonder....is the counselor a male or female?
You are his equal....not his property....
If your counselor doesn't pick up on this....It would make the hair o n the back of my neck stand u p......!!
dandylion
He, himself had been watching PORN!!! How come he "gets" to look a naked women....but you can't supposed to speak to someone with a male name---in a therapeutic relationship?
Grrrr.....
I wonder....is the counselor a male or female?
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
Ok - a little off the beaten path.
Could it be possible your husband has had an affair, or a dalliance? I ask because his projections and actions are as if you were cheating on him, when you haven't been (I assume) and he has no reason to think that. IME when a spouse or partner become consumed with jealousy and start up with these kinds of bizarre actions sometimes it could be because of what they are doing, not what you are doing.
Projection.
Could it be possible your husband has had an affair, or a dalliance? I ask because his projections and actions are as if you were cheating on him, when you haven't been (I assume) and he has no reason to think that. IME when a spouse or partner become consumed with jealousy and start up with these kinds of bizarre actions sometimes it could be because of what they are doing, not what you are doing.
Projection.
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Join Date: Jul 2015
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Originally Posted by redatlanta
Ok - a little off the beaten path.
Could it be possible your husband has had an affair, or a dalliance? I ask because his projections and actions are as if you were cheating on him, when you haven't been (I assume) and he has no reason to think that. IME when a spouse or partner become consumed with jealousy and start up with these kinds of bizarre actions sometimes it could be because of what they are doing, not what you are doing.
Projection.
Could it be possible your husband has had an affair, or a dalliance? I ask because his projections and actions are as if you were cheating on him, when you haven't been (I assume) and he has no reason to think that. IME when a spouse or partner become consumed with jealousy and start up with these kinds of bizarre actions sometimes it could be because of what they are doing, not what you are doing.
Projection.
There is certainly nothing going on my end. I have been completely faithful.
I think this has more to do with me standing up for myself and standing firm in what I believe is true. The last six months have been quite a journey for me regarding my own knowledge and strength.
The discovery of pornography (which supposedly ceased) finally made me stop and take a closer look at the marriage. I have set boundaries and stood my ground on a number of fronts and continue to do so. It's been an uphill battle.
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Join Date: Jul 2015
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Originally Posted by dandylion
Holdonloosely......It is hard to read your post.....because I can "feel" his sexism and condescending attitude toward you. He obviously has a double standard---one for him and another for you.
You are his equal....not his property....
If your counselor doesn't pick up on this....It would make the hair o n the back of my neck stand u p......!!
dandylion
He, himself had been watching PORN!!! How come he "gets" to look a naked women....but you can't supposed to speak to someone with a male name---in a therapeutic relationship?
Grrrr.....
I wonder....is the counselor a male or female?
You are his equal....not his property....
If your counselor doesn't pick up on this....It would make the hair o n the back of my neck stand u p......!!
dandylion
He, himself had been watching PORN!!! How come he "gets" to look a naked women....but you can't supposed to speak to someone with a male name---in a therapeutic relationship?
Grrrr.....
I wonder....is the counselor a male or female?
I have to go away this weekend so I don't have time to write. I'll come back to your post next week.
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
IMO the porn is not something that just "stops". Much like the drinking for alkies. And if he "fessed" to it and minimized it, it's always SO much more (why yes officer, I only had a couple). I hope you have your eyes and ears wide open for your sake.
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Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,872
^^ I agree with refiner. 100%. My ex admitted to watching porn while I was pregnant-this from a guy that said porn was dispicable and dirty and was like cheating on your spouse. Yep. After admitting it I shared how I felt (disgusted, cheated on, dirty, angry) and he told me he would t have done it if he was getting laid more. Yep-I'm to blame. Classic alcoholic stuff. The longer they drink the lower their morals seem to sink as well.
Keep your eyes wife open and trust God to reveal the truth in His time-He will! Peace to you!
