I have to ask why
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Originally Posted by rudeawakening 
I never denied it as I am in control and I choose. However the rhetorical question remains WHY ? The only constant that I have recently discovered was everyone that has negatively effected my life since childhood has been an alcoholic.
The rhetorical question, "why" can oftentimes only be answered by "why not?"
My choosing men who beat me, men who denigrated me, men who abandoned me, MAY have been "control." I choose to think of myself during that phase of my life as out-of-control in picking out-of-control partners.
I quit asking "why?" to many things when I realized I would probably drive myself crazy trying to get the answer, and the answer would likely elude me.
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Perhaps I should add this ...
I'm not here to intellectualize WHY I chose to marry an addict. I have tried to do that in a therapist's office and it just lead to nowhere.
When I asked "why?" I found that WAS my way of dancing around my own personal issues.
I think there are some well-meaning folks here who are trying the best way they know how to share their ES&H (experience, strength, and hope) with you. We are not psychologists or addictions counselors. We are just people who have been affected by the addicts in our lives.
I am sorry I don't have an answer to "why?" for you. It is a personal and unique response for every individual on this board.
When I asked "why?" I found that WAS my way of dancing around my own personal issues.
I think there are some well-meaning folks here who are trying the best way they know how to share their ES&H (experience, strength, and hope) with you. We are not psychologists or addictions counselors. We are just people who have been affected by the addicts in our lives.
I am sorry I don't have an answer to "why?" for you. It is a personal and unique response for every individual on this board.
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: NY State
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Why???
I know why I chose men that were abusive...it was because that was all I knew from the age of 3 years old-abuse. If all my abuse was re-inforced within me body and spirit, then that became my self worth...Thats all I deserved was the justification. Even as some relationships started out..they were not abusive from the beginning, but by the time they started being abusive, it was familiar once again.......The bigger question is how did you find your way out?......Terry
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Join Date: Mar 2008
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If I agree to three or more of these replies.....I may be a codepentdent... 
Thanks to all who gave their ES&H. So many of your replies helped me to think about my choices.
Rhetorical. Is there really ONE answer to this? No, as I'm sure you've noticed.
Knowing why isn't going to change who we are are what choices we make. Asking HOW we can do better from now on, seems more helpful.
Interesting thread.....helping us to think of the "why" each of us has made the choices we have. Thanks.
Not all those in abusive and/or addictive relationships stay because of low self-esteem, financial concerns, fear of change, hoping for the best, or trying to help others..... etc, etc, etc -- too many reasons to list.
So true. As was said in another reply, things are SO not black and white for many of us. I have always found myself in the "gray" -- knowing one thing is right, yet doing the other.
We each live our lives, do what we can, and make the best decisions based on what we know. Ideally, each of us can get to a point that we can learn about ourselves, grow emotionally, and find the courage to change our lives for the better -- regardless of our circumstances (dysfunctional or not).
My problem wasn't so much attracting losers. I have trouble walking away.
Since you now understand what kind of woman you attract, learning about the reasons you do this -- learning about yourself --might help you to find a way to avoid that in the future.
Thanks to all who gave their ES&H. So many of your replies helped me to think about my choices.
Originally Posted by rudeawakening
However the rhetorical question remains WHY ?
Knowing why isn't going to change who we are are what choices we make. Asking HOW we can do better from now on, seems more helpful.
Interesting thread.....helping us to think of the "why" each of us has made the choices we have. Thanks.
Not all those in abusive and/or addictive relationships stay because of low self-esteem, financial concerns, fear of change, hoping for the best, or trying to help others..... etc, etc, etc -- too many reasons to list.
We're all at different places in our learning and in our self-acceptance.
People can be harsh when summing up why those who love addicts stay with addicts. But only those who have been there know how hard it is to finally, finally, give up.
We each live our lives, do what we can, and make the best decisions based on what we know. Ideally, each of us can get to a point that we can learn about ourselves, grow emotionally, and find the courage to change our lives for the better -- regardless of our circumstances (dysfunctional or not).
My problem is I attract the losers and the dysfunctional women and find myself getting getting angry when I realize "I did it again".
Since you now understand what kind of woman you attract, learning about the reasons you do this -- learning about yourself --might help you to find a way to avoid that in the future.
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 45
I want to rephrase the term I used "Loser" to emotionally lost which better discribes them.
I feel that I have given the impression that I was talking about some Jerry Springer type person when actually these women are not.
The term loser is a very harsh description and I was wrong.
I feel that I have given the impression that I was talking about some Jerry Springer type person when actually these women are not.
