Terminally Unique

Thanks, silkspin. I've gotten some good feedback via PM as well, but all I am doing is giving you the view through the lens of AVRT. Ironically, if I were to post some of this stuff on the 'addictoid' side of the forums, it might go over like a lead balloon. I have exposed the addictive voice before in real time with people, and while they are often elated to realize what is actually going on, sometimes, like a cornered rat, they will go on the attack. I'm able to do this here without having to take that into account because the person in question is not actually present.

NYCDoglvr

Incorrect. This is him now. We're talking addiction. He has a choice to not drink or continue drinking. If he's serious about not drinking he won't do it for you but for himself.

This isn't about forgiveness it's about YOU. He can drink or not drink you do not want to hear from him again. When a drunk says he loves someone it doesn't matter -- it's the bottle talking.

RedCandle

Agreed. I think Terminally needs to publish a book. I would buy it in a heart beat!

Last night, first meeting. Certainly awkward, although everyone was INCREDIBLY nice. I had to separate from the whole group and go with two experienced Al Anon members into a separate room to get "Al Anon 101."

It was a little bit like the first day of school. I didn't think like I learned a whole lot...but I left feeling much better because I was actually DOING something productive.

I only heard from him via text, once, so far since yesterday. It said:

"I can live the rest of my life without alcohol and I can live the rest of my life without the cruelty of the people I love. Love is not cruel and that's how I know you never loved me..."

I felt very empowered after stating in black and white that I *was* going to chose "other people, places and things" (as he says) and move on with my life as he has chosen alcohol (again). That I will move forward assuming this IS his life, but that I will not tolerate alcohol in mine. That I can not live with active addiction, blah, blah, blah....

Admittedly, I started to feel like a real butt head after I got that text. Because I DO love this person and care about them and it DOES pain me to plan out a new life without him...but I KNOW that the path I've been taking isn't working!

I keep telling myself...it doesn't matter what you say right now...you are just talking to the BOTTLE! Its not him right now, its the BOTTLE! Stop feeling bad...stop feeling bad for the BOTTLE!

Anything else I need in my mental arsenal to stabilize my thinking? I'm sure this is a pretty weak time, emotionally speaking....

I laid down the law (with all of your help) and I don't want to turn back into putty again. No way!

Thanks everyone! And Terminally...about that book...

:-)

Terminally Unique

"I can live the rest of my life without alcohol..."

This is the real him, telling the truth.

"...and I can live the rest of my life without the cruelty of the people I love. Love is not cruel and that's how I know you never loved me..."

This is his addictive voice, being projected onto you. Translation: "I can also live the rest of my life drinking." It knows that you don't love that part of him at all, and it is trying to accomplish two things. Firstly, it is trying to make you (and him) think that you are being completely unreasonable by being 'cruel' towards the addiction and expecting him not to drink. Notice the change between the first half of the sentence and the second?

Quite obviously, if he is capable of living the rest of his life without alcohol, then you are not being unreasonable at all by expecting him not to drink. Secondly, it is trying to create discord and tension, since it knows that the love he feels could in fact prompt him to take action and actually end his addiction. It views you as 'the enemy', and from where it stands, the best thing in the world would be for him to view you as 'the enemy' as well. Whatever love he still feels toward you is a threat to its very survival, and it aims to replace it with enmity.

RedCandle

Terminally to the rescue.
That just completely realigned my head and my heart...
Thank you. THANK YOU.
I wish I had an ounce of the clarity you have! But you are truly helping!!

Terminally Unique

What you need to do is completely ignore the AV noise, since it is all nonsense anyway, and focus only on what 'he' said.

"I can live the rest of my life without alcohol..."

You could, for example, delete everything after this and respond calmly with "OK, I absolutely believe you. Let me know when you decide to do this."

fourmaggie

I baked an apple pie for us...you bring tea/and coffee...

TakingCharge999

I look forward to trying the bread! the pie and the tea..

This ex sounds like my ex. Very twisted, stressful, sad & exhausting times. I recall he also called me "the enemy" at one point. Enemy of his alcoholism perhaps?

In any case, there are great things out there that don't involve addict people. To me it started to be: the ramblings of a madman. I needed some logic & sanity in my life, that I got from No Contact, SR, AA/Alanon ideas, therapy. Although I was talking about EX in reality I was talking about me and seeking help for ME.

Its their battle...all the best in their battles.. now on we go to live our day.