Keep your eyes wife open and trust God to reveal the truth in His time-He will! Peace to you!
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 246
I debated: should I add a post to my thread and have it surface to the top again or let it fade away to where all other threads eventually go? Decision made.
I had a chance to reread the thread. I want to thank you for your responses. I started the thread to caution others. It became apparent to me I needed support too. The thread took a few unexpected twists and turns. I think the thread got a little away from me, and I would like to take this opportunity to try to bring it closer to what I view is the truth.
There is no abuse, sexism, condescension or projection. The invasion of privacy and other destructive behaviors have more to do with his insecurities, subtle control/manipulation, shame, guilt and desperation. I might even throw in arrogance.
My husband has become a less confident man from the man I used to know. His confidence has taken a hit in the last year or two. Add to that, mortification from following in his father’s footsteps: moderate drinking to alcoholism…all the family warning signs (alcoholism on both sides of his family) and he let it happen anyway. And, pornography - completely self-inflicted again – just deepened the shame.
He feels unworthy of my love. He wants so desperately to move forward and rebuild the marriage and not lose me. He admitted he’s mystified why – if a marriage needs to be built/rebuilt – I’d choose to rebuild with him. He also admitted that he let that desperation get the upper hand (invasion of my privacy). And, it’s not lost on him the irony behind the potential self-fulfilling prophecy: he fears there’s no reason for me to stay, then he does something to give me another reason not to. So far, his path to recovery hasn’t been a walk in the park. He attends AA and individual therapy once a week.
For myself, I sought individual therapy, Sober Recovery and the kind individual for knowledge and support to better understand the basics of alcoholism and addiction. It strengthened me. I prepared and protected myself and set boundaries. I concluded I was not powerless and have choices. I chose not to live with alcoholism and pornography. And, I approached the recovery period and moving forward with caution and thoughtfulness.
He sensed it, and it concerned him. Many months ago, I had told him I used an online support group (SR). Please no eye rolling. In hindsight, I shouldn’t have told him, but I wanted to be upfront and honest. A mistake. So, close to two weeks ago, he installed the keylogging software to track me to determine what had “influenced” me to be cautious and careful. Now you can roll your eyes. I am still SIMMERING over this. I'll stop here or I might write something I will later regret (long after the edit option is gone).
Somewhere buried within him is the wonderful man I used to know and love. I hope he’ll succeed in his recovery for himself and his family. Time will tell… But, I am not so foolish as I once was.
Anyway, I think this post comes closer to the truth. In the meantime, please remember to be careful regarding your privacy.
I had a chance to reread the thread. I want to thank you for your responses. I started the thread to caution others. It became apparent to me I needed support too. The thread took a few unexpected twists and turns. I think the thread got a little away from me, and I would like to take this opportunity to try to bring it closer to what I view is the truth.
There is no abuse, sexism, condescension or projection. The invasion of privacy and other destructive behaviors have more to do with his insecurities, subtle control/manipulation, shame, guilt and desperation. I might even throw in arrogance.
My husband has become a less confident man from the man I used to know. His confidence has taken a hit in the last year or two. Add to that, mortification from following in his father’s footsteps: moderate drinking to alcoholism…all the family warning signs (alcoholism on both sides of his family) and he let it happen anyway. And, pornography - completely self-inflicted again – just deepened the shame.
He feels unworthy of my love. He wants so desperately to move forward and rebuild the marriage and not lose me. He admitted he’s mystified why – if a marriage needs to be built/rebuilt – I’d choose to rebuild with him. He also admitted that he let that desperation get the upper hand (invasion of my privacy). And, it’s not lost on him the irony behind the potential self-fulfilling prophecy: he fears there’s no reason for me to stay, then he does something to give me another reason not to. So far, his path to recovery hasn’t been a walk in the park. He attends AA and individual therapy once a week.