The term loser is a very harsh description and I was wrong.
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Vicious cycle RA ~~
I appreciate your tenacity in wanting to know yet, after reading all the posts back to you and your replies to them, I see that you seem to be in a vicious cycle, spinning and spinning. I again say that why's don't matter as much as what we do about them.
I believe we attract what we need to learn.
Meaning, every situation I find myself in is a learning experience for me if I allow myself to go within. I cannot blame others (i.e., your quote about every alcoholic in your life has brought you problems....something like that) in that situation as I put myself there.
My suggestion is to be open to the solutions; not the problems that have been created. If it were so easy, you just would stop seeing alcoholics and you wouldn't be on this board looking for answers.
Again I ask, how's the meetings going for ya?
I appreciate your tenacity in wanting to know yet, after reading all the posts back to you and your replies to them, I see that you seem to be in a vicious cycle, spinning and spinning. I again say that why's don't matter as much as what we do about them.
I believe we attract what we need to learn.
Meaning, every situation I find myself in is a learning experience for me if I allow myself to go within. I cannot blame others (i.e., your quote about every alcoholic in your life has brought you problems....something like that) in that situation as I put myself there.My suggestion is to be open to the solutions; not the problems that have been created. If it were so easy, you just would stop seeing alcoholics and you wouldn't be on this board looking for answers.
Again I ask, how's the meetings going for ya?
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Join Date: Aug 2002
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I love you guys! Some of your responses made me laugh out loud and all made me think.
It took me a long time to learn the why's of my life - why I did what I did, why I continued to accept unacceptable behavior, why I seemed to keep going back for more.
My answers lie within me and my recovery. Al Anon taught me that I was responsible for my own behavior and for my own consequences as a result of my choices, no matter how good my intentions were. I had to learn where other people stopped and where I started. I learned about co-dependency and how it worked in my life and my relationships.
Low self esteem and conflicting messages in my home as a child taught me to be a people pleaser. That's how I got noticed and how I was able to get some of my needs met. As an adult, that behavior has taken me to some very dark places. In my case, controlling behavior on the part of a partner tends to expose itself gradually, so that I - like others who have already responded - thought perhaps I had done something wrong. I corrected or adjusted my OWN behavior in order to avoid another problem or conflict. Before ya know it? I'm right back in a very unhealthy place.
Regular attendance at Al Anon meetings keeps my thoughts and behaviors in balance. Being accountable to recovery friends keeps me from twirling in chaos. I need other healthy people to check in with and talk to so they can help me see what's really going on with me.
It took me a long time to learn the why's of my life - why I did what I did, why I continued to accept unacceptable behavior, why I seemed to keep going back for more.
My answers lie within me and my recovery. Al Anon taught me that I was responsible for my own behavior and for my own consequences as a result of my choices, no matter how good my intentions were. I had to learn where other people stopped and where I started. I learned about co-dependency and how it worked in my life and my relationships.
Low self esteem and conflicting messages in my home as a child taught me to be a people pleaser. That's how I got noticed and how I was able to get some of my needs met. As an adult, that behavior has taken me to some very dark places. In my case, controlling behavior on the part of a partner tends to expose itself gradually, so that I - like others who have already responded - thought perhaps I had done something wrong. I corrected or adjusted my OWN behavior in order to avoid another problem or conflict. Before ya know it? I'm right back in a very unhealthy place.
Regular attendance at Al Anon meetings keeps my thoughts and behaviors in balance. Being accountable to recovery friends keeps me from twirling in chaos. I need other healthy people to check in with and talk to so they can help me see what's really going on with me.
Always Hopeful
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: californication
Posts: 50
I wasnt aware that my xab was an alcoholic. I had never been involved with an alcoholic, so I didnt know. We didnt live together and we didnt see each other everyday, so there was no ways for me to know that he drank everyday. I did see red flags and ignored them because of what people above me stated. My self esteem wasnt healthy and I thought that is the best I could do and I will settle. I wanted to get married and he was in my life and he had many good attributes, so I overlooked the red flags, the excessive drinking. Yet, all the bad stuff that comes with drinking was there, I just thought like people above, that If I try hard and earn his love....he will love me and marry me and things will be great. I don't see this as a pattern for me, but I do think that because I was feeling vulnerable and lonely I settled for him, when I wouldnt have before when my self esteem was healthy. I learned that I need not to jump into a relationship when I am vulnerable and still healing because that vulnerability will lead us to overlook things. So, I want to have a clear mind next time I get into a relationship, so I can see things for what they really are....instead of desperation
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Originally Posted by rudeawakening
I want to rephrase the term I used "Loser" to emotionally lost which better discribes them.
Is the answer to your "why" :
1) you sensed in these women - or outright knew - that they were emotionally lost, and you were deriving some sort of pride, personal power, and/or other gratification in saving them?
2) you spent much of your life surrounded by the alcoholic lifestyle, so, like many of us ACoA people, you came to see that as normal. Normal=known=good. You chose relationships that made you feel normal.
Pretty common things, both. The question is....was it unpleasant enough that you'll now stop making those choices?
All questions only you can answer, but loaded with potential for improving your life & happiness if you can answer them. Keep on seeking....
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 45
Originally Posted by GiveLove
Well.....not being a psychiatrist, awakening, maybe I could venture this:
Is the answer to your "why" :
1) you sensed in these women - or outright knew - that they were emotionally lost, and you were deriving some sort of pride, personal power, and/or other gratification in saving them?
Actually no I didn't. It wasn't until we dated a while would the little things surface here and there. separately no big deal, but when you step back and look at the big picture, whoaaaaa.
You talk with them and by their responses, it doesn't take long to realize things aren't as them seem and they refuse to see what is keeping them in their predicament
2) you spent much of your life surrounded by the alcoholic lifestyle, so, like many of us ACoA people, you came to see that as normal. Normal=known=good. You chose relationships that made you feel normal.
I didn't make this revelation until this past weekend... It wasn't until I started listing everyone I knew that was an alcoholic or drank heavy that had some type of adverse effect on me. It was then did I realize the cycle I was in... You couldn't have
me any harder. So you see, I understand now... I just need the tools (Knowledge) on how to combat this so I can break the cycle
Pretty common things, both. The question is....was it unpleasant enough that you'll now stop making those choices?
I remember the pain of every failed relationship.
Please don't think that "EVERY" relationship in my life was dysfunctional, but it seems that the ones that are seem to effect me the most.
This latest lady, the xAGF, When I met her I literally said to myself... Her is a woman that has her stuff together. She has a beautiful home, every bit as nice as mine. She has a job, a nice economical car, children is grown, in fact she just graduated high school, GED.
I finally thought that for once I found someone good for me.
The truth was she is losing/selling her home, her car is not really hers. Her girls are violent, infact her youngest one broke her bf nose. she has a criminal history (spousal abuse) herself, she is a racist, she cannot talk to or about her grand children without meantioning color. She claimed she was 2 yrs sobber which needless to say she isn't. There is a lot more I found out, but these are some of the things she hide and fed me a little at a time.
The 1st month was great and then the guilt trips games began and I played right into it before I realized it, I was needing help getting to sleep where I NEVER needed any thing before. I had started back smoking with a vengeance, I was losing my drive for life and no longer had any structure in my life.
When searching for answers on how to deal with her and her problem, I made my discovery that just finished me off emotionally.
As a man, this was embarrassing for me as I am usually strong and I usually have control over my feelings.
So like I said, I have seen the light... I just need the understanding and the strength to work through this.
All questions only you can answer, but loaded with potential for improving your life & happiness if you can answer them. Keep on seeking....
Is the answer to your "why" :
1) you sensed in these women - or outright knew - that they were emotionally lost, and you were deriving some sort of pride, personal power, and/or other gratification in saving them?
Actually no I didn't. It wasn't until we dated a while would the little things surface here and there. separately no big deal, but when you step back and look at the big picture, whoaaaaa.
You talk with them and by their responses, it doesn't take long to realize things aren't as them seem and they refuse to see what is keeping them in their predicament
2) you spent much of your life surrounded by the alcoholic lifestyle, so, like many of us ACoA people, you came to see that as normal. Normal=known=good. You chose relationships that made you feel normal.
I didn't make this revelation until this past weekend... It wasn't until I started listing everyone I knew that was an alcoholic or drank heavy that had some type of adverse effect on me. It was then did I realize the cycle I was in... You couldn't have
me any harder. So you see, I understand now... I just need the tools (Knowledge) on how to combat this so I can break the cycle Pretty common things, both. The question is....was it unpleasant enough that you'll now stop making those choices?
I remember the pain of every failed relationship.
Please don't think that "EVERY" relationship in my life was dysfunctional, but it seems that the ones that are seem to effect me the most.
This latest lady, the xAGF, When I met her I literally said to myself... Her is a woman that has her stuff together. She has a beautiful home, every bit as nice as mine. She has a job, a nice economical car, children is grown, in fact she just graduated high school, GED.