For myself, I sought individual therapy, Sober Recovery and the kind individual for knowledge and support to better understand the basics of alcoholism and addiction. It strengthened me. I prepared and protected myself and set boundaries. I concluded I was not powerless and have choices. I chose not to live with alcoholism and pornography. And, I approached the recovery period and moving forward with caution and thoughtfulness.
He sensed it, and it concerned him. Many months ago, I had told him I used an online support group (SR). Please no eye rolling. In hindsight, I shouldn’t have told him, but I wanted to be upfront and honest. A mistake. So, close to two weeks ago, he installed the keylogging software to track me to determine what had “influenced” me to be cautious and careful. Now you can roll your eyes. I am still SIMMERING over this. I'll stop here or I might write something I will later regret (long after the edit option is gone).
Somewhere buried within him is the wonderful man I used to know and love. I hope he’ll succeed in his recovery for himself and his family. Time will tell… But, I am not so foolish as I once was.
Anyway, I think this post comes closer to the truth. In the meantime, please remember to be careful regarding your privacy.
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Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: South Jersey
Posts: 16,633
No, it was a good reminder. Regardless of the purity of motive, invasions of privacy like this are scary and upsetting. That's why there are laws against stalking--even if the stalker subjectively intends no harm, it makes the victim feel threatened--it's creepy to have ANYONE watching your every move after you reach adulthood.
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Join Date: Jul 2015
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Originally Posted by LexieCat
Regardless of the purity of motive, invasions of privacy like this are scary and upsetting. That's why there are laws against stalking--even if the stalker subjectively intends no harm, it makes the victim feel threatened--it's creepy to have ANYONE watching your every move after you reach adulthood.
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: USA
Posts: 2,393
Originally Posted by HoldOnLoosely
I debated: should I add a post to my thread and have it surface to the top again or let it fade away to where all other threads eventually go? Decision made.
I had a chance to reread the thread. I want to thank you for your responses. I started the thread to caution others. It became apparent to me I needed support too. The thread took a few unexpected twists and turns. I think the thread got a little away from me, and I would like to take this opportunity to try to bring it closer to what I view is the truth.
There is no abuse, sexism, condescension or projection. The invasion of privacy and other destructive behaviors have more to do with his insecurities, subtle control/manipulation, shame, guilt and desperation. I might even throw in arrogance.
My husband has become a less confident man from the man I used to know. His confidence has taken a hit in the last year or two. Add to that, mortification from following in his father’s footsteps: moderate drinking to alcoholism…all the family warning signs (alcoholism on both sides of his family) and he let it happen anyway. And, pornography - completely self-inflicted again – just deepened the shame.
He feels unworthy of my love. He wants so desperately to move forward and rebuild the marriage and not lose me. He admitted he’s mystified why – if a marriage needs to be built/rebuilt – I’d choose to rebuild with him. He also admitted that he let that desperation get the upper hand (invasion of my privacy). And, it’s not lost on him the irony behind the potential self-fulfilling prophecy: he fears there’s no reason for me to stay, then he does something to give me another reason not to. So far, his path to recovery hasn’t been a walk in the park. He attends AA and individual therapy once a week.
For myself, I sought individual therapy, Sober Recovery and the kind individual for knowledge and support to better understand the basics of alcoholism and addiction. It strengthened me. I prepared and protected myself and set boundaries. I concluded I was not powerless and have choices. I chose not to live with alcoholism and pornography. And, I approached the recovery period and moving forward with caution and thoughtfulness.
He sensed it, and it concerned him. Many months ago, I had told him I used an online support group (SR). Please no eye rolling. In hindsight, I shouldn’t have told him, but I wanted to be upfront and honest. A mistake. So, close to two weeks ago, he installed the keylogging software to track me to determine what had “influenced” me to be cautious and careful. Now you can roll your eyes. I am still SIMMERING over this. I'll stop here or I might write something I will later regret (long after the edit option is gone).
Somewhere buried within him is the wonderful man I used to know and love. I hope he’ll succeed in his recovery for himself and his family. Time will tell… But, I am not so foolish as I once was.
Anyway, I think this post comes closer to the truth. In the meantime, please remember to be careful regarding your privacy.
I had a chance to reread the thread. I want to thank you for your responses. I started the thread to caution others. It became apparent to me I needed support too. The thread took a few unexpected twists and turns. I think the thread got a little away from me, and I would like to take this opportunity to try to bring it closer to what I view is the truth.
There is no abuse, sexism, condescension or projection. The invasion of privacy and other destructive behaviors have more to do with his insecurities, subtle control/manipulation, shame, guilt and desperation. I might even throw in arrogance.
My husband has become a less confident man from the man I used to know. His confidence has taken a hit in the last year or two. Add to that, mortification from following in his father’s footsteps: moderate drinking to alcoholism…all the family warning signs (alcoholism on both sides of his family) and he let it happen anyway. And, pornography - completely self-inflicted again – just deepened the shame.
He feels unworthy of my love. He wants so desperately to move forward and rebuild the marriage and not lose me. He admitted he’s mystified why – if a marriage needs to be built/rebuilt – I’d choose to rebuild with him. He also admitted that he let that desperation get the upper hand (invasion of my privacy). And, it’s not lost on him the irony behind the potential self-fulfilling prophecy: he fears there’s no reason for me to stay, then he does something to give me another reason not to. So far, his path to recovery hasn’t been a walk in the park. He attends AA and individual therapy once a week.
For myself, I sought individual therapy, Sober Recovery and the kind individual for knowledge and support to better understand the basics of alcoholism and addiction. It strengthened me. I prepared and protected myself and set boundaries. I concluded I was not powerless and have choices. I chose not to live with alcoholism and pornography. And, I approached the recovery period and moving forward with caution and thoughtfulness.
He sensed it, and it concerned him. Many months ago, I had told him I used an online support group (SR). Please no eye rolling. In hindsight, I shouldn’t have told him, but I wanted to be upfront and honest. A mistake. So, close to two weeks ago, he installed the keylogging software to track me to determine what had “influenced” me to be cautious and careful. Now you can roll your eyes. I am still SIMMERING over this. I'll stop here or I might write something I will later regret (long after the edit option is gone).
Somewhere buried within him is the wonderful man I used to know and love. I hope he’ll succeed in his recovery for himself and his family. Time will tell… But, I am not so foolish as I once was.
Anyway, I think this post comes closer to the truth. In the meantime, please remember to be careful regarding your privacy.
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 246
I am struggling...
Last week, I was livid regarding the invasion of privacy and a couple of other related conversations with my husband. It takes a lot to make me livid. This week, I am simmering. Disappointment, anger and resentment have settled within me, and I don't know when those emotions will go away. But, I don't want them to linger.
I think I understand his issues and what he wrestles with. It's not making a dent into the disappointment and resentment though. I thought his rock bottom would have been the alcohol and pornography. Both of which he stopped. Now, I have come to better understand it's the marriage. I think it needed to crumble for him to start to look inward.
Will the emotions eventually fade away as a result of time and his actions going forward? The invasion of privacy hurt me so much...more than his other behaviors.
Last week, I was livid regarding the invasion of privacy and a couple of other related conversations with my husband. It takes a lot to make me livid. This week, I am simmering. Disappointment, anger and resentment have settled within me, and I don't know when those emotions will go away. But, I don't want them to linger.
I think I understand his issues and what he wrestles with. It's not making a dent into the disappointment and resentment though. I thought his rock bottom would have been the alcohol and pornography. Both of which he stopped. Now, I have come to better understand it's the marriage. I think it needed to crumble for him to start to look inward.