I finally thought that for once I found someone good for me.
The truth was she is losing/selling her home, her car is not really hers. Her girls are violent, infact her youngest one broke her bf nose. she has a criminal history (spousal abuse) herself, she is a racist, she cannot talk to or about her grand children without meantioning color. She claimed she was 2 yrs sobber which needless to say she isn't. There is a lot more I found out, but these are some of the things she hide and fed me a little at a time.
The 1st month was great and then the guilt trips games began and I played right into it before I realized it, I was needing help getting to sleep where I NEVER needed any thing before. I had started back smoking with a vengeance, I was losing my drive for life and no longer had any structure in my life.
When searching for answers on how to deal with her and her problem, I made my discovery that just finished me off emotionally.
As a man, this was embarrassing for me as I am usually strong and I usually have control over my feelings.
So like I said, I have seen the light... I just need the understanding and the strength to work through this.
All questions only you can answer, but loaded with potential for improving your life & happiness if you can answer them. Keep on seeking....
Absolutely and Thank You.
scorpiogirl Vicious cycle
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RA ~~
I appreciate your tenacity in wanting to know yet, after reading all the posts back to you and your replies to them, I see that you seem to be in a vicious cycle, spinning and spinning. I again say that why's don't matter as much as what we do about them.
Of course I'm spinning... but I did discover the answer that I have been seeking half of my life... I'm now working on it now.
You forget my question of "WHY" was to those that refuse to move on when their own well being is in question.
I believe we attract what we need to learn. Meaning, every situation I find myself in is a learning experience for me if I allow myself to go within. I cannot blame others (i.e., your quote about every alcoholic in your life has brought you problems....something like that) in that situation as I put myself there.
Yes I believe there is a lot of truth to this statement... Everything happens for a reason and people come and go in our lives for a purpose
My suggestion is to be open to the solutions; not the problems that have been created. If it were so easy, you just would stop seeing alcoholics and you wouldn't be on this board looking for answers.
Again I ask, how's the meetings going for ya?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
RA ~~
I appreciate your tenacity in wanting to know yet, after reading all the posts back to you and your replies to them, I see that you seem to be in a vicious cycle, spinning and spinning. I again say that why's don't matter as much as what we do about them.
Of course I'm spinning... but I did discover the answer that I have been seeking half of my life... I'm now working on it now.
You forget my question of "WHY" was to those that refuse to move on when their own well being is in question.
I believe we attract what we need to learn. Meaning, every situation I find myself in is a learning experience for me if I allow myself to go within. I cannot blame others (i.e., your quote about every alcoholic in your life has brought you problems....something like that) in that situation as I put myself there.
Yes I believe there is a lot of truth to this statement... Everything happens for a reason and people come and go in our lives for a purpose
My suggestion is to be open to the solutions; not the problems that have been created. If it were so easy, you just would stop seeing alcoholics and you wouldn't be on this board looking for answers.
Again I ask, how's the meetings going for ya?
I will say with great satisfaction that after my meltdown, I have not needed anything to help me sleep and my smoking is almost non existent and I'm begining to get active again.
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Earth School
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Hip, hip HOORAY!!
Originally Posted by rudeawakening
I might need some professional counseling in order to get more definitive answers... Keep in mind that I have just awoken from a 40 yr nap. I will say with great satisfaction that after my meltdown, I have not needed anything to help me sleep and my smoking is almost non existent and I'm begining to get active again.
Glad you're getting some clarity. You don't sound as spun as you did when you first started writing here. And congrats on being able to sleep and having less cigarettes. Yeaaa! :bounce
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Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Earth School
Posts: 137
The Proverbial WHYYYYY
Originally Posted by rudeawakening
You forget my question of "WHY" was to those that refuse to move on when their own well being is in question.
It's addiction, my friend, addiction. It afflicts everyone in it's path. If a person is a so-called "normal" person (using term loosely), they wouldn't choose someone with an addiction or major dysfunction. They just wouldn't. Their vibration would attract other's that had their lives more together. We choose people with active addictions, or dysfunction or many of the other things cause there is something inside of us that craves/needs it. We fill a need. Fill a void. That's why the family/friends of AA's or NA's, etc need help too.RA - one cannot figure out the disease. It just is. Just like cancer or other illnesses. We go for treatment (meetings, etc) to get better; we don't sit around wondering how did I get here.
Get yourself out of your head and into your feet and get movin'. Quit trying to figure out which came first, the chicken or the egg.
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