Will the emotions eventually fade away as a result of time and his actions going forward? The invasion of privacy hurt me so much...more than his other behaviors.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: MD
Posts: 59
I'm sorry to hear of the privacy issues. My AW and I recently separated back in Feb at which time I got a text saying she could locate me with my cell phone. I honestly didn't care as I have nothing to hide. Mind you for the last several yrs she's accused me of cheating because we didn't have sex as much as we used to. Never mind the all out verbal abuse off and on for nearly 2 yrs and the anxiety I had due to the chance of her being drunk by time I got home from work.
I called her out on the tracking of my cell and she said it was because she suspected me cheating. She said her counselor said, when men leave it's usually because they are cheating. She's accepted responsibility of her drinking to me verbally but these kinds of actions tell much more of the story. I see it as blame shifting since I doubt she's told her counselor about the yrs of issues with alcohol. Absolutely crazy.
I called her out on the tracking of my cell and she said it was because she suspected me cheating. She said her counselor said, when men leave it's usually because they are cheating. She's accepted responsibility of her drinking to me verbally but these kinds of actions tell much more of the story. I see it as blame shifting since I doubt she's told her counselor about the yrs of issues with alcohol. Absolutely crazy.
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Originally Posted by HoldOnLoosely
Will the emotions eventually fade away as a result of time and his actions going forward? The invasion of privacy hurt me so much...more than his other behaviors.
RAH could easily resent me for the snooping that I did while he was actively drinking & creating chaos in our lives. And truthfully I didn't stop for him - I stopped because I had that light bulb moment when I realized how much I was hurting myself. (finding info I shouldn't, drawing assumptions & acting on them, etc.) My actions stemmed from my insecurities & only stopped when I started getting healthy via recovery work.
You said he is 6 months into sobriety, but what is he doing for internal work? Therapy? Group Support? Step work? I think he needs something to help guide him through working this through & understanding his own actions & mental processes are what broke down here.
My only word of caution is to be careful about this kind of expectation:
I thought his rock bottom would have been the alcohol and pornography. Both of which he stopped. Now, I have come to better understand it's the marriage. I think it needed to crumble for him to start to look inward.
In this case, your husband is also an unrecovered child of an alcoholic too, right? That's another huge factor in all of this in my eyes - that's a potentially very deep well of hurt & buried emotions & resentments that he has to work through to begin to understand how it all is impacting his decisions still today. Just another perspective for you to consider.
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 667
I think what you are learning is the way I describe being with an addict. They are like a magician. You see the main show (trick) they are performing (misdirecting you with), meanwhile what is REALLY going on is what the other hand is doing that you can't see or don't want to see because the misdirection is what they want you to focus on looking at.
This has taken the focus off of his addiction, and keeps you on the defensive.
You will eventually learn that you have only seen a portion of what is really going on. This is textbook addiction behavior.
This has taken the focus off of his addiction, and keeps you on the defensive.
You will eventually learn that you have only seen a portion of what is really going on. This is textbook addiction behavior.
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 246
Originally Posted by Hangnbyathread
because the misdirection is what they want you to focus on looking at.
This has taken the focus off of his addiction, and keeps you on the defensive.
This has taken the focus off of his addiction, and keeps you on the defensive.
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
we see what we WANT to see, what we allow ourselves to see.
we believe what we CHOOSE to believe, and then view everything thru that filter. we hardly know ourselves.....how can we possibly think we know anything about another?
I don't think I've ever heard a single member here accurately predict what their qualifier's "rock bottom" moment will be. (myself included) We're always wrong for the same reason we struggle to understand while they abuse their DOC - we do not understand their mental processes no matter how much time we spend dissecting them.
^^^this. nothing more to add.
we believe what we CHOOSE to believe, and then view everything thru that filter. we hardly know ourselves.....how can we possibly think we know anything about another?
I don't think I've ever heard a single member here accurately predict what their qualifier's "rock bottom" moment will be. (myself included) We're always wrong for the same reason we struggle to understand while they abuse their DOC - we do not understand their mental processes no matter how much time we spend dissecting them.
^^^this. nothing more to add.
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